2021-04-28T00:09:55 #kisslinux <dilyn> that is rough :X
2021-04-28T00:10:03 #kisslinux <dilyn> just means you'll have to upgrade quick :P
2021-04-28T00:10:13 #kisslinux <dilyn> gcc updates always identify poor programming.
2021-04-28T00:10:28 #kisslinux <dilyn> ` error: 'numeric_limits' is not a member of 'std'`
2021-04-28T00:10:40 #kisslinux <midfavila> i'll definitely have to get better speakers soon-ish
2021-04-28T00:10:43 #kisslinux <midfavila> maybe next month
2021-04-28T00:13:18 #kisslinux <dilyn> https://www.amazon.com/Swans-Speakers-M200MKIII-Speaker-HiFi-Tweeters-5-25MidbassDriver-Solid-Cabinet-Highly/dp/B01MTW25ET :P
2021-04-28T00:13:49 #kisslinux <midfavila> >500USD
2021-04-28T00:13:54 #kisslinux <midfavila> i'm good
2021-04-28T00:13:56 #kisslinux <dilyn> :v
2021-04-28T00:14:16 #kisslinux <midfavila> one thing I've been considering doing that isn't related to electronics at all is getting rid of my bed
2021-04-28T00:14:26 #kisslinux <midfavila> and replacing it with a futon.
2021-04-28T00:14:31 #kisslinux <midfavila> not the couch futon
2021-04-28T00:14:35 #kisslinux <dilyn> :X
2021-04-28T00:14:43 #kisslinux <dilyn> slept on a futon for two years, 0/10 would not recommend
2021-04-28T00:15:04 #kisslinux <midfavila> uh, couch-futon or japanese-futon
2021-04-28T00:15:39 #kisslinux <dilyn> i mean isn't that just an air mattress with less steps
2021-04-28T00:16:05 #kisslinux <midfavila> Maybe? I've never used one or talked to someone who has.
2021-04-28T00:16:54 #kisslinux <dilyn> it's probably fine if you get a nice one... but the purpose of a bed+frame is to take advantage of vertical space
2021-04-28T00:16:57 #kisslinux <dilyn> are you hanging plants over your futon
2021-04-28T00:17:42 #kisslinux <midfavila> No, but the advantage of not having to disassemble and haul 100+ pounds of wood, metal and... whatever mattresses are made of around is very nice
2021-04-28T00:28:13 #kisslinux <dilyn> tru
2021-04-28T00:28:35 #kisslinux <dilyn> are all these bugfixes in webengine worth all this effort...
2021-04-28T00:28:45 #kisslinux <dilyn> how insecure is it rn *really*, y'know?
2021-04-28T00:29:04 #kisslinux <necromansy> need some penetration testing ;P
2021-04-28T00:29:19 #kisslinux <dilyn> penetrate my engine
2021-04-28T00:29:44 #kisslinux <dilyn> now i'm worried that if i push this gcc 11.1.0 update, chromium is gonna break for folx
2021-04-28T00:29:50 #kisslinux <dilyn> rip git-bruh
2021-04-28T00:35:34 #kisslinux <acheam> lol
2021-04-28T01:20:49 #kisslinux <dilyn> https://github.com/kiss-community/repo-main/issues/39
2021-04-28T01:20:55 #kisslinux <dilyn> everything builds with almost zero intervention!
2021-04-28T01:21:01 #kisslinux <dilyn> easier than the gcc 10 update
2021-04-28T01:22:37 #kisslinux <noocsharp> neat
2021-04-28T01:22:48 #kisslinux <noocsharp> i wasn't even around for gcc 10
2021-04-28T01:23:31 #kisslinux <dilyn> that was the great fno-common debacle
2021-04-28T01:24:01 #kisslinux <dilyn> this one is just c++ housekeeping (people are not including things they should, like <limits> headers)
2021-04-28T01:24:44 #kisslinux <noocsharp> ah, makes sense then
2021-04-28T01:36:47 #kisslinux <noocsharp> i honestly dont understand how the xorg server can be so big
2021-04-28T01:37:25 #kisslinux <noocsharp> like looking at swc, the core functionality should be on the order of 10s of thousands of lines
2021-04-28T01:37:43 #kisslinux <midfavila> well, you know, it only has to manage input and output from the mouse, keyboard, touchscreens, and god knows what else
2021-04-28T01:37:48 #kisslinux <midfavila> as well as include GPU drivers
2021-04-28T01:37:52 #kisslinux <midfavila> configuration interfaces
2021-04-28T01:37:55 #kisslinux <midfavila> network interfaces
2021-04-28T01:38:00 #kisslinux <midfavila> authentication methods
2021-04-28T01:38:04 #kisslinux <midfavila> etc
2021-04-28T01:38:32 #kisslinux <midfavila> but yes, there's a lot of crap that doesn't need to be there
2021-04-28T01:38:39 #kisslinux <noocsharp> i thought mesa has the gpu drivers
2021-04-28T01:39:13 #kisslinux <midfavila> no
2021-04-28T01:39:19 #kisslinux <midfavila> mesa only provides 3D acceleration
2021-04-28T01:39:24 #kisslinux <midfavila> via access to opengl
2021-04-28T01:39:52 #kisslinux <midfavila> xf86-video-{vesa,intel,amdgpu,ati,noveau} are GPU drivers
2021-04-28T01:39:59 #kisslinux <midfavila> they... are also unusual, in that they run in userspace
2021-04-28T01:40:03 #kisslinux <midfavila> instead of kernelspace
2021-04-28T01:40:19 #kisslinux <noocsharp> oh wait, yeah
2021-04-28T01:40:21 #kisslinux <dilyn> the thing is that xorg is built up over the course of thirty years of hardware support
2021-04-28T01:40:22 #kisslinux <noocsharp> but that isn't in the xorg server
2021-04-28T01:40:33 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's part of Xorg
2021-04-28T01:40:40 #kisslinux <noocsharp> the xorg-server tarball alone contains ~300K lines
2021-04-28T01:40:42 #kisslinux <midfavila> also yes, xorg is amazingly crufty
2021-04-28T01:40:57 #kisslinux <dilyn> until khronos group kicked its rear into gear, graphics on Linux was *still* hell until about five years ago
2021-04-28T01:41:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> honestly, if you could cut out a lot of that cruft and maintain compatiblity, that would be optimal
2021-04-28T01:41:17 #kisslinux <dilyn> the problem is you *can't* do that lmao
2021-04-28T01:41:20 #kisslinux <necromansy> ^
2021-04-28T01:41:24 #kisslinux <midfavila> uh huh.
2021-04-28T01:41:46 #kisslinux <dilyn> the guy who had been maintaining it for the last 15 years said "thanks, but I'm done now", and here we are. at the mercy of RedHat's bug fixes
2021-04-28T01:41:47 #kisslinux <kqz> mesa provides opengl and vulkan drivers (radeonsi, iris, radv, etc)
2021-04-28T01:42:13 #kisslinux <midfavila> i'll probably still be using X in 2030
2021-04-28T01:42:20 #kisslinux <kqz> so on wayland, you don't need the *bloat* xf86-yadda-yadda ;D
2021-04-28T01:42:24 #kisslinux <dilyn> if your hardware is sufficiently new (and new is relative to the last 30 years), mesa provides all the graphics you'd need
2021-04-28T01:42:28 #kisslinux <dilyn> even on xorg
2021-04-28T01:42:32 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's not bloat if it's necessary
2021-04-28T01:42:33 #kisslinux <midfavila> jfc
2021-04-28T01:42:37 #kisslinux <dilyn> i mean, yes
2021-04-28T01:42:44 #kisslinux <noocsharp> but its not
2021-04-28T01:42:48 #kisslinux <midfavila> but it literally is
2021-04-28T01:42:50 #kisslinux <midfavila> if you want to use X
2021-04-28T01:42:57 #kisslinux <dilyn> it's necessary IF you don't have cards supported by mesa
2021-04-28T01:43:05 #kisslinux <dilyn> OR you want to forgo 3D accel et al.
2021-04-28T01:43:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> i mean, *I* could probably get away with not using mesa
2021-04-28T01:43:13 #kisslinux <noocsharp> if you want to use X, not if you want to use desktop linux
2021-04-28T01:43:23 #kisslinux <dilyn> lmao
2021-04-28T01:43:27 #kisslinux <dilyn> gotim
2021-04-28T01:43:29 #kisslinux <kqz> lol
2021-04-28T01:43:40 #kisslinux <midfavila> if I want to use desktop linux, I technically don't even need a GUI.
2021-04-28T01:43:42 #kisslinux <dilyn> mid clearly doesn't want to use desktop Linux tho. They want to use 90s aesthetic Linux
2021-04-28T01:43:47 #kisslinux <midfavila> look
2021-04-28T01:43:49 #kisslinux <midfavila> if I had the option
2021-04-28T01:43:52 #kisslinux <midfavila> i'd be running QNX
2021-04-28T01:43:53 #kisslinux <dilyn> they want mainframe Linux
2021-04-28T01:44:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> or fuck, HURD
2021-04-28T01:44:09 #kisslinux <midfavila> but HURD is a turd
2021-04-28T01:44:11 #kisslinux <dilyn> do it
2021-04-28T01:44:20 #kisslinux <midfavila> sorry, but I don't have any PC ATs laying around
2021-04-28T01:44:45 #kisslinux <midfavila> next time I find a 386 box I'll be sure to install GNU HURD+Guix
2021-04-28T01:45:41 #kisslinux <noocsharp> i wouldn't even try it for the meme
2021-04-28T01:46:21 #kisslinux <dilyn> it's not even a meme
2021-04-28T01:46:27 #kisslinux <dilyn> people unironically do that shit :X
2021-04-28T01:46:32 #kisslinux <midfavila> all these kids with their memes and dreams
2021-04-28T01:46:39 #kisslinux <necromansy> some people are a bit weird hey
2021-04-28T01:46:40 #kisslinux <midfavila> i just wanna coooooompute, gosh dang nabbit
2021-04-28T01:46:46 #kisslinux <dilyn> schemes and teams
2021-04-28T01:46:59 #kisslinux <dilyn> I mean shit, we're definitely weird
2021-04-28T01:47:14 #kisslinux <dilyn> well outside the norm. nobody here uses electron
2021-04-28T01:47:23 #kisslinux <midfavila> dilyn s/electron/flutter/
2021-04-28T01:47:26 #kisslinux <dilyn> lol
2021-04-28T01:47:32 #kisslinux <dilyn> nobody uses flutter yet(tm)
2021-04-28T01:47:44 #kisslinux <dilyn> kvm works fine on KISS right?
2021-04-28T01:47:49 #kisslinux <midfavila> yes
2021-04-28T01:47:51 #kisslinux <necromansy> electron
2021-04-28T01:47:51 #kisslinux <midfavila> I use it regularly
2021-04-28T01:47:53 #kisslinux * necromansy pukes
2021-04-28T01:47:55 #kisslinux <dilyn> we should just start recommending KVM passthrough instead of chroots honestly
2021-04-28T01:48:02 #kisslinux <dilyn> for re: gaming
2021-04-28T01:48:04 #kisslinux <noocsharp> did y'all see the mighty web browser?
2021-04-28T01:48:10 #kisslinux <midfavila> which browser
2021-04-28T01:48:12 #kisslinux <dilyn> Web Browser
2021-04-28T01:48:15 #kisslinux <midfavila> ah yes
2021-04-28T01:48:18 #kisslinux <midfavila> i have it packaged
2021-04-28T01:48:22 #kisslinux <kqz> well, that's only really viable if you have dual gpu's or are willing to use effectively one system at a time ;d
2021-04-28T01:48:27 #kisslinux <noocsharp> its called mighty
2021-04-28T01:48:30 #kisslinux <midfavila> oh
2021-04-28T01:48:33 #kisslinux <necromansy> lmao
2021-04-28T01:48:37 #kisslinux <noocsharp> https://www.mightyapp.com/
2021-04-28T01:48:39 #kisslinux <dilyn> I'd gladly cut my system in half :v
2021-04-28T01:48:57 #kisslinux <midfavila> >browser
2021-04-28T01:48:58 #kisslinux <dilyn> oh damn i could use KVM to have windows change my hardware's RGB
2021-04-28T01:48:59 #kisslinux <midfavila> >from the cloud
2021-04-28T01:48:59 #kisslinux <dilyn> genius.
2021-04-28T01:49:04 #kisslinux <necromansy> NO
2021-04-28T01:49:05 #kisslinux <necromansy> stop
2021-04-28T01:49:09 #kisslinux <noocsharp> its an electron app
2021-04-28T01:49:09 #kisslinux <necromansy> this is awful
2021-04-28T01:49:09 #kisslinux <midfavila> WEB BROWSING AS A SERVICE
2021-04-28T01:49:12 #kisslinux <midfavila> WHAT THE FUCK
2021-04-28T01:49:18 #kisslinux <midfavila> THE ABSOLUTE STATE OF COMPUTING
2021-04-28T01:49:19 #kisslinux <dilyn> their website is nice looking
2021-04-28T01:49:41 #kisslinux <kqz> maybe someday we can have someting ala SR-IOV on consumer grade cards so we don't have to compromise, looking glass is great software
2021-04-28T01:49:43 #kisslinux <necromansy> its nice looking but theres so much moving bits
2021-04-28T01:49:57 #kisslinux <dilyn> people are unironically spinning up VPSs for chrome now? incredible
2021-04-28T01:50:25 #kisslinux <dilyn> can't wait until the days where I have to plug a Pi 42 into my computer so I can use it as a browser offload
2021-04-28T01:50:31 #kisslinux <dilyn> crunch my tabs pls small SOC
2021-04-28T01:50:43 #kisslinux <noocsharp> im seeing the next level of abstraction manifest before my eyes
2021-04-28T01:50:49 #kisslinux <necromansy> tbh tho i do find the idea of just going "welp web browsers are shit and a resource drain, lets just use the cloud"
2021-04-28T01:50:53 #kisslinux <necromansy> a neat one
2021-04-28T01:51:09 #kisslinux <dilyn> honestly, it's the most obvious solution
2021-04-28T01:51:15 #kisslinux <dilyn> effectively sandbox your browser
2021-04-28T01:51:26 #kisslinux <dilyn> for all your school/facebook/cruft needs
2021-04-28T01:51:36 #kisslinux <dilyn> local browser for your Real Shit(tm)
2021-04-28T01:52:13 #kisslinux <midfavila> I don't...
2021-04-28T01:52:13 #kisslinux <midfavila> no
2021-04-28T01:52:17 #kisslinux <midfavila> that site has to be a meme
2021-04-28T01:52:24 #kisslinux <kqz> think i'll just stick to wrapping my browser in bubblewrap ;d
2021-04-28T01:52:26 #kisslinux <midfavila> there's no way
2021-04-28T01:52:28 #kisslinux <midfavila> there's no fucking way
2021-04-28T01:52:31 #kisslinux <midfavila> i refuse to believe
2021-04-28T01:52:34 #kisslinux <dilyn> https://www.notion.so/Mighty-is-hiring-945d3168d3e34a37883ca4d823ed734f they're hiring mid
2021-04-28T01:52:44 #kisslinux <midfavila> I'm going undercover as a soydev
2021-04-28T01:52:48 #kisslinux <midfavila> to destroy them from the inside
2021-04-28T01:52:59 #kisslinux <necromansy> tbh if it wasnt an electron app id try it
2021-04-28T01:53:01 #kisslinux <necromansy> but uh
2021-04-28T01:53:02 #kisslinux <midfavila> dilyn, help me cop the san-fran hipster look
2021-04-28T01:53:03 #kisslinux <necromansy> fuck that
2021-04-28T01:53:08 #kisslinux <midfavila> i gotta blend in
2021-04-28T01:53:16 #kisslinux <midfavila> i know that I have to start drinking soy vanilla lattes
2021-04-28T01:53:19 #kisslinux <midfavila> and using a macbook and iphone
2021-04-28T01:53:22 #kisslinux <midfavila> and programming in rust
2021-04-28T01:53:24 #kisslinux <midfavila> but what else
2021-04-28T01:53:38 #kisslinux <necromansy> trust me soy vanilla lattes are better than the culture suggests :P
2021-04-28T01:53:54 #kisslinux <dilyn> just do roughly what I do
2021-04-28T01:54:02 #kisslinux <dilyn> you know what I look like. do that .
2021-04-28T01:54:12 #kisslinux <kqz> lol
2021-04-28T01:54:33 #kisslinux <midfavila> hmm
2021-04-28T01:54:44 #kisslinux <midfavila> do I dye my hair
2021-04-28T01:54:46 #kisslinux <midfavila> or is that too much
2021-04-28T01:54:59 #kisslinux <necromansy> also ive reached the age where im gonna just do a thing and exist fuck whats "cringe"
2021-04-28T01:55:13 #kisslinux <midfavila> that's cringe bro
2021-04-28T01:55:18 #kisslinux <midfavila> imagine not caring about social status
2021-04-28T01:55:19 #kisslinux <midfavila> cringe
2021-04-28T01:55:23 #kisslinux <midfavila> cringe cringe cringe
2021-04-28T01:55:25 #kisslinux <necromansy> yes
2021-04-28T01:55:32 #kisslinux <midfavila> wow what an out of touch boomer
2021-04-28T01:55:36 #kisslinux <midfavila> cringe!
2021-04-28T01:57:55 #kisslinux <necromansy> unrelated but submitted revised version of my first manuscript to a journal
2021-04-28T01:58:32 #kisslinux <noocsharp> what's it on?
2021-04-28T01:58:58 #kisslinux <midfavila> social media and the negative effects it has on society
2021-04-28T01:59:06 #kisslinux <necromansy> methods of estimating a ratio of electric fields in near-Earth space to magnetic fields on the ground
2021-04-28T02:00:40 #kisslinux <midfavila> how very sciency
2021-04-28T02:00:50 #kisslinux <necromansy> yes
2021-04-28T02:01:00 #kisslinux <necromansy> being a science phd does result in science
2021-04-28T02:01:13 #kisslinux <midfavila> idk, are you sure about that
2021-04-28T02:01:16 #kisslinux <midfavila> where's the proof?
2021-04-28T02:01:21 #kisslinux <necromansy> idk ill run some tests
2021-04-28T02:01:28 #kisslinux <necromansy> get back to you in uh, a few months
2021-04-28T02:01:28 #kisslinux <dilyn> `error: 'strncpy' was not declared in this scope` fucking lazy-ass devs
2021-04-28T02:01:30 #kisslinux <midfavila> come back to me with the results
2021-04-28T02:01:36 #kisslinux <dilyn> pay attention to your code you god damn hooligans
2021-04-28T02:01:40 #kisslinux <midfavila> if your results fit my worldview, I will accept them
2021-04-28T02:01:46 #kisslinux <midfavila> otherwise, you're a charlatan
2021-04-28T02:02:06 #kisslinux <dilyn> he studies physics he can only be a charlatan to philosophers
2021-04-28T02:02:09 #kisslinux * necromansy sweats
2021-04-28T02:02:22 #kisslinux <midfavila> i mean
2021-04-28T02:02:25 #kisslinux * dilyn doubts
2021-04-28T02:02:28 #kisslinux <midfavila> i watched a five minute video about diogenes
2021-04-28T02:02:33 #kisslinux <midfavila> i'm basically a philosopher
2021-04-28T02:03:19 #kisslinux <dilyn> i mean
2021-04-28T02:03:29 #kisslinux <dilyn> better than 80% of the undergraduate philosophy majors I met
2021-04-28T02:03:37 #kisslinux <noocsharp> dilyn: what did that error come from?
2021-04-28T02:04:05 #kisslinux <dilyn> qt5-webengine
2021-04-28T02:04:11 #kisslinux <dilyn> one of the many chromium bits
2021-04-28T02:04:17 #kisslinux <noocsharp> ha
2021-04-28T02:04:32 #kisslinux <dilyn> i'm doing all this work for nothing too, because in about two weeks it'll all be fixed anyways smh
2021-04-28T02:04:58 #kisslinux <midfavila> my experience with philosophy is like
2021-04-28T02:04:59 #kisslinux <dilyn> but the goal is to have a consistently buildable webengine in community YET AGAIN
2021-04-28T02:04:59 #kisslinux <midfavila> some videos
2021-04-28T02:05:04 #kisslinux <midfavila> and a few wikipedia entries
2021-04-28T02:05:13 #kisslinux <midfavila> and just generally having a lot of r/iam14andthisisdeep shower thoughts
2021-04-28T02:05:21 #kisslinux <dilyn> lol
2021-04-28T02:05:24 #kisslinux <dilyn> study logic mid
2021-04-28T02:05:26 #kisslinux <dilyn> it's rewarding af
2021-04-28T02:05:32 #kisslinux <midfavila> i mean, I intend to
2021-04-28T02:05:34 #kisslinux <necromansy> philosophy is a deep dive, ive recently had brushes with Hegalian stuff
2021-04-28T02:05:35 #kisslinux <necromansy> and uh
2021-04-28T02:05:38 #kisslinux * necromansy sweats
2021-04-28T02:05:40 #kisslinux <necromansy> its a lot
2021-04-28T02:05:41 #kisslinux <dilyn> f
2021-04-28T02:05:50 #kisslinux <midfavila> but i have a lot of stuff on the list of "To Do, Soon, Maybe, Definitely, Possibly:tm:"
2021-04-28T02:06:05 #kisslinux <dilyn> logic is nice because you can just pick *one thing* and do it forever
2021-04-28T02:06:24 #kisslinux <midfavila> i'm learning about linear algebra right now, and C, and sec+, and whatever the fuck my college is doing at the moment
2021-04-28T02:06:42 #kisslinux <necromansy> ahh linear algebra
2021-04-28T02:06:50 #kisslinux <necromansy> i need to learn that properly >_>
2021-04-28T02:07:02 #kisslinux <midfavila> i took pre-algebra in high school as part of the business maths course I was pushed into
2021-04-28T02:07:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> but like
2021-04-28T02:07:13 #kisslinux <midfavila> that's the extent of my numeracy
2021-04-28T02:07:19 #kisslinux <midfavila> and I intend to correct that
2021-04-28T02:07:21 #kisslinux <dilyn> it's overrated
2021-04-28T02:07:35 #kisslinux <necromansy> its important for like math understanding and some physics
2021-04-28T02:07:39 #kisslinux <necromansy> lin alg that is
2021-04-28T02:07:46 #kisslinux <midfavila> that's part of why I want to learn more about it
2021-04-28T02:07:51 #kisslinux <dilyn> mmhmm
2021-04-28T02:07:55 #kisslinux <dilyn> but physics is also overrated so
2021-04-28T02:07:56 #kisslinux <midfavila> i'd like to learn about physics, and differential and integral calculus, too
2021-04-28T02:08:05 #kisslinux <dilyn> if you want to learn linear algebra, look up Gilbert Strang's lectures
2021-04-28T02:08:21 #kisslinux <necromansy> ill have you know that i am deeply offended by your statement
2021-04-28T02:08:23 #kisslinux <necromansy> :<
2021-04-28T02:08:23 #kisslinux <noocsharp> Linear Algebra Done Right
2021-04-28T02:08:24 #kisslinux <dilyn> he has a very good series on basically every feature of linear algebra you might ever need. he exhausts the field
2021-04-28T02:08:36 #kisslinux <midfavila> er... I think I'll stick with Khan Academy for now...
2021-04-28T02:08:38 #kisslinux <dilyn> Linear Algebra Done Wrong >>>> Done Right
2021-04-28T02:08:41 #kisslinux <noocsharp> true
2021-04-28T02:08:58 #kisslinux <dilyn> not just because it's the book I learned it from lmao
2021-04-28T02:09:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> as it stands I'm working through algebra 1
2021-04-28T02:09:15 #kisslinux <necromansy> ill deffo look into that too
2021-04-28T02:09:15 #kisslinux <dilyn> the fun stuff!
2021-04-28T02:09:17 #kisslinux <midfavila> and then algebra 2
2021-04-28T02:09:17 #kisslinux <midfavila> and then linear algebra itself
2021-04-28T02:09:27 #kisslinux <midfavila> and there's a web development course that I've been doing a little bit of
2021-04-28T02:09:33 #kisslinux <noocsharp> what distinguishes algebra 1 from algebra 2?
2021-04-28T02:09:34 #kisslinux <noocsharp> i forget
2021-04-28T02:09:36 #kisslinux <dilyn> the best thing about linear algebra is that it's essentially completely solved, and there are only four major topics
2021-04-28T02:09:41 #kisslinux <necromansy> i mostly fuck with calc and dsp atm
2021-04-28T02:09:41 #kisslinux <midfavila> algebra 1 is simpler than algebra 2
2021-04-28T02:09:48 #kisslinux <midfavila> that's it
2021-04-28T02:09:51 #kisslinux <midfavila> it deals with like
2021-04-28T02:10:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> multivariable equations, balancing stuff, qudratics (I think...)
2021-04-28T02:10:07 #kisslinux <dilyn> algebra 2 deals with exponentials/logarithms more rigorously (if at all), more nonlinear equations, and harder probability/statistics
2021-04-28T02:10:25 #kisslinux <midfavila> s/.qudratics/quadratics/
2021-04-28T02:10:25 #kisslinux <movzbl> <midfavila> multivariable equations, balancing stuff,quadratics (I think...)
2021-04-28T02:10:29 #kisslinux <dilyn> broadly speaking, from an american perspective (having taught both courses)
2021-04-28T02:11:02 #kisslinux <noocsharp> its been many years since i took them
2021-04-28T02:11:11 #kisslinux <dilyn> ... a decade
2021-04-28T02:11:12 #kisslinux <dilyn> hnnnggg
2021-04-28T02:11:38 #kisslinux <acheam> aaaaaa I take a break from doing homework only to see that yall are talking about math
2021-04-28T02:11:41 #kisslinux <noocsharp> 5 years for me
2021-04-28T02:11:52 #kisslinux <dilyn> math is bae
2021-04-28T02:11:54 #kisslinux <necromansy> im procrastinating research by talking about math
2021-04-28T02:12:07 #kisslinux <dilyn> procrastinating
2021-04-28T02:12:18 #kisslinux <dilyn> when what y'all SHOULD be doing is rebuilding your community packages for gcc 11!
2021-04-28T02:12:19 #kisslinux <midfavila> i just feel like learning more about arithmetics and other elementary fields will help with learning the fundaments of programming down the line
2021-04-28T02:12:25 #kisslinux <dilyn> yes
2021-04-28T02:12:32 #kisslinux <necromansy> yeah for sure
2021-04-28T02:12:47 #kisslinux <dilyn> up to linear algebra, and if you want ML multivariable calc and stats
2021-04-28T02:12:50 #kisslinux <midfavila> because, shockingly, not understanding what summation is makes it hard to learn programming through implementing summation
2021-04-28T02:12:59 #kisslinux <necromansy> coming into programming with some math/physics has helped with programming stuff
2021-04-28T02:13:21 #kisslinux <necromansy> but obvi im a physicist first and computer scientist uh...last?
2021-04-28T02:13:23 #kisslinux <midfavila> i've been doing ten or so hours a day for the past couple weeks
2021-04-28T02:13:26 #kisslinux <dilyn> honestly I just cross my fingers and hope the compiler spits out helpful error messages
2021-04-28T02:13:44 #kisslinux <midfavila> and i've made... okay progress. less than I'd like, but I've corrected a lot of fundamental errors in my knowledge
2021-04-28T02:13:51 #kisslinux <necromansy> math for sure doesnt help understanding wtf error codes mean
2021-04-28T02:13:51 #kisslinux <necromansy> kek
2021-04-28T02:13:58 #kisslinux <dilyn> :'(
2021-04-28T02:14:04 #kisslinux <midfavila> error code 1
2021-04-28T02:14:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> aka
2021-04-28T02:14:08 #kisslinux <midfavila> "we failed"
2021-04-28T02:14:11 #kisslinux <midfavila> the best error
2021-04-28T02:14:15 #kisslinux <necromansy> s/math/maths
2021-04-28T02:14:16 #kisslinux <dilyn> f
2021-04-28T02:14:24 #kisslinux <noocsharp> s/maths/math
2021-04-28T02:14:35 #kisslinux <midfavila> mathemagicks
2021-04-28T02:14:37 #kisslinux <dilyn> I'd like to think that if I actually wrote foo.c I would be smart enough to include <string.h>
2021-04-28T02:15:02 #kisslinux <midfavila> i've spoken to people in CS courses who couldn't write hello world in C
2021-04-28T02:15:04 #kisslinux <dilyn> qt and google make me so bitter jesus
2021-04-28T02:15:07 #kisslinux <midfavila> because they forgot to include the stdlib
2021-04-28T02:15:19 #kisslinux <midfavila> dilyn wait until just turning on your computer makes you angry
2021-04-28T02:15:22 #kisslinux <noocsharp> i would have included it if only because i had to look at the man page to check the parameters lol
2021-04-28T02:15:23 #kisslinux <dilyn> main() { printf 'fuck u' }
2021-04-28T02:15:30 #kisslinux <midfavila> >all on one line
2021-04-28T02:15:32 #kisslinux <midfavila> abomination
2021-04-28T02:15:34 #kisslinux <midfavila> be GONE
2021-04-28T02:15:46 #kisslinux <necromansy> its readable idk what you want from him
2021-04-28T02:15:47 #kisslinux <necromansy> lmao
2021-04-28T02:15:53 #kisslinux <dilyn> vertical space is bloat
2021-04-28T02:15:56 #kisslinux <midfavila> muh K&R style
2021-04-28T02:16:17 #kisslinux <noocsharp> its valid shell script
2021-04-28T02:16:21 #kisslinux <noocsharp> oh wait
2021-04-28T02:16:25 #kisslinux <dilyn> I say this, but bubger generates all of its html as a *single line*
2021-04-28T02:16:28 #kisslinux <dilyn> and I fucking hate it lmao
2021-04-28T02:16:32 #kisslinux <midfavila> ...
2021-04-28T02:16:36 #kisslinux * midfavila inhales
2021-04-28T02:16:36 #kisslinux <necromansy> why
2021-04-28T02:16:41 #kisslinux <necromansy> why would any program do that
2021-04-28T02:16:47 #kisslinux <dilyn> probably because you shouldn't have to edit it
2021-04-28T02:16:49 #kisslinux <midfavila> REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
2021-04-28T02:16:51 #kisslinux <dilyn> and you don't
2021-04-28T02:16:52 #kisslinux <dilyn> lmao
2021-04-28T02:16:53 #kisslinux <dilyn> UNLESS
2021-04-28T02:16:54 #kisslinux <necromansy> yeah fair
2021-04-28T02:17:07 #kisslinux <noocsharp> save bytes by excluding newlines
2021-04-28T02:17:10 #kisslinux <midfavila> if you don't literally write your website's html by hand then what are you even doing
2021-04-28T02:17:11 #kisslinux <dilyn> the way your generating those pages results in duplicate entries because you're a fuck who can't properly write sieve
2021-04-28T02:17:26 #kisslinux <dilyn> mid it converts mbox to html
2021-04-28T02:17:31 #kisslinux <dilyn> i ain't got time for that
2021-04-28T02:17:42 #kisslinux <dilyn> 'converts', i should say
2021-04-28T02:17:51 #kisslinux <midfavila> if I was going to use anything for writing pages, it would be a template and m4
2021-04-28T02:17:59 #kisslinux <dilyn> do NOT make me learn m4
2021-04-28T02:18:02 #kisslinux <dilyn> m4, yacc, flex
2021-04-28T02:18:04 #kisslinux <dilyn> get out
2021-04-28T02:18:10 #kisslinux <midfavila> ''``''`'`''`''`''`'`''`'`'''`'`'
2021-04-28T02:18:15 #kisslinux <midfavila> the language of m4 beckons
2021-04-28T02:18:24 #kisslinux <midfavila> embrace the backtick
2021-04-28T02:18:38 #kisslinux <midfavila> actually, for a while I abused the C preprocessor for writing text files
2021-04-28T02:18:43 #kisslinux <midfavila> until I realized that maybe I shouldn't do that
2021-04-28T02:19:02 #kisslinux <noocsharp> thats what shell script is for
2021-04-28T02:19:09 #kisslinux <midfavila> i still use it in my xresources files though
2021-04-28T02:19:16 #kisslinux <necromansy> wait in what sense
2021-04-28T02:19:20 #kisslinux * necromansy confused
2021-04-28T02:19:22 #kisslinux <midfavila> #define
2021-04-28T02:19:27 #kisslinux <necromansy> ah
2021-04-28T02:19:32 #kisslinux <acheam> uhh
2021-04-28T02:19:36 #kisslinux <acheam> that gives me pain
2021-04-28T02:19:45 #kisslinux <midfavila> wait until you learn about imake
2021-04-28T02:19:48 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's like make
2021-04-28T02:19:50 #kisslinux <midfavila> except
2021-04-28T02:19:57 #kisslinux <midfavila> it uses the c preprocessor
2021-04-28T02:20:00 #kisslinux <midfavila> instead of autotools
2021-04-28T02:20:06 #kisslinux <acheam> /no/
2021-04-28T02:20:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's extremely cursed and I hate using it
2021-04-28T02:20:18 #kisslinux <midfavila> but that's what people used before autotools
2021-04-28T02:20:23 #kisslinux <noocsharp> but you can literally just do the same thing with make
2021-04-28T02:20:47 #kisslinux <midfavila> hey man, I just follow the 33 year old standard
2021-04-28T02:20:49 #kisslinux <midfavila> i didn't write it
2021-04-28T02:22:12 #kisslinux <midfavila> oh, one thing I'll say I'm glad I learned from high school math though
2021-04-28T02:22:16 #kisslinux <midfavila> calculating compound interest
2021-04-28T02:22:46 #kisslinux <midfavila> of all the stuff they taught, that's what stuck with me the most. because compound interest is terrifying
2021-04-28T02:24:18 #kisslinux <dilyn> P(1+r/n)^(nt)
2021-04-28T02:24:20 #kisslinux <dilyn> is bae
2021-04-28T02:24:54 #kisslinux <midfavila> the important lesson wasn't actually how to compute it
2021-04-28T02:25:00 #kisslinux <midfavila> but rather how fast it spirals
2021-04-28T02:25:07 #kisslinux <dilyn> the answer?
2021-04-28T02:25:08 #kisslinux <dilyn> hella2021-04-28T02:25:13 #kisslinux <midfavila> that was the class that put me off ever taking out a loan
2021-04-28T02:25:35 #kisslinux <midfavila> i don't care if it takes me ten times as long to get to the same point, I refuse to take on debt
2021-04-28T02:25:44 #kisslinux <midfavila> same point as anyone else*
2021-04-28T02:26:21 #kisslinux <dilyn> if you're lucky enough to get a credit card with a solid cash back program tho...
2021-04-28T02:26:25 #kisslinux <midfavila> nope
2021-04-28T02:26:27 #kisslinux <midfavila> don't care
2021-04-28T02:26:27 #kisslinux <dilyn> use the card to buy groceries
2021-04-28T02:26:31 #kisslinux <midfavila> refuse to get a credit card
2021-04-28T02:26:37 #kisslinux <dilyn> because you budgeted for it anways :v
2021-04-28T02:26:37 #kisslinux <midfavila> i don't like having a debit card as is
2021-04-28T02:26:46 #kisslinux <midfavila> and yeah, I understand the idea behind it
2021-04-28T02:26:53 #kisslinux <dilyn> some banks let you blacklist entire merchants from being valid purchases nowadays. v cool
2021-04-28T02:26:56 #kisslinux <midfavila> use it for little things that can be easily paid back, whatever
2021-04-28T02:27:04 #kisslinux <midfavila> but I want as little involvement with the banks as possible
2021-04-28T02:27:34 #kisslinux <midfavila> i'm about two steps away from buying a safe, closing my account, and shoving all my money into the safe
2021-04-28T02:28:00 #kisslinux <dilyn> I don't even know how to pay anything efficiently without a bank
2021-04-28T02:28:08 #kisslinux <dilyn> i don't even think my landlord accepts cashier's checks
2021-04-28T02:28:11 #kisslinux <midfavila> cash if in person, prepaids online
2021-04-28T02:28:20 #kisslinux <midfavila> otherwise get fucked
2021-04-28T02:28:28 #kisslinux <dilyn> prepaids still run through banks tho
2021-04-28T02:28:42 #kisslinux <midfavila> prepaids can't be tracked as easily, as far as I'm aware
2021-04-28T02:28:54 #kisslinux <dilyn> i mean if i'm paying my landlord
2021-04-28T02:28:59 #kisslinux <dilyn> -> tracked
2021-04-28T02:29:05 #kisslinux <midfavila> if I'm paying my landlord I'm paying in cash.
2021-04-28T02:29:23 #kisslinux <midfavila> card is for online stuff only.
2021-04-28T02:29:30 #kisslinux <dilyn> my employer doesn't even do physical checks anymore
2021-04-28T02:29:33 #kisslinux <dilyn> :'(
2021-04-28T02:29:40 #kisslinux <midfavila> ridiculous
2021-04-28T02:30:16 #kisslinux <midfavila> back when I worked at a local taco joint my boss offered to pay me in bitcoin
2021-04-28T02:30:18 #kisslinux <midfavila> that was...
2021-04-28T02:30:20 #kisslinux <midfavila> interesting
2021-04-28T02:31:00 #kisslinux <dilyn> take that in a heart beat
2021-04-28T02:31:02 #kisslinux <midfavila> said taco joint also has a crypto ATM and accepts payment in bitcoin. which is... weird.
2021-04-28T02:31:11 #kisslinux <dilyn> what wild times we live in
2021-04-28T02:31:14 #kisslinux <midfavila> like, of all shops, it's a fucking mexican food place
2021-04-28T02:31:21 #kisslinux <necromansy> man crypto is weird.
2021-04-28T02:31:33 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's not like they're smuggling cocaine in the creases of the pitas
2021-04-28T02:31:50 #kisslinux <midfavila> the owner of the franchise just really likes crypto.
2021-04-28T02:31:58 #kisslinux <midfavila> mind you, he was also a total dick
2021-04-28T02:32:06 #kisslinux <necromansy> oh yeah no, crypto isnt always sus
2021-04-28T02:32:08 #kisslinux <necromansy> its just weird
2021-04-28T02:32:10 #kisslinux <midfavila> so I left after like a month and a half of working there
2021-04-28T02:32:43 #kisslinux <midfavila> minimum wage isn't worth being screamed at for eight hours a day
2021-04-28T02:33:23 #kisslinux <necromansy> yeah good onya
2021-04-28T02:33:49 #kisslinux <midfavila> he came up to me in the middle of my shift, threatened to fire me, I pussied out and then five minutes later threw my hat and badge at him as I left
2021-04-28T02:34:00 #kisslinux <midfavila> ...then I promptly broke down and cried on the sidewalk, which kind of ruined the moment
2021-04-28T02:34:06 #kisslinux <necromansy> my fiancee works at a petrol station and got berated yesterday by a woman for calling her "ma'am" coz "its american not australian"
2021-04-28T02:34:18 #kisslinux <dilyn> kek
2021-04-28T02:34:26 #kisslinux <midfavila> i wasn't aware that american was a different language from australian
2021-04-28T02:34:51 #kisslinux <dilyn> you can tell they're different because one of them is less eloquent
2021-04-28T02:34:54 #kisslinux <dilyn> and the other is australian
2021-04-28T02:35:16 #kisslinux <midfavila> :thinking:
2021-04-28T02:35:22 #kisslinux <necromansy> she was telling me about it and i was like "you should have said 'aight cunt'" and been "is that aussie enough?"
2021-04-28T02:35:28 #kisslinux <midfavila> lmfao
2021-04-28T02:36:28 #kisslinux <dilyn> barbie cunt kangaroo tosser foster's wildfire fight me
2021-04-28T02:36:44 #kisslinux <dilyn> dingo dingo banana hammock
2021-04-28T02:36:58 #kisslinux <necromansy> idk why she was so incensed by being called ma'am anyway
2021-04-28T02:37:11 #kisslinux <midfavila> assuming pronouns in current year
2021-04-28T02:37:12 #kisslinux <midfavila> or something
2021-04-28T02:37:14 #kisslinux <necromansy> nah
2021-04-28T02:37:34 #kisslinux <dilyn> boomer's get mad when you DON'T assume their pronouns
2021-04-28T02:37:49 #kisslinux <necromansy> it was more "how dare you speak to me in a way that isn't true old school aussie fashion"
2021-04-28T02:38:47 #kisslinux <kqz> lol what would be "old school aussie fashion"? ma'am in my american mind is already rather old school and formal
2021-04-28T02:38:53 #kisslinux <necromansy> mate
2021-04-28T02:39:17 #kisslinux <dilyn> m8 h8 d8 r8
2021-04-28T02:40:59 #kisslinux <necromansy> its a coastal coal mining town so its true blue aussie with some of the locals
2021-04-28T02:41:00 #kisslinux <kqz> ha interesting, i woulda thought that one being the more informal one
2021-04-28T02:41:05 #kisslinux <necromansy> yeah
2021-04-28T02:41:08 #kisslinux <necromansy> thats the point
2021-04-28T02:41:17 #kisslinux <necromansy> we're suckers for informality
2021-04-28T02:42:08 #kisslinux <kqz> lol, so informal it's formal, informalception
2021-04-28T02:42:40 #kisslinux <necromansy> yeah basically lmao, the whole meme of "everyone's ya mate" in rural towns is pretty real
2021-04-28T02:43:33 #kisslinux <kqz> seems like a good mindset to have i guess, barring this one weird incident ;d
2021-04-28T02:44:15 #kisslinux <necromansy> yeah i mean the lady could have just said it outright instead of chucking a shitty tbh
2021-04-28T02:44:15 #kisslinux <noocsharp> apparently in english, 'thou' used to be the informal version of 'you', but then 'thou' disappeared and now we think of it as formal
2021-04-28T02:44:42 #kisslinux <noocsharp> sounds like a similar kind of swap
2021-04-28T02:44:43 #kisslinux <dilyn> languages are weird
2021-04-28T02:45:59 #kisslinux <necromansy> but people are a weird lot and get aggro, one bloke got real shitty with the manager coz she told him he'd have to prepay his petrol coz his car plates were dinged up
2021-04-28T02:46:18 #kisslinux <necromansy> i.e. no way to verify the car if he decided to do a runner without paying
2021-04-28T02:48:42 #kisslinux <noocsharp> maybe someone at another gas station dinged up his plates because he tried to do the same thing there
2021-04-28T02:52:51 #kisslinux <necromansy> maybe, people do love doing runners on petrol
2021-04-28T02:52:53 #kisslinux <necromansy> kek
2021-04-28T02:54:37 #kisslinux <noocsharp> wait, do y'all have to go inside a gas station to pay in general?
2021-04-28T02:54:44 #kisslinux <necromansy> yeah
2021-04-28T02:55:02 #kisslinux <noocsharp> huh, weird
2021-04-28T02:58:23 #kisslinux <dilyn> `env: exec python3: No such file or directory` wtf is this doing in my kernel
2021-04-28T02:58:32 #kisslinux <necromansy> what tf why
2021-04-28T02:58:50 #kisslinux <noocsharp> wdym in your kernel?
2021-04-28T02:59:06 #kisslinux <dilyn> tried to build 5.12 and i got this message sm h
2021-04-28T03:00:08 #kisslinux <dilyn> presumably caused by `  GEN     .tmp_initcalls.lds`
2021-04-28T03:03:06 #kisslinux <dilyn> hard system crashes are no fun and they keep happenign
2021-04-28T03:03:53 #kisslinux <midfavila> crashin', crashin', crashin', craaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaash
2021-04-28T03:06:11 #kisslinux <dilyn> hikari doesn't support wlr-output-management-unstable-v1
2021-04-28T03:06:19 #kisslinux <dilyn> which means kanshi won't work to change monitor settings
2021-04-28T03:06:30 #kisslinux <dilyn> ffs I guess I've been forced into using *shudder* sway
2021-04-28T03:06:33 #kisslinux <midfavila> waylet destroyed
2021-04-28T03:06:42 #kisslinux <dilyn> :'(
2021-04-28T03:08:24 #kisslinux <noocsharp> im in the process of porting svkbd to wayland
2021-04-28T03:08:46 #kisslinux <noocsharp> so far its 100 lines shorter
2021-04-28T03:12:02 #kisslinux <dilyn> noice
2021-04-28T03:15:12 #kisslinux <midfavila> https://vid.puffyan.us/watch?v=Ti6JL491oyA
2021-04-28T03:15:21 #kisslinux <midfavila> when will KISS have support for Protocol Seven?
2021-04-28T03:29:24 #kisslinux <acheam> finally switched from bitwarden to pass
2021-04-28T03:29:53 #kisslinux <acheam> I tried keepassxc first, but switched away when I saw the dependency list
2021-04-28T03:29:55 #kisslinux <midfavila> imagine using a password manager
2021-04-28T03:37:59 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> Hi
2021-04-28T03:38:05 #kisslinux <midfavila> iH
2021-04-28T03:38:24 #kisslinux <necromansy> heyhey
2021-04-28T03:40:34 #kisslinux <noocsharp> howdy
2021-04-28T03:51:51 #kisslinux <acheam> hey testuser_[m]
2021-04-28T03:54:53 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> dilyn: https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/chromium/blob/rawhide/f/chromium-gcc11.patch
2021-04-28T04:08:30 #kisslinux <dilyn> wowee is that all chromium required?
2021-04-28T04:08:36 #kisslinux <dilyn> ofc all my problems are qt's fault
2021-04-28T05:38:39 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> bruh why is busybox patch so dumb
2021-04-28T05:39:18 #kisslinux <dilyn> because if it were smarter it'd be gnu
2021-04-28T05:40:53 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> http://ix.io/3i9F
2021-04-28T05:41:34 #kisslinux <necromansy> is this hecken unicode
2021-04-28T05:43:46 #kisslinux <dilyn> kek
2021-04-28T06:47:12 #kisslinux <icy> h
2021-04-28T06:50:43 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> hi
2021-04-28T09:17:57 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> https://www.mightyapp.com/ wtf
2021-04-28T09:17:59 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> You use your browser to access another browser running in the cloud
2021-04-28T09:28:55 #kisslinux <tink> i'm about to tear down my laptop's screen frame without any youtube or iFixit guides to follow, i'm scared
2021-04-28T12:03:43 #kisslinux <acheam> tnk good luck
2021-04-28T12:04:32 #kisslinux <acheam> testuser_[m]: hmm yeah I suppose it can't patch to the start of the file
2021-04-28T12:04:44 #kisslinux <acheam> mighty browser is....
2021-04-28T12:05:04 #kisslinux <acheam> scary
2021-04-28T12:06:35 #kisslinux <yabobay> by the way, why is the website URL is k1sslinux and not kisslinux?
2021-04-28T12:14:32 #kisslinux <midfavila> we lost k1ss.org and had to register a new domain. i think we just stuck with k1ss because it was what we already had
2021-04-28T12:15:08 #kisslinux <yabobay> oh ok
2021-04-28T12:15:21 #kisslinux <yabobay> some places in k1sslinux.org still reference k1ss.org as i noticed
2021-04-28T12:15:37 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> Where
2021-04-28T12:15:53 #kisslinux <acheam> our grep implementations must have failed us
2021-04-28T12:16:02 #kisslinux <yabobay> i don't remember, if i see it again i'll report it here
2021-04-28T12:16:09 #kisslinux <yabobay> oh wait no it wasnt on the website
2021-04-28T12:16:21 #kisslinux <yabobay> https://github.com/kisslinux
2021-04-28T12:16:22 #kisslinux <yabobay> the link here
2021-04-28T12:16:29 #kisslinux <acheam> that's the old GH org
2021-04-28T12:16:35 #kisslinux <acheam> github.com/kiss-community
2021-04-28T12:16:39 #kisslinux <acheam> is the new
2021-04-28T12:17:12 #kisslinux <yabobay> internet is confusing
2021-04-28T12:18:28 #kisslinux <midfavila> wait until you realize that well-known ports are actually arbitrary
2021-04-28T12:18:42 #kisslinux <midfavila> and that there's nothing stopping you from using ssh over udp on port 443 if you wanted to
2021-04-28T12:19:00 #kisslinux <yabobay> thats so mindblowing that i dont even know what it means
2021-04-28T12:20:20 #kisslinux <midfavila> tl;dr protocols like http/s and ssh use "ports" to route traffic. a port is just a software thing, as far as I understand it. so you can redirect traffic from one port to instead travel over another port
2021-04-28T12:20:28 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's like... taking a detour, I guess
2021-04-28T12:20:45 #kisslinux <midfavila> tcp is the transmission control protocol, and it's used to transmit data over the internet when integrity is important
2021-04-28T12:21:04 #kisslinux <yabobay> and what's port 443?
2021-04-28T12:21:14 #kisslinux <midfavila> HTTP over SSL/TLS
2021-04-28T12:21:43 #kisslinux <yabobay> ok so i *think* i get what that means, but i dont think i get what the big deal is
2021-04-28T12:22:07 #kisslinux <midfavila> well, the interesting thing about it is that it allows you to bypass things like firewalls
2021-04-28T12:22:16 #kisslinux <midfavila> and just generally be sneaky-beaky
2021-04-28T12:22:30 #kisslinux <midfavila> it... also can result in programs not working properly, but such is the price to pay
2021-04-28T12:22:37 #kisslinux <yabobay> huhh
2021-04-28T12:22:43 #kisslinux <midfavila> so, for example
2021-04-28T12:22:57 #kisslinux <midfavila> ever log on to a public wireless access point and have to agree to terms and conditions to use it?
2021-04-28T12:23:17 #kisslinux <yabobay> i dont think i've logged on to a public wireless access point
2021-04-28T12:23:29 #kisslinux <midfavila> oh, huh. are they not common where you live?
2021-04-28T12:23:31 #kisslinux <yabobay> apart from a public use computer that's already installed at that location and already connected
2021-04-28T12:23:57 #kisslinux <yabobay> me going to places is what's uncommon tbh
2021-04-28T12:24:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> fair enough
2021-04-28T12:24:25 #kisslinux <yabobay> and if im somewhere with my phone i'll probably just use it offline if im gonna use it
2021-04-28T12:24:27 #kisslinux <yabobay> or use data
2021-04-28T12:24:51 #kisslinux <midfavila> well, anyway, when you use public wifi, normally they make you agree to a contract that does stuff like let them track you, selectively block websites, w/e
2021-04-28T12:25:15 #kisslinux <yabobay> oop
2021-04-28T12:25:19 #kisslinux <midfavila> but sometimes, if the network administrator is really incompetent, they'll use a password mechanism instead so that it's "secure"
2021-04-28T12:25:26 #kisslinux <midfavila> this technology is called a captive portal
2021-04-28T12:26:03 #kisslinux <midfavila> the way it works in my experience is that it intercepts traffic over HTTP, checks if your MAC is on a whitelist, and if not redirects you to the page with the agreement/password/both/whatever
2021-04-28T12:26:31 #kisslinux <midfavila> it also filters 23, 21, 22, etc, so you can't use ftp, telnet, ssh, etc
2021-04-28T12:26:37 #kisslinux <midfavila> this is, of course, inconvenient
2021-04-28T12:26:54 #kisslinux <midfavila> but there's one thing they don't and usually can't filter, and that's port 53 over UDP
2021-04-28T12:27:01 #kisslinux <yabobay> ohhh i get it now
2021-04-28T12:27:03 #kisslinux <yabobay> thanks
2021-04-28T12:27:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> so if you redirect your traffic over UDP 53, reserved for DNS...
2021-04-28T12:27:07 #kisslinux <midfavila> yeah
2021-04-28T12:27:33 #kisslinux <midfavila> ...of course, you can also just steal someone's MAC address and boot them off the network. but that's kind of a dick thing to do
2021-04-28T12:27:45 #kisslinux <yabobay> what *is* a mac address?
2021-04-28T12:27:57 #kisslinux <midfavila> you can think of it like a social insurance number
2021-04-28T12:28:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's a unique identifier for every network interface device
2021-04-28T12:28:09 #kisslinux <yabobay> but for computers?
2021-04-28T12:28:16 #kisslinux <midfavila> nah, NICs
2021-04-28T12:28:30 #kisslinux <midfavila> so like, for example, my laptop has three network interfaces
2021-04-28T12:28:36 #kisslinux <midfavila> and each of those interfaces has a unique MAC
2021-04-28T12:28:44 #kisslinux <yabobay> ohh
2021-04-28T12:28:53 #kisslinux <midfavila> it contains information that tells you what company manufactured it, what device it is, etc
2021-04-28T12:28:55 #kisslinux <soliwilos> Some of those networks doesn't factor in Tor, and connecting to Tor works.
2021-04-28T12:29:07 #kisslinux <midfavila> tor is also an option, as is i2p, librenet, etc
2021-04-28T12:29:12 #kisslinux <midfavila> and some VPNs will work, too
2021-04-28T12:29:17 #kisslinux <yabobay> like without signing the thingy?
2021-04-28T12:29:20 #kisslinux <midfavila> yeah
2021-04-28T12:29:37 #kisslinux <yabobay> oh also
2021-04-28T12:29:39 #kisslinux <yabobay> in other news
2021-04-28T12:29:55 #kisslinux <yabobay> just got QEmacs compiled in kiss linux
2021-04-28T12:30:08 #kisslinux <midfavila> ah yes, emacs without emacs
2021-04-28T12:30:27 #kisslinux <yabobay> i just want emacs keybindings lol
2021-04-28T12:30:32 #kisslinux <yabobay> yknow, Editor MACroS
2021-04-28T12:30:39 #kisslinux <midfavila> uh-huh.
2021-04-28T12:30:50 #kisslinux <midfavila> ...fuck, my phone's alarm is going off
2021-04-28T12:30:55 #kisslinux <midfavila> i wish I could ssh into it... uggggggggggggh
2021-04-28T12:31:55 #kisslinux <yabobay> you could turn off the alarm if you did that?
2021-04-28T12:32:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> well, yeah
2021-04-28T12:32:11 #kisslinux <midfavila> kill the process responsible for it
2021-04-28T12:32:24 #kisslinux <yabobay> i assume it's not an android then lol
2021-04-28T12:32:44 #kisslinux <midfavila> well, you're right, but you can do the same thing on android
2021-04-28T12:32:47 #kisslinux <midfavila> i use an old blackberry
2021-04-28T12:32:55 #kisslinux <yabobay> oooo
2021-04-28T12:33:43 #kisslinux <midfavila> yeah. it's a passport
2021-04-28T12:33:47 #kisslinux <midfavila> seven years old at this point
2021-04-28T12:33:53 #kisslinux <midfavila> still not intending to upgrade.
2021-04-28T12:34:09 #kisslinux <yabobay> niceee
2021-04-28T12:34:29 #kisslinux <midfavila> i have an ancient motorola startac
2021-04-28T12:34:32 #kisslinux <midfavila> i'd use that if I could
2021-04-28T12:34:46 #kisslinux <yabobay> why can't you?
2021-04-28T12:34:51 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's an analog cellphone, not digital, so it's wildly incompatible with modern infrastructure
2021-04-28T12:35:06 #kisslinux <yabobay> oh
2021-04-28T12:35:07 #kisslinux <yabobay> rip
2021-04-28T12:35:14 #kisslinux <midfavila> yes, very rip
2021-04-28T12:35:25 #kisslinux <midfavila> you can't buy boring old cellphones any more
2021-04-28T12:35:34 #kisslinux <midfavila> even "dumb" phones have all these stupid fucking apps
2021-04-28T12:35:52 #kisslinux <yabobay> are those nokia thingies usable now? yknow the iconic one
2021-04-28T12:35:53 #kisslinux <midfavila> i just want to be able to place and receive calls. not browse the web or message my buddies on Discord
2021-04-28T12:36:05 #kisslinux <midfavila> they still have a bunch of crap
2021-04-28T12:36:16 #kisslinux <yabobay> phone bloat
2021-04-28T12:36:23 #kisslinux <midfavila> i mean, yes, unironically
2021-04-28T12:36:30 #kisslinux <midfavila> if I had a landline in my apartment I'd use that
2021-04-28T12:36:35 #kisslinux <midfavila> because I have an old rotary phone
2021-04-28T12:36:49 #kisslinux <midfavila> but the telecomms company I'm with killed the line
2021-04-28T12:37:12 #kisslinux <yabobay> someone should make a rotary digital phone for using with modern landlines
2021-04-28T12:37:42 #kisslinux <midfavila> eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeh...
2021-04-28T12:37:47 #kisslinux <midfavila> that's a lot more complex than you might think
2021-04-28T12:38:02 #kisslinux <yabobay> it would probably need a computer inside cause it's totally different
2021-04-28T12:38:02 #kisslinux <midfavila> modern phones are basically just little computers. "landlines", I mean
2021-04-28T12:38:15 #kisslinux <midfavila> they use internal VoIP software to place calls, now
2021-04-28T12:38:23 #kisslinux <midfavila> and most of the time they're connected to fibre modems.
2021-04-28T12:38:33 #kisslinux <yabobay> i've heard people say that they sound worse than before
2021-04-28T12:38:46 #kisslinux <midfavila> that's probably because there's more overhead
2021-04-28T12:38:50 #kisslinux <midfavila> and therefore less useful bandwidth
2021-04-28T12:38:56 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's the same reason fax doesn't work over fibre
2021-04-28T12:39:05 #kisslinux <midfavila> ...or dialup, for that matter
2021-04-28T12:39:12 #kisslinux <yabobay> dude fax is cool
2021-04-28T12:39:16 #kisslinux <midfavila> fax is very cool
2021-04-28T12:39:18 #kisslinux <midfavila> and also very old
2021-04-28T12:39:23 #kisslinux <midfavila> older than the telephone, actually
2021-04-28T12:39:23 #kisslinux <yabobay> i saw it on tv and i thought "wait why did we get rid of that???"
2021-04-28T12:39:34 #kisslinux <midfavila> because it's OLD and LAME bro
2021-04-28T12:39:40 #kisslinux <midfavila> just use screensharing in microsoft teams
2021-04-28T12:39:50 #kisslinux <yabobay> you can frickin draw "ur stupid" and send it to someone IN UR OWN HANDWRITING
2021-04-28T12:39:59 #kisslinux <midfavila> the japanese love fax
2021-04-28T12:40:16 #kisslinux <midfavila> i knew this girl from Kyoto and she was *really* into it. apparently it's a big thing there, even for regular people
2021-04-28T12:40:41 #kisslinux <midfavila> hospitals and stuff use it, too
2021-04-28T12:40:42 #kisslinux <yabobay> makes sense, try encoding japanese text in computer. i mean now it's a thing but it must've taken longer for fax to die down for that reason
2021-04-28T12:40:56 #kisslinux <midfavila> that makes a fair bit of sense, actually.
2021-04-28T12:41:17 #kisslinux <yabobay> i heard CDs are also still really popular in japan
2021-04-28T12:41:27 #kisslinux <midfavila> japan is awesome
2021-04-28T12:41:38 #kisslinux <midfavila> it seems like all their tech is either cutting-edge or stuck in the 80s
2021-04-28T12:42:20 #kisslinux <yabobay> if i could have tech from any era and use it normally now i'd probably get like an old android phone like one of the first ones
2021-04-28T12:42:24 #kisslinux <yabobay> i love how those look
2021-04-28T12:42:35 #kisslinux <midfavila> there certainly were some interesting phone designs
2021-04-28T12:42:44 #kisslinux <yabobay> plus android 3.0 looks cool af
2021-04-28T12:43:02 #kisslinux <midfavila> honestly, though, I would be content if my Zebra Industries PDA could run linux
2021-04-28T12:43:11 #kisslinux <midfavila> but as it stands it's stuck running fucking windows
2021-04-28T12:43:29 #kisslinux <midfavila> such an amazing tool, and it's locked to Windows Mobile 6.5
2021-04-28T12:43:46 #kisslinux <midfavila> i can't even sideload programs onto it without a copy of windows XP
2021-04-28T12:43:53 #kisslinux <yabobay> yknow, i remember the first computer i used we had a few years ago, it was like a really specific netbook but i broke it
2021-04-28T12:44:09 #kisslinux <midfavila> nuclear take, but obsoleting computers via software should be fucking illegal
2021-04-28T12:44:24 #kisslinux <yabobay> tru
2021-04-28T12:44:27 #kisslinux <midfavila> like, if it's a device that runs an OS that's no longer supported, you should be required by law to unlock the bootloader and provide firmware
2021-04-28T12:44:31 #kisslinux <midfavila> so that it can continue to be used
2021-04-28T12:44:33 #kisslinux <yabobay> lemme use my hardware please thanks
2021-04-28T12:44:43 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's not YOUR hardware, yabobay
2021-04-28T12:44:48 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's $MANUFACTURER's hardware
2021-04-28T12:44:56 #kisslinux <midfavila> you just license it
2021-04-28T12:45:03 #kisslinux <yabobay> i have the license to use it until they make too many new ones
2021-04-28T12:45:08 #kisslinux <midfavila> exactly
2021-04-28T12:45:15 #kisslinux <midfavila> and then they cripple it to force you to buy a new model
2021-04-28T12:45:19 #kisslinux <midfavila> like, get this
2021-04-28T12:45:25 #kisslinux <midfavila> android is... i think almost ten gigs at this point
2021-04-28T12:45:35 #kisslinux <midfavila> at least going off the latest lineageos build for my android phone
2021-04-28T12:45:42 #kisslinux <midfavila> which is *ridiculous*
2021-04-28T12:45:55 #kisslinux <yabobay> that laptop i had, i actually broke it trynna put linux on it because some shish was locked and i didnt know anything about how to fix it
2021-04-28T12:46:09 #kisslinux <midfavila> rip
2021-04-28T12:46:15 #kisslinux <midfavila> honestly, don't bother with modern hardware
2021-04-28T12:46:21 #kisslinux <yabobay> and i still wanna buy another one, and put that *same* version of ubuntu on it
2021-04-28T12:46:25 #kisslinux <midfavila> unless it's enthusiast-grade or better
2021-04-28T12:47:24 #kisslinux <midfavila> we're all gonna end up in a situation where we use that mighty browser or whatever on chromebooks
2021-04-28T12:47:40 #kisslinux <midfavila> and everything is gonna be locked down
2021-04-28T12:47:43 #kisslinux <midfavila> mark my fucking works
2021-04-28T12:47:47 #kisslinux <midfavila> s/works/words/
2021-04-28T12:47:47 #kisslinux <movzbl> <midfavila> mark my fucking words
2021-04-28T12:48:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> https://www.critters.org/rms.right2read.html
2021-04-28T12:48:11 #kisslinux <midfavila> relevant
2021-04-28T12:48:14 #kisslinux <yabobay> i mean, i hope not
2021-04-28T12:48:29 #kisslinux <midfavila> if RISC-V ends up being a thing, it's gonna happen.
2021-04-28T12:48:33 #kisslinux <yabobay> i'll get a netbook some time soon and use it FOREVER
2021-04-28T12:48:35 #kisslinux <yabobay> what's risc-v
2021-04-28T12:48:45 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's an alternative ISA to x86-64
2021-04-28T12:48:47 #kisslinux <acheam> an open source cpu architecture
2021-04-28T12:48:57 #kisslinux <midfavila> because lemme tell you
2021-04-28T12:49:07 #kisslinux <midfavila> microshit is gonna copy apple's M1 system architecture
2021-04-28T12:49:09 #kisslinux <acheam> it seems very promising, but almost certainly wont get mass adoption
2021-04-28T12:49:13 #kisslinux <midfavila> substitute ARM for RISC-V
2021-04-28T12:49:21 #kisslinux <midfavila> and then lock it down super tight and sell that
2021-04-28T12:49:30 #kisslinux <midfavila> that's my conspiracy theory
2021-04-28T12:49:34 #kisslinux <yabobay> like embrace extend extinguish?
2021-04-28T12:49:41 #kisslinux <midfavila> basically
2021-04-28T12:50:00 #kisslinux <yabobay> i wonder what the free software movement will look like by that point
2021-04-28T12:50:15 #kisslinux <acheam> existant, but with somehow even less power than it has now
2021-04-28T12:50:16 #kisslinux <midfavila> and with them buying more and more influence over le open sores """community""" it's not like there's no precedence
2021-04-28T12:50:18 #kisslinux <midfavila> in fact, you know what?
2021-04-28T12:50:29 #kisslinux <midfavila> i bet they'll bend over and take it from microsoft with a smile on their faces
2021-04-28T12:50:31 #kisslinux <acheam> the more software as a service that exists, the less room there is for free software
2021-04-28T12:50:36 #kisslinux <acheam> yep
2021-04-28T12:50:37 #kisslinux <midfavila> because "it's open source guise!!!"
2021-04-28T12:50:45 #kisslinux <midfavila> and it's like,
2021-04-28T12:50:46 #kisslinux <midfavila> sure,
2021-04-28T12:50:53 #kisslinux <midfavila> but so was whatever the fuck Tivo did
2021-04-28T12:50:57 #kisslinux <acheam> jeez I get really worried thinking about the future like this
2021-04-28T12:51:03 #kisslinux <midfavila> oh dude
2021-04-28T12:51:03 #kisslinux <yabobay> dude if i am gonna leave for like an hour, do i keep my irc client on, like what am i supposed to do
2021-04-28T12:51:05 #kisslinux <midfavila> this is like
2021-04-28T12:51:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> okay so
2021-04-28T12:51:09 #kisslinux <acheam> let me go back to 2005 computing
2021-04-28T12:51:10 #kisslinux <midfavila> you know that iceberg meme
2021-04-28T12:51:21 #kisslinux <midfavila> well, if you mapped my paranoia to that,
2021-04-28T12:51:22 #kisslinux <acheam> yabobay: sure?
2021-04-28T12:51:26 #kisslinux <acheam> i mean, do what you want
2021-04-28T12:51:32 #kisslinux <midfavila> the whole "RISC-V conspiracy" thing would be the very tip
2021-04-28T12:51:33 #kisslinux <acheam> this is a publically logged channel so you wont miss anything
2021-04-28T12:51:41 #kisslinux <acheam> I use a bouncer so i'm on 24/7
2021-04-28T12:52:18 #kisslinux <yabobay> its kinda cool to not know whats been said cause its like entering and leaving an actual room
2021-04-28T12:52:53 #kisslinux <yabobay> a CHAT ROOM, if you will
2021-04-28T12:53:02 #kisslinux <yabobay> anyway im gonna go now
2021-04-28T12:53:16 #kisslinux <midfavila> anyway, RISC-V. fuck it
2021-04-28T12:53:23 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's good for laptops and mobile devices
2021-04-28T12:53:27 #kisslinux <midfavila> and maybe embedded
2021-04-28T12:53:28 #kisslinux <dilyn> historicity
2021-04-28T12:53:31 #kisslinux <dilyn> also kisslinux is taken
2021-04-28T12:53:35 #kisslinux <midfavila> use POWER
2021-04-28T12:55:53 #kisslinux <acheam> ooh k1ss.org is cheaper now
2021-04-28T12:55:56 #kisslinux <acheam> $688
2021-04-28T12:56:05 #kisslinux <acheam> seems to suggest that it will continue to drop
2021-04-28T12:56:07 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> Buy it
2021-04-28T12:58:09 #kisslinux <dilyn> nah, wait em out
2021-04-28T12:58:26 #kisslinux <midfavila> NEVER surrender to domain squatters
2021-04-28T12:58:40 #kisslinux <dilyn> if they're actually looking to sell it... I mean, they have a market of one. that's just bad praxis
2021-04-28T12:59:58 #kisslinux <acheam> a market of one who is willing to pay obscene amounts to please his internet friends ?
2021-04-28T13:00:23 #kisslinux <midfavila> don't be stupid
2021-04-28T13:14:15 #kisslinux <dilyn> i am willing to pay $8
2021-04-28T13:14:48 #kisslinux <dilyn> that's $2 less than the current domain; I've deducted value for being a dick and inconveniencing me :v
2021-04-28T13:14:57 #kisslinux <dilyn> you could say I'm a capitalist
2021-04-28T13:16:48 #kisslinux <midfavila> yes, I'm something of a mercantilist myself
2021-04-28T13:17:18 #kisslinux <midfavila> i want a kiss linux version of that business card meme now
2021-04-28T13:59:40 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> Released a new tarball for gkiss
2021-04-28T14:01:36 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]> 🎉
2021-04-28T14:07:21 #kisslinux <midfavila> oh, nice.
2021-04-28T14:07:36 #kisslinux <midfavila> i'll have to get that set up for when my SAS cable comes in
2021-04-28T14:24:33 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> Oops, the gcc got a zstd dependency
2021-04-28T14:24:38 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> Will have to re release
2021-04-28T14:24:44 #kisslinux <dilyn> but zstd is bae
2021-04-28T14:25:41 #kisslinux <yabobay> i just looked up zstd cause idk what it is and it shows facebook's github??
2021-04-28T14:25:58 #kisslinux <yabobay> and GCC depends on this??
2021-04-28T14:26:38 #kisslinux <acheam> so?
2021-04-28T14:26:43 #kisslinux <midfavila> >facebook
2021-04-28T14:26:45 #kisslinux <dilyn> zstd is developed by facebook
2021-04-28T14:26:49 #kisslinux <dilyn> like btrfs
2021-04-28T14:26:55 #kisslinux <acheam> facebook is in charge of a lot of important FOSS projects
2021-04-28T14:26:59 #kisslinux <acheam> for better or for worse
2021-04-28T14:27:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> definitely for worse.
2021-04-28T14:27:13 #kisslinux <acheam> but I like my btrfs
2021-04-28T14:27:24 #kisslinux <yabobay> free licenses *FOR NOW*
2021-04-28T14:27:28 #kisslinux <dilyn> Bruh the GPL guarantees this outcome
2021-04-28T14:27:42 #kisslinux <midfavila> ...in unrelated news,
2021-04-28T14:27:43 #kisslinux <acheam> and without FB it wouldn't be a thing.... its not like FB wouldn't exist wthout making BTRFS FOSS
2021-04-28T14:27:51 #kisslinux <midfavila> a friend of mine has just written a kernel module to use vRAM as swap.
2021-04-28T14:27:55 #kisslinux <midfavila> and...
2021-04-28T14:28:01 #kisslinux <dilyn> is it bad
2021-04-28T14:28:02 #kisslinux <midfavila> I'm... not sure how to feel about this.
2021-04-28T14:28:16 #kisslinux <dilyn> lol
2021-04-28T14:28:32 #kisslinux <midfavila> like, apparently it works
2021-04-28T14:28:42 #kisslinux <midfavila> but he abuses amdgpu extensively
2021-04-28T14:29:03 #kisslinux <midfavila> and just... god. I can't imagine using vRAM as swapspace during a compile.
2021-04-28T14:29:07 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's just such a weird thought
2021-04-28T14:30:56 #kisslinux <midfavila> also what the fuck do you mean gcc depends on zstd
2021-04-28T14:31:00 #kisslinux <midfavila> is that new with 11?
2021-04-28T14:31:10 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> It automatically adds zstd dep if installed
2021-04-28T14:31:40 #kisslinux <midfavila> ...oh, so it's optional. okay, good
2021-04-28T14:31:48 #kisslinux <yabobay> why does a compiler need a compression thingy anyway
2021-04-28T14:31:59 #kisslinux <midfavila> presumably,
2021-04-28T14:32:02 #kisslinux <midfavila> for compressing things
2021-04-28T14:32:07 #kisslinux <midfavila> but that's just a hunch
2021-04-28T14:33:09 #kisslinux <yabobay> hmmmm
2021-04-28T14:33:10 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]>  It helps with LTO data compression, compared to using zlib
2021-04-28T14:33:30 #kisslinux <yabobay> who in their right would use compression to compress things
2021-04-28T14:34:32 #kisslinux <jslick> zlib comes very early in LFS 10.1; I don't know if it used to be that way
2021-04-28T14:35:13 #kisslinux <jslick> looks like venom recently listed it as a dependency of gcc: https://github.com/venomlinux/ports/commit/20feca7a3878222f6578d46caeb97a9aec9390bb#diff-f9020473dd6de1f451f56d14d5501297125f0e8989e179fff41e4a1d26bf11bdR2
2021-04-28T14:35:26 #kisslinux <yabobay> i wanna do an LFS at some point
2021-04-28T14:36:05 #kisslinux <miskatonic> and stallman is ok with facebook messing with gcc?
2021-04-28T14:36:24 #kisslinux <midfavila> stallman only has problems with corps if they infringe on his beliefs
2021-04-28T14:36:27 #kisslinux <midfavila> which, like, okay, fair
2021-04-28T14:36:49 #kisslinux <midfavila> but giving large corporations any position of power over free software is... not great
2021-04-28T14:38:11 #kisslinux <yabobay> theoretically if something like zstd gets its license shitified couldn't they just fork the last version?
2021-04-28T14:38:27 #kisslinux <yabobay> and continue to use that with gcc
2021-04-28T14:38:28 #kisslinux <midfavila> i mean, yes
2021-04-28T14:39:02 #kisslinux <yabobay> that's kinda the same idea behind GNU isn't it? unix was used until its license got shitified
2021-04-28T14:39:06 #kisslinux <dilyn> facebook isn't messing with gcc...
2021-04-28T14:39:25 #kisslinux <midfavila> that's not at all the idea behind GNU
2021-04-28T14:39:32 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's like, not even in the same ballpark
2021-04-28T14:39:43 #kisslinux <dilyn> like they've literally created basically the best compression and decompression algorithm that also replaces xz,gzip,etal
2021-04-28T14:39:55 #kisslinux <midfavila> GNU only chose to emulate UNIX because it was common
2021-04-28T14:40:14 #kisslinux <yabobay> but the reason it was made was so they could have the free OS
2021-04-28T14:40:39 #kisslinux <midfavila> well, yes.
2021-04-28T14:42:56 #kisslinux <yabobay> by the way, what is the second field of version file for?
2021-04-28T14:43:02 #kisslinux <yabobay> it says in the wiki, but i dont get it
2021-04-28T14:43:17 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's the "generation" of the package
2021-04-28T14:43:25 #kisslinux <midfavila> so a brand new package is generation one
2021-04-28T14:43:34 #kisslinux <midfavila> then if you update the source, checksums, build, relver, whatever
2021-04-28T14:43:39 #kisslinux <midfavila> you bump the generation
2021-04-28T14:43:44 #kisslinux <yabobay> ohhhh alright
2021-04-28T14:43:47 #kisslinux <midfavila> yeah.
2021-04-28T14:44:13 #kisslinux <yabobay> is gen 1 the very first version i use, or the very first version that is published?
2021-04-28T14:44:26 #kisslinux <midfavila> first published version of the package
2021-04-28T14:44:30 #kisslinux <yabobay> oh ok
2021-04-28T14:44:31 #kisslinux <yabobay> thanks
2021-04-28T14:44:33 #kisslinux <midfavila> np
2021-04-28T14:44:44 #kisslinux <miskatonic> on FreeBSD, xorg-sever depends on zstd
2021-04-28T14:44:57 #kisslinux <yabobay> yikes
2021-04-28T14:44:58 #kisslinux <midfavila> more like worstbsd
2021-04-28T14:45:01 #kisslinux <midfavila> gottem
2021-04-28T14:45:22 #kisslinux <midfavila> dragonfly or fuck off. change my mind.
2021-04-28T14:45:49 #kisslinux <yabobay> i dont get what is the pros or cons between different BSD operating systems
2021-04-28T14:45:57 #kisslinux <midfavila> okay so
2021-04-28T14:45:58 #kisslinux <midfavila> tl;dr
2021-04-28T14:46:07 #kisslinux <midfavila> netBSD is super lightweight and has ports to basically everything ever
2021-04-28T14:46:13 #kisslinux <yabobay> i can get behind that
2021-04-28T14:46:22 #kisslinux <midfavila> freeBSD has linux compatiblity to some extent, and it's considered the best general "desktop" BSD
2021-04-28T14:46:34 #kisslinux <tink> you could do tldrlfs instead of lfs
2021-04-28T14:46:35 #kisslinux <tink> https://github.com/comfies/tldrlfs
2021-04-28T14:46:49 #kisslinux <midfavila> openBSD has a focus on code quality and security, and they produce a lot of really useful software like openSSH and libressl
2021-04-28T14:46:58 #kisslinux <yabobay> tink: yeah but most of why i wanna do it is doing a lotta reading about it
2021-04-28T14:47:28 #kisslinux <midfavila> dragonflyBSD is, at least imho, focused around research and development. dBSD has a lot of interesting and unique features, like HAMMER
2021-04-28T14:47:32 #kisslinux <yabobay> midfavila: nsa spy on me o nooo
2021-04-28T14:47:38 #kisslinux <acheam> HAMMER is awesome
2021-04-28T14:47:41 #kisslinux <yabobay> whats HAMMER
2021-04-28T14:47:46 #kisslinux <midfavila> cutting edge filesystem
2021-04-28T14:47:53 #kisslinux <tink> i think kiss might be better for it than lfs
2021-04-28T14:47:54 #kisslinux <acheam> but dragonfly is still used in servers and stuff
2021-04-28T14:48:05 #kisslinux <acheam> https://www.dragonflybsd.org/hammer/
2021-04-28T14:48:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> oh, and there's gonna be hyperbolaBSD soon
2021-04-28T14:48:09 #kisslinux <acheam> lol
2021-04-28T14:48:12 #kisslinux <acheam> the GPL BSD
2021-04-28T14:48:13 #kisslinux <midfavila> which is basically GNU/BSD
2021-04-28T14:48:16 #kisslinux <yabobay> tink: kiss is like minimal reading
2021-04-28T14:48:24 #kisslinux <midfavila> if you want to read, then yeah, do LFS
2021-04-28T14:48:27 #kisslinux <midfavila> you'll learn a lot
2021-04-28T14:48:54 #kisslinux <miskatonic> unfortunately, many difficult tasks are still in fromnt of the hyperbsd people
2021-04-28T14:50:04 #kisslinux <midfavila> dilyn the change I mentioned the other day has been upstreamed in hummingbird
2021-04-28T14:50:21 #kisslinux <midfavila> and yeah, h/BSD has a long way to go
2021-04-28T14:50:30 #kisslinux <midfavila> but it'd be nice if I could combine the h/BSD kernel with KISS
2021-04-28T14:50:34 #kisslinux <yabobay> in general why should i be interested in BSD? whenever i look it up all i see is people talking bout the license, and LiNuX sJw
2021-04-28T14:50:46 #kisslinux <midfavila> BSD is a "Real UNIX"
2021-04-28T14:50:52 #kisslinux <midfavila> and they tend to specialize
2021-04-28T14:51:00 #kisslinux <midfavila> whereas linux is much more of a general system
2021-04-28T14:51:56 #kisslinux <yabobay> wym specialize?
2021-04-28T14:52:03 #kisslinux <midfavila> like I said earlier
2021-04-28T14:52:09 #kisslinux <midfavila> n/BSD is portable and lightweight,
2021-04-28T14:52:14 #kisslinux <yabobay> oh oh yeah that
2021-04-28T14:52:18 #kisslinux <midfavila> o/BSD is highly secure and clean
2021-04-28T14:52:23 #kisslinux <miskatonic> the kernel allows for generality in linux, but most real existing distributions start to specialize or to become unmaintenable
2021-04-28T14:52:23 #kisslinux <midfavila> f/BSD is good for the desktop
2021-04-28T14:52:34 #kisslinux <midfavila> d/BSD is just really based
2021-04-28T14:52:34 #kisslinux <midfavila> etc
2021-04-28T14:52:43 #kisslinux <yabobay> ive seen once someone using netbsd on the desktop
2021-04-28T14:53:33 #kisslinux <midfavila> if it was an older machine or had obscure hardware, that would make sense
2021-04-28T14:53:43 #kisslinux <miskatonic> of course netbsd works well on the desktop if one knows what one is doing.
2021-04-28T14:53:57 #kisslinux <midfavila> also re: loonix specialization
2021-04-28T14:54:04 #kisslinux <midfavila> was talking about that IRL with someone I know yesterday
2021-04-28T14:54:15 #kisslinux <midfavila> had to explain why pretty much every distro is the exact same
2021-04-28T14:56:14 #kisslinux <dilyn> LFS is 100% worth doing if you want to learn more about the structures behind KISS
2021-04-28T14:56:18 #kisslinux <yabobay> dude i was legit shocked when i was looking at wikipedia and i saw like floppy disks that just said "linux" and they were bootable
2021-04-28T14:56:50 #kisslinux <yabobay> is kiss linux made by reading lfs?
2021-04-28T14:57:07 #kisslinux <dilyn> mid: I'll probably go back to hummingbird then. i keep flip-flopping over what I want to use...
2021-04-28T14:57:15 #kisslinux <konimex> well, somewhat, of course there's some deviation from pure LFS
2021-04-28T14:57:30 #kisslinux <dilyn> I like to think that `kiss` was born when Dylan was doing LFS and got to chapter 6 and thought 'package management... hmmm...'
2021-04-28T14:57:52 #kisslinux <dilyn> I mean that probably isn't at all the genesis tho
2021-04-28T14:58:55 #kisslinux <miskatonic> some small musl distros just skip package management completely
2021-04-28T14:59:19 #kisslinux <tink> are mouse controls really that based? sowm and plan 9 both use it extensively
2021-04-28T14:59:20 #kisslinux <yabobay> i wanna try the idea of doing an LFS not to make a distribution, but to just use as a system for myself
2021-04-28T14:59:24 #kisslinux <yabobay> package management unneeded
2021-04-28T14:59:57 #kisslinux <midfavila> mouse controls can be nice when implemented properly
2021-04-28T15:00:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> otherwise, they're just a caveman interface
2021-04-28T15:00:07 #kisslinux <midfavila> point, grunt
2021-04-28T15:00:44 #kisslinux <yabobay> keybinds are just pointing and grunting with a keyboard smh
2021-04-28T15:01:00 #kisslinux <miskatonic> yes, mice are based on mousepads
2021-04-28T15:01:15 #kisslinux <midfavila> actually, if anything, they're based on trackballs
2021-04-28T15:01:41 #kisslinux <midfavila> if I recall correctly the first device we might recognize as a "pointer" was basically a bowling ball hooked up to some sort of naval computer
2021-04-28T15:01:45 #kisslinux <tink> i am not sure if i have come across any good use for them. i don't like taking my fingers off my keyboard
2021-04-28T15:01:49 #kisslinux <midfavila> but it's been a long time since I've read about the history of mice
2021-04-28T15:01:54 #kisslinux <midfavila> and mice are good for inherently graphical work
2021-04-28T15:01:57 #kisslinux <yabobay> my dad has been using the same trackball mouse for like 15 years or so he told me
2021-04-28T15:02:00 #kisslinux <midfavila> e.g video editing and photo editing
2021-04-28T15:02:03 #kisslinux <midfavila> trackballs are fucking based
2021-04-28T15:02:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> i have like five
2021-04-28T15:02:08 #kisslinux <midfavila> i collect them
2021-04-28T15:02:16 #kisslinux <yabobay> he cant get any more cause theyre expensive
2021-04-28T15:02:23 #kisslinux <yabobay> but he has replaced every other thing except the mouse
2021-04-28T15:02:31 #kisslinux <midfavila> yeah, if you get the really nice ones they're pricey
2021-04-28T15:02:38 #kisslinux <midfavila> my trackball is technically like 300USD
2021-04-28T15:02:45 #kisslinux <midfavila> but I got it on ebay new old-stock for 50
2021-04-28T15:02:45 #kisslinux <tink> it's a huge pain in the ass doing graphical work without a mouse, that's a really good point
2021-04-28T15:02:57 #kisslinux <midfavila> because I'm THRIFTY like that
2021-04-28T15:03:00 #kisslinux <miskatonic> right from the xerox museum or so
2021-04-28T15:03:05 #kisslinux <midfavila> the downside is that you have to spend like a day refurbing stuff
2021-04-28T15:03:42 #kisslinux <yabobay> that's a downside? that soudns like fun if you have good guides
2021-04-28T15:04:37 #kisslinux <yabobay> dude, how what do i put in the checksums file for making a package? it doesnt even mention it in the wiki
2021-04-28T15:04:42 #kisslinux <miskatonic> there are dozens of keyboard-friendly wms that are easy to compile, so sowm is replacable
2021-04-28T15:05:06 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> Run `kiss c` to generate checksums, it'll download the file in `sources`
2021-04-28T15:05:13 #kisslinux <yabobay> in the dir of the package?
2021-04-28T15:05:34 #kisslinux <yabobay> ok i did it anyway
2021-04-28T15:05:47 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's a downside because most of my hardware has zero documentation available
2021-04-28T15:05:48 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> Yeah
2021-04-28T15:06:34 #kisslinux <midfavila> and some of the stuff I have is kind of exotic, so I don't want to break it
2021-04-28T15:07:25 #kisslinux <miskatonic> are real serial terminals like dec vt100 still available outside museum collections?
2021-04-28T15:07:42 #kisslinux <midfavila> if you have hundreds of dollars, yes
2021-04-28T15:07:56 #kisslinux <midfavila> they're sold on ebay because "L00K R@RE VINTAGE"
2021-04-28T15:08:19 #kisslinux <midfavila> honestly, just get an old laptop with a serial port, build or buy a switchbox, and hook that up to your machines
2021-04-28T15:08:30 #kisslinux <midfavila> gonna be doing that with my B300
2021-04-28T15:09:03 #kisslinux <tink> i applied the keyboard patch so i am using sowm with keybindings
2021-04-28T15:10:14 #kisslinux <yabobay> all the minimalist window managers are kinda absolute crapness when you wanna type in multiple languages
2021-04-28T15:11:07 #kisslinux <midfavila> imagine not having DIP switches on your keyboard to control layout using custom firmware
2021-04-28T15:11:08 #kisslinux <midfavila> smh
2021-04-28T15:11:10 #kisslinux <miskatonic> I'd use macros like those of LaTeX to write in multiple languages, no wm involved
2021-04-28T15:11:10 #kisslinux <midfavila> s m h
2021-04-28T15:11:32 #kisslinux <midfavila> alternatively you could use caps lock to change between layouts
2021-04-28T15:12:18 #kisslinux <tink> can't you use setxkbmap for that yabobay
2021-04-28T15:12:42 #kisslinux <yabobay> you can but i havent found a way to show you in the systray what thing you're having
2021-04-28T15:13:53 #kisslinux <miskatonic> I don't even use systrays, they are so macos/windowsish
2021-04-28T15:14:05 #kisslinux <tink> then it's the bar's problem, not the wm's
2021-04-28T15:14:22 #kisslinux <midfavila> if your systray is "windowsish" that's on you
2021-04-28T15:14:27 #kisslinux <midfavila> get creative with how you use it
2021-04-28T15:15:06 #kisslinux <yabobay> if y'all push me into the rabbit hole of software minimalism i will not forgive myself lmao
2021-04-28T15:15:41 #kisslinux <midfavila> minimalism is a meme
2021-04-28T15:15:48 #kisslinux <midfavila> in the sense that most people push it, anyway
2021-04-28T15:16:19 #kisslinux <yabobay> the only thing that compels me about minimal WM is maybe being able to change whatever i want, and higher portability
2021-04-28T15:16:32 #kisslinux <midfavila> the only good tiling manager is dwm
2021-04-28T15:16:42 #kisslinux <midfavila> so if you want a minimal WM, just use that
2021-04-28T15:16:51 #kisslinux <yabobay> meh i dont care much for tiling
2021-04-28T15:17:03 #kisslinux <yabobay> its for people who use a lot of terminal-y stuff and keyboard-driven stuff
2021-04-28T15:17:10 #kisslinux <midfavila> as for me, I'm content with FVWM... for now
2021-04-28T15:17:21 #kisslinux <midfavila> if they keep going down the current path, I'll have to switch to Afterstep
2021-04-28T15:17:52 #kisslinux <midfavila> the only thing exceeding my autism for FVWM configuration is my autism for avoiding Google anything
2021-04-28T15:17:53 #kisslinux <miskatonic> I use only terminally and keyboard-driven stuff
2021-04-28T15:18:26 #kisslinux <yabobay> uh-oh did i just hear someone use the word autism not literally
2021-04-28T15:18:35 #kisslinux <yabobay> have i entered /g/ territory
2021-04-28T15:19:09 #kisslinux * midfavila rolls their eyes
2021-04-28T15:20:19 #kisslinux <yabobay> i mean, i dont even think its offensive. i just think its kinda really dumb. like being edgy for the sake of being edgy.
2021-04-28T15:20:37 #kisslinux <midfavila> you clearly misunderstand the intent then.
2021-04-28T15:20:42 #kisslinux <midfavila> lurk more.
2021-04-28T15:21:01 #kisslinux <miskatonic> i'm literally autist (asperger), so what
2021-04-28T15:21:18 #kisslinux <yabobay> ahhh there's the irc i know
2021-04-28T15:23:09 #kisslinux <miskatonic> the irc you know came to an end with systemd
2021-04-28T15:23:29 #kisslinux <yabobay> what does that mean
2021-04-28T15:24:31 #kisslinux <miskatonic> "... came to an end with systemd" is nowadays a common saying on irc
2021-04-28T15:28:37 #kisslinux <yabobay> so i can build QEmacs in kiss linux manually, but it fails with the same instructions when trying to use kiss to do it
2021-04-28T15:28:56 #kisslinux <dilyn> where and how does it fail
2021-04-28T15:29:59 #kisslinux <yabobay> pastebin is having maintenance crappppp
2021-04-28T15:30:01 #kisslinux <acheam> logs. logs. logs
2021-04-28T15:30:04 #kisslinux <acheam> envs.sh
2021-04-28T15:30:24 #kisslinux <yabobay> what?
2021-04-28T15:30:33 #kisslinux <acheam> use envs.sh
2021-04-28T15:30:43 #kisslinux <acheam> as pastebin
2021-04-28T15:31:03 #kisslinux <tink> echo "text here" | curl -F'file=@-;' https://envs.sh
2021-04-28T15:32:10 #kisslinux <miskatonic> there's also termbin.com, which can be used with netcat
2021-04-28T15:33:23 #kisslinux <yabobay> https://termbin.com/pl05
2021-04-28T15:33:26 #kisslinux <yabobay> alright there we go
2021-04-28T15:33:35 #kisslinux <tink> would doing curl -F'file=@yourfile.c' https://envs.sh be the same as doing echo yourfile.c | curl -F'file=@-;' https://envs.sh
2021-04-28T15:34:17 #kisslinux <yabobay> brb ive gotta go deploy food for the dog
2021-04-28T15:35:49 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> Looks like the build system isn't adding the correct include paths
2021-04-28T15:37:16 #kisslinux <dilyn> I hate warning flags
2021-04-28T15:37:29 #kisslinux <dilyn> I am not a developer. I am not here to develop your code. Do not enable warnings.
2021-04-28T15:37:41 #kisslinux <midfavila> -w?
2021-04-28T15:37:54 #kisslinux <dilyn> what's the build script actually look like? it isn't finding some local css.h file
2021-04-28T15:38:05 #kisslinux <dilyn> -Wme-iambadprogrammar
2021-04-28T15:38:31 #kisslinux <miskatonic> gcc -Larry -Wall
2021-04-28T15:41:24 #kisslinux <acheam> lol larry walls website is amazing
2021-04-28T15:41:26 #kisslinux <acheam> http://www.wall.org/~larry/
2021-04-28T15:42:46 #kisslinux <dilyn> That should... should be...
2021-04-28T15:42:48 #kisslinux <dilyn> very illegal
2021-04-28T15:42:56 #kisslinux <dilyn> a pox on you for introducing me to that
2021-04-28T15:43:07 #kisslinux <midfavila> chartreuse is the official color for KISS now
2021-04-28T15:43:36 #kisslinux * acheam wget -r's wall.org
2021-04-28T15:44:42 #kisslinux <tink> I wonder why he has a different tag for computer science since CS could be included in S (science)
2021-04-28T15:45:11 #kisslinux <midfavila> something something computer science has nothing to do with computers or science
2021-04-28T15:45:45 #kisslinux <dilyn> transitioning qt from qt official to KDE forks is a fucking chore
2021-04-28T15:45:48 #kisslinux <dilyn> for INSTACE
2021-04-28T15:45:51 #kisslinux <acheam> why?
2021-04-28T15:45:57 #kisslinux <midfavila> because it's qt
2021-04-28T15:45:59 #kisslinux <midfavila> qt is shit
2021-04-28T15:46:01 #kisslinux <midfavila> stop using it
2021-04-28T15:46:05 #kisslinux <dilyn> http://ix.io/3jk4
2021-04-28T15:46:10 #kisslinux <dilyn> I have to do this bullshit for every qt package
2021-04-28T15:46:25 #kisslinux <dilyn> just create an empty, useless fucking folder.
2021-04-28T15:46:26 #kisslinux <midfavila> have you considered scripting it
2021-04-28T15:46:35 #kisslinux <dilyn> why would I do that
2021-04-28T15:46:49 #kisslinux <midfavila> so that you don't have to manually change every qt package's build file manually?
2021-04-28T15:47:02 #kisslinux <dilyn> that's not what I'm ranting about
2021-04-28T15:47:06 #kisslinux <dilyn> doing the adding is easy
2021-04-28T15:47:17 #kisslinux <dilyn> it's that I have to be adding in the first place that grinds my gears >=|
2021-04-28T15:47:30 #kisslinux <midfavila> really grinds your gears
2021-04-28T15:47:33 #kisslinux <midfavila> gets your goat
2021-04-28T15:47:36 #kisslinux <dilyn> not to mention KDE isn't doing releases, just patchsets. so you have to pick a commit for every damn package lmao
2021-04-28T15:47:38 #kisslinux <midfavila> wets your weasel
2021-04-28T15:47:42 #kisslinux <dilyn> floats my boat
2021-04-28T15:47:45 #kisslinux <midfavila> picks your pickle
2021-04-28T15:47:45 #kisslinux <dilyn> shaves my moustache
2021-04-28T15:47:50 #kisslinux <midfavila> paints your wall
2021-04-28T15:47:51 #kisslinux <midfavila> etc
2021-04-28T15:48:05 #kisslinux <dilyn> i wish it would paint my walls
2021-04-28T15:48:10 #kisslinux <dilyn> Qt 7 new feature request
2021-04-28T15:48:14 #kisslinux <midfavila> it paints your walls chartreuse
2021-04-28T15:48:17 #kisslinux <midfavila> :^)
2021-04-28T15:48:19 #kisslinux <konimex> does it do that in other systems too? weird if it's kiss-specific
2021-04-28T15:48:22 #kisslinux <dilyn> hng
2021-04-28T15:48:27 #kisslinux <dilyn> no it's KDE's damn fault
2021-04-28T15:48:34 #kisslinux <midfavila> KDE is kringe
2021-04-28T15:48:35 #kisslinux <dilyn> alpine does it (I'm stealing the commits they've chosen)
2021-04-28T15:49:23 #kisslinux <dilyn> but with any luck after all this work, qt-webengine will work yet again. and then people will be presented with the choice of using falkon/viper/otter/whateverthefuck
2021-04-28T15:49:31 #kisslinux <dilyn> and then simply choosing to use firefox anyways :v
2021-04-28T15:49:40 #kisslinux <midfavila> use nuegia browser
2021-04-28T15:49:50 #kisslinux <acheam> but my musl
2021-04-28T15:49:59 #kisslinux <midfavila> muh moosle
2021-04-28T15:50:03 #kisslinux <midfavila> muh moosle, mid
2021-04-28T15:50:23 #kisslinux <midfavila> i do wish that it would build against musl. :/
2021-04-28T15:53:15 #kisslinux <yabobay> i return
2021-04-28T15:55:09 #kisslinux <yabobay> https://termbin.com/6kamk
2021-04-28T15:55:14 #kisslinux <yabobay> dilyn: the build script looks like this
2021-04-28T15:55:38 #kisslinux <yabobay> and those are the same commands i ran manually
2021-04-28T15:55:50 #kisslinux <yabobay> in the directory of QEmacs source code
2021-04-28T15:56:19 #kisslinux <dilyn> your log shows that it isn't picking up on your --prefix, no?
2021-04-28T15:56:49 #kisslinux <dilyn> that should be pedestrian tho, because it seems to see tiny
2021-04-28T15:57:07 #kisslinux <yabobay> it picks up on that --prefix if i run the same command manually
2021-04-28T15:57:53 #kisslinux <yabobay> "Install prefix   /usr"
2021-04-28T15:58:30 #kisslinux <yabobay> is packaging things always so weird ?
2021-04-28T15:58:35 #kisslinux <yabobay> or am i just unlucky
2021-04-28T15:58:50 #kisslinux <konimex> depends on the package
2021-04-28T15:59:02 #kisslinux <yabobay> did i happen to choose really dumb packages
2021-04-28T15:59:25 #kisslinux <dilyn> > emacs
2021-04-28T15:59:26 #kisslinux <dilyn> yes
2021-04-28T15:59:36 #kisslinux <yabobay> its a small emacs ok??
2021-04-28T15:59:55 #kisslinux <midfavila> iirc it was written by torvalds
2021-04-28T16:00:08 #kisslinux <yabobay> that's a different emacs implementation
2021-04-28T16:00:14 #kisslinux <midfavila> my bad then
2021-04-28T16:00:15 #kisslinux <yabobay> and even that was just a fork of the main one
2021-04-28T16:00:29 #kisslinux <yabobay> the only reason i know this stuff is cause of trying to do this for the past couple days
2021-04-28T16:01:37 #kisslinux <konimex> you might want to see how other distros build qemacs and build off there
2021-04-28T16:02:00 #kisslinux <yabobay> off to the AUR then!
2021-04-28T16:02:21 #kisslinux <yabobay> but even if i get a working solution, that still doesnt answer the question of why it works when i do it manually
2021-04-28T16:02:47 #kisslinux <dilyn> it's potentially a problem with kiss
2021-04-28T16:03:02 #kisslinux <dilyn> for instance, I couldn't build qt5 because LC_ALL was set, and qt5 did not appreciate that
2021-04-28T16:03:20 #kisslinux <yabobay> can you imagine what that would be specifically?
2021-04-28T16:03:52 #kisslinux <dilyn> nope
2021-04-28T16:04:03 #kisslinux <yabobay> the AUR runs $CC on every .c file individually.
2021-04-28T16:04:04 #kisslinux <dilyn> perhaps make install is borked, considering the aur pkgbuild doesn't use it
2021-04-28T16:04:25 #kisslinux <dilyn> get rid of the `make install` line in your build script and do `KISS_DEBUG=1 kiss b`
2021-04-28T16:04:33 #kisslinux <yabobay> oh yeah i havent done make install at all
2021-04-28T16:04:35 #kisslinux <yabobay> not even manually
2021-04-28T16:04:44 #kisslinux <yabobay> lemme see what that does
2021-04-28T16:04:59 #kisslinux <yabobay> aha!
2021-04-28T16:05:04 #kisslinux <yabobay> the css.h error is here
2021-04-28T16:05:09 #kisslinux <dilyn> lmao the makefile is so broken the aur package doesn't even use it AT All
2021-04-28T16:05:32 #kisslinux <dilyn> yeah so I would just `install` the files manually
2021-04-28T16:05:45 #kisslinux <yabobay> oh boy
2021-04-28T16:05:58 #kisslinux <yabobay> if i was to do that, how would it be removed by kiss at a later time?
2021-04-28T16:06:11 #kisslinux <midfavila> kiss  uses manifests
2021-04-28T16:06:15 #kisslinux <dilyn> ^
2021-04-28T16:06:18 #kisslinux <yabobay> what's that??
2021-04-28T16:06:26 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's a log of what packages own what files
2021-04-28T16:06:39 #kisslinux <midfavila> this is also used by the alternatives system, I believe
2021-04-28T16:07:01 #kisslinux <midfavila> but I haven't done much reading of KISS' script... I think I'll spend this afternoon doing so
2021-04-28T16:07:07 #kisslinux <midfavila> I need to replace curl, anyways.
2021-04-28T16:07:29 #kisslinux <dilyn> when you `kiss a foo /usr/bin/bar`, the files get interchanged and the manifests are updated accordingly
2021-04-28T16:08:02 #kisslinux <yabobay> so,,,, how do i install the files manually.
2021-04-28T16:08:19 #kisslinux <midfavila> using install
2021-04-28T16:08:20 #kisslinux <yabobay> "manually"
2021-04-28T16:08:20 #kisslinux <konimex> you mean manual-manually or in a kiss build file
2021-04-28T16:08:29 #kisslinux <midfavila> for example
2021-04-28T16:08:33 #kisslinux <dilyn> i just mean that instead of using `make install` do `install -Dm755 qemacs "$1/usr/bin/qemancs"`
2021-04-28T16:08:41 #kisslinux <midfavila> >:c
2021-04-28T16:08:44 #kisslinux <dilyn> lel
2021-04-28T16:09:04 #kisslinux <midfavila> R U D E
2021-04-28T16:09:08 #kisslinux <yabobay> -Dm755 is permissions right?
2021-04-28T16:09:11 #kisslinux <midfavila> yes
2021-04-28T16:09:18 #kisslinux <dilyn> -D makes leading directories, -m sets perms
2021-04-28T16:09:26 #kisslinux <midfavila> indicates rwx for owner, rx for group, rx for world
2021-04-28T16:09:30 #kisslinux <midfavila> ...I think
2021-04-28T16:09:43 #kisslinux <dilyn> lol
2021-04-28T16:09:43 #kisslinux <midfavila> still getting the hang of octal perms
2021-04-28T16:09:52 #kisslinux <dilyn> chmod -R 1777 /
2021-04-28T16:09:59 #kisslinux <dilyn> everything sticky for everyone
2021-04-28T16:10:02 #kisslinux <midfavila> 7777*
2021-04-28T16:10:32 #kisslinux <yabobay> would a linux distro with everything having 7777 perms be able to run even?
2021-04-28T16:11:08 #kisslinux <midfavila> i mean
2021-04-28T16:11:13 #kisslinux <midfavila> yes
2021-04-28T16:11:16 #kisslinux <midfavila> **************************
2021-04-28T16:11:20 #kisslinux <konimex> well, you can't know if you don't try
2021-04-28T16:11:32 #kisslinux <midfavila> but like
2021-04-28T16:11:38 #kisslinux <midfavila> ... it's probably not a good idea.
2021-04-28T16:11:40 #kisslinux <midfavila> and by probably
2021-04-28T16:11:42 #kisslinux <midfavila> i mean it's not.
2021-04-28T16:11:58 #kisslinux <yabobay> single user system 4 lyf
2021-04-28T16:12:07 #kisslinux <dilyn> no
2021-04-28T16:12:09 #kisslinux <dilyn> do not do it
2021-04-28T16:12:26 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's not about single user, it's about basic security
2021-04-28T16:12:47 #kisslinux <yabobay> what if i wasn't connecting to a network with it
2021-04-28T16:12:47 #kisslinux <midfavila> letting any user (including daemons) write and execute *anything*...
2021-04-28T16:12:55 #kisslinux <midfavila> just don't do it.
2021-04-28T16:13:00 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's Bad:tm:
2021-04-28T16:13:03 #kisslinux <yabobay> yeah yeah im talking hypothetically here
2021-04-28T16:13:16 #kisslinux <dilyn> a lot of them won't even let you
2021-04-28T16:13:23 #kisslinux <midfavila> i mean, hypothetically you could use suicide linux as your daily driver
2021-04-28T16:13:25 #kisslinux <midfavila> but like
2021-04-28T16:13:34 #kisslinux <midfavila> it's one of those things where you just don't.
2021-04-28T16:13:46 #kisslinux <dilyn> the hard part is not changing the permissions for all of /
2021-04-28T16:13:52 #kisslinux <dilyn> it's changing them back when you realize that was a bad move
2021-04-28T16:13:59 #kisslinux <yabobay> suicide linux; woopsy i did a typo
2021-04-28T16:14:17 #kisslinux <dilyn> a freudian slip
2021-04-28T16:14:31 #kisslinux <midfavila> *pushes up glasses*
2021-04-28T16:15:02 #kisslinux <midfavila> i want an anime about a debate team.
2021-04-28T16:15:09 #kisslinux <yabobay> huh. qemacs executable is called "qe", but the makefile has it install as "qemacs"
2021-04-28T16:15:09 #kisslinux <midfavila> gimme.
2021-04-28T16:16:06 #kisslinux <yabobay> do you guys think i should install it as "qe" or "qemacs"?
2021-04-28T16:16:11 #kisslinux <dilyn> both
2021-04-28T16:16:12 #kisslinux <midfavila> do whatever
2021-04-28T16:16:14 #kisslinux <midfavila> or both
2021-04-28T16:16:14 #kisslinux <dilyn> symlink it
2021-04-28T16:16:25 #kisslinux <yabobay> i'll symlink it
2021-04-28T16:17:13 #kisslinux <yabobay> does `ln -s "$/usr/bin/qemacs" "$/usr/bin/qe"` look good?
2021-04-28T16:17:46 #kisslinux <konimex> ln -s qemacs "$1/usr/bin/qe"
2021-04-28T16:18:08 #kisslinux <yabobay> wouldn't that symlink it from the source code dir
2021-04-28T16:18:21 #kisslinux <yabobay> which would be ruined if the cache was deleted
2021-04-28T16:18:28 #kisslinux <konimex> not really, qemacs is relative path so /usr/bin/qe will look into the same directory
2021-04-28T16:19:32 #kisslinux <yabobay> oh actually
2021-04-28T16:19:38 #kisslinux <yabobay> it makes more sense to make qe be a real file
2021-04-28T16:19:43 #kisslinux <yabobay> and have qemacs as a symlink
2021-04-28T16:21:59 #kisslinux <yabobay> where do i install the man page btw?
2021-04-28T16:22:11 #kisslinux <midfavila> /usr/share/man/man1/
2021-04-28T16:22:21 #kisslinux <midfavila> manual section 1 is for user programs.
2021-04-28T16:23:00 #kisslinux <yabobay> i assume with -Dm744?
2021-04-28T16:23:31 #kisslinux <konimex> 644
2021-04-28T16:23:45 #kisslinux <midfavila> ^
2021-04-28T16:23:50 #kisslinux <midfavila> no need for an execute bit
2021-04-28T16:24:45 #kisslinux <midfavila> ...fuck
2021-04-28T16:24:47 #kisslinux <yabobay> btw konimex im really sorry but can you run that thing about ln by me again cause i dont have unix smartness
2021-04-28T16:24:50 #kisslinux <midfavila> I have to learn GPT
2021-04-28T16:24:55 #kisslinux <midfavila> ugggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggh
2021-04-28T16:25:04 #kisslinux <konimex> eh no problem, we all have to start somewhere
2021-04-28T16:25:35 #kisslinux <konimex> so, if qe is the real file, after installing qe, you just need to do `ln -s qe /usr/bin/qemacs`
2021-04-28T16:25:58 #kisslinux <konimex> with qe being the "source" and the latter with full path as the "target"
2021-04-28T16:26:18 #kisslinux <midfavila> wouldn't it be $1/usr/bin/qe /usr/bin/qemacs?
2021-04-28T16:26:19 #kisslinux <dilyn> why mid
2021-04-28T16:26:27 #kisslinux <midfavila> because my new disks are larger than 2tb
2021-04-28T16:26:34 #kisslinux <midfavila> and also I need more than four partitions on my main disk
2021-04-28T16:26:50 #kisslinux <yabobay> what's different about using GPT
2021-04-28T16:26:53 #kisslinux <dilyn> sad
2021-04-28T16:26:56 #kisslinux <konimex> making $1/usr/bin/qe the source would actually make the target look in the kiss cache directory instead of the relative path of the target directory
2021-04-28T16:27:04 #kisslinux <midfavila> don't know, I've never used GPT
2021-04-28T16:27:14 #kisslinux <dilyn> it's neater
2021-04-28T16:27:24 #kisslinux <dilyn> you have so many more hex id's for your partitions mid!
2021-04-28T16:27:31 #kisslinux <midfavila> hex ids fucking suck
2021-04-28T16:27:35 #kisslinux <dilyn> lol
2021-04-28T16:27:38 #kisslinux <yabobay> midfavila: you just have an EFI system partition is the only difference ive seen as a user
2021-04-28T16:27:42 #kisslinux <midfavila> use /dev/sdx as god intended
2021-04-28T16:27:43 #kisslinux <yabobay> maybe. idk im stupid
2021-04-28T16:27:51 #kisslinux <dilyn> now you can distinguish your linux fs as being linux root (x86-64) or linux home or linux data!
2021-04-28T16:27:51 #kisslinux <midfavila> no, you only use the EFI partition on an EFI system
2021-04-28T16:28:03 #kisslinux <midfavila> i'm gonna get to unleash the ultimate hipster move
2021-04-28T16:28:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> GPT+BIOS
2021-04-28T16:28:09 #kisslinux <dilyn> NO
2021-04-28T16:28:13 #kisslinux <midfavila> prepare for my ultimate technique, dilyn
2021-04-28T16:28:14 #kisslinux <dilyn> gl
2021-04-28T16:28:22 #kisslinux <dilyn> i will not help you debug that abomination :v
2021-04-28T16:28:49 #kisslinux <yabobay> konimex: but $1/usr/bin/qe as the source WOULD be the installed file, right?
2021-04-28T16:29:26 #kisslinux <konimex> no, $1/usr/bin/qe means that /usr/bin/qemacs (the symlink) will look for /home/user/.cache/kiss/proc/999/build/usr/bin/qe
2021-04-28T16:29:32 #kisslinux <konimex> which obviously will not exist
2021-04-28T16:29:43 #kisslinux <yabobay> but $1 is the installed place right?
2021-04-28T16:29:55 #kisslinux <konimex> what do you mean by "the installed place"?
2021-04-28T16:30:06 #kisslinux <yabobay> the kiss prefix
2021-04-28T16:30:14 #kisslinux <midfavila> you're installing a symlink from the binary to the package. when it's installed I believe it's automatically corrected
2021-04-28T16:30:21 #kisslinux <midfavila> i've seen a lot of packages do that.
2021-04-28T16:30:25 #kisslinux <konimex> well, "prefix" is not really accurate so I'd say it's more DESTDIR
2021-04-28T16:30:58 #kisslinux <midfavila> i got it mixed up, my bad
2021-04-28T16:30:59 #kisslinux <yabobay> yknow what, i'm probably the only person who will use this package even if it was published, so can i just not symlink it even
2021-04-28T16:31:02 #kisslinux <midfavila> other way round
2021-04-28T16:31:07 #kisslinux <konimex> fair enough
2021-04-28T16:31:24 #kisslinux <yabobay> i will put a todo comment in the file tho
2021-04-28T16:32:25 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> ln -s qemacs "$1/usr/bin/qe" is relative so qe points to qemacs present in the same dir as the qe symlink
2021-04-28T16:34:19 #kisslinux <midfavila> while I'm being a deviant
2021-04-28T16:34:25 #kisslinux <midfavila> i should convert all my packages to ftps
2021-04-28T16:34:30 #kisslinux <midfavila> just to torment dilyn
2021-04-28T16:37:25 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> dilyn: https://732706.bugs.gentoo.org/attachment.cgi?id=687663 idk if you found a fix for webengine already
2021-04-28T16:38:44 #kisslinux <yabobay> wait a sec i just realised
2021-04-28T16:38:50 #kisslinux <yabobay> why are install instructions in build?
2021-04-28T16:38:55 #kisslinux <yabobay> and not a separate file
2021-04-28T16:39:13 #kisslinux <midfavila> because that would be redundant
2021-04-28T16:39:37 #kisslinux <dilyn> "$1" points to KISS_TMPDIR/$pid/pkg/$pkgname
2021-04-28T16:39:59 #kisslinux <dilyn> KISS_TMPDIR/$pid/pkg/$pkgname is what gets read for the manifest and archived for installation
2021-04-28T16:40:14 #kisslinux <yabobay> ohhh
2021-04-28T16:40:16 #kisslinux <yabobay> thats pretty smart
2021-04-28T16:40:30 #kisslinux <dilyn> so putting "$1" in a target for a symlink will lead to a broken symlink, because the target will not exist
2021-04-28T16:40:43 #kisslinux <dilyn> so either make the target a full path (/usr/bin/foo), or a relative path (../foo)
2021-04-28T16:41:19 #kisslinux <yabobay> ohh
2021-04-28T16:41:25 #kisslinux <dilyn> it will be relative to the symlink itself, so ln -s ../foo "$1/usr/bin/foo" will result in a symlink being installed after kiss i $pkg in /usr/bin/foo, pointing to /usr/foo
2021-04-28T16:41:45 #kisslinux <dilyn> "$2" is the version of the package, also useful to use
2021-04-28T16:42:12 #kisslinux <dilyn> testuser_: gentoo stole my patches >=|
2021-04-28T16:42:17 #kisslinux <dilyn> that I have yet to push anywhere
2021-04-28T16:42:18 #kisslinux <dilyn> ty
2021-04-28T16:42:29 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> Lol
2021-04-28T16:44:58 #kisslinux <tink> i was just thinking, wouldn't it be simpler to employ a single user method/program rather than a multi user one which is supported by default on linux? from what i've seen, many people don't really have multiple users on their computer other than the main user and superuser.
2021-04-28T16:45:33 #kisslinux <yabobay> so i got it to build and install. but running `qe` after de-installation will still run qe.
2021-04-28T16:45:42 #kisslinux <yabobay> this is probably cause of my system.
2021-04-28T16:46:08 #kisslinux <dilyn> are you running as root?
2021-04-28T16:46:42 #kisslinux <tink> currently, just to have superuser and a user with restricted permissions, many users are supported. though, if superuser was not actually a user but implemented some other way, there would be only a single user and the support and permissions for it would be simpler
2021-04-28T16:48:09 #kisslinux <tink> nevermind, i need to sleep
2021-04-28T16:49:11 #kisslinux <dilyn> lol
2021-04-28T16:50:18 #kisslinux <dilyn> alright. one final test to make sure that everything builds with a regular KISS system. and then I can push it. and finally relax
2021-04-28T16:51:03 #kisslinux <yabobay> by the way, if i get a *good* package, and i wanna push it to say, community for example, what's a good guide for using git so i don't have to get on my internets browser and use github on that
2021-04-28T17:01:39 #kisslinux <midfavila> curl is officially banished from my systems
2021-04-28T17:01:59 #kisslinux <yabobay> what's wrong with curl?
2021-04-28T17:02:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> muh bloat
2021-04-28T17:02:15 #kisslinux <midfavila> and axel is faster for large file transfers anyway
2021-04-28T17:02:47 #kisslinux <yabobay> i thought wget was the muh bloat
2021-04-28T17:02:53 #kisslinux <midfavila> wget is also muh bloat
2021-04-28T17:03:04 #kisslinux <yabobay> what does kiss use?
2021-04-28T17:03:07 #kisslinux <midfavila> curl
2021-04-28T17:03:23 #kisslinux <yabobay> can you just easily put something else in its place?
2021-04-28T17:03:26 #kisslinux <yabobay> like as a user
2021-04-28T17:03:43 #kisslinux <midfavila> i mean, axel seems to work just fine. s'long as you can get the same output from the tool that KISS expects...
2021-04-28T17:03:50 #kisslinux <midfavila> KISS shouldn't really care about the tool being used.
2021-04-28T17:04:00 #kisslinux <midfavila> but yeah
2021-04-28T17:04:05 #kisslinux <midfavila> 3.7mb for curl's binary
2021-04-28T17:04:10 #kisslinux <midfavila> 74.5k for axel's
2021-04-28T17:04:46 #kisslinux <yabobay> unix philosophy
2021-04-28T17:08:09 #kisslinux <dilyn> mail server going down for a migration, don't email the lists :v
2021-04-28T17:08:15 #kisslinux <midfavila> QUICK
2021-04-28T17:08:17 #kisslinux <midfavila> EVERYONE EMAIL THE LISTS
2021-04-28T17:08:27 #kisslinux <yabobay> i have never been able to comprehend mailing lists
2021-04-28T17:08:31 #kisslinux <yabobay> like as a technology
2021-04-28T17:09:07 #kisslinux <yabobay> and don't worry, that is not a request for an explanation
2021-04-28T17:09:36 #kisslinux <dilyn> lol
2021-04-28T17:09:44 #kisslinux <dilyn> https://dilyn-corner.github.io/blog/Server-Mail
2021-04-28T17:09:45 #kisslinux <dilyn> :v
2021-04-28T17:11:05 #kisslinux <yabobay> wait a sec
2021-04-28T17:11:10 #kisslinux <yabobay> your website is the same as the kiss linux website
2021-04-28T17:11:17 #kisslinux <yabobay> in how it looks
2021-04-28T17:11:21 #kisslinux <midfavila> :thinking:
2021-04-28T17:11:27 #kisslinux <dilyn> :thinking:
2021-04-28T17:12:34 #kisslinux <yabobay> im looking around rn it says you used windows vista after ubuntu?
2021-04-28T17:12:40 #kisslinux <yabobay> how did that happen
2021-04-28T17:13:12 #kisslinux <dilyn> because vista had just come out
2021-04-28T17:13:47 #kisslinux <yabobay> yeah but like who in their right mind
2021-04-28T17:14:51 #kisslinux <Rio6> I don't think I've even seen a vista irl
2021-04-28T17:14:54 #kisslinux <yabobay> anyway i have made a pre-remove script that deletes the qe executable and manpage manually. it doesnt work without it ¯_(ツ)_/¯
2021-04-28T17:15:00 #kisslinux <midfavila> dilyn you have a typo on your about-me
2021-04-28T17:15:30 #kisslinux <midfavila> "The whole thing started because I wanted to play Civilaztion "
2021-04-28T17:15:32 #kisslinux <midfavila> plsfix
2021-04-28T17:18:16 #kisslinux <dilyn> Longhorn is best Windows, change my mind
2021-04-28T17:18:28 #kisslinux <midfavila> fuck you, XP is better
2021-04-28T17:18:34 #kisslinux <midfavila> that way you can run litestep
2021-04-28T17:19:14 #kisslinux <dilyn> fixed the typo :P
2021-04-28T17:19:18 #kisslinux <dilyn> XP is hot garbage and I hate it
2021-04-28T17:19:34 #kisslinux <midfavila> can we all agree that windows in general is trash
2021-04-28T17:19:40 #kisslinux <dilyn> lol
2021-04-28T17:19:52 #kisslinux <midfavila> *literally* a CP/M knockoff
2021-04-28T17:19:57 #kisslinux <midfavila> ...or, well, DOS was
2021-04-28T17:20:08 #kisslinux <yabobay> what's cpm
2021-04-28T17:20:17 #kisslinux <midfavila> Control Program for Microcomputers
2021-04-28T17:20:24 #kisslinux <midfavila> one of, if not the earliest OSes for home computers
2021-04-28T17:20:31 #kisslinux <midfavila> developed by Gary Kildall of Digital Research
2021-04-28T17:20:37 #kisslinux <midfavila> also responsible for the concept of the BIOS iirc
2021-04-28T17:20:43 #kisslinux <Rio6> XP was my first computer
2021-04-28T17:20:45 #kisslinux <Rio6> I'm newb :P
2021-04-28T17:20:52 #kisslinux <dilyn> same
2021-04-28T17:20:59 #kisslinux <midfavila> aren't you like
2021-04-28T17:21:03 #kisslinux <midfavila> literally a thirty year old boomer
2021-04-28T17:21:21 #kisslinux <yabobay> my first computer was a windows seben. i think thats the best windows still
2021-04-28T17:21:31 #kisslinux <midfavila> >seben
2021-04-28T17:21:36 #kisslinux <midfavila> that should be the WotD
2021-04-28T17:21:38 #kisslinux <dilyn> lel
2021-04-28T17:21:43 #kisslinux <midfavila> acheam
2021-04-28T17:22:01 #kisslinux <midfavila> and I mean, tbf, seven was the last version that's actually useable
2021-04-28T17:22:05 #kisslinux <midfavila> usable
2021-04-28T17:22:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> w/e
2021-04-28T17:22:09 #kisslinux <Rio6> ^
2021-04-28T17:22:22 #kisslinux <yabobay> dude if i wanna send images in here whats how do i what how do i do it
2021-04-28T17:22:25 #kisslinux <midfavila> metro is god-awful, and the less we say about ten the better
2021-04-28T17:22:28 #kisslinux <midfavila> you don't, yabobay
2021-04-28T17:22:31 #kisslinux <yabobay> not in irc, but where do i upload them
2021-04-28T17:22:34 #kisslinux <midfavila> 0x0.st
2021-04-28T17:22:45 #kisslinux <midfavila> ...although irc does support rudimentary file transfer...
2021-04-28T17:22:51 #kisslinux <yabobay> it does?
2021-04-28T17:22:55 #kisslinux <midfavila> yes
2021-04-28T17:23:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> there's also a peer-to-peer messaging mode
2021-04-28T17:23:17 #kisslinux <yabobay> how do i send a file in here then?
2021-04-28T17:23:26 #kisslinux <midfavila> i don't know the actual command for it under the hood
2021-04-28T17:23:33 #kisslinux <midfavila> because I don't transfer files via irc
2021-04-28T17:23:34 #kisslinux <midfavila> lmao
2021-04-28T17:24:11 #kisslinux <yabobay> http://0x0.st/-mF4.jpg
2021-04-28T17:24:12 #kisslinux <yabobay> there we go
2021-04-28T17:24:25 #kisslinux <midfavila> quality contribution
2021-04-28T17:24:37 #kisslinux <yabobay> of course
2021-04-28T17:24:39 #kisslinux <yabobay> it's important
2021-04-28T17:25:01 #kisslinux <yabobay> it would've been much funnier if i was able to do it quicker
2021-04-28T17:26:05 #kisslinux <acheam> midfavila:
2021-04-28T17:26:18 #kisslinux <midfavila> >seden
2021-04-28T17:26:21 #kisslinux <midfavila> >:c
2021-04-28T17:26:22 #kisslinux <yabobay> double typo
2021-04-28T17:26:30 #kisslinux <midfavila> disappointed in you acheam
2021-04-28T17:26:33 #kisslinux <acheam> thats part of the charm
2021-04-28T17:26:42 #kisslinux <midfavila> and you broke the sotd too
2021-04-28T17:26:43 #kisslinux <midfavila> gj
2021-04-28T17:26:48 #kisslinux <acheam> the special something that differentiates KISS and RHEL
2021-04-28T17:27:03 #kisslinux <midfavila> that special something is our clearly very high quality community
2021-04-28T17:27:12 #kisslinux <acheam> nope that can't be it
2021-04-28T17:27:24 #kisslinux <yabobay> wiktionary says that seden is the definite singular of sed in spanish
2021-04-28T17:30:05 #kisslinux <dilyn> why is rsync such a bitch
2021-04-28T17:30:11 #kisslinux <acheam> i love rsync
2021-04-28T17:30:15 #kisslinux <yabobay> whats rsync
2021-04-28T17:30:25 #kisslinux <dilyn> hng
2021-04-28T17:30:39 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> midfavila can you share the axel command that you use in kiss the package manager instead of curl
2021-04-28T17:31:00 #kisslinux <midfavila> just axel "$src" -o
2021-04-28T17:31:22 #kisslinux <yabobay> if axel is smoler why doesn't kiss use it by default?
2021-04-28T17:31:23 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> Cool
2021-04-28T17:31:30 #kisslinux <midfavila> because axel is obscure
2021-04-28T17:31:59 #kisslinux <yabobay> well you have a direct contact to the kiss guy right now.
2021-04-28T17:32:07 #kisslinux <dilyn> lol
2021-04-28T17:32:12 #kisslinux <dilyn> because curl is better
2021-04-28T17:32:16 #kisslinux <dilyn>  /shrug
2021-04-28T17:32:18 #kisslinux <yabobay> :O
2021-04-28T17:32:45 #kisslinux <Rio6> time to fork kiss /jk
2021-04-28T17:32:52 #kisslinux <midfavila> i mean
2021-04-28T17:32:53 #kisslinux <midfavila> i did
2021-04-28T17:32:54 #kisslinux <midfavila> lmao
2021-04-28T17:33:08 #kisslinux <midfavila> don't need -outdated or -reset, nor the docs
2021-04-28T17:33:14 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> How do you get git to use axel instead of libcurl
2021-04-28T17:33:27 #kisslinux <dilyn> probably don't
2021-04-28T17:33:39 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> Did you banish git too
2021-04-28T17:33:40 #kisslinux <Rio6> don't we all have a fork of kiss :P
2021-04-28T17:33:51 #kisslinux <dilyn> i have two forks of KISS!
2021-04-28T17:33:52 #kisslinux <midfavila> haven't banished git Yet:tm:
2021-04-28T17:34:01 #kisslinux <midfavila> but soon
2021-04-28T17:34:02 #kisslinux <midfavila> soon...
2021-04-28T17:34:13 #kisslinux <miskatonic> some have a knife or a spoon of KISS
2021-04-28T17:34:14 #kisslinux <dilyn> fossil incoming
2021-04-28T17:34:24 #kisslinux <midfavila> nah
2021-04-28T17:34:34 #kisslinux <midfavila> just gonna convert all my stuff to use release tarballs
2021-04-28T17:35:25 #kisslinux <yabobay> i frickin made a package and i wanna get it on the internets. help???
2021-04-28T17:37:56 #kisslinux <dilyn> "can't open `/dev/ tty1`" um
2021-04-28T17:38:33 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> git clone https://github.com/kiss-community/repo-community.git --depth=1; cd repo-community; git checkout -b mypkg; # add pkg; git add community; git commit -m mypkg: new pkg at $version; git format patch something; # send to ML
2021-04-28T17:39:13 #kisslinux <yabobay> this wouldn't tell me how to do it, this is just you doing it via me.
2021-04-28T17:39:25 #kisslinux <yabobay> turns out the package has a problem yet again anyway.
2021-04-28T17:40:09 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> You clone the repo, checkout a new branch for your package, add your build files to community, add a commit message, then either create a github pr or send it to the mailing list
2021-04-28T17:40:29 #kisslinux <Rio6> <is just you doing it via me> for some reason these words make me laugh
2021-04-28T17:40:56 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> A branch is a somewhat like a copy of the original stuff, so you can add packages without modifying the original copy
2021-04-28T17:41:08 #kisslinux <yabobay> i'll just frickin read the git manual
2021-04-28T17:43:24 #kisslinux <dilyn> lmao
2021-04-28T17:43:25 #kisslinux <dilyn> good idea
2021-04-28T17:43:54 #kisslinux <yabobay> oh nevermind. the git website calls it the BOOK. now this is what i'm talkin about
2021-04-28T17:46:04 #kisslinux <acheam> midfavila: you're a cathedral guy, eh?
2021-04-28T17:46:33 #kisslinux <midfavila> "Cathedral"?
2021-04-28T17:46:39 #kisslinux <midfavila> As opposed to bazaar?
2021-04-28T17:46:41 #kisslinux <acheam> yes
2021-04-28T17:46:48 #kisslinux <midfavila> No, not really.
2021-04-28T17:47:39 #kisslinux <miskatonic> stallman was the cathedral par excellence
2021-04-28T17:47:46 #kisslinux <acheam> well the release tarballs without VC is more of the cathedral view, no?
2021-04-28T17:48:09 #kisslinux <yabobay> "The Linux kernel is an open source software project of fairly large scope." -- the git book. i just think thats a funny statement
2021-04-28T17:48:46 #kisslinux <acheam> its not as big as a script kiddie with a for loop's repo
2021-04-28T17:48:51 #kisslinux <dilyn> oh wtf rsync. I said DONT sync dev entries
2021-04-28T17:49:07 #kisslinux <acheam> are you using rsync for backups?
2021-04-28T17:49:09 #kisslinux <dilyn> no wonder it's so fucking wonky. dev can't be populated because actual *files* exist there
2021-04-28T17:49:13 #kisslinux <acheam> why not borg?
2021-04-28T17:49:22 #kisslinux <dilyn> because rsync is a one-liner I know
2021-04-28T17:49:43 #kisslinux <dilyn> i'm downgrading the vps to a single core 1gb ram 10gb storage because i don't need to pay $20/mo for all this
2021-04-28T17:50:06 #kisslinux <yabobay> the vps hosts what? k1sslinux.org?
2021-04-28T17:50:10 #kisslinux <dilyn> so i have to migrate, but because I made a partition on the disk linode can't automagically resize it, so i have to rsync everything to a different disk so i can do the migration
2021-04-28T17:50:23 #kisslinux <dilyn> vps hosts {git,fossil,mail}.k1sslinux.org
2021-04-28T17:50:28 #kisslinux <dilyn> github hosts k1sslinux.org
2021-04-28T17:50:33 #kisslinux <acheam> boo
2021-04-28T17:50:48 #kisslinux <yabobay> awww cmon. if you have the vps why not put the website too
2021-04-28T17:50:58 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> midfavila what issues do palememe and webbrowser have building on musl exactly ?
2021-04-28T17:51:18 #kisslinux <dilyn> because I'm too lazy atm
2021-04-28T17:51:47 #kisslinux <Rio6> do the servers run kiss
2021-04-28T17:51:52 #kisslinux <dilyn> ofc
2021-04-28T17:52:02 #kisslinux <yabobay> ayy
2021-04-28T17:53:13 #kisslinux <yabobay> i should probably finish installing kiss instead of reading the BOOK
2021-04-28T17:54:26 #kisslinux <yabobay> ughhh i'm getting used to VI while im editing these config files. what have you done to me
2021-04-28T17:56:37 #kisslinux <rgybmc[m]> Hi everyone. Is there an easy way to see what features differ between busybox and gnu coreutils commands (and others)?
2021-04-28T17:57:31 #kisslinux <yabobay> if someone is not using gnu coreutils, are they running "busybox/linux"?
2021-04-28T17:58:32 #kisslinux <rgybmc[m]> or busybox plus linux :P
2021-04-28T17:59:57 #kisslinux <yabobay> oR As iVe ReCeNtLy tAkEn tO CaLlInG iT
2021-04-28T18:00:34 #kisslinux <yabobay> when rms said he never installed gnu+linux, he meant he uses busybox instead
2021-04-28T18:01:22 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> rgybmc I don't think there's a list but busybox stuff mostly supports a little more than required by posix and gnu adds a ton of extensions
2021-04-28T18:01:43 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> with sbase ubase you have the bare minimum required
2021-04-28T18:02:42 #kisslinux <Rio6> busybox plus hurd
2021-04-28T18:03:20 #kisslinux <rgybmc[m]> testuser_: That makes sense. I think I'll have a look at the posix spec and maybe get busybox to play with (not running kiss right now)
2021-04-28T18:11:22 #kisslinux <yabobay> oh yeah does anybody really use hurd?
2021-04-28T18:11:23 #kisslinux <dilyn> god this is infuriating
2021-04-28T18:18:57 #kisslinux <dilyn> uuuummmm
2021-04-28T18:19:24 #kisslinux <dilyn> the inittab... was corrupted
2021-04-28T18:19:26 #kisslinux <dilyn> fuck rsync lads
2021-04-28T18:20:06 #kisslinux <dilyn> doesn't matter didn't fix it. wtf
2021-04-28T18:23:09 #kisslinux <rgybmc[m]> Huh, it turns out less (that I was mainly interested in) isn't part of coreutils, busybox just has a minimal version anyway, that's good.
2021-04-28T18:28:35 #kisslinux <yabobay> how come there is no tool for making a kernel config based on what hardware you're running the tool on?
2021-04-28T18:28:49 #kisslinux <yabobay> and if there is, why isn't it in any guide ever
2021-04-28T18:30:51 #kisslinux <dilyn> make localyesconfig
2021-04-28T18:31:38 #kisslinux <yabobay> i tried that, didn't do jack on the VM, and even when i looked at it in menuconfig, it enabled several things for each hardware category that were totally unrelated.
2021-04-28T18:31:41 #kisslinux <yabobay> do you use it?
2021-04-28T18:32:21 #kisslinux <dilyn> no, but i know all the options i need
2021-04-28T18:32:32 #kisslinux <yabobay> ahA
2021-04-28T18:32:39 #kisslinux <yabobay> yeah it's kinda no good
2021-04-28T18:35:12 #kisslinux <yabobay> we should have a bin package for linux kernel
2021-04-28T18:35:17 #kisslinux <dilyn> no
2021-04-28T18:35:20 #kisslinux <yabobay> and make it be VERY not recommended
2021-04-28T18:37:20 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> what are you having issues with in the VM?  VirtualBox worked "out of the box" except the video driver didn't get picked up for me (vboxvideo)
2021-04-28T18:37:53 #kisslinux <yabobay> ethernet didnt work. i dont even know if its a driver issue but that's what this channel said.
2021-04-28T18:38:09 #kisslinux <yabobay> i *was* using IA-32 though,,
2021-04-28T18:38:17 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> what ethernet driver do you have the VM using?
2021-04-28T18:38:30 #kisslinux <yabobay> whatever virtualbox does by default?
2021-04-28T18:38:37 #kisslinux <yabobay> it worked on the arch iso
2021-04-28T18:38:47 #kisslinux <yabobay> im not doing the VM anymore anyway
2021-04-28T18:40:29 #kisslinux <yabobay> on my real hardware we're gonna have bigger problems cause i gotta get iwlwifi
2021-04-28T18:41:13 #kisslinux <yabobay> and figure out wpa_supplicant oh god
2021-04-28T18:41:24 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> is that in linux-firmware for you to grab?
2021-04-28T18:41:50 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> yo udon't have to use wpa_supplicant, there's other options like https://github.com/dylanaraps/eiwd
2021-04-28T18:42:48 #kisslinux <yabobay> and why not normal iwd?
2021-04-28T18:42:56 #kisslinux <yabobay> and also that's still trying to connect to wifi from command line
2021-04-28T18:43:06 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> no dbus
2021-04-28T18:43:10 #kisslinux <yabobay> why dbus bad?
2021-04-28T18:43:32 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> https://k1sslinux.org/guidestones
2021-04-28T18:44:09 #kisslinux <yabobay> ok so it's not in kiss so that makes sense
2021-04-28T18:44:16 #kisslinux <yabobay> but that opens another question
2021-04-28T18:44:18 #kisslinux <yabobay> why dbus bad?
2021-04-28T18:47:05 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> d-bus itself as a protocol isn't inherently bad
2021-04-28T18:47:17 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> but what d-bus brokers exist?
2021-04-28T18:47:30 #kisslinux <yabobay> d-bis brokers?
2021-04-28T18:47:42 #kisslinux <yabobay> d-bus*
2021-04-28T18:47:44 #kisslinux <yabobay> lol dbis
2021-04-28T18:47:55 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> yes, server implementations of the protocol
2021-04-28T18:50:38 #kisslinux <yabobay> if someone has ported kde, could i port MATE
2021-04-28T18:50:44 #kisslinux <yabobay> and how many years of work would that be
2021-04-28T18:53:57 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> probably start here: https://github.com/mate-desktop looking at what pieces you want and what it takes to build them (dependencies, does it work with musl, etc)
2021-04-28T18:54:45 #kisslinux <yabobay> this will probably come later, because i wanna learn to use KISS the KISS way, before i make KISS work in my way.
2021-04-28T18:55:34 #kisslinux <yabobay> that said, i think kiss would be pretty cool for a live system i've been wanting to do that just boots you into fullscreen emacs as quickly as possible
2021-04-28T18:55:41 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> btw https://github.com/periish/kiss-dbus that's a repo with dbus, it's a little outdated now probably
2021-04-28T19:07:30 #kisslinux <jslick> I think some periish repos got consolidated to https://github.com/periish/kiss-all
2021-04-28T19:07:48 #kisslinux <jslick> which also hasn't seen activity recently
2021-04-28T19:08:10 #kisslinux <yabobay> i guess you could say these repos have periished
2021-04-28T19:14:22 #kisslinux <acheam> lol
2021-04-28T19:15:08 #kisslinux <zenomat> hello everyohe
2021-04-28T19:16:14 #kisslinux <yabobay> hii
2021-04-28T19:16:31 #kisslinux <zenomat> spend the whole day with social interactions and work, now it is time for tinkering with my system
2021-04-28T19:17:31 #kisslinux <yabobay> i wonder if i'll ever get to actually use a kiss linux system
2021-04-28T19:17:47 #kisslinux <zenomat> sure you will. if i can do it, you can too
2021-04-28T19:18:04 #kisslinux <yabobay> that's not what i mean
2021-04-28T19:18:25 #kisslinux <yabobay> i mean, will i get to use it to accomplish some sort of goal outside of setting up a kiss linux system
2021-04-28T19:20:03 #kisslinux <acheam> zenomat: thats a mood
2021-04-28T19:20:17 #kisslinux <zenomat> I think that comes naturally in the end, when you have a system that you are comfortable with. but if not, then maybe KISS is just a hobby and you have another OS for actual work
2021-04-28T19:21:00 #kisslinux <acheam> thats kind of my setup right now
2021-04-28T19:25:15 #kisslinux <zenomat> yesterday some of you guys mentioned the gcc update and the rebuilding of software. is it advised to rebuild my system after the gcc update?
2021-04-28T19:25:25 #kisslinux <zenomat> or did I interpret that wrong?
2021-04-28T19:31:15 #kisslinux <spryc> any palememers here?
2021-04-28T19:31:39 #kisslinux <yabobay> what palememer
2021-04-28T19:31:42 #kisslinux <yabobay> *what's
2021-04-28T19:33:20 #kisslinux <spryc> someone who uses the palemoon browser
2021-04-28T19:35:27 #kisslinux <yabobay> i feel like the more independent parts of the internet you go to (this is freenode which isnt THAT independent but relatively is) the more likely it is you'll hear something like "palememer"
2021-04-28T19:37:42 #kisslinux <dilyn> mid's around somewhere
2021-04-28T19:38:08 #kisslinux <dilyn> zenomat: i was rebuilding the whole repo to make sure the gcc update doesn't break any obvious things before sending it
2021-04-28T19:38:27 #kisslinux <dilyn> (common practice for major version bumps; we did the same thing for gcc 10 and it broke *many* things)
2021-04-28T19:38:44 #kisslinux <dilyn> unless there's a major library soname bump you won't have to rebuild anything
2021-04-28T19:38:53 #kisslinux <zenomat> alright. thanks
2021-04-28T19:52:02 #kisslinux <yabobay> uh-oh problem : im running localmodconfig on a chroot, and it cant find the vbox modules that i have to run virtualbox as a host. how do i unload them without rebooting so it doesnt find them?
2021-04-28T19:56:13 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> does modprobe list them?
2021-04-28T19:56:32 #kisslinux <yabobay> in the host or the chroot?
2021-04-28T19:56:34 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> are you trying to run virtualbox within the chroot?
2021-04-28T19:56:44 #kisslinux <yabobay> nope, and i dont want these modules in the chroot
2021-04-28T19:58:09 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> are you configuring a kernel to build within the chroot?
2021-04-28T19:58:18 #kisslinux <yabobay> yeah
2021-04-28T19:58:39 #kisslinux <yabobay> ok i misworded the first message
2021-04-28T19:58:57 #kisslinux <yabobay> it sees i'm running the modules on my host machine, but those modules are not bundled with the linux kernel
2021-04-28T19:59:01 #kisslinux <yabobay> so it errors out
2021-04-28T19:59:09 #kisslinux <yabobay> how do i unload those on my host, so it doesnt see them
2021-04-28T20:00:07 #kisslinux <dilyn> rmmod
2021-04-28T20:00:29 #kisslinux <yabobay> thanks
2021-04-28T20:00:34 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> `modprobe -r` as well i think?
2021-04-28T20:00:51 #kisslinux <yabobay> although i looked it up and was able to do it on my own in the same time. i should learn to do that more. i'm sorry
2021-04-28T20:05:26 #kisslinux <spryc> what repos have netsurf?
2021-04-28T20:18:39 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> the fb frontend is packaged as netsurf-fb in community.  muevoid used it for a while, i think they pulled the build information from https://github.com/kisslinux/community/commit/4fb09dc964a51a1f3a133b812dcf34cd57f3a594
2021-04-28T20:18:52 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> *used the gtk frontend for a while
2021-04-28T20:30:56 #kisslinux <yabobay> lsmod says i have iwlwifi/iwlmvm loaded, but i can't find it in the linux-firmware i downloaded.
2021-04-28T20:31:15 #kisslinux <dilyn> search dmesg for the firmware name?
2021-04-28T20:32:08 #kisslinux <yabobay> every mention is iwlwifi / iwlmvm / iwl-mvm-rs
2021-04-28T20:32:46 #kisslinux <yabobay> the linux-firmware thing i have here is a bunch of iwlwifi-somenumbers
2021-04-28T20:33:13 #kisslinux <dilyn> because there are many
2021-04-28T20:33:20 #kisslinux <dilyn> check gentoo wiki for your specific card maybe?
2021-04-28T20:33:58 #kisslinux <yabobay> but how do i know what my specific card is?
2021-04-28T20:34:44 #kisslinux <yabobay> nevermind, found it
2021-04-28T20:34:50 #kisslinux <yabobay> by doing lsusb
2021-04-28T20:52:22 #kisslinux <midfavila> testuser I'll run some tests next time I've got a musl system, I can't recall the exact error
2021-04-28T20:52:26 #kisslinux <midfavila> er,
2021-04-28T20:52:33 #kisslinux <midfavila> s/testuser/testuser_[m]/
2021-04-28T20:52:33 #kisslinux <movzbl> <midfavila> er,
2021-04-28T20:52:35 #kisslinux <midfavila> ...
2021-04-28T20:53:06 #kisslinux <midfavila> anyway, sorry for the late reply, I had a friend over and then had to install my SAS drives, but then I broke one of my new cable's power connectors like a mongoloid
2021-04-28T20:53:12 #kisslinux <midfavila> so now I need to order a replacement
2021-04-28T21:12:27 #kisslinux <dilyn> pushed qt5 update. if anybody experiences any problems with it, lmk :X
2021-04-28T21:14:57 #kisslinux <acheam> wow thats a lot of wiped patches
2021-04-28T21:15:09 #kisslinux <dilyn> just ended up rewriting most of them
2021-04-28T21:15:26 #kisslinux <dilyn> some required additional stuff...
2021-04-28T21:15:52 #kisslinux <dilyn> chromium devs have a habit of just randomly flip-flopping their comments and ifdef's so those parts of patches have be reverted to the prior version
2021-04-28T21:15:54 #kisslinux <dilyn> it's fucking dumb.
2021-04-28T21:17:55 #kisslinux <yabobay> menuconfig sux
2021-04-28T21:20:34 #kisslinux <acheam> nconfig ftw
2021-04-28T21:20:45 #kisslinux <yabobay> wait
2021-04-28T21:20:48 #kisslinux <yabobay> nconfig is different?
2021-04-28T21:20:50 #kisslinux <yabobay> i never tried it
2021-04-28T21:20:55 #kisslinux <acheam> its much better
2021-04-28T21:21:10 #kisslinux <yabobay> omg it's different
2021-04-28T21:21:21 #kisslinux <dilyn> there's an X, GTK, and QT one as well
2021-04-28T21:21:21 #kisslinux <yabobay> it looks quite the same
2021-04-28T21:21:31 #kisslinux <acheam> wait there is?
2021-04-28T21:21:32 #kisslinux <yabobay> yeah but i dont have those installed in kiss yet
2021-04-28T21:22:22 #kisslinux <aarng> make help, acheam
2021-04-28T21:23:00 #kisslinux <acheam> aarng always descends down to us with the best little bits of genius :)
2021-04-28T21:23:28 #kisslinux <aarng> that's how I roll, lol
2021-04-28T21:31:26 #kisslinux <yabobay> i'm just looking through nconfig, what is NSA SELinux? i've heard of it but i have no idea
2021-04-28T21:31:30 #kisslinux <yabobay> something tells me i wanna turn it off
2021-04-28T21:33:18 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> https://www.nsa.gov/Portals/70/documents/what-we-do/research/selinux/documentation/presentations/2005-flexible-support-for-security-policies-into-linux-os-presentation.pdf
2021-04-28T21:33:57 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> you can use it to define permissions for users and applications, access controls on system capabilities
2021-04-28T21:34:34 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> i personally don't use it or recommend it but a lot of corporations will require it or an equivalent as part of any deployed system
2021-04-28T21:35:39 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> my work uses AppArmor instead
2021-04-28T21:39:00 #kisslinux <yabobay> is apparmor like a similar thing? if so prolly not gonna use that either
2021-04-28T21:53:05 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> yeah, you don't need it
2021-04-28T23:21:56 #kisslinux <dilyn> hikari is dead
2021-04-28T23:22:00 #kisslinux <dilyn> wayfire is new best friend
2021-04-28T23:24:42 #kisslinux <acheam> isnt wayfire just compiz for wayland?
2021-04-28T23:39:08 #kisslinux <dilyn> it's a compositor inspired by all that gaudy stuff
2021-04-28T23:39:18 #kisslinux <dilyn> but it's a floating window manager that isn't GPL and doesn't depend on pango
2021-04-28T23:39:29 #kisslinux <dilyn> and it supports setting monitor refresh rate
2021-04-28T23:39:44 #kisslinux <dilyn> and most of it's more excentric features can be disabled
2021-04-28T23:41:14 #kisslinux <claudia007> muh libexecinfo
2021-04-28T23:45:10 #kisslinux <dilyn> nah just patch that b out ;)
2021-04-28T23:48:14 #kisslinux <claudia007> heh :v saw the tiny patch
2021-04-28T23:54:28 #kisslinux <dilyn> I can be quite surgical with my patches :v
2021-04-28T23:55:18 #kisslinux <claudia007> wayfire hits the sweetspot on usability/development with small set of dependencies IMO
2021-04-28T23:55:25 #kisslinux <claudia007> *at the moment
2021-04-28T23:56:24 #kisslinux <dilyn> yeah it's basically perf
2021-04-28T23:56:26 #kisslinux <dilyn> bbl