1 upvotes, 1 direct replies (showing 1)
View submission: Conflicted about Zen Buddhism in general
Of course, you are free to do as you wish, and I am sure that it is a beneficial practice if you find it so. It is just that I have not heard any Shikantaza teacher in Soto Zen link Shikantaza with stages and Jhana. So, maybe this is just your own notion?
As a matter of fact, in Fukanzazengi, Master Dogen seems to say not. He says "所謂坐禪は習禪には非ず" which can mean that it is not "learning Jhana" or Zen by stages. Also, the expression sometimes translated as "bliss" is actually "唯是れ安楽の法門なり" with "安楽" which is more like "Peaceful Ease" ... 安楽 (Ch. 安樂), is the raku 楽 of Sukkha (i.e. 大樂), the opposite of "Dukkha." I prefer a translation of "peaceful ease/comfort" for anraku 安楽. But in ordinary Japanese, it just means "comfortable." https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%E5%AE%89%E6%A5%BD[1][2]
1: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%E5%AE%89%E6%A5%BD
2: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%E5%AE%89%E6%A5%BD
If anything, I sometimes make the link (purely my own) of Shikantaza and the Fourth Jhana. The Fourth Jhana in the Pali Suttas was considered the 'summit' of Jhana practice (as the higher "otherworldly" Jhanas, No. 5 to 8, were not encouraged as a kind of 'dead end') and appears to manifest (quoting the sutta descriptions in the book link below) "an abandoning of pleasure, pain, attractions/aversions, a dropping of both joy and grief", a dropping away of both rapture and bliss states, resulting in a "purity of mindfulness" and "equanimity". Combine this with the fact that, more than a "one pointed mind absorbed into a particular object", there is a "unification of mind" (described as a broader awareness around the object of meditation ... whereby the "mind itself becomes collected and unmoving, but not the objects of awareness, as mindfulness becomes lucid, effortless and unbroken" (See, for examples. pages 82-83 here)) https://books.google.co.jp/books?id=lQ%5C_ZzFgJ1AwC&lpg=PP1&ots=Nfh%5C_Zax84P&dq=richard%20skankman&pg=PA80#v=onepage&q&f=false[3][4]
In any case, I have not heard any Soto Zen interpretation of Shikantaza and 1st Jhana like that, so take it as your notion. I would advise, if you have bliss, cherish such. But do not cling to bliss, of course. If you do not have bliss, cherish such. It is also what is, whole and complete.
Comment by Most-Entertainer-182 at 17/02/2025 at 07:34 UTC*
1 upvotes, 1 direct replies
You can’t cling to that bliss, because it is the bliss of non clinging, as soon as you try to cling to it it disappears, that’s why it is the perfect metric, it is born of viveka which means correct disengagement/discernment away from the unreal and unwholesome.
And in second jhana it becomes samadhi jam Piti sukham, the bliss born of samadhi, and the mind is unified, and there is bliss effortless bliss.
As you mention, later state jhana (4th) the bliss is transcended, but you go ‘through’ it, you don’t let go of it, I fades into something more subtle, it’s a very subtle but important point.
You don’t learn jhana in stages, it just happens as the mind becomes more refined. The different jhanas are just descriptions of different stages of mental refinement.
And also don’t forget, zen is a cognate of ch’an, which is a cognate of jhana, which is a cognate of dhyana.