Bradley D. Thornton Bradley at NorthTech.US
Mon Mar 15 09:03:27 GMT 2021
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On 3/14/2021 1:08 AM, Stephane Bortzmeyer wrote:
On Sat, Mar 13, 2021 at 08:30:19PM -0700,
Thomas Frohwein <tfrohwein at fastmail.com> wrote
a message of 79 lines which said:
Thirdly and lastly, about Gitlab. I strongly dislike the fact that
discussions which can have quite an impact on all Gemini users are
happening in Gitlab issues; to stay up-to-date on all these
requires regularly going through multiple webpages, and to comment
requires a Gitlab account! I think this is a mistake.
Agree, even with this one.
Group work is funny. When the discussion on the specification was on
the mailing list, everybody complained that it made a lot of messages,
that it was difficult to follow, to know for sure what was decided or
not, etc. (I did share some of these complaints but not all; many
problems were simply because some people do not use some features of
their email client, such as threading and full-text search.) Nobody
defended the mailing list and asked for the specification discussion
to remain there.
Now that we moved to another system, people (but may be not the same)
complain about the new system. My (long) experience with "groupware"
is that it is impossible to find a solution that will please
everyone.
Yes, it is the nature of an email list to become noisy when thepopulation and popularity of that list increases.
So the WG style discussions for finalizing the Gemini spec have migratedto a platform which is [also] well suited for such purposes. As aplatform, it is Perhaps even better equipped to compartmentalize andfocus upon each particularity that needs focused attention.
Issues can be isolated and related discussions can remain on topic therein the issue tracker much more coherently.
I don't see how lamenting the move to a Gitlab issue tracker systemelswhere (here on this list) is going to facilitate the discussionsoccuring there, and to be certain, one can participate there if thoseare important issues for them or they can choose not to participate.
As far as what I've observed (I'm still going back over all of thearchives on my mail server) with respect to people leaving the list dueto complaints related to traffic, I've noticed that most of those werefolks that were of the, let's say, 'user' class, who found the nebulousand arcane joo joo black arts of the core development andstandardization process too overhwelming to enjoy.
I've also noticed, not as many, but several technically minded folksleaving citing disdain for banter and discussion that isn't specificallyrelated to the canonization of Gemini protocol specifications and thedevelopment cycle of software.
I think this list will evolve over time to be a more user centricresource medium with the more occasional announcements related to coredev topics, with a lot more of the development related discussionstaking place in arenas more centric to actual development.
That's just kinda what I figure. But it does little to no good tocomplain here about a discussion taking place elsewhere when anyone'sinvited - if it is something important to a person, it stands to reasonthat they'll make their positions heard where the majority of suchimpactful discussions are currently taking place.
In the end, it really is a matter of what, "Is, is", and right now,those matters are being *decided* elsewhere.
I hope that helps :)
Kindest regards,
-- Bradley D. ThorntonManager Network Serviceshttp://NorthTech.USTEL: +1.310.421.8268