It is unfortunate to see how slow countries are being to protect Ukraine, especially given that this slow response also happened during the Holocaust and led to ~6 millions Jews and others (those with impairments, disease, etc.) being killed.
It is also disheartening to see people stereotype all people who come from or have ancestry from Russia. Not everyone of them supports Russia and it is wrong to assume such things.
9 months ago 路 馃憤 xandra, eph
Do you find a dark irony that the US, the only country to ever use nuclear weapons on civilians, is calling other countries terrorist states? Look at your original post: you are comparing the situation in the Ukraine to the Holocaust, a ridiculous comparison, made more ridiculous by the fact that a sizeable chunk of the Holocaust happened in the Ukraine by Ukrainian hands.
Obviously I am not saying some lives are more important than others, or whatever it is that seems to be irking you.
rest my case. 路 8 months ago
1 million Jews killed in the Ukraine alone. 路 8 months ago
Which does not make your original statement less ironic. 路 8 months ago
@stacksmith FYI, Hitler also hated and killed homosexuals and the Romana people, and he hated Christians as well.
It has been estimated that 12 million indiginous peoples were killed by Europeans in the Americas (about 90%). The Hundred Years' War killed about 3 million people. The 30 years' war killed from 4 million to 12 million people. And there are many more where that came from.
Every single person in these wars mattered. 路 8 months ago
@stacksmith Btw, it was over 6 million Jews, not 1 million. For someone who is supposed to know so much about the Shoah, you vastly underestimated the number of Jews killed. 路 8 months ago
@stacksmith Did you know the Talmud made Capital Punishment all but impossible to enforce? Bet you didn't.
Had you read what I was trying to say instead of getting extremely defensive against anybody using the word "Holocaust" (as if Jews were the only people in history who have been wrongly killed, lmao), you would know that I wasn't comparing numbers but was appealing to the same morality that is being advocated for by a lot of Jews at this very moment - that two wrongs don't make a right, that children should not be punished for their parents' sins, and that all people are made in the image of God and are valuable. 路 8 months ago
What's ironic is not that people in the Ukraine are suffering, but that you are ignoramus, an uneducated clumsy oaf, to compare this military action to the Holocaust -- in a country where more than 100,000 locals joined the Nazis to exterminate over one million Jews. I was laughing at your idiocy. I suppose you are right that I was (and still am) mocking you, and it is not fair -- perhaps you are really far on the spectrum or have low intelligence. But more likely you are an entitled, ignorant whitey, blabbing about the Holocaust when convenient, from a safe distance. 路 8 months ago
@stacksmith Are you serious? You claim I'm bullying you, but you've mocked and stereotyped Ukraine, the Catholic Church, and every Christian in your own country. You are in fact the one who is bullying people, not me. I'm merely pointing out that you're wrong.
Fyi, mockery is only humorous to the people who agree with you. 路 8 months ago
Enough! My life was radically affected by my grandparents running from Odessa with whatever they could grab. That is a part of my family's story, and if I choose to laugh about it and everything that happened since -- instead of crying, that is my choice. Maybe you should stop bullying me. And anyway, this is quite tedious. 路 8 months ago
@stacksmith You're also being extremely vague about your intentions of bringing up certain "taboo" topics, so whether you're not actually mocking but being humorous about how people can make wrong assumptions about others, that doesn't come across at all, and contradicts your very first reply where you felt the need to point out that a country supported the Nazis.
I have no clue what you're trying to do, but I can only assume you keep bringing up disparaging things about people because you want to mock or shame them and people who might support them. 路 8 months ago
@stacksmith What you are doing looks more like mockery to me, not humor. And mockery has nothing to do with allowing taboo conversations, it's more about degrading other people to the people who agree with you, or it's about shaming people. 路 8 months ago
I find it extremely humorous to falsely compare people to killers, and make fun of certain religions based on all kinds of biases. Humour is there specifically to allow certain, otherwise taboo, conversations, to take place. But it looks like you are not enjoying this sort of discourse, so perhaps we should put an end to it here. 路 8 months ago
@stacksmith Did you know the ancient greeks were what we would call pedophilic (not to mention homoerotically so)?
Is the Catholic Church a breeding ground for pedophiles, or is it used by pedophiles to try to escape their thinking and better themselves, only to fail at times? The Catholic Church clearly doesn't cause pedophilia (a mental illness), it tries to give (possibly false) hope to them and offer some way of living.
And have you ever thought that these "bible-thumpers" are not "gun-toting" because of Christianity, but because of the particular interpretation of Christianity that developed in a specific type of country that allowed guns from the very beginning? 路 8 months ago
I don't get your point @stacksmith. It's not humorous or ironic to falsely compare people to killers, just like it's no more ironic to make implications about the nature of certain religions based on the selection bias you've been fed. 路 8 months ago
Well, looking at my previous remark -- that is hardly comedy. But you know what I mean. 路 8 months ago
@ktixano: when faced with horrible atrocities, some of us reach to comedy to make sense of the world. For instance, when you talk of 'modern Christians' as different from the Crusaders, I can't help but think of the Catholic Church as a breeding ground for pedophiles, not to mention the gun-toting bible-thumpers in my country. But point your finger anywhere, and you will hit someone whose ancestors raped and pillaged at some point. Some still do. 路 8 months ago
@stack Sure. I just don't get the irony, because the people of Ukraine are not necessarily the same as those who were complicit. The US, Britain, and many other countries, and even the Catholic Church and many Christian Churches, were complicit to the Nazis. And yet if any one of their lives are at stake, they should be helped.
It's a similar thing with Christians and Muslims. Christians have judged modern Muslims for what their ancestors did, and this leads them to neglect the very real violence that is happening against Muslims.
And with Christians, who killed Jews and Muslims and raped citizens in the Crusades, and yet they are not the same as modern Christians. 路 8 months ago
@krixano I of course agree. My comment is simply to point out the irony of invoking H, not to justify one. 路 8 months ago
@stacksmith That doesn't matter. Children should not be punished for their parents' sins. 路 8 months ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_collaboration_with_Nazi_Germany 路 9 months ago
Not entirely relevant, but as you mention the H word, my grandmother escaped from the Ukraine as antisemitism was rampant and people literally beat you up in the street for being Jewish. During WWII, Ukraine an Poland were not entirely against eliminating Jews: 路 9 months ago
@comatoast That would be fine if people didn't die, but your position will kill a *bunch* of people just like it did when this level of indifference was advocated early in the Holocaust. Had countries actually took action early on in the Holocaust, less people would have died, period. Catholics have a position called "Just War" for a reason, where War must be done by a state, towards a good end, and out of love.
It is not the fault of the people who are being killed that countries like Russia and China and North Korea are killing them. To advocate for letting genocide and anything else related happen is completely unethical. 路 9 months ago
I mean this the best way possbile, but, ukraine is being used as a proxy to destablize the Russian Federation. I understand and agree putin is a meglomanical stooge, but, to me the correct opinion in this matter is to, as it has been since the history of progressive causes; me as a socialist. The correct answer is to be against war of all kinds against the working people of the world. To be against wars of agression on these people by any and all capitalist empires and nations and to support the working people unilaterally.
Fight war not wars. 路 9 months ago