2021-02-17T00:01:26 #kisslinux <merakor> Ah no, that's a different scm software
2021-02-17T00:06:30 #kisslinux <merakor> It seems I mixed it up with Radicle, a peer-to-peer git forge?
2021-02-17T00:07:03 #kisslinux <merakor> IT'S GIT BUT WITH A BLOCKCHAIN
2021-02-17T00:09:19 #kisslinux <dilyn> lmao
2021-02-17T00:09:25 #kisslinux <merakor> ALSO BUILT IN RUST HOW COOL IS THAT
2021-02-17T00:09:34 #kisslinux <dilyn> some Qt dev wants me to submit the patch I used to build Qt on wyverkiss
2021-02-17T00:10:08 #kisslinux <dilyn> mfw they want a gerrit account, me to accept GPL licensing my contribution, me to generate an SSH key, me to test my patch on qt5.15.2 qt6, and potentially backport to *checks notes* every version of qt
2021-02-17T00:10:50 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> <acheam "this is why fossil is nice- when"> is fossil or git more kiss/suckless in philosophy?
2021-02-17T00:11:17 #kisslinux <dilyn> I don't think there's a clearcut answer to that
2021-02-17T00:11:21 #kisslinux <merakor> dilyn: They might as well give you maintainership at this point
2021-02-17T00:11:27 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> <merakor "ALSO BUILT IN RUST HOW COOL IS T"> dowewantthis
2021-02-17T00:11:29 #kisslinux <dilyn> lmfaoooo NO
2021-02-17T00:11:34 #kisslinux <dilyn> fuk a cute
2021-02-17T00:11:54 #kisslinux <dilyn> what ssh tools exist in community? anything to generate an ssh key?
2021-02-17T00:12:05 #kisslinux <dilyn> I have one but that's for my arch machine and I lost that key :v
2021-02-17T00:12:06 #kisslinux <merakor> Qt dev gives the keys to dilyn and runs away
2021-02-17T00:12:14 #kisslinux <merakor> openssh
2021-02-17T00:12:17 #kisslinux <dilyn> I will never not once do that
2021-02-17T00:12:28 #kisslinux <dilyn> openssh isn't in community!
2021-02-17T00:12:29 #kisslinux <dilyn> f
2021-02-17T00:12:36 #kisslinux <merakor> It's in main?
2021-02-17T00:12:57 #kisslinux <dilyn> is it??
2021-02-17T00:13:09 #kisslinux <merakor> I mean it was when I forked it 2 years ago
2021-02-17T00:13:19 #kisslinux <dilyn> oh jeez wow it is
2021-02-17T00:13:21 #kisslinux <dilyn> look at that
2021-02-17T00:14:24 #kisslinux <dilyn> (I haven't used SSH since 2009 with my iPod touch)
2021-02-17T00:14:29 #kisslinux <dilyn> I'm v hip
2021-02-17T00:16:56 #kisslinux <merakor> phoebos[m]1: I don't know about fossil, but git definitely isn't suckless. I personally don't think that it should be either. Source code management is a complex issue and git handles it really well. cvs could be considered suckless, but it is an absolute piece of shit that I hope I will never have to use it ever again.
2021-02-17T00:18:14 #kisslinux <merakor> Some people say that mercurial could be considered more simplistic than Git, but I don't have much experience with it. (Also it uses python, and it is sloow)
2021-02-17T00:20:00 #kisslinux <merakor> dilyn: I literally first installed Linux to use ssh and look cool
2021-02-17T00:20:10 #kisslinux <merakor> I am not even joking
2021-02-17T00:21:27 #kisslinux <dilyn> god you're so cool
2021-02-17T00:21:55 #kisslinux <dilyn> I first installed linux because Windows ME was bloat
2021-02-17T00:22:17 #kisslinux <dilyn> and then I couldn't get my wifi to work because broadcom chips were even more shit in 2006 than they are now
2021-02-17T00:22:34 #kisslinux <merakor> dilyn: But have you heard of realtek?
2021-02-17T00:22:40 #kisslinux <dilyn> the fucking luxury these zoomers have with PopOS! making their wireless cards and everything work right out the box smfh they don't understand the struggle
2021-02-17T00:22:42 #kisslinux <dilyn> realtek is banned
2021-02-17T00:23:05 #kisslinux <dilyn> oh damn if I switch my repos to ssh keys will github stop sending me emails about how my commit method is deprecated
2021-02-17T00:23:22 #kisslinux <dilyn> s/keys/commits/
2021-02-17T00:23:23 #kisslinux <kissbot> <dilyn> oh damn if I switch my repos to ssh commits will github stop sending me emails about how my commit method is deprecated
2021-02-17T00:23:31 #kisslinux <merakor> I never got such a mail, soo probably
2021-02-17T00:24:27 #kisslinux <dilyn> my biggest fear is publicizing my private key instead of my public key
2021-02-17T00:24:31 #kisslinux <dilyn> dont hax me pl0x
2021-02-17T00:24:51 #kisslinux <merakor> copypasta your private key here won't steal promise
2021-02-17T00:26:51 #kisslinux <dilyn> 696969696969694204204204201800suckmydickilovetosuckadick696969696969694204204204201800suckmydickilovetosuckadick696969696969694204204204201800suckmydickilovetosuckadick696969696969694204204204201800suckmydickilovetosuckadick696969696969694204204204201800suckmydickilovetosuckadick696969696969694204204204201800suckmydickilovetosuckadick
2021-02-17T00:26:57 #kisslinux <dilyn> ?
2021-02-17T00:28:53 #kisslinux <merakor> WAIT THAT WORKED?
2021-02-17T00:30:50 #kisslinux <dilyn> RSA key generation was pretty on-brand for that one huh
2021-02-17T00:35:52 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> <dilyn "oh damn if I switch my repos to "> yep will do
2021-02-17T00:36:09 #kisslinux <merakor> Yeah, they have really improved OpenSSH
2021-02-17T00:36:38 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> bcs http is so much deprecation than ssh
2021-02-17T00:38:05 #kisslinux <dilyn> bububut
2021-02-17T00:38:06 #kisslinux <dilyn> muh https
2021-02-17T00:38:20 #kisslinux <merakor> I have only used ssh because I am too lazy to type my credentials everytime I push
2021-02-17T00:39:04 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> oops I still haven't worked that out
2021-02-17T00:39:09 #kisslinux <dilyn> I am doing so much work for what amounts to like, two seds
2021-02-17T00:39:11 #kisslinux <dilyn> wtf
2021-02-17T00:39:26 #kisslinux <dilyn> it's not even ~my patch~
2021-02-17T00:39:37 #kisslinux <merakor> lmao
2021-02-17T00:40:45 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> dilyn: do you actually run your kde on kiss
2021-02-17T00:40:53 #kisslinux <dilyn> I did for a while!
2021-02-17T00:40:58 #kisslinux <dilyn> I will do so again eventually
2021-02-17T00:41:06 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> nice!!
2021-02-17T00:41:08 #kisslinux <dilyn> Once I am satisfied with my wyverkiss setup and get sufficiently bored
2021-02-17T00:41:22 #kisslinux <dilyn> yeah it ran like a charm. Super lightweight if you opt for sowm over kwin as the WM
2021-02-17T00:41:24 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> it v impresses me
2021-02-17T00:41:28 #kisslinux <dilyn> lol
2021-02-17T00:41:36 #kisslinux <merakor> I can't leave dwm
2021-02-17T00:41:43 #kisslinux <dilyn> there were some parts that were intensive but it was mostly pretty straightforward
2021-02-17T00:41:47 #kisslinux <dilyn> you could also use dwm :v
2021-02-17T00:41:55 #kisslinux <merakor> I tried installing wayland and sway and stuff
2021-02-17T00:41:56 #kisslinux <dilyn> so now you have no good reason not to switch
2021-02-17T00:42:10 #kisslinux <dilyn> I could never get sway to work for me. No matter what I did, it would never recognize my keyboard
2021-02-17T00:42:25 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> it feels like such a juxtaposition of the most understandable os and a massive complicated framework
2021-02-17T00:42:26 #kisslinux <dilyn> had an easier time setting up xorg without a device manager than I did sway
2021-02-17T00:42:29 #kisslinux <merakor> Oh I didn't have any issues with sway
2021-02-17T00:43:06 #kisslinux <dilyn> kde frameworks is chaos. I don't know why they switched from a monolithic package to over seventy distinct, smaller ones, when basically all of them are needed anyways
2021-02-17T00:43:28 #kisslinux <dilyn> like as far as I know KISS-kde packages the minimum, and it's 62 packages
2021-02-17T00:43:45 #kisslinux <dilyn> and that's not even the desktop evironment! that's just the backend!
2021-02-17T00:43:54 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> uNiX pHiLOsoPhY innit
2021-02-17T00:43:56 #kisslinux <merakor> My problem was that I am reaally happy with the window management of dwm, so there are two options on wayland: dwl, and velox. I was not happy with either of them
2021-02-17T00:44:05 #kisslinux <dilyn> i want velox to be floating
2021-02-17T00:44:17 #kisslinux <dilyn> qq how hard to do it myself qq learn C
2021-02-17T00:44:29 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> dwl is not quite there
2021-02-17T00:44:40 #kisslinux <dilyn> also gpl :'(
2021-02-17T00:45:38 #kisslinux <merakor> Yeah, the development is quite slow on either sides.
2021-02-17T00:45:39 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> stoppingpeopletakingyourcodeandcontortingitisgood?
2021-02-17T00:47:16 #kisslinux <merakor> Why dislike GPL?
2021-02-17T00:47:28 #kisslinux <merakor> I would only dislike GPL on a library
2021-02-17T00:47:36 #kisslinux <dilyn> again, I should write a blog post
2021-02-17T00:47:52 #kisslinux <dilyn> https://freenode.logbot.info/kisslinux/20210126#c6673714
2021-02-17T00:48:04 #kisslinux <dilyn> KEK WHAT QT
2021-02-17T00:48:08 #kisslinux <dilyn> "If you have only a minor contribution to make and find the process out of proportion for that, you may simply attach a patch to a bug report. However, the more of the necessary steps you defer to the code's maintainers, the less likely is your contribution to be integrated in a timely manner." I DID THat
2021-02-17T00:48:35 #kisslinux <dilyn> at the end of this whole convoluted process they give this shortcut. at the END! W H A T
2021-02-17T00:50:21 #kisslinux <merakor> Yeah, I know that GPL is a restrictive license, but Linux wouldn't have quarter of its usability if it wasn't for the GPL.
2021-02-17T00:50:34 #kisslinux <merakor> The only restriction of GPL is that you can't restrict others.
2021-02-17T00:50:42 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> Eh yeh
2021-02-17T00:50:55 #kisslinux <dilyn> sure! and that's fine
2021-02-17T00:51:01 #kisslinux <dilyn> It's not what I would choose, and so I don't
2021-02-17T00:51:01 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> to preserve freedom you need some restriction
2021-02-17T00:51:10 #kisslinux <dilyn> I mean, maybe
2021-02-17T00:51:26 #kisslinux <dilyn> I also don't care about freedom. My issue is not freedom, it's coherence
2021-02-17T00:51:38 #kisslinux <dilyn> I think the GPL fails that test
2021-02-17T00:52:17 #kisslinux <dilyn> It might be analogous to the 'tolerance of intolerance' contradiction, and people can easily accuse me of that. But I'm not terribly interested in that accusation; the issue is so banal to me that I don't care lmfao
2021-02-17T00:52:19 #kisslinux <merakor> "Old man rants on a form of legal document"
2021-02-17T00:52:29 #kisslinux <dilyn> am old, can confirm
2021-02-17T00:52:43 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> lmao
2021-02-17T00:52:59 #kisslinux <dilyn> I think one of the only people in here older than me is tracer
2021-02-17T00:53:22 #kisslinux <merakor> How old are you?
2021-02-17T00:53:29 #kisslinux <dilyn> 2OLD2LIVE
2021-02-17T00:53:33 #kisslinux <dilyn> 2YUNG2DIE
2021-02-17T00:53:36 #kisslinux <dilyn> 28
2021-02-17T00:53:46 #kisslinux <dilyn> wait what year is
2021-02-17T00:53:48 #kisslinux <dilyn> it
2021-02-17T00:53:55 #kisslinux <merakor> Don't make me say it
2021-02-17T00:53:56 #kisslinux <dilyn> 27. 28 in october. unless I'm crazy
2021-02-17T00:54:03 #kisslinux <dilyn> say it coward
2021-02-17T00:54:12 #kisslinux <merakor> It's the year after 2020
2021-02-17T00:54:28 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> also don't start shouting but what tends to be the politics of kiss people
2021-02-17T00:55:07 #kisslinux <dilyn> it's december 47 2020 obvi
2021-02-17T00:55:28 #kisslinux <dilyn> in general i'd say it tends more left libertarian, but like, that's a LOOSE tendency
2021-02-17T00:55:58 #kisslinux <dilyn> probably more libertarian in general, with some interesting philosophical values sprinkled in
2021-02-17T00:56:04 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> i thought so but every so often something throws me off and it's hard to tell
2021-02-17T00:56:16 #kisslinux <dilyn> yeah that's why I say loose
2021-02-17T00:56:23 #kisslinux <dilyn> it's pretty disparate
2021-02-17T00:56:43 #kisslinux <merakor> yup
2021-02-17T00:57:03 #kisslinux <mcpcpc[m]> 32 here. so f you all. ^^.
2021-02-17T00:57:30 #kisslinux <merakor> Honestly I was really surprised for 28 to be the second oldest
2021-02-17T00:57:39 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> daimn oldie
2021-02-17T00:57:48 #kisslinux <necromansy> man im 26 going on 27 this year
2021-02-17T00:58:03 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> me too
2021-02-17T00:58:57 #kisslinux <dilyn> olds in the chat
2021-02-17T00:59:01 #kisslinux <dilyn> pour out the beers
2021-02-17T00:59:03 #kisslinux <necromansy> sod off kid
2021-02-17T00:59:04 #kisslinux <necromansy> :>
2021-02-17T00:59:11 #kisslinux <dilyn> <:
2021-02-17T00:59:16 #kisslinux <merakor> I'll be 23 this year
2021-02-17T00:59:16 #kisslinux <mcpcpc[m]> i feel 10 years too late for all this, to be honest. but i enjoy learning. so that’s why i am here.
2021-02-17T00:59:34 #kisslinux <dilyn> nah
2021-02-17T00:59:40 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> im 19
2021-02-17T00:59:40 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> recently started uni, expected there to be more people into linux etc
2021-02-17T00:59:54 #kisslinux <acheam> I'm 16...
2021-02-17T00:59:55 #kisslinux <dilyn> it's scarey how few people are, huh phoebos:
2021-02-17T01:00:01 #kisslinux <dilyn> acheam WHAT
2021-02-17T01:00:02 #kisslinux <merakor> It's never too late to learn anything mcpcpc[m]
2021-02-17T01:00:24 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> im doing physics not compsci tbf but im literally the only one out of like 150
2021-02-17T01:00:31 #kisslinux <necromansy> hey! physics
2021-02-17T01:00:36 #kisslinux <necromansy> i'm a physics phd student
2021-02-17T01:00:39 #kisslinux <merakor> I used to be a literature student
2021-02-17T01:00:40 #kisslinux <dilyn> I used to study physics!
2021-02-17T01:00:43 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> YAY
2021-02-17T01:00:51 #kisslinux <dilyn> then I decided philosophy was just way better
2021-02-17T01:00:53 #kisslinux <dilyn> f
2021-02-17T01:00:54 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> what's your phd in?
2021-02-17T01:00:56 #kisslinux <necromansy> lmao nice
2021-02-17T01:01:17 #kisslinux <necromansy> uuuuuuuuh near-earth space physics, looking at ultra-low frequency wave propagation between the magnetosphere and the ground
2021-02-17T01:01:26 #kisslinux <dilyn> oh that's the fun stuff
2021-02-17T01:01:33 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> sexy
2021-02-17T01:01:36 #kisslinux <acheam> the what now?
2021-02-17T01:01:46 #kisslinux <necromansy> the magnetosphere
2021-02-17T01:01:47 #kisslinux <dilyn> well you see
2021-02-17T01:01:50 #kisslinux <necromansy> lmao
2021-02-17T01:01:54 #kisslinux <dilyn> the ground is the part of the earth you usually touch
2021-02-17T01:01:59 #kisslinux <dilyn> UNLESS
2021-02-17T01:02:02 #kisslinux <dilyn> you're on a boat
2021-02-17T01:02:14 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> lmfaooo
2021-02-17T01:02:36 #kisslinux <acheam> maybe I *am* on a boat, what do you know?
2021-02-17T01:02:44 #kisslinux <necromansy> the magnetosphere is the part of space just near earth where earth's magnetic field is the dominating influence on particles
2021-02-17T01:02:47 #kisslinux <necromansy> just fyi
2021-02-17T01:02:53 #kisslinux <acheam> interesting, thanks necromansy
2021-02-17T01:02:56 #kisslinux <necromansy> np
2021-02-17T01:03:04 #kisslinux <merakor> acheam: well that is where dylin's expertise on philosophy comes into play
2021-02-17T01:03:14 #kisslinux <necromansy> i just got reviews for my first paper in, so ive gotta fix those up and send a fixed manuscript back
2021-02-17T01:03:30 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> ohh nice!
2021-02-17T01:04:30 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> i wanna use kiss for sciencey worky stuff
2021-02-17T01:04:36 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> but latex
2021-02-17T01:04:44 #kisslinux <necromansy> i've got latex working in kiss
2021-02-17T01:04:53 #kisslinux <necromansy> i had to build it from source from texlive
2021-02-17T01:04:55 #kisslinux <necromansy> it was a pain
2021-02-17T01:05:03 #kisslinux <acheam> oh boy
2021-02-17T01:05:05 #kisslinux <merakor> There is texlive-bin :>
2021-02-17T01:05:10 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> im scared of texlive
2021-02-17T01:05:19 #kisslinux <necromansy> aarng: i saw the fix on my script, cheers!
2021-02-17T01:05:51 #kisslinux <acheam> I just use pandoc to handle tex for me... ignorance is bliss
2021-02-17T01:06:13 #kisslinux <merakor> Doesn't pandoc require pdflatex for pdf generation?
2021-02-17T01:06:27 #kisslinux <acheam> yes
2021-02-17T01:06:28 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> too much maths for pandoc
2021-02-17T01:06:34 #kisslinux <acheam> but i'm not on kiss full time
2021-02-17T01:06:46 #kisslinux <acheam> so not a concern as to whether its packaged or not
2021-02-17T01:06:56 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> also pip is broken everywhere is it just me
2021-02-17T01:07:02 #kisslinux <necromansy> im gonna try to write my thesis in groff but all papers kinda need to be in work or *tex
2021-02-17T01:07:08 #kisslinux <necromansy> yeah nah pip is fucked
2021-02-17T01:07:12 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> <necromansy "im gonna try to write my thesis "> oh wow
2021-02-17T01:07:12 #kisslinux <merakor> I use org-mode -> latex -> pdf
2021-02-17T01:07:13 #kisslinux <acheam> why would you voluntarily use groff?
2021-02-17T01:07:15 #kisslinux <dilyn> I'm thankful every day that my graduating year at my alma mater was exactly one year ahead of the maths department's requirement to learn and use LaTeX for everything
2021-02-17T01:07:18 #kisslinux <dilyn> didn't have to learn a lick
2021-02-17T01:07:45 #kisslinux <necromansy> why not acheam?
2021-02-17T01:07:50 #kisslinux <necromansy> minimalism meme gang
2021-02-17T01:08:05 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> its only a meme
2021-02-17T01:08:15 #kisslinux <acheam> Seems like a pain to use compared to LaTeX, but i've never given it a fair shot
2021-02-17T01:08:15 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> how did you learn groff?
2021-02-17T01:08:27 #kisslinux <acheam> heck even for my manpages, I write them in markdown and use pandoc to convert them
2021-02-17T01:08:40 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> ^
2021-02-17T01:08:40 #kisslinux <necromansy> read the man pages, some reference papers
2021-02-17T01:08:42 #kisslinux <necromansy> practice
2021-02-17T01:08:48 #kisslinux <necromansy> i haven't really even gotten that good in it
2021-02-17T01:09:22 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> also it's a bit ugly
2021-02-17T01:09:23 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> i mean compared to nice tex
2021-02-17T01:09:39 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> *In output, not the source
2021-02-17T01:09:40 #kisslinux <merakor> Yeah, groff is actually a really capable processor, albeit really difficult to grasp.
2021-02-17T01:09:55 #kisslinux <merakor> I relearn manpage format everytime I write it.
2021-02-17T01:10:01 #kisslinux <acheam> so much to learn, so little time...
2021-02-17T01:10:03 #kisslinux <necromansy> https://old.reddit.com/r/groff/comments/ibsyh8/automatic_equation_number_resolving_forward/
2021-02-17T01:10:08 #kisslinux <necromansy> i did enough to write this post
2021-02-17T01:10:37 #kisslinux <acheam> woah thats pretty cool. Didn't know that you could do that kind of thing in troff
2021-02-17T01:10:39 #kisslinux <dilyn> 3 months after you got a single comment
2021-02-17T01:10:41 #kisslinux <dilyn> that's amazing
2021-02-17T01:10:43 #kisslinux <merakor> I literally forget the syntax and the macros everytime I am done with it
2021-02-17T01:10:56 #kisslinux <necromansy> lmao yeah the groff subreddit is pretty inactive
2021-02-17T01:11:20 #kisslinux <necromansy> theres been recent activity coz one dude has started making vids on YT plus got a discord up
2021-02-17T01:12:52 #kisslinux <dilyn> and that man's name?
2021-02-17T01:12:54 #kisslinux <dilyn> Luke Smith
2021-02-17T01:12:57 #kisslinux <acheam> wtf is this https://teddit.ggc-project.de/r/redditrequest/comments/ljrbih/request_for_rkisslinux_adminmod_inactive/gnog4ue/
2021-02-17T01:13:01 #kisslinux <merakor> cringe
2021-02-17T01:13:04 #kisslinux <necromansy> nah, not Luke fortunately
2021-02-17T01:14:21 #kisslinux <dilyn> yeah someone called me out for having an agenda
2021-02-17T01:14:25 #kisslinux <dilyn> eat my shorts nerd
2021-02-17T01:14:40 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> yeah what was that
2021-02-17T01:14:47 #kisslinux <dilyn> who tf knows!
2021-02-17T01:15:15 #kisslinux <acheam> also really weird that post got 22 upvotes
2021-02-17T01:15:24 #kisslinux <dilyn> I mean, I get it sure. but like, people are worried about dylan. essentially my only intention with taking over the sub is to make a pinned post explaining what has happened and what the plan is wrt IRC logs
2021-02-17T01:15:31 #kisslinux <dilyn> R I G H T
2021-02-17T01:15:33 #kisslinux <dilyn> like how
2021-02-17T01:16:01 #kisslinux <necromansy> i dont get that comment
2021-02-17T01:16:19 #kisslinux <necromansy> even if he was bad at reddit and was originally heavy
2021-02-17T01:16:20 #kisslinux <acheam> dilyn:  don't worry, you don't have to pretend around us with that fake explanation, we all know your true agenda
2021-02-17T01:16:27 #kisslinux <necromansy> *originally wanting to be heavy
2021-02-17T01:16:33 #kisslinux <necromansy> he's still *gone*?
2021-02-17T01:16:46 #kisslinux <dilyn> https://freenode.logbot.info/kisslinux/20210125#c6657620
2021-02-17T01:16:52 #kisslinux <dilyn> hostile takeover confirmed
2021-02-17T01:17:32 #kisslinux <acheam> that settles it folks
2021-02-17T01:17:48 #kisslinux <merakor> Yeah, dilyn assasinated dylan
2021-02-17T01:17:58 #kisslinux <merakor> We should have seen it coming
2021-02-17T01:18:11 #kisslinux <necromansy> also unironically id push back and say that the website falling out of registration is enough to argue that he's at least, for the foreseeable future, gone
2021-02-17T01:18:35 #kisslinux <acheam> Even much before that, the SSL cert on git.k1ss.org expired
2021-02-17T01:18:46 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> yeh
2021-02-17T01:19:07 #kisslinux <acheam> I wonder how that was being hosted.....
2021-02-17T01:19:18 #kisslinux <acheam> k1ss.org was being hosted at GH Pages, but not sure about the git mirror
2021-02-17T01:19:30 #kisslinux <merakor> It was on a vyper vps
2021-02-17T01:20:05 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> necromansy: is your groff is kiss? is it nice to compile?
2021-02-17T01:20:10 #kisslinux <dilyn> I mean the SSL cert lapsed, all the emails to his address bounce, and the domain expired
2021-02-17T01:20:28 #kisslinux <acheam> merakor:  what's vyper? I can't find it online
2021-02-17T01:20:30 #kisslinux <dilyn> he has no commit history and essentially zero internet presence attached to his work on github
2021-02-17T01:20:36 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> or troff
2021-02-17T01:20:37 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> i assume groff wants glib
2021-02-17T01:20:45 #kisslinux <dilyn> he's officially a ghost. If he isn't dead, he abandoned the project for at least the short term.
2021-02-17T01:20:53 #kisslinux <necromansy> yeah to both, tho i havent written anything larger than some test scripts, and *started* transferring my thesis stuff to groff
2021-02-17T01:21:31 #kisslinux <necromansy> the groff package depends on just gcc according to kiss depends
2021-02-17T01:21:46 #kisslinux <merakor> Sorry vultr not vyper
2021-02-17T01:21:48 #kisslinux <acheam> ah
2021-02-17T01:21:58 #kisslinux <acheam> his own?
2021-02-17T01:22:04 #kisslinux <acheam> I wonder why he didn't host the site there
2021-02-17T01:22:13 #kisslinux <acheam> I know he used netlify before GH pages
2021-02-17T01:22:24 #kisslinux <merakor> He rented it much later than GH pages
2021-02-17T01:22:51 #kisslinux <acheam> dilyn:  yep. Funnily enough, his other (much larger) projects have not even noticed his dissapearance despite a pile up of PRs
2021-02-17T01:22:56 #kisslinux <acheam> I see, merakor
2021-02-17T01:23:17 #kisslinux <dilyn> I don't think anybody appreciated dylan as much as we did :v
2021-02-17T01:23:28 #kisslinux <necromansy> i was wondering about that, neofetch has a ton of PR/issues now
2021-02-17T01:23:35 #kisslinux <dilyn> necromansy: what's your thesis about?
2021-02-17T01:23:42 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> 😢
2021-02-17T01:23:59 #kisslinux <acheam> we should fork it into neoneofetch
2021-02-17T01:24:07 #kisslinux <dilyn> nofetch
2021-02-17T01:24:15 #kisslinux <dilyn> the script just returns 'No'
2021-02-17T01:24:35 #kisslinux <dilyn> but it forkbombs you immediately afterwards
2021-02-17T01:24:35 #kisslinux <necromansy> obtaining a ratio of the magnetospheric electric field to ground magnetic field for ULF waves for remote sensing purposes
2021-02-17T01:24:38 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> <necromansy "uuuuuuuuh near-earth space physi"> ^
2021-02-17T01:24:46 #kisslinux <necromansy> ^
2021-02-17T01:24:47 #kisslinux <dilyn> 'remote sensing purposes'?
2021-02-17T01:24:49 #kisslinux <dilyn> as in, location?
2021-02-17T01:25:06 #kisslinux <acheam> //i.imgur.com/3sucCBC.png
2021-02-17T01:25:09 #kisslinux <dilyn> or is it more specific/niche
2021-02-17T01:25:11 #kisslinux <acheam> https://i.imgur.com/3sucCBC.png
2021-02-17T01:25:15 #kisslinux <necromansy> nah as in, we have this value of field on ground, we can say that the electric field at this point in the magnetospheric has this value
2021-02-17T01:25:28 #kisslinux <dilyn> bruh you forgot the forkbomb
2021-02-17T01:25:30 #kisslinux <necromansy> its used a lot for looking at how the ULF waves energise particles in the magnetosphere
2021-02-17T01:25:37 #kisslinux <dilyn> oh damn that's hella sick
2021-02-17T01:25:41 #kisslinux <acheam> I wrote it before you sent that lol
2021-02-17T01:25:45 #kisslinux <dilyn> isn't that like, a hard problem to solve?
2021-02-17T01:25:50 #kisslinux <necromansy> yep!
2021-02-17T01:25:54 #kisslinux <necromansy> coz of the ionosphere
2021-02-17T01:25:59 #kisslinux <dilyn> mhm
2021-02-17T01:26:02 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> <acheam "https://i.imgur.com/3sucCBC.png"> don't forget nice shebang and -e
2021-02-17T01:26:20 #kisslinux <necromansy> my supervisors have a code/model working that can do it, but i'm also looking at it from that data and trying to *define* what the ratio really is
2021-02-17T01:26:25 #kisslinux <dilyn> (I was thinking from a mathematical perspective but also yes ionosphere causes issues)
2021-02-17T01:26:28 #kisslinux <necromansy> so we have something to verify model results against
2021-02-17T01:26:38 #kisslinux <dilyn> that's sick
2021-02-17T01:26:42 #kisslinux <acheam> phoebos[m]1:  I could never!
2021-02-17T01:26:46 #kisslinux <merakor> acheam: newlines are bloat now too?
2021-02-17T01:26:51 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> that's really cool
2021-02-17T01:26:57 #kisslinux <acheam> merakor:  cant be having them extra bytes
2021-02-17T01:27:00 #kisslinux <dilyn> nno
2021-02-17T01:27:01 #kisslinux <necromansy> lmao yeah the math isn't too bad, its built on decades of magnetohydrodynamic research
2021-02-17T01:27:01 #kisslinux <dilyn> n
2021-02-17T01:27:07 #kisslinux <merakor> Truen
2021-02-17T01:27:10 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> acheam: muscle memory, as it should be
2021-02-17T01:27:41 #kisslinux <dilyn> ah, see all my knowlegdge of electromagnetism and extensions of it come from calc 3 so I'm semi-familiar with problems re: navier stokes
2021-02-17T01:27:53 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> necromansy: why groff btw, is it just for memes
2021-02-17T01:28:02 #kisslinux <necromansy> yeah phoebos mostly
2021-02-17T01:28:14 #kisslinux <necromansy> i think the syntax of the language is nicer tho
2021-02-17T01:28:20 #kisslinux <acheam> nicer than what?
2021-02-17T01:28:25 #kisslinux <necromansy> latex
2021-02-17T01:28:42 #kisslinux <necromansy> specifically the ms macro
2021-02-17T01:28:43 #kisslinux <necromansy> IMO
2021-02-17T01:28:53 #kisslinux <konimex> really?
2021-02-17T01:29:16 #kisslinux <necromansy> yes but im willing to admit that its a dumb subjective opinion :>
2021-02-17T01:29:44 #kisslinux <acheam> latex is a bit more descriptive and verbose in its macros, which I like compared to troff which just feels like memorizing random acronyms
2021-02-17T01:30:34 #kisslinux <necromansy> yeah you can really tell the age of latex based on that, groff was built when you needed the small acronyms
2021-02-17T01:30:39 #kisslinux <acheam> But I barely use latex or troff, so i'm not really one to judge
2021-02-17T01:31:42 #kisslinux <merakor> * laughs in org-mode
2021-02-17T01:32:08 #kisslinux <necromansy> latex is also definitely way more user friendly as a typesetting language
2021-02-17T01:32:09 #kisslinux <dilyn> :puke:
2021-02-17T01:33:07 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> dumb q, can you really do all the latex things you need in troff - tables, images
2021-02-17T01:33:20 #kisslinux <necromansy> yes
2021-02-17T01:33:22 #kisslinux <merakor> phoebos[m]1: yeah
2021-02-17T01:33:30 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> wow
2021-02-17T01:33:55 #kisslinux <necromansy> there's preprocessors for equations (eqn), tables (tbl), images (pic), graphs (grap)
2021-02-17T01:33:56 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> i can feel several hours of work being lost tomorrow
2021-02-17T01:34:06 #kisslinux <dilyn> lmao
2021-02-17T01:34:18 #kisslinux <merakor> phoebos[m]1: don't
2021-02-17T01:34:29 #kisslinux <necromansy> t h e g r o f f v o i d
2021-02-17T01:34:32 #kisslinux <merakor> It's a rabbit-hole of unending pain
2021-02-17T01:34:33 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> too late
2021-02-17T01:34:48 #kisslinux <dilyn> f
2021-02-17T01:34:50 #kisslinux <necromansy> i wont apologise for bringing doom to the kiss community
2021-02-17T01:35:10 #kisslinux <dilyn> he has become death
2021-02-17T01:35:11 #kisslinux <acheam> doom is fine, as long as it isn't doom emacs
2021-02-17T01:35:13 #kisslinux <dilyn> destroyer of nerds
2021-02-17T01:35:20 #kisslinux <merakor> acheam: WHAT
2021-02-17T01:35:27 #kisslinux <acheam> merakor:  I said what I said.
2021-02-17T01:35:33 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> acheam: omg
2021-02-17T01:35:37 #kisslinux <merakor> acheam: I AM SCREAMING AT YOU THROUGH MY IRC CLIENT ON DOOM EMACS
2021-02-17T01:35:46 #kisslinux <necromansy> i dont get emacs
2021-02-17T01:35:49 #kisslinux <necromansy> like at all
2021-02-17T01:36:10 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> neither lol
2021-02-17T01:36:11 #kisslinux <dilyn> emacs is for 5head humans
2021-02-17T01:36:16 #kisslinux <necromansy> oh fair
2021-02-17T01:36:22 #kisslinux <acheam> merakor:  ah, the natural rage of an emacs user. Quite fitting indeed.
2021-02-17T01:36:27 #kisslinux <merakor> :(
2021-02-17T01:36:45 #kisslinux <dilyn> he has to justify learning lisp to program his OS-within-an-OS, forgive him
2021-02-17T01:36:57 #kisslinux <acheam> Really, we should pity you
2021-02-17T01:37:24 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> sounds like bloat
2021-02-17T01:37:29 #kisslinux <merakor> It is bloat
2021-02-17T01:37:49 #kisslinux <dilyn> what like you've never done what is essentially firing up a Windows VM to run notepad?
2021-02-17T01:37:50 #kisslinux <dilyn> psh
2021-02-17T01:38:02 #kisslinux <merakor> lol
2021-02-17T01:39:05 #kisslinux <acheam> https://github.com/a-schaefers/systemE
2021-02-17T01:39:19 #kisslinux <dilyn> WHat
2021-02-17T01:39:22 #kisslinux <dilyn> NO
2021-02-17T01:39:28 #kisslinux <dilyn> b&
2021-02-17T01:40:07 #kisslinux <dilyn> "That's because systemd is a mild editor lacking a decent lisp os" fucking kill me
2021-02-17T01:40:16 #kisslinux <merakor> I don't want a minimalist text editor, I spend around ten hours a day editing text, I want to have an efficient workflow and get things done.
2021-02-17T01:40:16 #kisslinux <necromansy> lmaooo
2021-02-17T01:40:51 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> yeah so ive got a report due thursday and it's almost done in latex but i wanna put it in troff now to see all the pretty arcane commands run
2021-02-17T01:41:22 #kisslinux <necromansy> merakor: meanwhile here's me doing my stuff in ed because im a masochist
2021-02-17T01:41:37 #kisslinux <dilyn> I am surrounded by lunatics
2021-02-17T01:41:43 #kisslinux <merakor> I tried loots of editors before landing on Emacs
2021-02-17T01:41:52 #kisslinux <dilyn> no wonder dylan left
2021-02-17T01:42:13 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> hahahaha
2021-02-17T01:42:23 #kisslinux <merakor> I was making the same Emacs jokes you are doing right now to Adam like a year ago
2021-02-17T01:42:23 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> HAHAHAHA
2021-02-17T01:43:38 #kisslinux <dilyn> wait are you saying that in a year i'll be like you?
2021-02-17T01:43:40 #kisslinux <dilyn> b e t
2021-02-17T01:44:37 #kisslinux <merakor> https://freenode.logbot.info/kisslinux/20200220#c3273045
2021-02-17T01:44:56 #kisslinux <merakor> It's almost a year now
2021-02-17T01:45:50 #kisslinux <konimex> lots of names I've never heard from anymore
2021-02-17T01:45:56 #kisslinux <konimex> fun times
2021-02-17T01:46:12 #kisslinux <merakor> I mean everybody has their own workflow. I still use vi for basic file editing. I use emacs for projects.
2021-02-17T01:46:14 #kisslinux <necromansy> community has changed a lot since then
2021-02-17T01:46:18 #kisslinux <merakor> Oh hey konimex
2021-02-17T01:46:21 #kisslinux <dilyn> :'(
2021-02-17T01:46:24 #kisslinux <konimex> sup
2021-02-17T01:46:28 #kisslinux <necromansy> i adopted kiss early but was never really involved
2021-02-17T01:47:56 #kisslinux <dilyn> how early?
2021-02-17T01:48:04 #kisslinux <dilyn> the people who were around before me I find fascinating
2021-02-17T01:50:31 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> OMG EVERYONE
2021-02-17T01:50:31 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> LETS WRITE THE KISS WIKI IN GROFF
2021-02-17T01:51:06 #kisslinux <konimex> No.
2021-02-17T01:51:07 #kisslinux <acheam> fucking genius
2021-02-17T01:51:11 #kisslinux <konimex> absolutely not
2021-02-17T01:51:23 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> 💡
2021-02-17T01:51:24 #kisslinux <necromansy> dilyn: at least a year ago
2021-02-17T01:52:29 #kisslinux <dilyn> No.
2021-02-17T01:52:42 #kisslinux <dilyn> necromansy: so we're from roughly the same time, fun!
2021-02-17T01:52:56 #kisslinux <dilyn> KISS is almost two years old now :S
2021-02-17T01:53:03 #kisslinux <mcpcpc[m]> realized the `kiss-convert` script on the website fork breaks some of the urls. particularly, the first step of the install page (due to lack of release tarball).  womp.
2021-02-17T01:53:16 #kisslinux <necromansy> yeah i don't recall exactly when, but i know i dropped in before the first year anniversery
2021-02-17T01:55:02 #kisslinux <dilyn> my personal repo's first commitment was at the end of january but I started using it probably end of december
2021-02-17T01:55:17 #kisslinux <dilyn> time flies
2021-02-17T01:55:21 #kisslinux <merakor> I forked it in late 2019, but didn't drop to IRC until 2020
2021-02-17T01:56:01 #kisslinux <necromansy> oop looks like i got into it in Feb 2020
2021-02-17T01:56:04 #kisslinux <necromansy> so about a year
2021-02-17T01:56:42 #kisslinux <merakor> https://freenode.logbot.info/kisslinux/20191215#c2971357 :)
2021-02-17T01:57:08 #kisslinux <acheam> oh ooops yeah that is problematic, mcpcpc[m]
2021-02-17T01:57:10 #kisslinux <dilyn> #carbs4ever
2021-02-17T01:58:04 #kisslinux <acheam> Just one more reason this text wiki isn't sustainable... replacing the links screwed up all the textboxes
2021-02-17T01:58:17 #kisslinux <dilyn> lol
2021-02-17T01:58:22 #kisslinux <dilyn> so don't do that
2021-02-17T01:58:28 #kisslinux <merakor> lmao
2021-02-17T01:59:07 #kisslinux <merakor> Just get a website with the same url length 5head
2021-02-17T02:00:11 #kisslinux <merakor> Yeah, I never really liked the text wiki approach as well
2021-02-17T02:01:31 #kisslinux <merakor> It is nice to read it on terminal, but that's it. I have always found it really ugly on web, even on terminal browsers.
2021-02-17T02:03:02 #kisslinux <merakor> Dylan is actually good at web design too, the earlier versions of the website were just really good.
2021-02-17T02:03:34 #kisslinux <merakor> The good old goatpiss.org era
2021-02-17T02:06:45 #kisslinux <konimex> the early version where he bolted the markdown format to the css? oh yeah that was good
2021-02-17T02:09:10 #kisslinux <merakor> Yup, he was also using pandoc iirc
2021-02-17T04:39:55 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> hi
2021-02-17T04:40:42 #kisslinux <necromansy> sup
2021-02-17T04:43:48 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> gonna have to figure out some busybox wget stuff
2021-02-17T04:44:08 #kisslinux <necromansy> yeah its got way less flags than the standard
2021-02-17T04:44:26 #kisslinux <necromansy> also i saw aarng fixed up my script, which is dope
2021-02-17T04:53:34 #kisslinux <acheam> hi testuser_[m]
2021-02-17T07:07:52 #kisslinux <Rio6> I like the terminal style website
2021-02-17T08:22:18 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> Bruh this github action just puts the first line of output in the issue content
2021-02-17T08:22:29 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> does anyone know other actions to create issues with a workflow
2021-02-17T08:22:36 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> currently im using JasonEtco/create-an-issue@v2
2021-02-17T08:33:01 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> Tried stuff like quoting the output, putting raw n but it just takes the first line
2021-02-17T08:52:10 #kisslinux <necromansy> no idea tbh
2021-02-17T08:57:58 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> Lol I've spent hours now trying to get this to show full output, either I'm doing something seriously wrong or the action broke
2021-02-17T13:25:03 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> necromansy: btw you can just do `jq -r '.commit.author.name.asdfd'` instead of piping through awk and stuff
2021-02-17T13:25:21 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> s/.asdfd/
2021-02-17T13:25:23 #kisslinux <kissbot> <testuser_[m]> necromansy: btw you can just do `jq -r '.commit.author.name'` instead of piping through awk and stuff
2021-02-17T13:45:10 #kisslinux <tink> Would it be considered bloat to implement a search function to the Kiss wiki website?
2021-02-17T13:45:26 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> yes
2021-02-17T13:45:45 #kisslinux <mcpcpc[m]> ^
2021-02-17T13:45:56 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> it's small enough
2021-02-17T13:48:48 #kisslinux <tink> I guess so. Plus, GH can be used to search anyway.
2021-02-17T13:49:23 #kisslinux <tink> Nevermind, I don't think it works
2021-02-17T13:50:00 #kisslinux <tink> Forked repos aren't searchable
2021-02-17T14:00:14 #kisslinux <acheam> see the search functionality on my website
2021-02-17T14:00:16 #kisslinux <acheam> armaanb.net
2021-02-17T14:00:29 #kisslinux <acheam> Super simple, works well
2021-02-17T14:02:41 #kisslinux <acheam> It does run on yacy/solr/Java, so couldn't run on KISS yet, but there are other simple self-hosted search engines
2021-02-17T14:06:42 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> im dropping this workflow thing, atleast we have a fast enough script now that can be run manually
2021-02-17T14:09:05 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> http://ix.io/2PJP combined both the scripts
2021-02-17T14:09:45 #kisslinux <acheam> is that script anywhere on github? Maybe we shouldmake a meta repo with this kind of stuff
2021-02-17T14:11:50 #kisslinux <necromansy> testuser: thanks, was my first time messing with jq so i kinda just banged up something
2021-02-17T14:12:07 #kisslinux <necromansy> appreciate knowing how to make things more efficient!
2021-02-17T14:12:18 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> np
2021-02-17T14:12:34 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> i forgot, in the jq part it should be '.commit.committer.name'
2021-02-17T14:12:34 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]>  not author
2021-02-17T14:12:40 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> else it gets the real name instead of gh
2021-02-17T14:13:25 #kisslinux <necromansy> yeah i went for comitter.login for that reason originally
2021-02-17T14:13:43 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> yeah that one!
2021-02-17T14:13:50 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> this one was giving wrong names too
2021-02-17T14:15:05 #kisslinux <necromansy> man that tightened up script looks so much nicer
2021-02-17T14:16:56 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> i think there's some rate limit cuz it just starts returning null after fetching 4 names
2021-02-17T14:17:17 #kisslinux <necromansy> yeah, i ran into that testing it last night
2021-02-17T14:17:39 #kisslinux <necromansy> i thought something was wrong with my script until i tried commands straight rather than in a script
2021-02-17T14:17:53 #kisslinux <acheam> is there any repology alternative we could use, with perhaps higher rate limits?
2021-02-17T14:18:01 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> no repology is fine
2021-02-17T14:18:04 #kisslinux <necromansy> its gh
2021-02-17T14:18:05 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> gh api is limiting
2021-02-17T14:18:07 #kisslinux <necromansy> yeah
2021-02-17T14:18:11 #kisslinux <acheam> ah okay
2021-02-17T14:18:34 #kisslinux <necromansy> i think you need to pay to get more api calls
2021-02-17T14:18:42 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> wtf
2021-02-17T14:19:01 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> put sleep 100 after fetching every name :p
2021-02-17T14:20:51 #kisslinux <necromansy> 5000 requests per hour by the look
2021-02-17T14:21:27 #kisslinux <konimex> an alternative to repology would be https://github.com/lilydjwg/nvchecker but yeah it's python
2021-02-17T14:21:48 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> repology is python too
2021-02-17T14:22:23 #kisslinux <konimex> what's the "rate limit" here for? calling repology api via github?
2021-02-17T14:22:45 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> no calling github api to get author's gh username from commit sha
2021-02-17T14:23:37 #kisslinux <konimex> and what would that accomplish?
2021-02-17T14:23:53 #kisslinux <necromansy> automated issue text for outdated packages
2021-02-17T14:24:02 #kisslinux <konimex> ah got it
2021-02-17T14:24:31 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> i think putting sleep 1 would be enough cuz i didnt encounter this with python
2021-02-17T14:24:36 #kisslinux <merakor> I am using a jq-based shell script to check mine, but it only works on a repository
2021-02-17T14:24:43 #kisslinux <konimex> instead of using git metadata, I'd honestly prefer a necessary metadata of "maintainer" but I don't know which problem you would face if you do that
2021-02-17T14:25:06 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> dylan was against adding extra files tho
2021-02-17T14:25:15 #kisslinux <konimex> yeah that was the problem
2021-02-17T14:25:57 #kisslinux <acheam> I wouldn't be against adding a maintainer file
2021-02-17T14:25:59 #kisslinux <necromansy> how does kiss maintainer get its info?
2021-02-17T14:26:01 #kisslinux <acheam> it seems entirely reasonable
2021-02-17T14:26:04 #kisslinux <konimex> dylan was also (probably) against automating the outdated packages notification too tbh
2021-02-17T14:26:18 #kisslinux <merakor> necromansy: last commiter information on the package's 'version' file
2021-02-17T14:27:15 #kisslinux <necromansy> oh yep it just uses git log
2021-02-17T14:29:41 #kisslinux <necromansy> konimex: yeah, seems valid, atm all we've got is a script that generates the text for the issue, with GH usernames tagged, posting still needs to be manual
2021-02-17T14:29:43 #kisslinux <necromansy> afaik
2021-02-17T14:30:12 #kisslinux <acheam> Can the GH cli handle that?
2021-02-17T14:30:21 #kisslinux <acheam> Or even replace the username lookup?
2021-02-17T14:30:34 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> yeah i was gonna make a workflow but the action didn't want to put more than one line in the issue
2021-02-17T14:33:41 #kisslinux <konimex> <testuser_[m] "dylan was against adding extra f"> speaking of metadata, dylan is against unnecessary metadata, and I agree on that, however we have different things of what is "necessary", for him licenses wasn't necessary, but I am in favour of including licenses, same with the maintainer thing
2021-02-17T14:35:28 #kisslinux <konimex> git can handle maintainers just fine, but the kiss package format should not just limit itself to git, in a hypothetical scenario, what if the package repos are delivered using rsync and not git? there are no maintainer metadata there
2021-02-17T14:35:43 #kisslinux <acheam> ^
2021-02-17T14:36:08 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> yeah
2021-02-17T14:38:32 #kisslinux <konimex> but again, the package format is very flexible, however, KISS is first and foremost dylan's brainchild and the moment we add something not in his guidelines (e.g. mandatory static packages for every single package (including X eventhough it's impossible), or even small things such as metadata), I don't think the future iteration should call itself "KISS".
2021-02-17T14:39:01 #kisslinux <konimex> KISS as in KISS Linux of course, not the "keep it simple stupid" thing
2021-02-17T14:40:13 #kisslinux <acheam> If anything, a maintainer file is even more KISS, IMO
2021-02-17T14:40:32 #kisslinux <acheam> It reduced dependence on complex external tools, and is a super simple solution
2021-02-17T14:40:42 #kisslinux <acheam> it even simplifies the kiss-maintainer script
2021-02-17T14:41:12 #kisslinux <acheam> ah wait, I misread your comment
2021-02-17T14:41:14 #kisslinux <acheam> sorry
2021-02-17T15:09:51 #kisslinux <aarng> > testuser_[m]  i think there's some rate limit cuz it just starts returning null after fetching 4 names
2021-02-17T15:10:04 #kisslinux <aarng> I handled that in the script I posted I think
2021-02-17T15:10:36 #kisslinux <aarng> https://termbin.com/65bd
2021-02-17T15:11:21 #kisslinux <aarng> if there is a .message, it prints it and makes the entire script exit
2021-02-17T15:18:53 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> oh, i didnt see this script. Only the repology one
2021-02-17T15:18:53 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> or maybe i forgot
2021-02-17T15:38:38 #kisslinux <aarng> not even sure I send it tbh
2021-02-17T16:42:11 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> test
2021-02-17T16:42:37 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> nice
2021-02-17T17:13:32 #kisslinux <mcpcpc[m]> https://k1ss.armaanb.net mirror down?
2021-02-17T17:17:44 #kisslinux <noocsharp> kiss.armaanb.net
2021-02-17T17:19:01 #kisslinux <mcpcpc[m]> oh. lol. kk. thnx
2021-02-17T17:20:20 #kisslinux <mcpcpc[m]> ah. i see. i clicked the link on README.  which is wrong.
2021-02-17T17:22:38 #kisslinux <mcpcpc[m]> directs to you k1ss* instead of kiss*
2021-02-17T17:25:47 #kisslinux <acheam> oh shoot
2021-02-17T17:27:30 #kisslinux <acheam> it now redirects
2021-02-17T17:30:57 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> all the GH links on there go to dylan's kiss, not kiss-community
2021-02-17T17:30:58 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> is that intentional
2021-02-17T17:34:17 #kisslinux <acheam> ehr I though I changed all those
2021-02-17T17:34:32 #kisslinux <acheam> oh thats embarrasing
2021-02-17T17:34:44 #kisslinux <acheam> I was replacing kiss-community with kiss-community not kisslinux with kiss-community lol
2021-02-17T17:34:53 #kisslinux <mcpcpc[m]> happens.  lol. i’ve done worse.  :)
2021-02-17T17:34:55 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> bruh
2021-02-17T17:36:43 #kisslinux <acheam> ohh, wait no I did it correct the first time I did it, but the shell script ran on itself...
2021-02-17T17:37:07 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> oof
2021-02-17T17:37:22 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> mcpcpc: what matrix client do you use on your pc ?
2021-02-17T17:38:45 #kisslinux <acheam> the GH links should be all fixed up now
2021-02-17T17:39:26 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> https://kiss.armaanb.net/wiki/ is empty
2021-02-17T17:39:34 #kisslinux <acheam> i'm aware
2021-02-17T17:39:44 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> ah okie
2021-02-17T17:42:06 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> also the "edited at" at the top of wiki pages substitution isn't working
2021-02-17T17:42:12 #kisslinux <sad_plan> how does one exacly start using tmpfs on kiss? is it like I seem to understand it from reading gentoo wiki. just mount tmpfs to /var/tmp, add it to fstab, with some flags about size and such?
2021-02-17T17:42:29 #kisslinux <acheam> argh I hate this SSG. Thanks phoebos[m]1
2021-02-17T17:42:48 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> sad_plan: also use a kiss-hook to tell kiss to build packages in tmpfs
2021-02-17T17:43:00 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> sad_plan /tmp is tmpfs by default in kiss fstab from baselayout
2021-02-17T17:43:08 #kisslinux <mcpcpc[m]> testuser_: matrix client on my phone only.  but, at my desktop i either use kirc or irc2.
2021-02-17T17:43:21 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> you can copy that line for /var/tmp or other dir
2021-02-17T17:43:23 #kisslinux <mcpcpc[m]> <acheam "argh I hate this SSG. Thanks pho"> amen to that. lol.
2021-02-17T17:43:42 #kisslinux <sad_plan> ive never used hooks, so Im abit unsure as to how to use them, but I can see if I cant read up on it on the wiki.
2021-02-17T17:43:50 #kisslinux <sad_plan> yeah, I have a tmpfs in fstab
2021-02-17T17:43:53 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> mcpcpc: ah, ok
2021-02-17T17:43:55 #kisslinux <sad_plan> tmpfs /tmp tmpfs defaults,nosuid,nodev 0 0
2021-02-17T17:44:30 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> is the markdown wiki hosted anywhere?
2021-02-17T17:44:37 #kisslinux <sad_plan> testuser_[: wont I have to specify its size aswell?
2021-02-17T17:45:23 #kisslinux <sad_plan> like adding size=10gb or whatever, looks similar on gentoo wiki anyway
2021-02-17T17:46:25 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> sad_plan: mount will automatically use half your ram if you don't give a size i think
2021-02-17T17:46:31 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> s/use/allocate
2021-02-17T17:46:32 #kisslinux <kissbot> <phoebos[m]1> sad_plan: mount will automatically allocate half your ram if you don't give a size i think
2021-02-17T17:47:13 #kisslinux <sad_plan> ah, that wont be enough, so id have to specify it in any case
2021-02-17T17:49:06 #kisslinux <sad_plan> shoot. there is even a part in the wiki about doing just this.
2021-02-17T17:49:28 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> yep :)
2021-02-17T17:50:34 #kisslinux <sad_plan> :D
2021-02-17T17:51:01 #kisslinux <acheam> okay, the date substitution is now working, it just needed a newer version of git
2021-02-17T17:51:27 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> yay
2021-02-17T17:54:02 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> acheam: all looks nice
2021-02-17T17:54:20 #kisslinux <acheam> great, thanks phoebos[m]1!
2021-02-17T17:54:27 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> the only remaining $/kisslinux link is on the contact page, but ig that's a weird one
2021-02-17T17:54:51 #kisslinux <acheam> oh yeah, that ones different becuase it doesn't have a trailing slash
2021-02-17T17:56:20 #kisslinux <acheam> its fixed now
2021-02-17T17:56:38 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> nice
2021-02-17T17:56:56 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> is the plan for this to be a temporary mirror?
2021-02-17T17:57:25 #kisslinux <acheam> Yes, until we get the k1ss.org domain
2021-02-17T17:57:38 #kisslinux <acheam> and then maybe we will redo the website a bit as well
2021-02-17T17:57:55 #kisslinux <acheam> we should be able to auction for k1ss.org in a few weeks time
2021-02-17T17:57:59 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> i mean still adding bug fixes or whatever but when people decide what to do with bdfls and stuff will all the stuff dylan wrote in the first person be removed?
2021-02-17T17:58:40 #kisslinux <acheam> I don't think it needs to be removed, just reated as a past phase of the distro
2021-02-17T17:59:16 #kisslinux <acheam> s/reated/treated/g
2021-02-17T17:59:17 #kisslinux <kissbot> <acheam> I don't think it needs to be removed, just treated as a past phase of the distro
2021-02-17T17:59:57 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> ok
2021-02-17T18:00:13 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> its all part of the bigger question of whether kiss is gonna still be kiss
2021-02-17T18:00:20 #kisslinux <acheam> yes
2021-02-17T18:00:49 #kisslinux <acheam> and that's kind of why i'd support a neokiss, or the like. It just increases the freedom for us to do what we want with the distro
2021-02-17T18:01:39 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> i can see that being good
2021-02-17T18:01:41 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> would you suggest a fork or more just a rename of kiss-community?
2021-02-17T18:02:03 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> fork
2021-02-17T18:02:32 #kisslinux <acheam> not that the fork would immediately change anything, but it would just make it a bit easier to change things without worriying about ruining kiss/what dylan created
2021-02-17T18:02:44 #kisslinux <acheam> for example, the website
2021-02-17T18:03:02 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> true
2021-02-17T18:03:47 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> what kind of major changes would be there to KISS anyways
2021-02-17T18:03:59 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> but a fork is unlikely to bring the community with it
2021-02-17T18:04:13 #kisslinux <acheam> nothing too major, but stuff like a maintainer file,
2021-02-17T18:04:55 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> is that kinda stuff worthy of a fork tho
2021-02-17T18:05:11 #kisslinux <aarng> I think fracturing the community is not the worst we can do
2021-02-17T18:05:39 #kisslinux <aarng> certainly not for something like a maintainer file
2021-02-17T18:05:51 #kisslinux <aarng> eh, -not
2021-02-17T18:06:05 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> making changes which aren't dylany, a fork does feel like the "correct" thing to do
2021-02-17T18:06:20 #kisslinux <acheam> I agree with that, but lets continue the example of the maintainer file. Its something Dylan wouldn't have liked, but seems to have general community appeal
2021-02-17T18:06:34 #kisslinux <acheam> incorporating it into kiss would go against dylan's wish, but for the communities wish
2021-02-17T18:06:43 #kisslinux <aarng> yeh but what do we really gain from it?
2021-02-17T18:06:47 #kisslinux <aarng> not much in my opinion
2021-02-17T18:07:07 #kisslinux <acheam> It reduces git reliance, and makes things simpler in general
2021-02-17T18:07:27 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> i like doing what a community wants, but kiss isn't really supposed to have a community or listen to it
2021-02-17T18:07:27 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> like you can do it by yourself
2021-02-17T18:07:27 #kisslinux <acheam> a simple text file is much simpler than parsing the output of git log IMO
2021-02-17T18:07:56 #kisslinux <acheam> so we need a BDFL to make this decision
2021-02-17T18:08:02 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> its very unlikely that git is gonna stop being used tho
2021-02-17T18:08:06 #kisslinux <aarng> true but I think operation where you need to find the maintainer are rather edge cases
2021-02-17T18:08:14 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> ^
2021-02-17T18:08:19 #kisslinux <aarng> honestly, I have never once cared who the maintainer is of a pkg
2021-02-17T18:08:45 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> when an update doesn't build is not that rare
2021-02-17T18:08:46 #kisslinux <acheam> perhaps not for SCM, but maybe for the distribution of the repos, phoebos[m]1
2021-02-17T18:09:19 #kisslinux <acheam> I mean, just a few hours ago, we've had to struggle with the GH API to find the GH username of the maintainers
2021-02-17T18:09:34 #kisslinux <acheam> That'd be infinitely simpler if there was a maintainer file with name, email, GH username
2021-02-17T18:09:47 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> if you forked, you could do that
2021-02-17T18:10:21 #kisslinux <aarng> I'm not against it per se, it's just that it's not worth fracturing the community over that
2021-02-17T18:10:34 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> thats part of the "problem" of using GH where there are features not a part of git itself
2021-02-17T18:10:45 #kisslinux <acheam> ^
2021-02-17T18:10:51 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> ^
2021-02-17T18:11:04 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> the main thing about forking is visibility of the fork (if it is deemed the "golden fork" going forward).  Advertising it as such both here and in the subreddit would allow that visibility (since that is where the majority of users come from)
2021-02-17T18:11:24 #kisslinux <acheam> Meanwhile, if we had a BDFL, they could make this decision without fracturing the community, precisely for the reason that its not worth fracturing the community over
2021-02-17T18:11:41 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> There's like 15 active people in IRC and maybe 100-200 users in total and splitting it would def kill off the project
2021-02-17T18:12:59 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> yes, but as long as there's no not-backward-compatible changes to kiss the package man then people still using the original could just add the fork's repos
2021-02-17T18:13:13 #kisslinux <acheam> Here's what I'm saying: Running KISS as a community project won't work because we're still carriying Dylan's words and scared to change anything. I see two options: Continue with a new BDFL, or fork into a new community-run project not trying to adhere to Dylan. The latter would certainly kill the project, as many here have pointed out.
2021-02-17T18:13:44 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> We need a bdfl, but I don't think anyone has a lot of free time to maintain stuff while also being as skilled as dylan
2021-02-17T18:14:07 #kisslinux <acheam> Right, so where does that leave us?
2021-02-17T18:14:50 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> what's against a kind of voting system
2021-02-17T18:15:09 #kisslinux <sad_plan> to answer that, youd have to answer the question, of what exacly do we want? except dylans return obviously.
2021-02-17T18:15:15 #kisslinux <acheam> Multiple BDFLs for different aspects of the project, is something I've brought up before and I think could work. One person works on KISS/K/package management, one person works on documentation/communication, one person manages the repos, etc
2021-02-17T18:15:16 #kisslinux <sad_plan> voting is a great idea
2021-02-17T18:15:31 #kisslinux <aarng> I'm fine with a new bdfl who would even do things dylan would definitely be against
2021-02-17T18:15:39 #kisslinux <aarng> as long as it stays true to the kiss principle
2021-02-17T18:15:42 #kisslinux <acheam> ^
2021-02-17T18:15:43 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> kiss isn't big enough for people who don't know what theyre talking about voting for bad stuff
2021-02-17T18:15:54 #kisslinux <acheam> Nothing would ever get done in a voting system
2021-02-17T18:16:02 #kisslinux <acheam> Imagine having a 1 week voting period for every decision
2021-02-17T18:16:13 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> the idea for diff bdfls for diff stuff is good but how many deserving people are willing to devote that time
2021-02-17T18:16:16 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> as long as there's a committee (of bdfls) to create the ballots so there are no weird options
2021-02-17T18:16:43 #kisslinux <sad_plan> not everything has to be done through voting, but if we wanna figure out what people want, doing ONE vote, would initially suffice
2021-02-17T18:17:05 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> <acheam "Imagine having a 1 week voting p"> only big decisions like massive changes to the structure of the project (maintainer file, wiki formatting) need a vote
2021-02-17T18:17:06 #kisslinux <acheam> testuser_[m]:  I mean, you're already pretty much the BDFL of the repos, I'm already focusing on the documentation/website, and dilyn or someone could do packaging,
2021-02-17T18:17:18 #kisslinux <sad_plan> like have one vote for the future, where to host, whos bdfl, or just community vs bdfl or something like that
2021-02-17T18:17:42 #kisslinux <acheam> if we do go for a voting system, this is a nice system. https://codeberg.org/Codeberg/codeberg_voting_system
2021-02-17T18:17:42 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> certainly for deciding on bdfls a vote is necessary
2021-02-17T18:17:53 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> i think the amount of work/effort on the core KISS system is being overstated here.  i think the actual effort will be in the repository maintenance (keeping package versions up to date) and rehosting the website.
2021-02-17T18:18:16 #kisslinux <sad_plan> acheam: then why are you guys even arguing about how to run things if youve already figured this out? :p assuming whats already going is actually working
2021-02-17T18:18:18 #kisslinux <acheam> Whoever works on the core KISS system would also probably be working on K
2021-02-17T18:18:37 #kisslinux <sad_plan> in the long run I mean
2021-02-17T18:18:40 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> what i'm saying is there's nothing to work on there
2021-02-17T18:18:42 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> hmm
2021-02-17T18:18:46 #kisslinux <sad_plan> brb
2021-02-17T18:19:07 #kisslinux <acheam> sad_plan:  But take the maintainer file decision. In the current method of governance, we have nobody to make that decision. Its not working IMO
2021-02-17T18:19:16 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> repo updates still (should) use PRs etc
2021-02-17T18:19:18 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> The imp stuff is community repo and package manager
2021-02-17T18:19:32 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> main repo is quite small and easy to maintain
2021-02-17T18:21:00 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> or, have bdfls for each major section, who could send out votes to get a feel for the community opinion, but still have executive power
2021-02-17T18:21:20 #kisslinux <acheam> phoebos[m]1:  that's what i'm suggesting
2021-02-17T18:21:27 #kisslinux <aarng> > what i'm saying is there's nothing to work on there
2021-02-17T18:21:29 #kisslinux <aarng> this
2021-02-17T18:21:34 #kisslinux <acheam> K?
2021-02-17T18:21:46 #kisslinux <acheam> there's tons of work to do on it.
2021-02-17T18:22:14 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> there are obviously at least a couple of big decisions to be made
2021-02-17T18:22:15 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> it's not necessary for kiss
2021-02-17T18:22:32 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> even if we just need someone to say no
2021-02-17T18:26:52 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> if someone wanted to "finish" K, then in my mind the appropriate thing to do would be for them to fork it, do whatever they wanted, and then if it gets finished the fork could get listed on the website and wiki as an alternative under the Package Manager information
2021-02-17T18:28:37 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> There's WIP `king` in golang, it can probably be a good addition to community repo once stable TM
2021-02-17T18:28:55 #kisslinux <acheam> I think forking it to kiss-community would be sufficient. Its not like working on it erases Dylan's work
2021-02-17T18:29:25 #kisslinux <acheam> testuser_[m]:  do you have a link?
2021-02-17T18:30:11 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> @acheam that's fine too, sure.  and in that case yes whoever maintains kiss-community could decide where to go with it
2021-02-17T18:31:01 #kisslinux <acheam> I just forked it into kiss-community, if someone wants to work on it, mention me and I can give you push access to the repo
2021-02-17T18:31:01 #kisslinux <testuser_[m]> https://github.com/ïlliliti/king, replace the weird i with a normal one, don't want to ping unnecessarily
2021-02-17T18:31:08 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> acheam: isn't kiss-community explicitly kiss but maintained by (um) the community
2021-02-17T18:31:08 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> ie still following the kiss guidestones etc
2021-02-17T18:31:32 #kisslinux <acheam> phoebos[m]1:  what's your point?
2021-02-17T18:32:02 #kisslinux <acheam> thanks testuser_[m]
2021-02-17T18:32:16 #kisslinux <phoebos[m]1> so making changes in kiss-community isn't different from making changes to kiss
2021-02-17T18:32:31 #kisslinux <acheam> yes
2021-02-17T18:35:23 #kisslinux <ominous_anonymou> k technically isn't part of kiss since it is an alternative to the package manager.  so making changes to it isn't the same as making changes to kiss, even if the repo is in kiss-community
2021-02-17T18:35:46 #kisslinux <acheam> Yeah, it wasn't even in the kisslinux GH org
2021-02-17T18:56:03 #kisslinux <sad_plan> acheam: are you refering to the script you guys are working on? in any case, its not really too much of an issue. either the current maintainer wishes to continue doing this, or not. if he/she does, problem solved. if not, will  someone else do this job? yes? problem solved. no? well either drop the package, or leave it there for some other time. we made a kiss-graveyard repo for this particular thing, so its really easy to pick up
2021-02-17T21:30:20 #kisslinux <necromansy> can i suggest that maybe trying to replicate Dylan's POV into the project is a self-defeating one, and that the guidestones are probably the best thing to follow
2021-02-17T21:30:56 #kisslinux <necromansy> "Continue to work towards the removal of unneeded software, patching existing software or writing replacements if required"
2021-02-17T21:33:45 #kisslinux <necromansy> i know this is unspecific to the PM though
2021-02-17T21:41:40 #kisslinux <dilyn> I think a lot of these conversations are just ancillary
2021-02-17T21:42:06 #kisslinux <dilyn> The only question that actually has to be answered is whether we proceed with a BDFL or not
2021-02-17T21:42:24 #kisslinux <necromansy> true
2021-02-17T21:52:44 #kisslinux <sad_plan> ^both
2021-02-17T23:25:12 #kisslinux <dilyn> successfully booted with s6!
2021-02-17T23:25:21 #kisslinux <dilyn> for some reason, my toybox getty is broken when executed by s6 tho