14 upvotes, 6 direct replies (showing 6)
View submission: Tuesday Check In: How's Everybody's Mental Health?
Something's been bothering me and I still have yet to find a satisfactory response.
I see on social media all the time statements about men such as:
And there's data to support all this.
What am I supposed to take away from all this? Are we men just inherently worse than women? Do I just have to come to terms with the fact that I'll never be as good or pure as a woman due to being a man? Will I never be deserving of love because of my lower moral capabilities? Is physical strength really the only thing men have going for us?
Comment by StrangeBid7233 at 15/01/2025 at 20:48 UTC
7 upvotes, 0 direct replies
While this all sucks to hear all the time and it's hard not to feel insecure about it in some way, it's also important to remember social media is not at all how real world is.
My life experience has taught me that, despite all these being stereotypes, they are far from truth and a lot of my female friends know that.
Bear in mind this is my personal experience with these things and experiences of people I know as I have talked about these topics.
Some of these things are also context based, sex thing, from my view, especially. Men overall are easier to sexually satisfy, while women have harder time reaching orgasm, my opinion is that sexual performance pressure is really high for men due to that, while at same time people (both men and women) suck at communicating about sex, add 2 and 2 and you get why perception is that men are bad at sex. Hell from my experience I noticed that I had way lower bar as to what good sex was for me when it came to my side of satisfaction, and that is probably true for a lot of men.
I know a ton of female friendships that are so toxic, yet appear close and wholesome on outside, and in my circles it seems far more common than toxic male friendships, while at same time every guy I know has at least 1 (and most of us way more) ride or die friends that would drop everything to help you.
If women were happier single than married to men then why do so many of them seek relationships?
Also be careful about that whole data thing, a lot of "statistics" on internet are very skewed polls, remember that on internet negativity sells.
There are issues that us men have, there are issues that women have, there are issues we share, every issue deserves to be heard and validated.
Comment by CheeseAttack at 15/01/2025 at 19:12 UTC
2 upvotes, 0 direct replies
What you should take away is that you have developed internalized misandry. Treat those mad ravings the same way you would treat the mad ravings of people online posting stupid misogynistic stuff. I'm sure you've seen plenty of the latter online over the years and realized that it was just some sad lonely misogynistic troll whose words should rightly be ignored, and you should ignore these remarks just the same.
Originally most trolls on the internet were male because most people on the internet were men, but over the past decade the gender ratios online evened out more, and women are just as likely to be shitty as men are so now we increasingly see misandrist troll content circulating. Try not to let it get to you.
Comment by Kippetmurk at 15/01/2025 at 11:14 UTC*
8 upvotes, 0 direct replies
What am I supposed to take away from all this? Are we men just inherently worse than women?
You know, early feminist movements struggled with the same question for women.
As an early 20th century feminist, what do you do with the fact that men are just *better* at certain things than women?
Do you argue against it? Do you try to disprove the inherent advantages that men have over women? Because that's almost impossible. Women as a group have a whole bunch of measurable disadvantages compared to men. Less muscle mass, worse spatial perception, less detailed eyesight, whatever, you could write an endless list.
Some of those disadvantages are biological, some are taught to girls at a young age, but either way, by the time you're an adult woman, the average men is better than you at certain things.
In the early days, some feminists struggled with that, because it's such an in-your-face attack - almost a challenge: either disprove that men are better at some things than women, or accept that women are lesser humans.
But of course there's a third option, and by now, feminism has pretty much settled on that. In hindsight it seems obvious:
They do not matter for what you deserve as a human: rights, opportunities, love and appreciation... none of that should be dependent on your strengths and weaknesses, as an individual or a group.
If you walk up to the average feminist nowadays and tell them: "Men are stronger than women"... they will likely just shrug and say ***so what?***
But that's a process that feminism had to go through: going from "women can do everything that men can do" to "it doesn't matter what you can do, you deserve equality".
And issues like racial equality or equality for people with disabilities went through the same process. Our first instinct seems to be to argue that differences do not exist, before we realise "huh, even if the differences exist, it doesn't matter".
----- Anyway, men now have to go through that same process. We are now bombarded by social media and online articles and influencer grifters telling us about all the weaknesses of men, and men are struggling with that.
It's the same old attack - a challenge: either disprove that men are more violent, or accept that they are lesser humans.
So you'll find people tackling that challenge head-on: noooo, violence is taught and can be untaught; or the violence comes with equal benefits; or it applies to the group but not to the individual; or it's just a lie...
But I suspect that eventually, like we always do, we will settle on that third option:
Maybe men are inherently more violent, worse at communicating, bad at seeing colours... could be -- but they deserve the same rights, opportunities, love and appreciation as any other human being.
Comment by Tharkun140 at 15/01/2025 at 10:07 UTC
5 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Men are more violent
In situations where physical strength matters. Women are just as likely to initiate domestic abuse, start wars or commit infanticide. They're just less likely to enter scenarios where they'd need muscle strength to come out on top.
Men are worse at sex than women
Male gay couples have sex and orgasm more frequently than people in straight or lesbian relationships. Female orgasm is much more difficult to invoke than male orgasm, and that's hardly men's fault.
It's a waste of time worrying about the "Male Loneliness Epidemic" as it is self-inflicted
That's a purely subjective opinion. How would you even back it up with data?
Female friendships are closer than male friendships
And less frequent. What of it?
Women feel safer with a bear than a man
Which is why zoos frequently struggle to prevent women from jumping into grizzly bear enclosures and escaping countless men in the crowd. It's totally not just a stupid social media trend.
Will I never be deserving of love because of my lower moral capabilities?
Which ethical philosophy are you using to determine your "moral capabilities"? Utilitarian ethics, popularized by Jeremy Betham, or some deontological theory like ones championed by Immanuel Kant? I'm just curious what male scholar provides the basis for your male inferiority theory.
Is physical strength really the only thing men have going for us?
Yes. You got it exactly right, just like Einstein forming the theory of relativity by breaking atoms with his brute, dumb strength. Men have nothing but muscles and never invented or accomplished anything of value. No sir.
Forgive the sarcasm, but some of those points can be easily countered with a cursory look at the world. Stop doom-scrolling, or at least taking the eternal gloom of social media so seriously.
Comment by Useful-Field-9037 at 14/01/2025 at 21:14 UTC
7 upvotes, 0 direct replies
I can't say I have a perfect solution, but I do think one must realize that a lot of these statistics (for the ones that have actually been studied) are likely caused by the society and are not inherent to being a man.
Also a couple of these stereotypes you mention are just straight up false. The two I mean are the "men can't clean up after themselves" and "female friendships are closer than male friendships".
Cleaning is not super difficult for men. Personally I enjoy cleaning both my surroundings and myself. I find it therapeutic.
And there is nothing within ourselves that would indicate that men are inherently bad at being friends to one another. This seems to me to be a very recent stereotype because there are many instances I can think of from history where men have been amazing friends. While not "history" technically, I would suggest you read the Epic of Gilgamesh or at least the parts about Enkidu to get what I mean.
Comment by greyfox92404 at 14/01/2025 at 21:12 UTC
9 upvotes, 0 direct replies
What am I supposed to take away from all this?
That social media algos are based on ad revenue that do not reflect real life and we need to be careful in how these views can affect our mental health. Nor do social media views come with the nuance these topics deserve.
That digital self harm often manifests in the form of "doomscrolling ~~> internalizing generalized messages targeted at us ~~> extreme feelings of guilt or a desperate need to feel accepted ~~> doomscrolling to placate these feelings of guilt or need to be accepted"
That the existence of data does not make a view truthful or present the full issue.
That framing matters. The framing of these topics as an absolute truth but none of these views are truthful in the way you present them even if there's some truth at the center.
That your self-reflection relies on harmful ideas that don't stop once you become this "inherently immoral, physically strong" kind of man that you think you might have to be. That even if you learn to accept this version of you that is based on the harmful internalization of social media views of men, it doesn't lead to a more fulfilling life or more happy life.
And if you don't have the tools to prevent yourself from participating in doomscrolling or other unhealthy behaviors while on social media, that it's ok to separate from social media. I will be honest in saying that this is me too. I don't allow myself to have a facebook, tik tok, IG, snap chat or other social media apps on my phone. It is not good for me and I'll just end up scrolling for bad feels in the quiet parts of my day. I almost exclusively use reddit when it's attached to my keyboard. Otherwise I'll harm myself with it. I have to heavily curate my reddit feed. I don't ever accept youtube's next recommendation. And I never let people tell me who I am.