2021-01-26T05:50:40 #kisslinux <dilyn> I find it hard to believe nobody has ever attempted to build chromium with only an llvm toolchain
2021-01-26T05:50:54 #kisslinux <dilyn> they *distribute llvm* WITH chromium ffs
2021-01-26T06:32:33 #kisslinux <testuser[m]_> aaaaaaaaaa ff 85 still needs gtk2 make
2021-01-26T07:16:11 #kisslinux <claudia> morning
2021-01-26T07:16:51 #kisslinux <claudia> dilyn: looking at the obsd ports tree, they might build with only clang https://github.com/openbsd/ports/blob/master/www/chromium/Makefile#L45 . How I read it it could either be one.
2021-01-26T07:16:53 #kisslinux <testuser[m]_> hello
2021-01-26T07:16:59 #kisslinux <claudia> morning testuser[m]_
2021-01-26T07:17:53 #kisslinux <claudia> First snow this year in my place :D
2021-01-26T07:19:08 #kisslinux <testuser[m]_> nice
2021-01-26T07:19:15 #kisslinux <claudia> maybe you could pick *one* of their patches :v
2021-01-26T07:20:13 #kisslinux <testuser[m]_> wtf there's like a literal thousand patches in that directory
2021-01-26T07:21:01 #kisslinux <claudia> They often need several patches to get things going, but this one is enormous
2021-01-26T07:21:33 #kisslinux <testuser[m]_> are ALL of those patches used or only some of them are used depending on version?
2021-01-26T07:21:42 #kisslinux <claudia> and they even need to get updated for version bumps^^
2021-01-26T07:22:25 #kisslinux <testuser[m]_> a lot of them are just one liners but still looks like hell to maintain
2021-01-26T07:22:44 #kisslinux <claudia> I think they get all applied. And some, e.g starting with 'powerpc-*' just for powerpc arch
2021-01-26T07:24:51 #kisslinux <claudia> Sb must have strong reasons for chrome
2021-01-26T07:27:18 #kisslinux <claudia> ~/ports/www/chromium/patches $ ls | wc -l = 809
2021-01-26T07:28:00 #kisslinux <testuser[m]_> oooooooof
2021-01-26T07:29:10 #kisslinux <testuser[m]_> and i thought 12 patches for musl was a lot
2021-01-26T10:35:13 #kisslinux <salvia> hi
2021-01-26T10:37:06 #kisslinux <testuser[m]_> hello
2021-01-26T10:38:35 #kisslinux <salvia> I'm still trying to install kiss and now it's way better than yesterday, but still not to good
2021-01-26T10:38:53 #kisslinux <testuser[m]_> what is the problem this time?
2021-01-26T10:39:14 #kisslinux <salvia> kiss b dhcpcd returns checksum mismatch
2021-01-26T10:39:38 #kisslinux <testuser[m]_> are you using repo-community
2021-01-26T10:41:13 #kisslinux <salvia> it's not like I'm deliberately using smth but I can't find dhcpcd package on community github so it's repo I assume
2021-01-26T10:42:08 #kisslinux <testuser[m]_> repo-community as in the new github org
2021-01-26T10:42:08 #kisslinux <testuser[m]_> you cloned kisslinux/repo or kiss-community/repo-main ?
2021-01-26T10:43:08 #kisslinux <salvia> it's https://github.com/kisslinux/repo
2021-01-26T10:43:46 #kisslinux <testuser[m]_> Oh, you should switch to kiss-community/repo-main dylan has been gone for a while now so no updates on that repo
2021-01-26T10:47:12 #kisslinux <salvia> do you thik I need kiss-community/repo-community?
2021-01-26T10:49:16 #kisslinux <testuser[m]_> repo-community is the forked community repo and repo-main is the forked main repo, replace both kisslinux/repo and kisslinux/commmunity with them
2021-01-26T10:49:39 #kisslinux <salvia> ok, thanks
2021-01-26T11:25:58 #kisslinux <matiss> close
2021-01-26T13:46:02 #kisslinux <dilyn> claudia: bsd just does what I've done, basically
2021-01-26T13:46:22 #kisslinux <dilyn> in the relevant bits. since I'm still having the issue, there's something else dirty inserting this into the build system
2021-01-26T15:10:09 #kisslinux <tracer^afk> re, now online with fibre line :-)
2021-01-26T15:21:53 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> noice
2021-01-26T15:22:00 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> how'd the switchover go?
2021-01-26T15:32:17 #kisslinux <tracer^afk> Currently I've got both in parallel, dsl and fibre. Just the provider box attached and things were up and running, The Box says 200/100 (as I pay), but the test says 400/100 :-)  When my wife finished work (Home Office) I'll attach it to my pfSense.
2021-01-26T15:33:42 #kisslinux <tracer> But they didn't update my reverse dns yet :-(
2021-01-26T15:36:53 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> ooo nice!  they didn't cap you!
2021-01-26T17:36:52 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> anybody package kermit up?
2021-01-26T18:25:26 #kisslinux <testuser[m]_> don't think so
2021-01-26T18:26:52 #kisslinux <tracer> Oh, sorry for flooding the channel. I forgot to  close Lime Chat. Was working on my network. Fibre now works behind pfSende, but IPv6 doesn't :-( Will cal the support tomorrow.
2021-01-26T18:28:40 #kisslinux <salvia> anybody knows wtf is "grub-install: error: Decompressor is too big." and what to do with it?
2021-01-26T19:28:06 #kisslinux <sad_plan> dilyn I was looking through one of your repos the other day, and I noticed you pointed out your distaste for GPL, and Im just curious, but whats your reason for this? I always thought gpl was a good thing, and not the other way around
2021-01-26T19:31:16 #kisslinux <dilyn> I mean fundamentally I think the GPL is a contradiction of its own goal
2021-01-26T19:31:45 #kisslinux <dilyn> if the aim is to provide software which does not restrict my rights, the same license cannot also say "but you must use the GPL"
2021-01-26T19:32:37 #kisslinux <dilyn> the premise is no longer a 'free as in freedom license' but a 'free as in freedom except to relicense license'
2021-01-26T19:33:32 #kisslinux <dilyn> essentially, that something is licensed MIT is not a restriction on freedom; that I cannot relicense GPL software as MIT *is* a restriction on freedom. And I can't accept that kind of disonnance
2021-01-26T19:46:52 #kisslinux <acheam> dilyn: I think your argument holds up when talking about people like you and me, but when dealing with large companies who would happily "steal" permissively-licensed code, the GPL prevents them from doing this, and restricting freedoms on their users. There is a reason why MacOS and Playstation OS are based on *BSD userlands/kernels
2021-01-26T19:47:13 #kisslinux <acheam> The GPL protects you in advance from this sort of thing
2021-01-26T19:47:51 #kisslinux <genevino> the GPL doesn't *prevent* them from doing so, no. the GPL gives you a chance that a possible lawsuit against them will work out.
2021-01-26T19:48:55 #kisslinux <dilyn> the important thing to point is out is that noone can 'steal' permissively licensed software
2021-01-26T19:49:26 #kisslinux <dilyn> It's all well-and-good that people want to stop companies like amazon or facebook or apple or google from profiting of the work of what are essentially volunteers and enthusiasts
2021-01-26T19:49:43 #kisslinux <dilyn> but you can't simultaneously say that you are doing so AND that you are not restricting freedom
2021-01-26T19:49:56 #kisslinux <dilyn> because that is precisely what the license aims to do
2021-01-26T19:50:38 #kisslinux <genevino> do you consider it "freedom" to be able to use your code to build "weapons"?
2021-01-26T19:50:50 #kisslinux <dilyn> I have no qualms with the desire to restrict large, megapowerful companies and organizations from gaining essentially infinite ROI on FOSS. my largest reservation is that the GPL is literally contradictory
2021-01-26T19:51:01 #kisslinux <dilyn> Sure, that's a moral question
2021-01-26T19:51:22 #kisslinux <dilyn> Look, I have a highly restrictive perspective on freedoms and what they should be. My problem with GPL is not about freedom
2021-01-26T19:51:33 #kisslinux <dilyn> it is strictly about the contradictory nature of the license
2021-01-26T19:52:16 #kisslinux <genevino> well fair enough, but one man's freedom can obviously be some other ones harm.
2021-01-26T19:52:25 #kisslinux <dilyn> sure, absolutely!
2021-01-26T19:52:32 #kisslinux <genevino> i don't think the GPL will cover everyone's needs.
2021-01-26T19:52:36 #kisslinux <dilyn> but I haven't said anything about my views on freedom :v
2021-01-26T19:52:38 #kisslinux <genevino> neither will the bsd licenses.
2021-01-26T19:52:41 #kisslinux <genevino> hehe
2021-01-26T19:52:44 #kisslinux <genevino> fair enough.
2021-01-26T19:53:14 #kisslinux <genevino> i mean i couldn't say myself.
2021-01-26T19:53:23 #kisslinux <genevino> on the one hand i want every developer to use my code however they like.
2021-01-26T19:53:26 #kisslinux <dilyn> I'm far too interested in integrity, authenticity, and clarity. These principles ground my worldview, and I am a highly principled person.
2021-01-26T19:53:32 #kisslinux <genevino> but then again, if you kill people with it? difficult.
2021-01-26T19:53:34 #kisslinux <dilyn> the GPL violates those principles in my mind
2021-01-26T19:53:41 #kisslinux <dilyn> yeah absolutely genevino
2021-01-26T19:54:22 #kisslinux <genevino> dilyn: especially then it's great that you came to the conclusion that reducing bloat will ease your way to these 3 goals.
2021-01-26T19:54:22 #kisslinux <dilyn> I mean I might have to revisit these questions if I ever produce actually useful code, that's quite possible
2021-01-26T19:54:36 #kisslinux <genevino> i think these are very valuable goals.
2021-01-26T19:54:51 #kisslinux <dilyn> my computer is a reflection, if not an extension, of my self :)
2021-01-26T19:54:59 #kisslinux <genevino> both :D
2021-01-26T19:55:15 #kisslinux <genevino> definitely so, it is. it's the realization of my own mind. :)
2021-01-26T19:55:27 #kisslinux <genevino> with all the chaos, all the brokenness, the contradictions, everything. :)
2021-01-26T19:56:01 #kisslinux <genevino> my brain does weird things, and that absolutely shows in how i build a computer, especially softwire-wise.
2021-01-26T19:57:29 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> My view is kind of like the joke: "Interviewer: Why should I hire you as a Software engineer if I can just copy and paste the code from Stackoverflow myself?"
2021-01-26T19:57:33 #kisslinux <dilyn> tech sits at that fascinating intersection of humanness and progress
2021-01-26T19:57:40 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> "Me: It's still worth the money, the breakdown is: "
2021-01-26T19:58:02 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> "Copying code from Stackoverflow: $1... but knowing which code to copy from Stackoverflow: $100000/year.
2021-01-26T19:58:41 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> You're never going to prevent the Big Guys from copying something you've done if they really want to.  Apple has shown that, for example https://www.theverge.com/2020/2/5/21124116/apple-developers-sherlocked-blix-bluemail-anonymous-email-feature
2021-01-26T20:06:34 #kisslinux <genevino> on the other hand, a friend of mine, who has written a VPN layer 2 daemon, was once asked for permission by some company to use his code. ended up in a couple of thousand bucks they transferred to his bank account, just because he chose to release the code under the GPL.
2021-01-26T20:06:39 #kisslinux <dilyn> this is a whole other can of words haha
2021-01-26T20:06:58 #kisslinux <dilyn> compensation for work done is good, if that's what you want
2021-01-26T20:07:11 #kisslinux <dilyn> and theft is also wrong
2021-01-26T20:07:34 #kisslinux <dilyn> i dunno; the license people choose is none of my business. the software I choose IS my business
2021-01-26T20:07:38 #kisslinux <genevino> i just don't know if it's normal that this happens, i'd bet the status quo is to just use code and to not contact the author of it, at all.
2021-01-26T20:07:53 #kisslinux <dilyn> if you have enough lawyers, anything can be free...
2021-01-26T20:10:43 #kisslinux <salvia> I apologize for repreating myself but not being able to do a final step is frustrating. Anybody knows what to do with "grub-install: error: Decompressor is too big." error?
2021-01-26T20:12:50 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> When does this error come up?  When you're building/installing grub?
2021-01-26T20:13:19 #kisslinux <salvia> no, `kiss b grub && kiss i grub` went just fine
2021-01-26T20:13:26 #kisslinux <salvia> after grub-install /dev/sda
2021-01-26T20:14:20 #kisslinux <dilyn> you're using BIOS? or EFI
2021-01-26T20:14:25 #kisslinux <salvia> bios
2021-01-26T20:14:49 #kisslinux <dilyn> what's your partition layout look like?
2021-01-26T20:15:29 #kisslinux <salvia> /var/db/kiss # lsblk
2021-01-26T20:15:29 #kisslinux <salvia> NAME   MAJ:MIN RM   SIZE RO TYPE MOUNTPOINT
2021-01-26T20:15:29 #kisslinux <salvia> loop0    7:0    0 566.5M  1 loop
2021-01-26T20:15:29 #kisslinux <salvia> sda      8:0    0 465.8G  0 disk sda1   8:1    0    40G  0 part / sda2   8:2    0 415.3G  0 part /home sda3   8:3    0   512M  0 part /boot sda4   8:4    0   9.9G  0 part [SWAP]
2021-01-26T20:15:32 #kisslinux <salvia> sdb      8:16   1  14.8G  0 disk sdb1   8:17   1  14.8G  0 part
2021-01-26T20:15:39 #kisslinux <salvia> fuck
2021-01-26T20:15:44 #kisslinux <salvia> sda
2021-01-26T20:15:48 #kisslinux <dilyn> lmao
2021-01-26T20:15:48 #kisslinux <salvia> -sda1
2021-01-26T20:15:51 #kisslinux <salvia> -sda2
2021-01-26T20:15:58 #kisslinux <salvia> -sda3
2021-01-26T20:16:01 #kisslinux <salvia> -sda4
2021-01-26T20:16:16 #kisslinux <salvia> root, home, boot and swap
2021-01-26T20:16:59 #kisslinux <dilyn> do you have a small unformatted amount of space at the beginning of the disk?
2021-01-26T20:17:02 #kisslinux <dilyn> ~1MB in size
2021-01-26T20:17:44 #kisslinux <salvia> I think there's 2048 of whatever (I don't remember)
2021-01-26T20:18:01 #kisslinux <dilyn> hmhm
2021-01-26T20:18:14 #kisslinux <salvia> there was nothing I would have left intentionally though
2021-01-26T20:18:19 #kisslinux <dilyn> (cfdisk from util-linux might show if it's there or not; idr I haven't used MBR in over a decade)
2021-01-26T20:18:56 #kisslinux <dilyn> most software will leave 1MB free at the start of disk if MBR is chosen i just want to make sure, cus that's my first thought (the space is too small; if that 2048 is bytes ot kB it's too small)
2021-01-26T20:19:37 #kisslinux <dilyn> specifically refer to https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/GRUB#Master_Boot_Record_(MBR)_specific_instructions
2021-01-26T20:44:08 #kisslinux <salvia> perhaps, I should have made boot partition number 1, not 3...
2021-01-26T20:47:32 #kisslinux <dilyn> eeehhhh
2021-01-26T20:47:38 #kisslinux <dilyn> you don't need a boot partition with BIOS
2021-01-26T20:48:30 #kisslinux <dilyn> but if you're on a spinning disk instead of an ssd I would recommend sda1{swap} sda2{root} sda3{home}
2021-01-26T20:49:28 #kisslinux <salvia> well, then I have one explanation less
2021-01-26T20:49:48 #kisslinux <dilyn> lol
2021-01-26T20:51:27 #kisslinux <salvia> does https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Partitioning#Partition_alignment mean that I shouldn't bother as long as I use fdisk?
2021-01-26T20:52:15 #kisslinux <salvia> ok, I guess, I want to try leaving 1 or 2 megs unformatted as I can't think of anything better
2021-01-26T20:53:36 #kisslinux <dilyn> I believe that is in reference to the fact that those programs will automatically leave no empty space between partitions and they are alligned to (I believe the right word is) sectors on the disk
2021-01-26T20:53:46 #kisslinux <dilyn> definitely need that leading unformatted space though
2021-01-26T20:54:16 #kisslinux <dilyn> luckily it's an easy thing to test... lol
2021-01-26T20:56:23 #kisslinux <salvia> I'm afraid I don't know a way to safely reduce partition size
2021-01-26T20:56:49 #kisslinux <dilyn> unfortunately you can't reduce from the start of a partition just the end
2021-01-26T20:56:57 #kisslinux <dilyn> maybe gparted (the live CD) could do it but idk
2021-01-26T20:57:24 #kisslinux <dilyn> you could copy everything off sda1 to a different partition, delete it, and maybe that free space wont' get shuffled to end of disk? never tried it
2021-01-26T20:58:49 #kisslinux <salvia> I guess, I'll just copy kernel config as making it was the most tedious part
2021-01-26T21:08:59 #kisslinux <salvia> the battle is lost -- I'm going to sleep, but the war is not over -- I'll try with this 1M tommorow (I wonder why I've never faced all this installing arch)
2021-01-26T21:09:05 #kisslinux <salvia> thanks, dilyn
2021-01-26T21:09:10 #kisslinux <salvia> good night everyone
2021-01-26T21:15:05 #kisslinux <dilyn> gngn :) hopefully it works out
2021-01-26T21:28:21 #kisslinux <sad_plan> @dylin, fair point. Its kinda ironic that fsf is imposing restrictions on freedom, when the whole foundation is build upon respecting freedom in the first place.
2021-01-26T21:48:41 #kisslinux <fehawen> Hey o/
2021-01-26T21:50:04 #kisslinux <fehawen> Still no word on dylan's whereabouts?
2021-01-26T21:54:44 #kisslinux <jedavies> Nope
2021-01-26T22:01:16 #kisslinux <fehawen> And that cryptic message (if it even is), anyone figured that out yet?
2021-01-26T22:07:38 #kisslinux <dilyn> no news :(
2021-01-26T22:07:50 #kisslinux <dilyn> except for me! think I might have resolved my libatomic error... :o
2021-01-26T22:08:12 #kisslinux <fehawen> ^^
2021-01-26T22:46:19 #kisslinux <sad_plan> what cryptic message are you refering to?
2021-01-26T22:52:51 #kisslinux <acheam> sad_plan: https://dylan.k1ss.org/
2021-01-26T22:55:23 #kisslinux <sad_plan> oh. where did you find it? did he post it somewhere?
2021-01-26T22:57:39 #kisslinux <acheam> Its just his personal website, the logs are all on Git
2021-01-26T22:58:07 #kisslinux <acheam> We've been casually trying to crack the code for the last few months... some are still skeptical as to whether it means anything or not
2021-01-26T22:59:28 #kisslinux <acheam> ooh, idea: Maybe the "Dylan Araps" corresponds with "66Q 999 MN1", and we can use that to crack the rest of it, like they cracked the Enigma machine
2021-01-26T23:00:03 #kisslinux <sad_plan> i see.
2021-01-26T23:00:27 #kisslinux <sad_plan> perhaps. does the first line refer to anything related to the gpg key? and the second to his github, and so on?
2021-01-26T23:03:51 #kisslinux <acheam> Well no substantial section of the code is in his GPG key, but thats about as far as I got
2021-01-26T23:03:55 #kisslinux <acheam> I'm not a huge puzzler
2021-01-26T23:04:51 #kisslinux <travankor> anyone know where dylan is?
2021-01-26T23:05:19 #kisslinux <acheam> nope
2021-01-26T23:06:06 #kisslinux <dilyn> some island in greece, maybe
2021-01-26T23:06:07 #kisslinux <dilyn> :v
2021-01-26T23:07:33 #kisslinux <travankor> i certainly hope this didn't happen, but i wonder if he got kidnapped
2021-01-26T23:08:19 #kisslinux <sad_plan> what irc client do you guys use? other than the webclient i mean. webclient is rather boring imo. I like cli tools instead. makes me feel like a haxxor, lol
2021-01-26T23:08:36 #kisslinux <sad_plan> Im sure his fine, and he has his reasons for his abcense
2021-01-26T23:10:55 #kisslinux <acheam> sad_plan: weechat
2021-01-26T23:11:13 #kisslinux <acheam> if you want to go full KISS, Dylan wrote a client in shell script
2021-01-26T23:11:17 #kisslinux <kiedtl> birch
2021-01-26T23:11:22 #kisslinux <kiedtl> https://github.com/dylanaraps/birch
2021-01-26T23:11:55 #kisslinux <acheam> or if you need a GUI, I really like Quassel. Its designed to be distributed, but doesn't need to be used as that
2021-01-26T23:12:03 #kisslinux <kiedtl> travankor: it's more likely that COVID got him :<
2021-01-26T23:13:14 #kisslinux <sad_plan> nice. birch seems cool. Ive started to really enjoy cli tools, and usually prefer them over gui tools.
2021-01-26T23:13:53 #kisslinux <sh4rm4^bnc> irc is pretty much the only use case where a gui client is way more comfortable
2021-01-26T23:13:59 #kisslinux <sh4rm4^bnc> because of copy/paste
2021-01-26T23:14:01 #kisslinux <acheam> I will say, Birch might become a bit painful to use if/when you join many networks/channels
2021-01-26T23:14:25 #kisslinux <acheam> sh4rm4^bnc:  I just switched from GUI (Quassel) to TUI (Weechat) and have been fairing just fine
2021-01-26T23:14:32 #kisslinux <acheam> Its been a few days
2021-01-26T23:14:46 #kisslinux <sh4rm4^bnc> did you have to copy text out of the irc client ?
2021-01-26T23:15:06 #kisslinux <acheam> Not yet, but I know that weechat has a way of making this easier
2021-01-26T23:15:06 #kisslinux <sh4rm4^bnc> the issue i have with it is that every line contains   | somenick
2021-01-26T23:15:24 #kisslinux <acheam> I can also just use visual block mode in allacritty
2021-01-26T23:15:28 #kisslinux <sh4rm4^bnc> from the nick display "tab" on the right
2021-01-26T23:15:29 #kisslinux <sad_plan> currently, Im only on this channel on irc. so no biggie for me anyway.
2021-01-26T23:17:06 #kisslinux <acheam> I would generally reccomend some kind of bouncer or always-connected soluton, whether that be ZNC, SSH, or Quassel
2021-01-26T23:17:38 #kisslinux <acheam> I run weechat on my server, which I then use through SSH, so my connection never drops, and I get scrollback
2021-01-26T23:17:44 #kisslinux <aarng> yeah, irc sucks if you are not on 24/7
2021-01-26T23:17:44 #kisslinux <midfavila> bouncer is on my list of "things to set up Soon:tm:"
2021-01-26T23:18:16 #kisslinux <aarng> re: copying text out of terminal irc clients
2021-01-26T23:18:25 #kisslinux <acheam> You could use a bouncer hosted by someone else, but that requires trusting them. Right now im using ZNC from envs.net on my phone
2021-01-26T23:18:36 #kisslinux <acheam> Out of laziness more than anything
2021-01-26T23:18:37 #kisslinux <aarng> the trick is not having nicklists and text wrapping which aligns to the first line
2021-01-26T23:19:23 #kisslinux <sad_plan> archeam, thats actually clever. means you wont have to use the log. you can just scroll back up instead
2021-01-26T23:19:28 #kisslinux <aarng> In my client I can just select text like in a gui
2021-01-26T23:21:33 #kisslinux <acheam> thats a clever solution
2021-01-26T23:22:04 #kisslinux <acheam> on weechat you can just use meta+l to hide everything else  but the message buffer, to make copying easier
2021-01-26T23:22:36 #kisslinux <aarng> oh it actually has a solution, nice
2021-01-26T23:22:45 #kisslinux <aarng> I thought it would require a plugin
2021-01-26T23:22:55 #kisslinux <aarng> been ages since I've used weechat
2021-01-26T23:22:56 #kisslinux <acheam> nope, built-in with a default keybinding too
2021-01-26T23:22:58 #kisslinux <acheam> its comfy
2021-01-26T23:23:11 #kisslinux <acheam> I use it with the vim-mode plugin which is nice
2021-01-26T23:24:14 #kisslinux <aarng> vi input ftw :)
2021-01-26T23:24:37 #kisslinux <midfavila>  >vi
2021-01-26T23:24:39 #kisslinux <aarng> I would totally use ash as my shell but its vi mode sucks
2021-01-26T23:24:39 #kisslinux <midfavila> ew
2021-01-26T23:24:55 #kisslinux <acheam> I just use bloated Zsh
2021-01-26T23:25:00 #kisslinux <acheam> Its got a great vi-mode
2021-01-26T23:25:07 #kisslinux <acheam> And i'm to invested in it to switch now
2021-01-26T23:25:09 #kisslinux <midfavila> i just use mksh tbh
2021-01-26T23:25:25 #kisslinux <midfavila> tried using s but it was less than useable in a few areas
2021-01-26T23:25:35 #kisslinux <aarng> I think it has a couple features over oksh
2021-01-26T23:25:47 #kisslinux <aarng> if you don't need them, I'd switch to oksh
2021-01-26T23:26:11 #kisslinux <aarng> don't ask me which features, I forgot
2021-01-26T23:26:33 #kisslinux <sad_plan> does any of the other shells have autocomplete like zsh? mksh, osh oksh? I really enjoy that one feature, and doesnt really rely on anything else. having to input more stuff than what absolutely need is cumbersome sometimes
2021-01-26T23:26:34 #kisslinux <midfavila> hmm. I'll definitely look into it
2021-01-26T23:26:42 #kisslinux <midfavila> I try to keep my interactive shell as minimal as possible
2021-01-26T23:26:53 #kisslinux <midfavila> basically all I want is readline and standard redirection operators
2021-01-26T23:27:10 #kisslinux <sad_plan> I might wanna check them out, if however, theyre more lightweight/faster than zsh
2021-01-26T23:27:24 #kisslinux <midfavila> the only shell heavier than zsh is bas
2021-01-26T23:27:25 #kisslinux <midfavila> h
2021-01-26T23:27:25 #kisslinux <midfavila> so
2021-01-26T23:27:39 #kisslinux <dilyn> oksh has tab completion but not like zsh
2021-01-26T23:27:47 #kisslinux <aarng> midfavila, definitely do
2021-01-26T23:28:01 #kisslinux <aarng> it's from OpenBSD, so code quality is probably a lot better than mksh
2021-01-26T23:28:07 #kisslinux <midfavila> ngl tab completion is only useful when dealing with long and complex file names
2021-01-26T23:28:10 #kisslinux <acheam>  have my Zsh completions piped through FZF which is nice
2021-01-26T23:28:12 #kisslinux <aarng> it also supports proper PS1 escapes
2021-01-26T23:28:17 #kisslinux <dilyn> ^
2021-01-26T23:28:17 #kisslinux <acheam> I use tab completion for *everything* midfavila
2021-01-26T23:28:39 #kisslinux <midfavila> i find that when I rely on tabs and history I spend more time tabbing and searching than just typing
2021-01-26T23:29:00 #kisslinux <midfavila> and I mean, the code might be better in oksh, but mirBSD isn't a bad system either
2021-01-26T23:29:39 #kisslinux <acheam> With low quality bash-style tab completion, I agree, but if you have your tab completion setup to work well with you, then it can be a huge help. I have Zsh setup to fuzzy match from within a word, so I can even fix typos just by hitting tab
2021-01-26T23:30:07 #kisslinux <midfavila> sure, that sounds convenient
2021-01-26T23:30:16 #kisslinux <midfavila> but i don't much need it
2021-01-26T23:30:26 #kisslinux <acheam> Whatever works for your workflow
2021-01-26T23:30:33 #kisslinux <midfavila> basically all my common commands are aliased to one or two characters
2021-01-26T23:30:37 #kisslinux <sad_plan> thats really convinient
2021-01-26T23:30:52 #kisslinux <midfavila> so my response to typos is to just not make any by virtue of alias abuse
2021-01-26T23:31:03 #kisslinux <midfavila> oksh definitely compiles faster than mksh tho
2021-01-26T23:31:23 #kisslinux <acheam> A quick search of my zshrc shows I have 65 aliases... I might be guilty of that too
2021-01-26T23:32:10 #kisslinux <midfavila> oh wow, oksh is about a quarter the size of mksh
2021-01-26T23:32:17 #kisslinux <midfavila> yeah, I'll definitely give oksh a shot
2021-01-26T23:32:19 #kisslinux <aarng> lol
2021-01-26T23:34:54 #kisslinux <aarng> I prefer simple shells too, can't stand all the fancy stuff like auto suggestions as you type etc.
2021-01-26T23:35:12 #kisslinux <aarng> or a ton of information in PS1
2021-01-26T23:35:17 #kisslinux * midfavila nods
2021-01-26T23:35:26 #kisslinux <midfavila> for me it's just $USER@HOSTNAME
2021-01-26T23:35:42 #kisslinux <aarng> my prompt is a simple $, which I set the background and foreground to the same color so it's a block
2021-01-26T23:36:16 #kisslinux <aarng> and I change the color $? is non-zero
2021-01-26T23:36:37 #kisslinux <aarng> s/color/color when/
2021-01-26T23:36:38 #kisslinux <kissbot> <aarng> and I change the color when $? is non-zero
2021-01-26T23:36:54 #kisslinux <acheam> aarng:  you would hate my shell lol
2021-01-26T23:37:12 #kisslinux <aarng> probably would :D
2021-01-26T23:37:33 #kisslinux <acheam> I feel like I would get lost without even the PWD being shown
2021-01-26T23:38:01 #kisslinux <acheam> Especially with multiple terminals open
2021-01-26T23:38:28 #kisslinux <midfavila> if I could I would catch $PWD and put it in the titlebar of my terminal
2021-01-26T23:38:29 #kisslinux <aarng> oh, I guess I lied - I show PWD on a separate line when I'm outside ~
2021-01-26T23:38:38 #kisslinux <midfavila> but I wouldn't put PWD in PS1
2021-01-26T23:39:53 #kisslinux <acheam> midfavila:  lots of DE's terminals do that AFAIK shouldn't be that hard, but it depends on your WM/Terminal/Shell
2021-01-26T23:39:59 #kisslinux <acheam> aarng:  makes sense
2021-01-26T23:40:00 #kisslinux <dilyn> for oksh just make sure you setup the keybinds for scrollback
2021-01-26T23:40:10 #kisslinux <midfavila> if oksh can catch it then it'll be ezpz
2021-01-26T23:40:22 #kisslinux <midfavila> i just use xterm and fvwm
2021-01-26T23:40:26 #kisslinux <midfavila> extremely basic
2021-01-26T23:41:13 #kisslinux <aarng> what's that about, dilyn?
2021-01-26T23:41:36 #kisslinux <aarng> you can simply echo the escape sequence to set the window title from your PS1
2021-01-26T23:41:46 #kisslinux <midfavila> hmm. fair
2021-01-26T23:41:47 #kisslinux <dilyn> https://github.com/dilyn-corner/dotfiles/blob/master/.shrc
2021-01-26T23:41:57 #kisslinux <midfavila> any way to do something similar with the current process?
2021-01-26T23:41:58 #kisslinux <dilyn> had to set __A etc for up/down to work
2021-01-26T23:42:00 #kisslinux <midfavila> I know you can do it in bash
2021-01-26T23:42:16 #kisslinux <midfavila> i.e change the title of the window to lynx when lynx is running, or w/e
2021-01-26T23:42:43 #kisslinux <aarng> don't think that's possible
2021-01-26T23:42:59 #kisslinux <midfavila> rip
2021-01-26T23:43:05 #kisslinux <midfavila> oh well, that's just sugar anyway
2021-01-26T23:43:29 #kisslinux <aarng> oh, you mean history, dilyn
2021-01-26T23:43:53 #kisslinux <dilyn> yes sry
2021-01-26T23:45:26 #kisslinux <aarng> `PS1='${PWD} -> '`
2021-01-26T23:45:42 #kisslinux <aarng> `PS1='w ->'`
2021-01-26T23:45:51 #kisslinux <aarng> saves a sub-process :)
2021-01-26T23:49:04 #kisslinux <aarng> oh nvm, those are curly braces
2021-01-26T23:51:02 #kisslinux <aarng> and it would also have to be `pwd` obviously, no idea why I thought you used a command in your PS1
2021-01-26T23:52:46 #kisslinux <acheam> I wonder what the relationship between the $PWD variable and the pwd command. `pwd` seems to have a flag ("-L") which prints it from the environment, so are they two seperate implementations?
2021-01-26T23:53:09 #kisslinux <dilyn> i murder sobprocesses
2021-01-26T23:56:33 #kisslinux <wololo> -s chat.freenode.net
2021-01-26T23:57:24 #kisslinux <wololo> birch -U sad_plan
2021-01-26T23:57:30 #kisslinux <sad_plan> ffs
2021-01-26T23:58:14 #kisslinux <dilyn> just don't type your password lmao
2021-01-26T23:58:24 #kisslinux <dilyn> you just need birch -u sad_plan; birch defaults to #kiss
2021-01-26T23:58:25 #kisslinux <sad_plan> haha yeah, Im aware lol
2021-01-26T23:58:40 #kisslinux <sad_plan> ah ok, lets see