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So I have seen us have a lot of talks about how dumb most BEV's are, so I figured we should have a subspace for it! 😁
In reality we are talking BEC's (battery electric cars) here, cos BEV's as concept aren't stupid and have been used for a lot of things for decades, from Golf carts to factory ground trucks.
BEC's problem, is them being 2T iPhone's. When research has shown passenger occupancy ~1,6 people. Realistically, if you are a big person, that is 160/2000, which is 8% of the vehicle mass. Even if you are extremely heavy set, that is still only 16%.
If we disregard for a second what a 1T battery pack does of damage to the environment and the fact that the car would have to drive 1M km to just break even pollution wise.
It makes for objectively poor cars, the new Model 3 for example only has a payload of 439kg, is only able to tow 1000kg and not at the same time. Which is roughly the same you could get out of any 1.0L gasoline hatchback, that weighs closer to 1T.
It is a safety concern as well, as the sleek aero to make these bricks more efficient, basically turns them into terminal velocity weapons. Going through guardrails and plowing through other cars. Plus of course the whole exploding and burning for days thing as well.
Dec 09 · 8 days ago
🐸 HanzBrix [OP/mod] · Dec 09 at 12:00:
I would like to applaud companies for cars such as the BMW i3 and Microlino, for making very small, useful cars, both of which would seat the ~1,6 people nicely.
Sadly they are both gone or going and I believe laws have a lot to do with it. It is prohibitively expensive to create a new car, with all the requirements, that ultimately shouldn't even be there.
Safety, always, but some of the "safety" requirements like ISA, is just moronic Other requirements that are idiotic, is CANBUS and what it has to be connected to, this includes lights, electric windows and seat warmers.
I always made fun of cars having more computers than me, but with all the requirements, you kind of have to.
I once read somewhere (possibly on or via lowtechmagazine) something like "the vehicle of the future has two wheels, a handlebar, and it's a bicycle" 😃.
I'm looking forward to a world where electric-assisted bicycles have somewhat standardized their parts (at least to the degree classic bikes parts are standardized), and they become reparable. The industry will probably try to delay that scenario as much as they can, sadly.
👻 darkghost · Dec 09 at 17:30:
The over computerization of cars aren't limited to just BEVs. They just tend to get saddled with them to make them more "futuristic."
👻 darkghost · Dec 09 at 17:35:
@jmcs I just think about my poor elderly mother when I see things like this. She doesn't have a hope of ever hopping back on a bicycle, electrical or not. It is worth remembering that bicycles are great for the able bodied but not great if you aren't.
🐸 HanzBrix [OP/mod] · Dec 09 at 20:50:
@jmns In Europe we actually mostly have standardised stuff, some of the batteries of certain manufacturers have weird connectors though. I bought a kickbike recently, less parts, more standardised and I can install an e-motor on it if I choose. 😂
@darkghost 100% the computerisation is a legislation problem, as well as a manufacturer problem. Legislatively you can't make a vehicle today, without at least 4-5 computers.
We need to keep in mind that people with poor motor skills, shouldn't be piloting large vehicles either. I am actually a huge fan of the little 3 wheeled electric moped things, but they have a stigma of being for the disabled. ☹️
👻 darkghost · Dec 09 at 23:50:
Not to derail the conversation too much but I'd rather be hit by a 2T aerodynamic sedan instead of the overgrown Tonka trucks that are popular here in the States.
I will not get into one.
These are deathtraps.
In case of a collision you have seconds to get out before the stupid thing ignites.
I cannot believe large lithium batteries are not classified as incendiary devices. A phone battery fire can bring down a plane. You want me to sit on 500 kilos of lithium? No thank you.
More and more fires that cannot be extinguished are underreported by mainstream media. Once ignited - from a bump or overcharging, the car will burn for hours, setting everything nearby on fire. Firemen have to observe the wreck for days as it often reignites if any lithium is left.
Lithium will spontaneously ignite on contact with air. A pinhole puncture or any bump cracking the battery case will do. As it burns it emits toxic smoke that will kill you if the fire doesn't.
Gasoline is a toy compared to lithium.
Be very afraid when an EV is nearby.
🐸 HanzBrix [OP/mod] · Dec 10 at 07:07:
@stack It is rather odd that this is barely reported on, there was a whole line of Chevy Volts, that was recalled, cos they would.just randomly explode in peoples garages.
@darkghost Not derailing, you can get the tonka trucks in electric now too, maximising their weight and making them more useless in the process. 😂
Ford made a V8 you can put in the bed, so you can make your electric tonka truck also have no bed space. 😂
I came across the Maxus t90, which is a shit electric pickup truck, it can't tow anything, doesn't have much bed space and can't carry a lot of weight either.
👻 darkghost · Dec 10 at 12:46:
@stack Here is another perspective that I find interesting. In summary, it speaks about what ship insurers think about the issue of EV battery fires. On a ship, there is nowhere to go that's safe, so how do you manage risk when transporting hundreds of these cars? It acknowledges they burn hotter, longer, and can't be deprived of oxygen but insurers generally view fires as happening less frequently.
— Maritime Magazine on EV fires
@darkghost - thank you for the link.
At the risk of appearing paranoid... EVs are not viable economically without major state subsidies. Everyone in the manufacturing/distribution chain is paid off.
I'd be surprised if a major segment of the supply chain is not quietly incentivized to downplay certain inconvenient risks.
Virgin batteries may be safer than banged up ones, although I believe the FedEx jet that went down a while ago was carrying new batteries...
Several hundred fires per year and growing -- usually severe and hard to extinguish -- are linked to evs, in NYC mostly scooters and ebikes, stored and charged indoors.
👻 darkghost · Dec 10 at 22:04:
Oh these scooters and E-Bikes terrify me. There are so many shady products for sale in this space.
🐸 HanzBrix [OP/mod] · Dec 10 at 22:38:
@stack @darkghost Yeah there is a bit of a problem with the regulation and quality of ebikes and escooters. In europe there are laws requiring bike helmets and only allowed to ride fast in specific zones, but sadly I still think the police look the other way, they generally do with a lot of safety stuff.
Escooters also have a problem with a huge surge in severe head injures caused by them, partly because people use them without helmets, but mostly because the tiny wheels make them prone to tipping accidents, ejecting the driver forward. I know voi and others have been removed from cities as they were considered health risks.
It's why we need new ideas!