gemini - kennedy.gemi.dev

💾 Archived View for gemini.ctrl-c.club › ~phoebos › logs › kisslinux-2023-03-31.txt captured on 2024-05-12 at 16:00:42.
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[2023-03-31T00:01:56Z] <midfavila> http://careerowl.ca/frontpage.aspx
[2023-03-31T00:01:59Z] <midfavila> i also found this site
[2023-03-31T00:02:00Z] <midfavila> which is amazing
[2023-03-31T00:02:07Z] <midfavila> i love their mascot lmao
[2023-03-31T00:02:15Z] <midfavila> http://careerowl.ca/GenericPages/Images/learning_clipart.jpg
[2023-03-31T00:02:20Z] <midfavila> look at this smug mf
[2023-03-31T00:10:46Z] <drez> nice and stretched on the front page
[2023-03-31T00:11:05Z] <drez> sweet site though
[2023-03-31T00:14:18Z] <midfavila> ikr
[2023-03-31T03:37:06Z] <testuser[m]> Hi
[2023-03-31T03:37:10Z] <sad_plan> hi
[2023-03-31T05:35:09Z] <sewn> hi
[2023-03-31T09:25:50Z] <acidbong> hi there, hello
[2023-03-31T09:25:50Z] <acidbong> is Glasnost installed the same was as Kiss? they don't elaborate on that on their main page
[2023-03-31T09:31:47Z] <illiliti> yes
[2023-03-31T09:31:53Z] <illiliti> and they do
[2023-03-31T09:32:06Z] <illiliti> > This distribution is currently intended only for experienced Linux users. Installation should be treated similar to KISS Linux.
[2023-03-31T09:34:30Z] <acidbong> ah, missed that
[2023-03-31T09:51:15Z] <acidbong> is glasnost/gcc category necessary?
[2023-03-31T10:02:15Z] <illiliti> idk
[2023-03-31T15:00:23Z] <sewn> hello everynyan
[2023-03-31T15:01:50Z] <sewn> how are you? fine thank you
[2023-03-31T15:46:32Z] <acidbong> i wonder if you actually resemble any of Japanese prime ministers
[2023-03-31T15:50:55Z] <riteo> hiiiiiii!
[2023-03-31T15:56:06Z] <testuser[m]> riteo: hiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii8iiiiiiiiiiiii
[2023-03-31T15:57:21Z] <riteo> how's its going?
[2023-03-31T16:08:22Z] <midfavila> :ooo
[2023-03-31T16:08:27Z] <midfavila> wow hey look it's riteo
[2023-03-31T16:23:39Z] <acidbong> hey, chat's not dead
[2023-03-31T16:27:51Z] <midfavila> chat is never dead
[2023-03-31T16:36:56Z] <phoebos> > debugging netsurf for hours only to find the bug has been detected by their CI for at least 4 months, and just ignored
[2023-03-31T16:37:44Z] <phoebos> said bug causes a segfault
[2023-03-31T16:37:59Z] <sewn> what was the bug
[2023-03-31T16:38:21Z] <phoebos> a null dereference
[2023-03-31T16:50:04Z] <riteo> fuck
[2023-03-31T16:50:07Z] <riteo> when did I timeout
[2023-03-31T16:50:19Z] <riteo> got distracted helping my brother, I must've closed my laptop's lid by accident
[2023-03-31T16:58:16Z] <riteo> yeah btw it's great seeing this chat as never dead
[2023-03-31T16:58:20Z] <riteo> a bit like this distro tbh
[2023-03-31T16:58:29Z] <riteo> small but always alive
[2023-03-31T17:07:15Z] <acidbong> i wonder if anyone uses Kiss for audio production
[2023-03-31T17:16:15Z] <sewn> like, music?
[2023-03-31T17:17:07Z] <acidbong> yep
[2023-03-31T17:17:24Z] <acidbong> JACK and stuff
[2023-03-31T17:18:01Z] <acidbong> although ALSA might be useful by itself
[2023-03-31T17:19:08Z] <drez> non-daw could run well on kiss
[2023-03-31T17:19:22Z] <drez> it's a fltk-based jack-only daw
[2023-03-31T17:19:30Z] <drez> more like jack-centric
[2023-03-31T17:19:58Z] <drez> it is designed around jack's features
[2023-03-31T17:20:06Z] <drez> like freewheel mode
[2023-03-31T17:20:33Z] <drez> Trackers are also an option
[2023-03-31T17:21:38Z] <drez> I guess there isn't much audiovisual software ported to KISS, though
[2023-03-31T17:27:53Z] <acidbong> although community repo has pipewire
[2023-03-31T17:32:08Z] <riteo> oh
[2023-03-31T17:32:14Z] <riteo> non-daw look(ed) like a nice thing
[2023-03-31T17:32:31Z] <riteo> but bruh, it looks semi-dead due to continue harassment to the dude behind
[2023-03-31T17:32:39Z] <riteo> or at least, that's what its site says
[2023-03-31T17:32:46Z] <riteo> the tuxfamily repo is also gone
[2023-03-31T17:33:13Z] <acidbong> btw, why are skalibs in the main repo, if s6 tools are in community?
[2023-03-31T17:33:13Z] <acidbong> is something else dependent on them?
[2023-03-31T17:34:08Z] <riteo> it looks like mdevd depends on them
[2023-03-31T17:41:07Z] <riteo> this non-daw thing kinda worries me
[2023-03-31T17:41:17Z] <riteo> the community tab literally says "There is no community. Like me, you're on your own."
[2023-03-31T17:41:31Z] <riteo> this software might have completely disappeared if not for a bunch of weird github repos
[2023-03-31T17:41:41Z] <riteo> a proper mirror must be _somewhere_
[2023-03-31T17:45:08Z] <riteo> here it is https://github.com/linuxaudio/non
[2023-03-31T17:45:39Z] <riteo> the submodules are also handled correctly
[2023-03-31T17:52:14Z] <drez> yes it was abandoned basically
[2023-03-31T17:52:22Z] <drez> let me see where I got my source code from
[2023-03-31T17:52:34Z] <drez> but, it is still quite stable
[2023-03-31T17:52:52Z] <drez> and the ecosystem hasn't changed much, other than the popularization of LV2 plugins
[2023-03-31T17:53:07Z] <drez> but those are too bloated to fit in a KISS install anyways ;)
[2023-03-31T17:53:33Z] <drez> https://github.com/Stazed/non
[2023-03-31T17:53:45Z] <drez> this guy has been patching it for a while
[2023-03-31T17:54:09Z] <drez> he seems to have added some sort of rudimentary LV2 support
[2023-03-31T17:54:34Z] <drez> https://github.com/jean-emmanuel/non and only 2 extra commits from this guy
[2023-03-31T17:54:55Z] <drez> https://github.com/linuxaudio/ntk
[2023-03-31T17:55:17Z] <drez> you'll also need non's tweaked fltk, called ntk
[2023-03-31T17:55:27Z] <drez> I think it's included in the 'non' repository 
[2023-03-31T17:56:50Z] <riteo> yeah the linuxaudio mirror already has the submodule handled
[2023-03-31T17:57:02Z] <drez> I think I have Stazed's fork installed
[2023-03-31T17:57:09Z] <riteo> that's a pity though that it went like this
[2023-03-31T17:57:13Z] <drez> it really is
[2023-03-31T17:57:23Z] <riteo> its goals were very, very, nice
[2023-03-31T17:57:35Z] <riteo> not that KISS and creative tools really go hand-to-hand (for various reasons)
[2023-03-31T17:57:35Z] <drez> well, it was developed for many  years
[2023-03-31T17:57:50Z] <drez> it's not like it's super incomplete
[2023-03-31T17:57:54Z] <drez> it's very usable
[2023-03-31T18:02:52Z] <drez> riteo, why don't they go together ?
[2023-03-31T18:03:19Z] <riteo> drez: I guess the thirst for every feature possible
[2023-03-31T18:03:24Z] <riteo> and I mean, that kinda makes sense
[2023-03-31T18:03:48Z] <riteo> creative tools usually want to give you every tool possible because it might be genuinely useful for that niche use case that you might need to finish your work
[2023-03-31T18:03:56Z] <riteo> I mean, it's not like blender is that bloated AFAIK
[2023-03-31T18:04:10Z] <riteo> but stuff like Krita is still pretty heavy
[2023-03-31T18:07:32Z] <riteo> or perhaps I'm misunderstanding feature-completeness with bloatedness and un-KISSy software?
[2023-03-31T18:07:49Z] <riteo> I guess that in some cases something might have a shitton of features and still be "simple"
[2023-03-31T18:08:19Z] <riteo> I'd definitely consider Godot "simple" yet it's surprisingly close to feature-parity with Unity for the average indie developer IMO
[2023-03-31T18:08:35Z] <drez> no well
[2023-03-31T18:08:41Z] <drez> you could just modularize stuff
[2023-03-31T18:08:44Z] <drez> but still have all the features
[2023-03-31T18:08:49Z] <drez> which is what non was doing
[2023-03-31T18:08:53Z] <riteo> right
[2023-03-31T18:09:07Z] <riteo> well I guess that's definitely the ideal, despite being the harder choice
[2023-03-31T18:09:14Z] <drez> pretty hard for sure
[2023-03-31T18:09:24Z] <riteo> a bit like the issue with microkernels, they were initially slower and thus got put to the side
[2023-03-31T18:09:37Z] <riteo> although the new ones are blazing fast
[2023-03-31T18:09:44Z] <riteo> only took 40 years :P
[2023-03-31T18:09:47Z] <drez> :D
[2023-03-31T18:09:50Z] <drez> which ones exactly?
[2023-03-31T18:09:55Z] <drez> l4?
[2023-03-31T18:09:58Z] <riteo> yeah
[2023-03-31T18:10:13Z] <riteo> I'm pretty ignorant about the actual history but the main comparison I know of is mach and l4
[2023-03-31T18:10:41Z] <riteo> the first one was slow enough to be actually considered as one of its main con while L4 only had, IIRC, a 4% overhead compared to a monolithic kernel
[2023-03-31T18:10:45Z] <riteo> not shabby for an IPC :P
[2023-03-31T18:12:01Z] <riteo> Yeah the first sentence of wikipedia says: "The poor performance of first-generation microkernels, such as Mach, led a number of developers to re-examine the entire microkernel concept in the mid-1990s."
[2023-03-31T18:12:31Z] <riteo> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L4_microkernel_family
[2023-03-31T18:19:45Z] <midfavila> the performance problems with microkernels haven't been solved *to my knowledge*
[2023-03-31T18:19:56Z] <midfavila> it's just the overhead inherent in using IPC instead of a monokernel
[2023-03-31T18:20:09Z] <midfavila> but the increase in commodity hardware has rendered that overhead irrelevant
[2023-03-31T18:21:31Z] <midfavila> s/increase/performance increase/
[2023-03-31T18:21:51Z] <midfavila> i love when i just randomly forget to include words in my sentences
[2023-03-31T18:29:23Z] <riteo> mh I can't find numbers for l4
[2023-03-31T18:29:43Z] <riteo> I only found this random uni document talking about mach having an 800 cycle overhead
[2023-03-31T18:29:49Z] <riteo> whatever that means
[2023-03-31T18:31:16Z] <midfavila> 800 ticks of the CPU timer
[2023-03-31T18:31:25Z] <midfavila> 800 cycles in the mach era would have been a huge deal
[2023-03-31T18:32:03Z] <midfavila> (cycles are measured in "frequency", so when you hear people talking about an Xghz cpu or whatever they're referring to how many ticks of the CPU's clock are happening per second)
[2023-03-31T18:32:29Z] <midfavila> but given the speed of modern CPUs and the whole multithreading thing... it's kind of whatever if you spend 800 cycles on IPC overhead
[2023-03-31T18:32:53Z] <riteo> mh
[2023-03-31T18:33:05Z] <riteo> well, L4's being used also for embedded so I presume that it's good enough
[2023-03-31T18:33:24Z] <midfavila> yeap
[2023-03-31T18:33:24Z] <riteo> and in theory the benefits would have been worth it anyways balancing the pros and cons
[2023-03-31T18:33:48Z] <riteo> obv depending on the use-case, but security-wise a capability-based ukernel AFAIK should be a huge win
[2023-03-31T18:34:38Z] <midfavila> mmhm
[2023-03-31T18:38:15Z] <riteo> the most I found for now is this https://www.l4ka.org/126.php
[2023-03-31T18:38:40Z] <riteo> a cycles thing would allow for a better comparison though
[2023-03-31T18:38:44Z] <riteo> oh wait
[2023-03-31T18:38:45Z] <riteo> there is
[2023-03-31T18:39:46Z] <riteo> well, I have no idea what the mach count was based on and what are the average value here
[2023-03-31T18:40:27Z] <riteo> > The kernel was compiled with GCC 3.3. 
[2023-03-31T18:40:36Z] <riteo> > AMD Opteron 242, 1.6GHz
[2023-03-31T18:40:42Z] <riteo> holy fuck how old is this benchmark
[2023-03-31T18:42:34Z] <drez> I wonder how an OS exclusively designed for audiovisual applications would look like
[2023-03-31T18:42:53Z] <midfavila> beos 
[2023-03-31T18:42:55Z] <midfavila> probably
[2023-03-31T18:43:06Z] <drez> nice one
[2023-03-31T18:43:09Z] * midfavila shrugs
[2023-03-31T18:43:12Z] <drez> that's probably it
[2023-03-31T18:43:37Z] <drez> hmmm, I wonder if haiku has a JACK port
[2023-03-31T18:47:27Z] <riteo> btw I just setup mbsync, great stuff
[2023-03-31T18:47:46Z] <riteo> I initially wanted to use fdm, but it looks pretty unidirectional
[2023-03-31T18:48:16Z] <riteo> also, does anybody know a slim daemon for queueing smtp stuff (pretty much the send part)
[2023-03-31T18:51:37Z] <drez> https://github.com/jackaudio/jack2/issues/187
[2023-03-31T19:10:08Z] <riteo> I'm trying something, I might timeout
[2023-03-31T19:10:38Z] <acidbong> riteo: also fdm, if you're not careful enough, might fetch the mail and clean up the remote inbox
[2023-03-31T19:11:56Z] <riteo> I indeed timed out
[2023-03-31T19:12:42Z] <acidbong> from irc? i can't see the join-leave messages in my client
[2023-03-31T19:13:32Z] <acidbong> btw, is glasnost the only kiss distro with arm64 tarballs?
[2023-03-31T19:13:36Z] <riteo> oh well, I regained the account quickly
[2023-03-31T19:13:42Z] <riteo> I timed out from my client though
[2023-03-31T19:14:00Z] <riteo> sadly (but understandibly) wifi mesh roaming doesn't persist tcp sessions
[2023-03-31T19:14:13Z] <riteo> I'm still a bit too ignorant on the matter but I think that makes sense
[2023-03-31T19:14:55Z] <riteo> I wonder if it depends on the local IP changing, I didn't check if it changed
[2023-03-31T19:19:02Z] <riteo> ok I think tcp just insta-closes as soon as an error happens, I'm not sure that a TCP connection can be recovered
[2023-03-31T19:19:36Z] <riteo> oh well, I have another reason to fix my server and setup a bouncer
[2023-03-31T19:19:38Z] * riteo shrugs
[2023-03-31T19:24:58Z] <testuser[m]> https://github.com/twitter/the-algorithm
[2023-03-31T19:27:42Z] <riteo> ugh, youtube messed their api once again
[2023-03-31T19:27:55Z] <riteo> how am I going to consoom videos now
[2023-03-31T19:28:17Z] <riteo> now all the python scripts must change, why Google why?
[2023-03-31T19:28:45Z] <riteo> I mean, I can still consoom, I just can't fetch channels for their latest videos
[2023-03-31T19:29:18Z] <riteo> and EEVBlog has like 194720955897204801576489679028 mirrors (even direct downloads from his server, which is extremely based)
[2023-03-31T19:30:17Z] <riteo> testuser[m]: wait, is that an april fools thing
[2023-03-31T19:30:21Z] <drez> > https://github.com/twitter/the-algorithm | impossible
[2023-03-31T19:30:37Z] <riteo> this sounds too serious to be an april fools thing
[2023-03-31T19:30:42Z] <riteo> wait is this real I can't tell
[2023-03-31T19:30:52Z] <drez> I think it's real
[2023-03-31T19:31:00Z] <drez> Time for google to follow...
[2023-03-31T19:32:25Z] <riteo> wtf
[2023-03-31T19:32:45Z] <riteo> did they do an NVIDIA and announce something hella serious pretty much at april's fools
[2023-03-31T19:32:53Z] <drez> I think so
[2023-03-31T19:32:58Z] <drez> They must think it's very funny
[2023-03-31T19:33:02Z] <riteo> what the actual fuck
[2023-03-31T19:33:37Z] <riteo> perhaps they're hoping to offset some costs by... making people contribute to it?
[2023-03-31T19:33:50Z] <riteo> I doubt it but I have no other idea why they would want to expose their "algorithm"
[2023-03-31T19:34:09Z] <testuser[m]> https://github.com/twitter/the-algorithm/blob/140ae7f9ba7c84b6436a28860fa02959bb0ce9a5/home-mixer/server/src/main/scala/com/twitter/home_mixer/functional_component/decorator/HomeTweetTypePredicates.scala#L225
[2023-03-31T19:34:11Z] <testuser[m]> Maybe joke lol
[2023-03-31T19:34:48Z] <riteo> there are also a list of "features" which also include elon
[2023-03-31T19:34:55Z] <riteo> and political parties for some goddamn reason
[2023-03-31T19:35:13Z] <riteo> I mean, it would make sense to favour elon's posts
[2023-03-31T19:35:27Z] <riteo> but I'm seriously confused by this thing
[2023-03-31T19:35:56Z] <riteo> yeah ok that was the list
[2023-03-31T19:36:22Z] <riteo> I mean as someone pointed out it's also at the end of the list and could've thus been added very lately
[2023-03-31T19:36:28Z] <riteo> IDK this is seriously baffling me
[2023-03-31T19:36:43Z] <riteo> this looks like too much effort, either they wrote random stuff or IDK
[2023-03-31T19:36:56Z] <riteo> it's not like they have the money to put all that effort for a silly april fools
[2023-03-31T19:37:51Z] <riteo> yeah if this is serious I'm pretty confident that it's just a cost-offsetting method. They talk about contributing and hackerone bounties
[2023-03-31T19:37:58Z] <testuser[m]> Hmm
[2023-03-31T19:38:01Z] <riteo> > We hope to benefit from the collective intelligence and expertise of the global community in helping us identify issues and suggest improvements, ultimately leading to a better Twitter.
[2023-03-31T19:38:09Z] <riteo> yeah they broke af lately and are desperate
[2023-03-31T19:38:42Z] <riteo> that's my bet, they haven't the resources for such an elaborate joke IMO
[2023-03-31T19:39:10Z] <riteo> holy fuck look at the submodules READMEs https://github.com/twitter/the-algorithm/tree/main/follow-recommendations-service
[2023-03-31T19:41:32Z] <riteo> lmao however this ends up this was such an unexpected move that it's funny, it genuinely feels like a joke but seriously doesn't look like one
[2023-03-31T19:51:36Z] <sewn> cat gif
[2023-03-31T19:54:59Z] <testuser[m]> https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/RESTRICT_Act
[2023-03-31T19:55:08Z] <testuser[m]> So good
[2023-03-31T19:56:06Z] <riteo> dang it
[2023-03-31T20:17:55Z] <riteo> well, going to eat, cya next time guys
[2023-03-31T20:17:57Z] <riteo> byeeeeeeeeee!
[2023-03-31T20:23:35Z] <sewn> :wave :
[2023-03-31T20:29:18Z] <sad_plan> hi
[2023-03-31T20:30:00Z] <sewn> hello sad_lan
[2023-03-31T21:37:45Z] <midfavila> god i just want to look up temperatures for cooking salmon 
[2023-03-31T21:37:56Z] <midfavila> and now pale meme is frozen because of some jackass's JS tomfoolery
[2023-03-31T22:02:15Z] <sewn> <midfavila> "god i just want to look up..." <- shrimp>