💾 Archived View for gemini.ctrl-c.club › ~phoebos › logs › kisslinux-2021-07-13.txt captured on 2024-05-12 at 16:04:48.
⬅️ Previous capture (2021-12-17)
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[2021-07-13T00:00:00Z] <dilyn> also, I only appropriate texan lango because it's inclusive
[2021-07-13T00:00:07Z] <dilyn> so y'all folx better get with it, y'hear?
[2021-07-13T00:00:52Z] <akira01> GalaxyNova: is already mounted
[2021-07-13T00:01:40Z] <claudia> I always thought that 'y'all' was some kind of urban/hiphopish lang :D
[2021-07-13T00:10:03Z] <riteo> hiiiiii!
[2021-07-13T00:10:27Z] <riteo> I did it, now minekiss supports fabric!
[2021-07-13T00:12:45Z] <noocsharp> nice!
[2021-07-13T00:13:00Z] <kayw> minekiss? minecraft for kiss?
[2021-07-13T00:13:06Z] <riteo> sort of
[2021-07-13T00:13:14Z] <riteo> it's a minecraft launcher written in pure* posix shell
[2021-07-13T00:13:20Z] <kayw> oh nice
[2021-07-13T00:13:33Z] <akira01> lol
[2021-07-13T00:13:38Z] <riteo> still, there's no java on kiss, I'll work on it when the time comes
[2021-07-13T00:14:04Z] <riteo> I might also fiddle locally with the package format slightly to make gradle and the whole java stack fit into the "download first, build later" mindset behind kiss
[2021-07-13T00:14:14Z] <akira01> make a port of minecraft to run in shell not java lol
[2021-07-13T00:14:21Z] <riteo> lmao
[2021-07-13T00:14:31Z] <riteo> I seriously plan to make a minecraft clone as my first big c project
[2021-07-13T00:14:53Z] <riteo> but not a regular minecraft clone, one with all I wish minecraft became, expecially on the technical side
[2021-07-13T00:15:06Z] <riteo> btw I just read the note
[2021-07-13T00:15:18Z] <noocsharp> i would do something smaller tbh
[2021-07-13T00:15:33Z] <dilyn> ang: man-pages-posix is actually bundled with man-pages in repo/extra, so we should drop it
[2021-07-13T00:15:35Z] <riteo> I actually quite like the separation behind the huge community repos and the smaller repo! This should burn out dylan way less
[2021-07-13T00:15:47Z] <riteo> althought I'm relatively worried about community feedback
[2021-07-13T00:16:05Z] <dilyn> riteo: ddevault had a minecraft clone iirc
[2021-07-13T00:16:06Z] <riteo> like, staying on the IRC server really gives you an idea of what the community wants and needs
[2021-07-13T00:16:11Z] <dilyn> still on github i believe
[2021-07-13T00:16:15Z] <riteo> dilyn: oh cool
[2021-07-13T00:16:37Z] <noocsharp> it's written in c#
[2021-07-13T00:16:41Z] <dilyn> f
[2021-07-13T00:16:41Z] <riteo> oh
[2021-07-13T00:16:45Z] <riteo> so java microsoft edition
[2021-07-13T00:16:53Z] <riteo> what a bummer
[2021-07-13T00:16:58Z] <noocsharp> i mean...
[2021-07-13T00:17:10Z] <riteo> I'll do it in a later time though, and I'll surely have to learn a TON of stuff, but it'll be worth it I'm sure
[2021-07-13T00:17:14Z] <noocsharp> well i guess it is java microsoft edition
[2021-07-13T00:17:24Z] <noocsharp> but minecraft is already minecraft microsoft edition
[2021-07-13T00:17:29Z] <dilyn> minecraft has been msft edition since like... 2013 or something
[2021-07-13T00:17:40Z] <riteo> minecraft the name itself sort of
[2021-07-13T00:17:45Z] <riteo> minecraft:je is basically the same
[2021-07-13T00:17:59Z] <riteo> microsoft came to notch and like told him: hi we would like your brand
[2021-07-13T00:18:06Z] <riteo> that's the only thing they did lol
[2021-07-13T00:18:37Z] <noocsharp> until they start forcing microsoft accounts this year
[2021-07-13T00:18:55Z] <riteo> i found out it wasn't because of microsoft
[2021-07-13T00:19:06Z] <riteo> mojang just needs "safer" accounts, you know, 2fa and whatnot
[2021-07-13T00:19:18Z] <riteo> so instead of implementing it they're choosing the lazy path, still hate it though
[2021-07-13T00:19:20Z] <dilyn> claudia: i'm opting to drop them one by one in the hopes that people notice something tragic going on the next time they `kiss u` (:
[2021-07-13T00:19:32Z] <claudia> heh, y :D
[2021-07-13T00:19:59Z] <claudia> I thought in perspective of people who have to send several PRs in your way
[2021-07-13T00:20:04Z] <dilyn> also like what xeno-hypster said; maintainers have the option of swapping some packages to wayland, and I don't want to investigate that option myself lol
[2021-07-13T00:20:17Z] <dilyn> they can just say 'i will drop this' and I'll do it for them haha
[2021-07-13T00:20:31Z] <claudia> ah ok
[2021-07-13T00:20:40Z] <dilyn> but they're welcome to if they want their name on it
[2021-07-13T00:20:55Z] <dilyn> they can put a little angsty comment in the PR or a diatribe against ayyland in the commit message...
[2021-07-13T00:21:01Z] <dilyn> express yo selves
[2021-07-13T00:22:10Z] <claudia> Leaving this project full of anger.
[2021-07-13T00:22:19Z] <riteo> oh, it looks like the official repo is free from fribidi
[2021-07-13T00:22:27Z] <riteo> how will it rendere bidirectional text now?
[2021-07-13T00:22:32Z] <riteo> s/rendere/render/
[2021-07-13T00:23:01Z] <acheam> it wont
[2021-07-13T00:23:03Z] <cem> it won't?
[2021-07-13T00:23:19Z] <riteo> so it'll be, like, black squares?
[2021-07-13T00:23:23Z] <acheam> not sure
[2021-07-13T00:23:26Z] <riteo> or will it literally be invisible
[2021-07-13T00:23:29Z] <acheam> kiss targets english, its in the guidestones
[2021-07-13T00:23:43Z] <cem> it'll be black squares
[2021-07-13T00:23:44Z] <riteo> I mean, I'm not arabic or whatever, but on a webbrowser having messed up output is kinda weird
[2021-07-13T00:23:54Z] <riteo> I mean, at this point you could switch to ascii
[2021-07-13T00:23:57Z] <rio6> rotate your screen 180 degrees /jk
[2021-07-13T00:24:32Z] <acheam> xrandr to flip your screen
[2021-07-13T00:24:44Z] <riteo> lmao
[2021-07-13T00:25:03Z] <riteo> I see that kiss avoids // in paths
[2021-07-13T00:25:08Z] <riteo> I wonder both why and how
[2021-07-13T00:25:32Z] <riteo> is /folder//anotherfolder/file non standard?
[2021-07-13T00:26:57Z] <cem> They are the same to the filesystem, but they are not the same as a string to be parsed
[2021-07-13T00:26:58Z] <dilyn> wl-randr*
[2021-07-13T00:27:24Z] <acheam> no.
[2021-07-13T00:27:32Z] <dilyn> ^ multiple slashes behave strangely sometimes too
[2021-07-13T00:27:37Z] <riteo> I see
[2021-07-13T00:27:42Z] <acheam> you will use xrandr on wayland and deal with it.
[2021-07-13T00:27:52Z] <dilyn> musl ml recently (<12mo ago) had a discussion about resolving //, ///, /////...
[2021-07-13T00:28:00Z] <dilyn> you can't... use xrandr... on wayland...
[2021-07-13T00:28:02Z] <dilyn> :thinking:
[2021-07-13T00:28:15Z] <cem> Jokes on all of you neither xrandr nor wl-randr work for me
[2021-07-13T00:28:27Z] <cem> nvidia gang
[2021-07-13T00:28:35Z] <dilyn> wl-randr doesn't work on hikari (:
[2021-07-13T00:28:37Z] <riteo> damn, I'm still kinda unsure about bidirectional text. I mean, isn't it breaking a feature? After all the system supports unicode, doesn't it?
[2021-07-13T00:28:39Z] <dilyn> imagine MY surprise!
[2021-07-13T00:30:06Z] <cem> riteo: I mean, it's not that bad unless you need it
[2021-07-13T00:30:43Z] <riteo> well, thinking about it it'll be the same as not having arabic fonts I guess...
[2021-07-13T00:30:45Z] <dilyn> I think KISS targets english primarily, fully conforming to UTF be damned
[2021-07-13T00:30:55Z] <riteo> yeah I know that
[2021-07-13T00:31:21Z] <riteo> mhh, I'll have to get used to this idea
[2021-07-13T00:31:34Z] <dilyn> now imagine using only a single font
[2021-07-13T00:31:41Z] <dilyn> and that font only supports english characters...
[2021-07-13T00:32:03Z] <riteo> well I understand that translating is a mess
[2021-07-13T00:32:08Z] <riteo> but I still need accented characters
[2021-07-13T00:32:16Z] <riteo> I'm italian after all
[2021-07-13T00:32:26Z] <acheam> dilyn: what font do you use
[2021-07-13T00:33:00Z] <dilyn> cozette still
[2021-07-13T00:33:05Z] <cem> accented characters are supported by utf
[2021-07-13T00:33:23Z] <riteo> while reading the new changelog I wonder: will dylan switch to pax?
[2021-07-13T00:33:31Z] <dilyn> might move back to iosevka... wish foot supported it better
[2021-07-13T00:33:43Z] <acheam> how do you support a font better?
[2021-07-13T00:33:44Z] <dilyn> dylan wants to! I can't say I blame him
[2021-07-13T00:33:47Z] <dilyn> I'm digging it so far
[2021-07-13T00:33:49Z] <acheam> i can.
[2021-07-13T00:33:58Z] <riteo> I agree it would be a pretty nice thing
[2021-07-13T00:34:03Z] <dilyn> iosevka does ligatures foot does not support ligatures
[2021-07-13T00:34:07Z] <akira01> anyone can help me with my efivar build error?
[2021-07-13T00:34:12Z] <riteo> its portability is scary
[2021-07-13T00:34:21Z] <acheam> o
[2021-07-13T00:35:12Z] <dilyn> akira01: I'm not sure what's up with it
[2021-07-13T00:35:30Z] <cem> acheam: why don't you like pax?
[2021-07-13T00:35:56Z] <akira01> dilyn: you see my logs?
[2021-07-13T00:35:58Z] <dilyn> mmhmm
[2021-07-13T00:36:00Z] <acheam> cem: one more program to install
[2021-07-13T00:36:09Z] <acheam> for 1-2 sec speed gain
[2021-07-13T00:36:10Z] <dilyn> efivar is trying to link against libefivar.so, for a reason
[2021-07-13T00:36:12Z] <dilyn> idk why
[2021-07-13T00:36:29Z] <dilyn> acheam! dylan just saved us all 30 extra packages by switching to wayland!
[2021-07-13T00:36:34Z] <dilyn> you've got package space aplenty!
[2021-07-13T00:36:37Z] <cem> acheam: I mean, true, but it's 180K statically linked on my system
[2021-07-13T00:36:49Z] <acheam> no! I just can't install this one!
[2021-07-13T00:36:55Z] <dilyn> lol
[2021-07-13T00:36:56Z] <riteo> wooo llvm/clang will become officially supported!
[2021-07-13T00:37:01Z] <acheam> yeah thats nice
[2021-07-13T00:37:10Z] <cem> lol
[2021-07-13T00:37:23Z] <dilyn> you'll have an issue building nodejs without libatomic tho
[2021-07-13T00:37:27Z] <akira01> any idea if xwayland will be in the official repo?
[2021-07-13T00:37:30Z] <cem> dilyn: I think acheam has been spending too much time with mid lol
[2021-07-13T00:37:31Z] <dilyn> it won't
[2021-07-13T00:37:38Z] <zola> I see there is a giant purging of X packages from community repo, will they get a new home?
[2021-07-13T00:37:42Z] <dilyn> cem: it's noticeable!
[2021-07-13T00:37:46Z] <dilyn> these impressionable youths (:
[2021-07-13T00:37:58Z] <acheam> leave me be, I need to get back to my bayonet
[2021-07-13T00:38:07Z] <dilyn> efivar was recently updated here d8e18b91c6c7882f4c025c21095c6d9d116e45c2 so it's possible the new version is just... broken...
[2021-07-13T00:38:24Z] <akira01> oh sad :€
[2021-07-13T00:38:26Z] <riteo> oh what does the last part of the changelog about bearssl talk about?
[2021-07-13T00:38:44Z] <acheam> akira01: can always downgrade it temporarily
[2021-07-13T00:39:03Z] <riteo> will dylan think about implementing it or is he just talking about the fact that he considered it?
[2021-07-13T00:39:06Z] <akira01> is just dylan saying that is interesting idea using bearssl
[2021-07-13T00:39:26Z] <acheam> mcf pls port more thingz for us
[2021-07-13T00:39:41Z] <akira01> riteo: considered
[2021-07-13T00:39:44Z] <dilyn> akira01: do export MAKEFLAGS=-j1; kiss b efivar
[2021-07-13T00:39:45Z] <dilyn> should work now
[2021-07-13T00:39:49Z] <dilyn> it's just a race condition
[2021-07-13T00:39:49Z] <riteo> akira01: I see
[2021-07-13T00:39:57Z] <akira01> damn
[2021-07-13T00:40:09Z] <acheam> throw that in the build file?
[2021-07-13T00:40:14Z] <akira01> i will try dilyn
[2021-07-13T00:40:19Z] <acheam> it does make me wonder why dylan was building with -j1
[2021-07-13T00:40:22Z] <dilyn> dylan will see my comment and add it hisself soon enough :v
[2021-07-13T00:40:27Z] <acheam> ^^ DYLAN ^^
[2021-07-13T00:40:34Z] <dilyn> he probably didn't set his makeflags that one time...
[2021-07-13T00:40:42Z] <dilyn> j24 might be too much either way
[2021-07-13T00:40:53Z] <acheam> wow whenever you can show that off, eh?
[2021-07-13T00:41:00Z] <dilyn> :) :) :)
[2021-07-13T00:41:02Z] <akira01> anyone knows if dylans read all hes emails?
[2021-07-13T00:41:08Z] <cem> -j24?
[2021-07-13T00:41:10Z] <cem> what?
[2021-07-13T00:41:14Z] <dilyn> 3900x baybeeee
[2021-07-13T00:41:19Z] <akira01> i send one about the site not sure he will see
[2021-07-13T00:41:21Z] <acheam> idk, do you read all your emails, akira01?
[2021-07-13T00:41:30Z] <dilyn> akira01: he probably reads them, don't think he'll always reply tho
[2021-07-13T00:41:55Z] <cem> he used to reply to me back when he was active
[2021-07-13T00:41:59Z] <dilyn> :'(
[2021-07-13T00:42:00Z] <akira01> yeah no need reply just read and change the little bug
[2021-07-13T00:42:01Z] <dilyn> special boy
[2021-07-13T00:42:03Z] <cem> :)
[2021-07-13T00:43:34Z] <dilyn> https://github.com/kisslinux/repo/issues/277 dylan should just switch to chromium
[2021-07-13T00:43:40Z] <dilyn> wayland support is just like, two flags
[2021-07-13T00:43:44Z] <dilyn> boom bam
[2021-07-13T00:43:52Z] <cem> dilyn: s/chromium/webkit/
[2021-07-13T00:43:57Z] <dilyn> >=|
[2021-07-13T00:43:59Z] <dilyn> naughty
[2021-07-13T00:44:04Z] <cem> wayland support is just like
[2021-07-13T00:44:05Z] <cem> a flag
[2021-07-13T00:44:15Z] <dilyn> but at what cost
[2021-07-13T00:44:24Z] <cem> nothing, it's great
[2021-07-13T00:44:58Z] <dilyn> hm
[2021-07-13T00:45:02Z] <cem> at the cost of free ram?
[2021-07-13T00:45:16Z] <riteo> oh dilyn thinking about it the website should stay as a quick hub to all the community's stuff and to the main website if you plan to keep it up IMO
[2021-07-13T00:45:27Z] <riteo> there are still mirrors and links to irc and whatnot
[2021-07-13T00:45:48Z] <dilyn> i'm just worried about stepping on the official namespace :X
[2021-07-13T00:46:00Z] <riteo> mhh
[2021-07-13T00:46:17Z] <riteo> maybe slowly transition to k1ss-community.org as a domain name?
[2021-07-13T00:46:25Z] <acheam> i can provide *.armaanb.net if you /really/ dont want to step on the namespace lol
[2021-07-13T00:46:31Z] <dilyn> hyphens are bad praxis
[2021-07-13T00:46:38Z] <riteo> then without one
[2021-07-13T00:46:40Z] <dilyn> but yes that's the current plan
[2021-07-13T00:46:44Z] <riteo> I don't get why dylan chose .xyz domains though
[2021-07-13T00:46:49Z] <riteo> those are UGLY
[2021-07-13T00:46:56Z] <dilyn> I won't mind stepping on the namespace as long as dylan doesn't yell at me :v
[2021-07-13T00:47:06Z] <zola> Cheap and available most likely
[2021-07-13T00:47:10Z] <dilyn> heck riteo I'll just get kisscommunity.xyz to flex on u
[2021-07-13T00:47:20Z] <riteo> lmao it'd be consistent though
[2021-07-13T00:47:33Z] <riteo> i don't think he'll scream at you anyways, expecially if it's just an hub to the main website
[2021-07-13T00:47:37Z] <cem> dilyn: do it
[2021-07-13T00:47:37Z] <riteo> and community links I suppose
[2021-07-13T00:47:38Z] <dilyn> > 99c
[2021-07-13T00:47:39Z] <dilyn> kekw
[2021-07-13T00:47:51Z] <riteo> oh yeah xyz domains are cheap a
[2021-07-13T00:47:52Z] <riteo> af
[2021-07-13T00:48:04Z] <riteo> do you know an "important" site that uses it?
[2021-07-13T00:48:07Z] <riteo> abc.xyz
[2021-07-13T00:48:12Z] <riteo> alphabet being based for once
[2021-07-13T00:48:31Z] <cem> i was lowkey expecting luke smith joke
[2021-07-13T00:48:46Z] <riteo> no it's really their domain
[2021-07-13T00:48:57Z] <dilyn> our lovely woods screaming boomer is not a joke cem
[2021-07-13T00:49:50Z] <cem> i'm so sorry
[2021-07-13T00:57:06Z] <dilyn> oh damn my life with qt5 just became trivial
[2021-07-13T00:57:43Z] <cem> openssl?
[2021-07-13T00:57:51Z] <dilyn> mmhmm
[2021-07-13T00:59:27Z] <cem> Ah yes, I also love it when my graphics toolkit requires openssl for some reason
[2021-07-13T00:59:41Z] <dilyn> :v
[2021-07-13T00:59:56Z] <cem> :^)
[2021-07-13T00:59:58Z] <acheam> hey you use webkitgtk you dont get a say
[2021-07-13T01:00:08Z] <dilyn> somebody could bring lirishell to KISS
[2021-07-13T01:00:17Z] <dilyn> and adopt qt5* while they're at it
[2021-07-13T01:00:22Z] <acheam> lol
[2021-07-13T01:00:32Z] <dilyn> frfr
[2021-07-13T01:00:40Z] <dilyn> the sooner the number of packages in community i maintain drops to zero
[2021-07-13T01:00:43Z] <dilyn> the sooner i can kiss r git
[2021-07-13T01:00:46Z] <cem> webkit is literally the simplest browser backend compared to chromium and firefox
[2021-07-13T01:00:57Z] <acheam> which means no more github!
[2021-07-13T01:00:58Z] <acheam> woot
[2021-07-13T01:01:05Z] <riteo> dilyn: will you use your own fork of kiss for that?
[2021-07-13T01:01:10Z] <cem> and don't say crap like netsurf, I use a browser that can actually display most of the web
[2021-07-13T01:01:13Z] <acheam> cem: i mean, I use webkit too
[2021-07-13T01:01:25Z] <cem> acheam: i love you
[2021-07-13T01:01:28Z] <dilyn> lol
[2021-07-13T01:01:37Z] <dilyn> wdym riteo?
[2021-07-13T01:01:46Z] <riteo> well you said you wanted to use fossil
[2021-07-13T01:01:46Z] <dilyn> i've been doing my own KISS thing for a long-ass while (:
[2021-07-13T01:02:04Z] <dilyn> yaaaaahhhhh
[2021-07-13T01:02:05Z] <riteo> you said you wanted to avoid forking a distro now that dylan's there
[2021-07-13T01:02:23Z] <cem> dilyn: https://xkcd.com/37
[2021-07-13T01:02:25Z] <dilyn> i mean officially forking it, where I have to actually be held responsible when I push a breaking update
[2021-07-13T01:02:37Z] <riteo> oh I see
[2021-07-13T01:02:38Z] <dilyn> that's a long ass-while
[2021-07-13T01:02:40Z] <acheam> cem: it doesnt work in this case
[2021-07-13T01:02:40Z] <dilyn> wait a secon...
[2021-07-13T01:02:53Z] <riteo> I'm still kinda unsure about fossil, I kinda like it, as it basically has an integrated huge cool readme (the website part) but at the same time I feel like it does too many things as once
[2021-07-13T01:02:57Z] <dilyn> yeah! now the only one who gets mad when I break their system is me :D
[2021-07-13T01:03:00Z] <cem> acheam: yeah that's true
[2021-07-13T01:03:15Z] <acheam> thats what anyone in love with me would say
[2021-07-13T01:03:23Z] <dilyn> it does many things, that's for sure
[2021-07-13T01:03:32Z] * cem winks, I guess?
[2021-07-13T01:03:35Z] <acheam> someone call the UNIX police
[2021-07-13T01:03:41Z] <riteo> lmao
[2021-07-13T01:04:14Z] <cem> o shit
[2021-07-13T01:04:50Z] <acheam> I called them on dilyn, but now that there here, might as well arrest cem too
[2021-07-13T01:05:17Z] <dilyn> commit to the wink
[2021-07-13T01:05:21Z] <dilyn> wink with both eyes
[2021-07-13T01:05:34Z] * cem gouges own eyes
[2021-07-13T01:05:47Z] <cem> I didn't do it, officer
[2021-07-13T01:05:52Z] <cem> I don't even have eyes
[2021-07-13T01:06:07Z] <acheam> dilyn: literally lol
[2021-07-13T01:07:00Z] <cem> Well, UNIX police can't arrest both dilyn and me
[2021-07-13T01:07:25Z] <cem> But I'm sure they can arrest dilyn really well
[2021-07-13T01:08:22Z] <riteo> wow you're right
[2021-07-13T01:08:27Z] <riteo> they have to do one thing and do it well
[2021-07-13T01:08:51Z] <riteo> oh you already said it lol
[2021-07-13T01:09:17Z] <dilyn> f
[2021-07-13T01:09:22Z] <riteo> well, now that fabric works it's time to put the most important feature in minekiss
[2021-07-13T01:09:28Z] <cem> lmao
[2021-07-13T01:09:30Z] <riteo> KISS style compatibility
[2021-07-13T01:09:41Z] <riteo> minekiss' style is inspired by kiss, but not *identical*
[2021-07-13T01:09:48Z] <riteo> how should I name the variable?
[2021-07-13T01:10:18Z] <riteo> KISS_STYLE?
[2021-07-13T01:12:43Z] <cem> to add a layer to my dumb joke, they can't catch me because I'm middle-eastern and fribidi is dropped
[2021-07-13T01:12:52Z] <riteo> lmao
[2021-07-13T01:13:06Z] <riteo> does anyone know if there's a way to know if the current shell is interactive?
[2021-07-13T01:13:39Z] <cem> Uhm, not in POSIX
[2021-07-13T01:14:40Z] <riteo> I see
[2021-07-13T01:14:58Z] <riteo> wait, how does kiss then work fine with less?
[2021-07-13T01:16:29Z] <cem> You can check whether the output is a terminal
[2021-07-13T01:16:39Z] <riteo> that'll do the job
[2021-07-13T01:16:47Z] <cem> [ -t 1 ]
[2021-07-13T01:17:04Z] <riteo> thanks!
[2021-07-13T01:17:17Z] <cem> You're welcome
[2021-07-13T01:22:16Z] <akira01> gosh dylan removed the eiwd article part saying about add a network
[2021-07-13T01:25:51Z] <riteo> yes, I did it
[2021-07-13T01:25:58Z] <riteo> now minekiss has the most important feature of them all
[2021-07-13T01:26:04Z] <riteo> accurate kiss style compatibility
[2021-07-13T01:26:34Z] <riteo> now it should look identical to kiss
[2021-07-13T01:33:37Z] <akira01> guys is mdev required in sway?
[2021-07-13T01:43:30Z] <acheam> idk if its required but your probably going to want a device manager
[2021-07-13T01:43:35Z] <acheam> s/your/you're/g
[2021-07-13T01:46:49Z] <dilyn> you don't need a running device manager service for wayfire, i would assume this extends to sway
[2021-07-13T01:52:52Z] <akira01> i still divided
[2021-07-13T01:53:03Z] <akira01> sway or sway-tiny?
[2021-07-13T01:54:25Z] <akira01> not know what is the gains and the costs
[2021-07-13T01:56:04Z] <acheam> do you want a bar?
[2021-07-13T01:56:08Z] <acheam> if not, sway-tiny
[2021-07-13T01:56:11Z] <acheam> if yes, sway
[2021-07-13T01:57:39Z] <akira01> the bar is this useful?
[2021-07-13T01:58:03Z] <acheam> not really
[2021-07-13T01:58:17Z] <acheam> I only use a bar on tag-based window managers like DWM
[2021-07-13T01:58:26Z] <acheam> because they are impossible to keep track of without one
[2021-07-13T01:58:36Z] <acheam> but on a workspace-based compositor like sway you can do without it
[2021-07-13T01:58:46Z] <acheam> see https://armaanb.net/no-bar.html
[2021-07-13T01:59:53Z] <acheam> wow lots of people running IRC as root today
[2021-07-13T02:01:28Z] <akira01> I will test sway
[2021-07-13T02:01:48Z] <akira01> Probably run tiny in few weeks
[2021-07-13T02:12:51Z] <zola> acheam: People running as irc as root aren't really in any more danger than everybody else who just runs irc as their default user
[2021-07-13T02:14:16Z] <zola> If irc client can be exploited to get code execution, then that code will execute with the privileges of the default user
[2021-07-13T02:15:35Z] <zola> And as such be able to access (and destroy) everything that is really important to the person, as everything will be kept in the default user home dir
[2021-07-13T02:20:01Z] <rio6> that's why you run your irc client on a raspberry pi :)
[2021-07-13T02:22:19Z] <zola> That is insecure, that pi will most likely be on your network and all those master hackers could come get you easily
[2021-07-13T02:23:03Z] <zola> You need to get a server on the other side of the planet, and ssh into it
[2021-07-13T02:33:19Z] <acheam> zola: that only applies to single user systems
[2021-07-13T02:35:43Z] <acheam> i was mostly joking too
[2021-07-13T02:35:52Z] <acheam> i run lots of things I shouldn't as root
[2021-07-13T02:37:38Z] <dilyn> ssh into a wireguard machine which exclusively connects to your irc client through a vpn
[2021-07-13T02:38:00Z] <rio6> <You need to get a server on the other side of the planet> that's what I do, but it's for the uptime not for security :P
[2021-07-13T02:45:58Z] <acheam> dilyn: maybe I'm just blind, but what's the difference in the case statements in your pre-build hook
[2021-07-13T02:47:25Z] <dilyn> the difference is the first set are very important/things that buid other things
[2021-07-13T02:47:32Z] <dilyn> the second set are things that sit on top of those/extras
[2021-07-13T02:47:46Z] <dilyn> it's a sorting thing rather than a meaning thing
[2021-07-13T02:48:12Z] <acheam> oh
[2021-07-13T02:48:44Z] <acheam> the python people who drilled DRY into my brain are shouting at you right now
[2021-07-13T02:48:55Z] <dilyn> DRY?
[2021-07-13T02:49:02Z] <acheam> dont repeat yourself
[2021-07-13T02:49:08Z] <dilyn> lol
[2021-07-13T02:49:31Z] <acheam> there's an analogous one for most or damp or wet or something I forget it though
[2021-07-13T02:49:35Z] <dilyn> technically I could just put all these in the build files themselves
[2021-07-13T02:49:45Z] <dilyn> considering I maintain every package I use...
[2021-07-13T02:49:47Z] <dilyn> BuT
[2021-07-13T02:49:48Z] <dilyn> nah
[2021-07-13T02:49:55Z] <acheam> yeah thats a dilemma I faced recently too when I was revamping my kiss hook
[2021-07-13T02:54:49Z] <dilyn> I should be better about my hooks
[2021-07-13T02:54:58Z] <dilyn> just delete all of /usr/share frfr
[2021-07-13T02:56:22Z] <rio6> I should probably move my configure-related change to hooks so I don't need to fork things like vim just to get python and clipboard to work
[2021-07-13T02:57:08Z] <akira01> sway-tiny get failed to build
[2021-07-13T02:57:30Z] <akira01> Is a good day to install kiss
[2021-07-13T02:57:53Z] <GalaxyNova> lol
[2021-07-13T02:58:06Z] <GalaxyNova> akira01 sauce the kiss log
[2021-07-13T02:58:15Z] <akira01> one sec
[2021-07-13T03:00:56Z] <akira01> termbin.com/e4hq
[2021-07-13T03:03:10Z] <Guest2884> quit
[2021-07-13T03:04:10Z] <GalaxyNova> akira01: kiss b cmake
[2021-07-13T03:04:20Z] <akira01> Think in this
[2021-07-13T03:04:20Z] <GalaxyNova> or kiss b pango
[2021-07-13T03:05:07Z] <akira01> pango cannot set
[2021-07-13T03:05:29Z] <akira01> because dylans said that pango is not in sway-tiny
[2021-07-13T03:05:40Z] <akira01> i will try
[2021-07-13T03:05:44Z] <akira01> cmake
[2021-07-13T03:07:29Z] <akira01> if works this is a missing dependencie from sway-tiny
[2021-07-13T03:10:12Z] <GalaxyNova> acheam: Good news! wayland fixed the annoying nouveau tty bug
[2021-07-13T03:16:09Z] <acheam> nice
[2021-07-13T03:19:00Z] <akira01> cmake not work
[2021-07-13T03:19:11Z] <akira01> sway-tiny is not so tiny
[2021-07-13T03:20:44Z] <acheam> akira01: it would be very helpful if you accompanied your issues with logs and at least a somewhat detailed description so that we have a chance at helping you
[2021-07-13T03:20:56Z] <akira01> i send a log
[2021-07-13T03:21:18Z] <akira01> is up in chat
[2021-07-13T03:21:25Z] <akira01> i will send to dylan
[2021-07-13T03:21:31Z] <akira01> is a fresh install of kiss
[2021-07-13T03:32:17Z] <dilyn> sway-tiny definitely depends on pango
[2021-07-13T03:33:32Z] <dilyn> which is basically what that error tells you
[2021-07-13T03:33:58Z] <dilyn> repo/wayland/sway also has a dependency on pango, but sway-no-seat and sway-tiny don't, which looks like a mistake
[2021-07-13T03:44:10Z] <testuser[m]> Hi
[2021-07-13T03:49:07Z] <testuser[m]> claudia: webkit needed libglvnd for GL stuff right ? To use the WPE renderer
[2021-07-13T03:51:44Z] <acheam> hi testuser[m]
[2021-07-13T03:52:51Z] <akira01> well mistake or not
[2021-07-13T03:53:15Z] <akira01> i will send dylan something about it
[2021-07-13T03:53:26Z] <testuser[m]> Wat
[2021-07-13T03:53:45Z] <akira01> sway-tiny error
[2021-07-13T03:53:50Z] <akira01> missing pango
[2021-07-13T03:54:06Z] <akira01> build failed because of it
[2021-07-13T03:54:44Z] <acheam> ^^^ DYLAN ^^^
[2021-07-13T03:54:49Z] <akira01> and he said in last post that sway-tiny had no depends on pango
[2021-07-13T03:56:10Z] <noocsharp> hmm, ownership in rust is a really cool idea
[2021-07-13T03:58:06Z] <acheam> I dont really get it from my quick web searching
[2021-07-13T03:58:16Z] <acheam> there are no pointers?
[2021-07-13T03:58:29Z] <testuser[m]> Ddg borrow checker
[2021-07-13T03:58:34Z] <testuser[m]> Idk if they're talking about that
[2021-07-13T03:59:55Z] <kyxor> so sad to see packages dropped :(
[2021-07-13T03:59:58Z] <noocsharp> basically things that you allocate on the heap act like something stack allocated, in that they disappear when they go out of scope
[2021-07-13T04:00:18Z] <acheam> so it automatically frees variables for you?
[2021-07-13T04:00:31Z] <acheam> that doesnt seem so revolutionary
[2021-07-13T04:00:37Z] <noocsharp> yes, but with extra flexibility
[2021-07-13T04:00:40Z] <rio6> my experience is more like if I forget to free the compiler won't event compile
[2021-07-13T04:01:05Z] <noocsharp> like a scope can have a variable, and then it can pass off ownership to another scope
[2021-07-13T04:01:20Z] <rio6> free using destructor (I forgot what rust calls it) I mean
[2021-07-13T04:01:21Z] <dilyn> https://github.com/DCVIII/sway/commit/6379c0eded568b551b2a95578ed9de4a5772516c#diff-30d8f6be6320feeacf686be94f48c70869b52630e01ea625f0f15adc0d57c3e4R44 it looks like dylan might've just forgotten a line...
[2021-07-13T04:01:33Z] <acheam> lol the links website doesnt even load right in links
[2021-07-13T04:01:58Z] <acheam> i mean, it loads, the layout is just weir
[2021-07-13T04:01:58Z] <acheam> d
[2021-07-13T04:05:39Z] <testuser[m]> Bruh
[2021-07-13T04:06:06Z] <noocsharp> i agree completely
[2021-07-13T04:08:38Z] <acheam> hmm im having trouble with bits/alltypes.h provided by musl and clang
[2021-07-13T04:08:46Z] <acheam> error: cannot combine with previous 'int' declaration specifier typedef int pid_t;
[2021-07-13T04:08:59Z] <acheam> i've had this problem before I think, so its not just this project
[2021-07-13T04:09:22Z] <testuser[m]> What are you building
[2021-07-13T04:09:27Z] <acheam> graphical links
[2021-07-13T04:09:31Z] <acheam> and syslinux earlier
[2021-07-13T04:09:51Z] <acheam> but i dont think its project-dependent
[2021-07-13T04:10:29Z] <testuser[m]> Are the headers conflicting ? Which one is being included?
[2021-07-13T04:11:49Z] <acheam> oh I think I found the issue, it is project dependent
[2021-07-13T04:11:54Z] <acheam> rebuilding to verify
[2021-07-13T04:12:09Z] <acheam> Many projects do
[2021-07-13T04:12:09Z] <acheam> #define pid_t int
[2021-07-13T04:12:23Z] <acheam> which doesn't work with the way that musl typedefs pid_t
[2021-07-13T04:12:57Z] <acheam> yep thats it
[2021-07-13T04:24:59Z] <dilyn> sway is so greedy
[2021-07-13T04:25:04Z] <dilyn> i can launch a hikari window inside of a hikari session
[2021-07-13T04:25:11Z] <dilyn> but I can't launch a sway window inside a wayfire session?
[2021-07-13T04:25:13Z] <dilyn> what is this madness
[2021-07-13T04:29:03Z] <riteo> bruh
[2021-07-13T04:34:48Z] <noocsharp> that's weird, any idea why?
[2021-07-13T04:46:03Z] <dilyn> could be many things
[2021-07-13T04:46:06Z] <dilyn> I'm probably just dumb
[2021-07-13T04:51:59Z] <testuser[m]> dilyn: can we submit 1 pr with multiple commits for stuff like renaming libressl to openssl, or dropping multiple xorg packages
[2021-07-13T04:52:04Z] <testuser[m]> then it can be rebase merged
[2021-07-13T04:59:34Z] <humaid_02> Hello
[2021-07-13T05:00:00Z] <testuser[m]> hi
[2021-07-13T05:00:15Z] <humaid_02> How are you test?
[2021-07-13T05:00:20Z] <acheam> hallo
[2021-07-13T05:00:34Z] <humaid_02> Hey acheam
[2021-07-13T05:01:03Z] <testuser[m]> nice
[2021-07-13T05:01:34Z] <humaid_02> So I switched to Wayland but vt0 permissions are an issue
[2021-07-13T05:01:48Z] <testuser[m]> groups ?
[2021-07-13T05:02:18Z] <humaid_02> Video audio
[2021-07-13T05:03:03Z] <humaid_02> just a sec
[2021-07-13T05:04:13Z] <humaid_02> Why does sway start on tty0 ?
[2021-07-13T05:04:29Z] <humaid_02> Not on current tty
[2021-07-13T05:07:12Z] <testuser[m]> add to input
[2021-07-13T05:07:16Z] <testuser[m]> group
[2021-07-13T05:07:20Z] <humaid_02> On it
[2021-07-13T05:07:38Z] <testuser[m]> if it still doesnt work after relogin send sway --debug > log 2>&1
[2021-07-13T05:12:36Z] <humaid_02> testuser, https://termbin.com/jyi5
[2021-07-13T05:14:07Z] <testuser[m]> ln -s /etc/sv/seatd /var/service
[2021-07-13T05:18:45Z] <humaid_02> I'm on sway-tiny
[2021-07-13T05:19:04Z] <humaid_02> no /etc/sv/seatd
[2021-07-13T05:19:44Z] <humaid_02> I did ssu getty 38400 tty0
[2021-07-13T05:21:04Z] <humaid_02> Changed XDG_RUNTIME_DIR to /tmp/$(id)
[2021-07-13T05:22:42Z] <humaid_02> sway opens now
[2021-07-13T05:23:21Z] <humaid_02> s/id/id -u
[2021-07-13T05:25:11Z] <testuser[m]> jedavies webkit 2.32.2 works fine, did you build the dev version by mistake ?
[2021-07-13T05:48:35Z] <humaid_02> testuser, do you use wayland?
[2021-07-13T05:49:50Z] <testuser[m]> Yeah
[2021-07-13T05:49:58Z] <testuser[m]> Why
[2021-07-13T05:50:08Z] <humaid_02> What browser do you have?
[2021-07-13T05:50:54Z] <kyxor> probably every one of them :) he is test user
[2021-07-13T05:50:54Z] <humaid_02> Nix chromium and firefox cant open X displays
[2021-07-13T05:52:18Z] <humaid_02> It'll be convenient to have a binary browser that works on Wayland.
[2021-07-13T05:52:35Z] <humaid_02> kyxor haha
[2021-07-13T05:53:13Z] <testuser[m]> i use chromium but tried ff webshit everything works
[2021-07-13T05:53:19Z] <testuser[m]> Nix won't work, you'll need xwayland
[2021-07-13T05:53:32Z] <testuser[m]> I just built a webkit binary i can send that
[2021-07-13T05:54:18Z] <humaid_02> does chromium have Wayland support?
[2021-07-13T05:54:27Z] <testuser[m]> Yeah through ozone
[2021-07-13T05:54:46Z] <humaid_02> Good
[2021-07-13T05:54:50Z] <kyxor> 300 MB executable though
[2021-07-13T05:55:08Z] <kyxor> Is that like what? about 50 million lines of C++?
[2021-07-13T05:55:22Z] <testuser[m]> Lemme check
[2021-07-13T05:55:31Z] <testuser[m]> It will probably take hours to finish the computation
[2021-07-13T05:56:10Z] <kyxor> Imagine it not having wayland support though.. but having all that
[2021-07-13T05:56:24Z] <kyxor> would of been strange
[2021-07-13T05:57:01Z] <schillingklaus> another reason to avoid wayland
[2021-07-13T05:57:30Z] <testuser[m]> Bruh
[2021-07-13T05:58:47Z] <humaid_02> I'm trying to build labwc
[2021-07-13T05:59:01Z] <humaid_02> Tiling is very new to me
[2021-07-13T05:59:54Z] <testuser[m]> 10011013 lines of c++ excluding third_party kyxor
[2021-07-13T06:00:01Z] <testuser[m]> Wtf
[2021-07-13T06:01:23Z] <schillingklaus> what is that large? labwc?
[2021-07-13T06:01:31Z] <kyxor> chrome...
[2021-07-13T06:01:57Z] <testuser[m]> 10 million lines, still 1/5 of what you said
[2021-07-13T06:02:01Z] <testuser[m]> lol
[2021-07-13T06:02:30Z] <schillingklaus> 4GB ram are largely insufficient to build that beast, I guess
[2021-07-13T06:02:34Z] <testuser[m]> How do they even maintain this thing
[2021-07-13T06:02:52Z] <kyxor> yeah, I never bothered to count. just assumed based on elf exe size
[2021-07-13T06:03:29Z] <schillingklaus> google has lots of paid manpower. no community project could do that
[2021-07-13T06:04:50Z] <kyxor> well thirdparty may be like another 5+ mil, maybe
[2021-07-13T06:05:09Z] <testuser[m]> Third party is 5-6gb out of 8gb source
[2021-07-13T06:05:11Z] <testuser[m]> So a lot more
[2021-07-13T06:06:55Z] <schillingklaus> does it even build and run with musl, or is a glibc chroot required?
[2021-07-13T06:07:21Z] <testuser[m]> It builds with a ton of patches
[2021-07-13T06:07:42Z] <kyxor> yeah it runs fine with x11 package on musl, the one testuser maintains is still on repo community
[2021-07-13T06:07:55Z] <testuser[m]> Including ungoogled patches its patched 130+ times
[2021-07-13T06:09:37Z] <humaid_02> https://termbin.com/5ru0
[2021-07-13T06:09:51Z] <humaid_02> Do you guys have any idea
[2021-07-13T06:10:10Z] <kyxor> run seatd & ?
[2021-07-13T06:11:11Z] <humaid_02> Could not bind socket : Permission denied
[2021-07-13T06:11:18Z] <msk[m]> I had the same error 30 mins ago, running seatd didn't fix it
[2021-07-13T06:11:33Z] <testuser[m]> Run it as root
[2021-07-13T06:11:56Z] <msk[m]> su -c "seatd &"
[2021-07-13T06:14:40Z] <kyxor> I wonder if someone will make a proper patch to make wayland run as root, cause last time I tried it was freaking out
[2021-07-13T06:15:22Z] <kyxor> Or maybe that's only specific to sway
[2021-07-13T06:18:25Z] <testuser[m]> Sway can run as suid and drop perms
[2021-07-13T06:18:27Z] <msk[m]> humaid_02 did it work for you?
[2021-07-13T06:18:55Z] <humaid_01> mks https://termbin.com/l8x1
[2021-07-13T06:19:01Z] <humaid_01> top
[2021-07-13T06:19:07Z] <humaid_01> srry
[2021-07-13T06:20:10Z] <testuser[m]> Means Seatd isn't running
[2021-07-13T06:20:15Z] <testuser[m]> Don't you have the /etc/sv service?
[2021-07-13T06:20:49Z] <humaid_02> It's running testuser
[2021-07-13T06:21:27Z] <testuser[m]> Then /run/seatd.sock should exist
[2021-07-13T06:21:45Z] <humaid_02> no I don't have /etc/seatd
[2021-07-13T06:21:47Z] <testuser[m]> export LIBSEAT_BACKEND=seatd
[2021-07-13T06:21:47Z] <testuser[m]> exec seatd -g video
[2021-07-13T06:21:54Z] <msk[m]> ls /etc/sv | grep seatd
[2021-07-13T06:22:05Z] <msk[m]> Oh
[2021-07-13T06:22:29Z] <humaid_02> No /etc/sv/seatd
[2021-07-13T06:24:01Z] <humaid_02> testuser, could not bind socket: Address in use
[2021-07-13T06:24:35Z] <humaid_02> Could not create server socket: Adress in use
[2021-07-13T06:24:48Z] <kyxor> use lsof to see what is holding it
[2021-07-13T06:25:44Z] <humaid_02> lsof seatd?
[2021-07-13T06:26:00Z] <humaid_02> nvm
[2021-07-13T06:26:44Z] <humaid_02> no seatd
[2021-07-13T06:27:17Z] <humaid_02> Just busybox ttys and kirc
[2021-07-13T06:28:00Z] <msk[m]> does killall seatd get rid of the address in use error
[2021-07-13T06:28:07Z] <humaid_02> I wonder if this is what dylin means by strange issues
[2021-07-13T06:28:22Z] <msk[m]> Not that it would help
[2021-07-13T06:28:47Z] <humaid_02> It changed after killall
[2021-07-13T06:28:58Z] <humaid_02> Permission denied
[2021-07-13T06:29:11Z] <msk[m]> Yeah run it as root again
[2021-07-13T06:29:40Z] <msk[m]> Are you using intel
[2021-07-13T06:29:54Z] <humaid_02> It worked
[2021-07-13T06:30:11Z] <msk[m]> Everything works?
[2021-07-13T06:30:26Z] <msk[m]> Wayland launched?
[2021-07-13T06:30:47Z] <humaid_02> su -c 'exec seatd -g video'
[2021-07-13T06:30:51Z] <humaid_02> Did it
[2021-07-13T06:30:59Z] <humaid_02> Yes msk
[2021-07-13T06:31:09Z] <humaid_02> Thanks testuser, msk
[2021-07-13T06:31:14Z] <msk[m]> OK I need to write that down
[2021-07-13T06:31:22Z] <msk[m]> I never tried -g video
[2021-07-13T06:32:20Z] <msk[m]> Did you export LIBSEAT_BACKEND humaid_02
[2021-07-13T06:32:29Z] <humaid_01> yes msk
[2021-07-13T06:32:39Z] <msk[m]> Okay so I need to do both
[2021-07-13T06:32:49Z] <msk[m]> Thanks
[2021-07-13T06:33:06Z] <humaid_01> and then su -c 'exec seatd -g video'
[2021-07-13T06:33:13Z] <schillingklaus> does that mean that seatd runs with the group id of video?
[2021-07-13T06:33:23Z] <humaid_01> i think so
[2021-07-13T06:33:27Z] <msk[m]> > <@testuser:testuser-synapse.duckdns.org> export LIBSEAT_BACKEND=seatd
[2021-07-13T06:33:27Z] <msk[m]> >
[2021-07-13T06:33:27Z] <msk[m]> > exec seatd -g video
[2021-07-13T06:33:27Z] <msk[m]> How did you know to run this
[2021-07-13T06:34:09Z] <humaid_01> testuser told me to.
[2021-07-13T06:34:45Z] <msk[m]> I'm asking testuser, maybe matrix replies don't go through irc properly
[2021-07-13T06:34:57Z] <humaid_02> Ok
[2021-07-13T06:36:18Z] <testuser[m]> Hmm dylan hasn't included a runit service for seatd for some reason
[2021-07-13T06:36:39Z] <testuser[m]> I had a sv file stolen from himmalerin/kiss-wayland msk
[2021-07-13T06:37:00Z] <GalaxyNova> for some reason the suggested environment variables for sway didn't work for me :/
[2021-07-13T06:37:31Z] <GalaxyNova> i set XDG_RUNTIME_DIR to /tmp instead of what was suggested to get it to work
[2021-07-13T06:38:07Z] <kyxor> so this did not work? XDG_RUNTIME_DIR=/run/user/$(id -u)
[2021-07-13T06:38:11Z] <GalaxyNova> nope
[2021-07-13T06:38:20Z] <GalaxyNova> sway refused to open with that
[2021-07-13T06:38:39Z] <kyxor> interesting, i'll keep that in mind for next time I try it
[2021-07-13T06:38:49Z] <msk[m]> Did you create the directory as well
[2021-07-13T06:38:49Z] <schillingklaus> in dylan's time, there was no need for seatd
[2021-07-13T06:39:43Z] <GalaxyNova> msk[m]: the environment variable uses command substitution through? I don't really understand what you mean.
[2021-07-13T06:39:46Z] <humaid_01> GalaxyNova me too XDG_RINTIME_DIR didn't work for me
[2021-07-13T06:39:57Z] <GalaxyNova> schillingklaus: What even is seatd
[2021-07-13T06:40:28Z] <GalaxyNova> humaid_01: try setting it to /tmp
[2021-07-13T06:40:28Z] <schillingklaus> seatd is a partial replacement for logind
[2021-07-13T06:40:34Z] <GalaxyNova> ew
[2021-07-13T06:40:41Z] <msk[m]> I thought the wiki said to mkdir $XDG_RUNTIME_DIR after setting it
[2021-07-13T06:40:46Z] <GalaxyNova> good thing im using sway-no-seat then
[2021-07-13T06:40:49Z] <msk[m]> Or something
[2021-07-13T06:41:02Z] <schillingklaus> together with consolekit, I think
[2021-07-13T06:41:19Z] <humaid_01> GalaxyNova: that's what I did. (/tmp)
[2021-07-13T06:42:17Z] <schillingklaus> so it is more modular than elogind
[2021-07-13T06:42:18Z] <msk[m]> You can't have a statusbar without seatd, right?
[2021-07-13T06:42:30Z] <GalaxyNova> you can
[2021-07-13T06:42:46Z] <GalaxyNova> im running no-seat and I still have swaybar
[2021-07-13T06:43:15Z] <msk[m]> What's the functional difference, then
[2021-07-13T06:43:20Z] <GalaxyNova> also for some reason I still have the old kiss-community kiss-help pages instead of the updated ones
[2021-07-13T06:45:13Z] <GalaxyNova> msk[m]: It's a replacement for logind so it's probably something to do with login management
[2021-07-13T06:46:25Z] <msk[m]> But why would that be necessary for the graphical server
[2021-07-13T06:46:41Z] <msk[m]> There's already that tty login prompt
[2021-07-13T06:46:54Z] <kyxor> because its "modern"
[2021-07-13T06:47:35Z] <msk[m]> Lol what
[2021-07-13T06:47:52Z] <GalaxyNova> ah yes "modern". An adjective to describe things that solve problems that never existed.
[2021-07-13T06:48:17Z] <humaid_01> kyxor: haha
[2021-07-13T06:48:43Z] <schillingklaus> seatd origined in some BSD, as elogind can't work there
[2021-07-13T06:49:34Z] <humaid_01> Is it supposed to be more secure?
[2021-07-13T06:49:39Z] <GalaxyNova> Seriously though wayland so far has exceeded my expectations.
[2021-07-13T06:49:49Z] <GalaxyNova> it's actually LESS buggy than xorg
[2021-07-13T06:50:30Z] <msk[m]> Your browser worked without errors?
[2021-07-13T06:50:36Z] <GalaxyNova> yes
[2021-07-13T06:50:42Z] <GalaxyNova> > firefox
[2021-07-13T06:50:58Z] <GalaxyNova> and it refused to launch on Xorg
[2021-07-13T06:51:06Z] <GalaxyNova> smh
[2021-07-13T06:51:22Z] <msk[m]> Yeah that happened to me after updating
[2021-07-13T06:52:11Z] <msk[m]> Wayland better work tomorrow
[2021-07-13T06:52:23Z] <GalaxyNova> lol
[2021-07-13T06:52:26Z] <GalaxyNova> are you using nvidia
[2021-07-13T06:52:57Z] <msk[m]> Nope, it's just an old HP laptop
[2021-07-13T06:53:40Z] <msk[m]> I had to install xf86-intel or whatever for xorg
[2021-07-13T06:54:03Z] <msk[m]> Hopefully that will work out of the box on Wayland
[2021-07-13T06:55:05Z] <humaid_02> What compositors you guys use?
[2021-07-13T06:55:37Z] <msk[m]> I'm planning on dwl
[2021-07-13T06:55:54Z] <schillingklaus> ooooops wrong channel
[2021-07-13T06:56:10Z] <schillingklaus> seatd allows for muliple users working on the same display, each with a different mouse pointer
[2021-07-13T06:56:31Z] <GalaxyNova> humaid_02: sway-no-seat
[2021-07-13T06:56:38Z] <GalaxyNova> might try dwl
[2021-07-13T06:56:46Z] <GalaxyNova> the thing keeping me away from dwl atm is the lack of patches
[2021-07-13T06:56:46Z] <msk[m]> when would you ever need that
[2021-07-13T06:56:58Z] <kyxor> peer programming dream come true? XD
[2021-07-13T06:57:02Z] <humaid_02> labwc is nice
[2021-07-13T06:57:26Z] * GalaxyNova joined the wayland session.
[2021-07-13T06:57:34Z] <msk[m]> GalaxyNova: which ones are missing that you need?
[2021-07-13T06:58:47Z] <GalaxyNova> in my old dwm config i had like 10 layouts
[2021-07-13T06:59:00Z] <GalaxyNova> and each one patched to work with the gaps
[2021-07-13T07:00:07Z] <GalaxyNova> not to mention my status script which I'm sure would break with wayland...
[2021-07-13T07:02:32Z] <msk[m]> They won't have some sort of xsetroot alternative?
[2021-07-13T07:02:35Z] <GalaxyNova> mask[m]: and it's still based on wlroots, which from my understanding means that it won't be much ligher
[2021-07-13T07:02:45Z] <GalaxyNova> than sway
[2021-07-13T07:03:17Z] <msk[m]> And wlroots requires seatd, right?
[2021-07-13T07:04:21Z] <GalaxyNova> msk[m]: i believe so
[2021-07-13T07:04:32Z] <GalaxyNova> and there's no patch for removing it like there is for sway
[2021-07-13T07:04:59Z] <msk[m]> I wonder if that can be patched out
[2021-07-13T07:05:15Z] <humaid_02> So in Wayland there can't be 300 sloc compositors?
[2021-07-13T07:05:17Z] <testuser[m]> It's just a -Dlibseat option i think
[2021-07-13T07:05:25Z] <testuser[m]> humaid_02: with wlroots, they can i think
[2021-07-13T07:06:01Z] <msk[m]> Sorry messages didn't load
[2021-07-13T07:06:02Z] <humaid_02> So wlroots is kind of xcb, right?
[2021-07-13T07:06:05Z] <schillingklaus> there's also libswc (simple wayland client), used by oasis
[2021-07-13T07:06:23Z] <GalaxyNova> so wlroots does the heavy work that Xorg would have done right?
[2021-07-13T07:06:44Z] <GalaxyNova> I wonder if something of the likes of sowm is possible in wayland
[2021-07-13T07:06:49Z] <schillingklaus> oops simple wayland compositor
[2021-07-13T07:07:09Z] <humaid_02> GalaxyNova: I was wondering the same.
[2021-07-13T07:07:42Z] <GalaxyNova> hmm
[2021-07-13T07:07:47Z] <humaid_02> klaus: nice.
[2021-07-13T07:07:56Z] <GalaxyNova> One of the main selling points of wayland for me was that it's "just a protocol"
[2021-07-13T07:08:04Z] <schillingklaus> isn't wayfire the substiturte for sowm?
[2021-07-13T07:08:05Z] <GalaxyNova> but so far I've only seen compositors that use wlroots
[2021-07-13T07:08:19Z] <testuser[m]> Yeah its way too much work to do all that stuff yourself
[2021-07-13T07:08:34Z] <testuser[m]> There's some taiwins thingy
[2021-07-13T07:08:35Z] <testuser[m]> Wait
[2021-07-13T07:08:38Z] <GalaxyNova> schillingklaus: Doesn't wayfire have tons of uneeded visual effects
[2021-07-13T07:08:52Z] <GalaxyNova> it's basically compiz but for wayland
[2021-07-13T07:09:05Z] <schillingklaus> I do not know, but dilyn seems to favour wayfire for whatever reason
[2021-07-13T07:09:08Z] <testuser[m]> https://github.com/taiwins
[2021-07-13T07:10:42Z] <GalaxyNova> is there some wayland backend targeted towards embeded devices?
[2021-07-13T07:10:44Z] <humaid_02> Do wlroots and taiwins compare to xorg-server?
[2021-07-13T07:10:49Z] <GalaxyNova> that would probably be more lightweight
[2021-07-13T07:11:17Z] <GalaxyNova> humaids_02: from my understanding yes
[2021-07-13T07:11:28Z] <testuser[m]> https://taiwins.org/
[2021-07-13T07:11:28Z] <testuser[m]> > . Writing a minimum wayland client using twidgets would take only 20 lines of code.
[2021-07-13T07:11:37Z] <GalaxyNova> ooh
[2021-07-13T07:11:39Z] <GalaxyNova> interesting
[2021-07-13T07:12:13Z] <humaid_02> I hope I can see something like sowm soon.
[2021-07-13T07:12:24Z] <humaid_02> On wayland
[2021-07-13T07:12:24Z] <GalaxyNova> > Taiwins is a modern and modular wayland compositor, and it is extensible through lua script.
[2021-07-13T07:12:28Z] <testuser[m]> You can make it :)
[2021-07-13T07:12:29Z] <GalaxyNova> lost me in the first sentence
[2021-07-13T07:12:39Z] <GalaxyNova> why lua
[2021-07-13T07:13:02Z] <GalaxyNova> it also has a built in shell
[2021-07-13T07:13:04Z] <GalaxyNova> wtf
[2021-07-13T07:13:06Z] <msk[m]> Later it says dbus support
[2021-07-13T07:13:23Z] <humaid_02> testuser: thanks for encouragement. :)
[2021-07-13T07:13:56Z] <testuser[m]> I don't think that shell is THE shell
[2021-07-13T07:14:05Z] <GalaxyNova> ye boys lets implement wlroots in 2000 LOC then make a compositor in 300 LOC lets gooooooo
[2021-07-13T07:14:24Z] <GalaxyNova> testuser[m]: What is it then
[2021-07-13T07:15:05Z] <humaid_02> Gnome shell.
[2021-07-13T07:15:20Z] <humaid_02> Reminds me of ..
[2021-07-13T07:15:46Z] <testuser[m]> https://wayland-book.com/xdg-shell-basics.html
[2021-07-13T07:15:48Z] <testuser[m]> I think this
[2021-07-13T07:15:51Z] <testuser[m]> But not sure
[2021-07-13T07:16:52Z] <testuser[m]> Traditional user interfaces can rely on this interface to define the foundations of typical desktops. Currently it's possible to set up background, panels and locking surfaces.
[2021-07-13T07:17:00Z] <testuser[m]> https://github.com/taiwins/taiwins/blob/26c650f50c7b98fc66b710e8dd785bcbfce9ec7e/protocols/taiwins-shell.xml
[2021-07-13T07:17:21Z] <GalaxyNova> ill pass
[2021-07-13T07:17:34Z] <riteo> well, gtg for now, bye everyone!
[2021-07-13T07:17:42Z] <testuser[m]> Bye riteo
[2021-07-13T07:18:51Z] <GalaxyNova> On the topic... How is wayland capable of running so well out of the box without any other external packages needed??
[2021-07-13T07:19:29Z] <GalaxyNova> for Xorg you always have to download all those xf86 programs
[2021-07-13T07:22:18Z] <schillingklaus> because wayland lacks modularity
[2021-07-13T07:22:46Z] <GalaxyNova> schillingklaus: wayland is just a protocol
[2021-07-13T07:23:00Z] <Erus_Iluvatar> is anyone here just running on a framebuffer ?
[2021-07-13T07:23:04Z] <GalaxyNova> right?
[2021-07-13T07:23:22Z] <GalaxyNova> schillingklaus: I take it you still run X?
[2021-07-13T07:23:55Z] <schillingklaus> yes, I still run X
[2021-07-13T07:25:39Z] <GalaxyNova> hm
[2021-07-13T07:26:10Z] <GalaxyNova> I must admit I am not yet knoledgable enough with Wayland to respond to that myself...
[2021-07-13T07:26:31Z] <GalaxyNova> but smart people:tm: say that wayland is lighter than Xorg and Xorg is bloated sooooo
[2021-07-13T07:26:37Z] <GalaxyNova> :P
[2021-07-13T07:29:14Z] <schillingklaus> x11 is not bloated, desktop environments are
[2021-07-13T07:30:09Z] <GalaxyNova> well Xorg (the most popular implementation of the X11 protocol) is objectively bloated
[2021-07-13T07:30:12Z] <GalaxyNova> "bloated"
[2021-07-13T07:31:34Z] <GalaxyNova> it's got 40 years of technical debt
[2021-07-13T07:32:13Z] <GalaxyNova> schillingklaus: Excuse the youtube link :P: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMX_FuOLoCI
[2021-07-13T07:35:01Z] <testuser[m]> https://vid.puffyan.us/watch?v=KMX_FuOLoCI
[2021-07-13T09:09:53Z] <dbz> the real redpill is to use Accelerated-X lol
[2021-07-13T12:22:09Z] <claudia> hola
[2021-07-13T12:22:11Z] <dilyn> testuser: multiple commits to fix/drop packages are fine rn :)
[2021-07-13T12:22:38Z] <claudia> I have trouble running sway-no-seat/-tiny without seatd deamon.
[2021-07-13T12:22:54Z] <claudia> http://ix.io/3sQJ
[2021-07-13T12:23:01Z] <dilyn> schillingklaus: I favor wayfire because it's 1) not a tiling window manager, 2) isn't gpl, and 3) implements certain wlr things hikarai didn't
[2021-07-13T12:23:12Z] <claudia> They complain botch about permissions about gpu(seatd related)
[2021-07-13T12:23:17Z] <claudia> Can someone reproduce?
[2021-07-13T12:23:42Z] <testuser[m]> It makes sense, cuz static linking seatd doesn't make the daemon run
[2021-07-13T12:23:57Z] <dilyn> yeah it seems like perm issues on /dev/dri are the real issue?
[2021-07-13T12:23:57Z] <testuser[m]> Idk how Dylan i s running it
[2021-07-13T12:24:52Z] <claudia> This is ls -lah /dev/dri/card0 http://ix.io/3sQK
[2021-07-13T12:25:34Z] <dilyn> ls -l /dev/dri/* shows root:video?
[2021-07-13T12:25:44Z] <claudia> y.
[2021-07-13T12:25:49Z] <dilyn> hmhm
[2021-07-13T12:25:51Z] <claudia> oh mom
[2021-07-13T12:26:01Z] <claudia> yes
[2021-07-13T12:33:17Z] <claudia> made an issue.
[2021-07-13T12:51:14Z] <claudia> haha, sway-tiny does not recognize XF86Audio* keybindings :v
[2021-07-13T12:51:34Z] <testuser[m]> Cuz Its tiny
[2021-07-13T12:51:41Z] <testuser[m]> :p
[2021-07-13T12:51:51Z] <acheam> you can probably just give it the keycode
[2021-07-13T12:56:27Z] <dilyn> sounds like sway is just dum
[2021-07-13T12:56:39Z] <dilyn> maybe they're called wlr_audio :P
[2021-07-13T13:09:41Z] <soliwilos> The "mach-o/compact_unwind_encoding.h" bits was removed from (kiss-community) lld's build file? It's not building here without that.
[2021-07-13T13:29:43Z] <konimex> dilyn: you use netbsd-curses?
[2021-07-13T13:37:06Z] <konimex> how do you generate those terminfo database for your favorite terminal and add it to netbsd-curses database? I can't wrap my head around the docs on its readme
[2021-07-13T13:37:58Z] <dilyn> I don't (:
[2021-07-13T13:38:13Z] <dilyn> foot uses tic -e, which netbsd-curses tic doesn't support. so I just disable it
[2021-07-13T13:38:39Z] <konimex> then I'll just probably move back to ncurses, according to its creator it ain't a GNU project anyway
[2021-07-13T13:38:59Z] <dilyn> it's true, it isn't
[2021-07-13T13:39:18Z] <testuser[m]> Not even GPL (anymore)
[2021-07-13T13:39:30Z] <dilyn> mit 4lyfe
[2021-07-13T13:39:37Z] <konimex> well I don't mind GPL
[2021-07-13T13:41:10Z] <icy> yo
[2021-07-13T13:41:22Z] <icy> just saw y'all are switching to wayland
[2021-07-13T13:41:41Z] <icy> wasn't dylan firmly against wayland about a year or so ago? what changed?
[2021-07-13T13:41:55Z] <testuser[m]> hicy
[2021-07-13T13:42:06Z] <dilyn> https://github.com/kisslinux/repo/issues/270
[2021-07-13T13:44:28Z] <icy> nice
[2021-07-13T13:44:32Z] <icy> hey testuser[m]
[2021-07-13T13:44:44Z] <icy> ok fair enough. lol @ the drew issue.
[2021-07-13T13:45:05Z] <icy> mention wayland and he'll show up
[2021-07-13T13:45:32Z] <icy> wonder what openbsd is going to do. probably continue with xenocara.
[2021-07-13T13:49:10Z] <acheam> presumably so
[2021-07-13T13:49:16Z] <acheam> isn't Wayland pretty Linux specific?
[2021-07-13T13:51:45Z] <icy> acheam: no idea
[2021-07-13T13:51:53Z] <icy> i've never tried wayland
[2021-07-13T13:52:48Z] <icy> but if upstream software are going to drop xorg support (firefox/chromium etc.), that's going to be annoying
[2021-07-13T14:01:27Z] <dilyn> https://blog.netbsd.org/tnf/entry/wayland_on_netbsd_trials_and?utm_source=discoverbsd slowly
[2021-07-13T14:06:01Z] <testuser[m]> soon
[2021-07-13T14:50:14Z] <akira01> need help again
[2021-07-13T14:50:27Z] <akira01> sway-tiny error
[2021-07-13T14:50:54Z] <akira01> [sway/server.c:180] Unable to open wayland socket
[2021-07-13T14:51:02Z] <akira01> any idea?
[2021-07-13T15:15:09Z] <humaid_02> Can I use rustc from dylin's bin to install Firefox on wayland?
[2021-07-13T15:15:36Z] <humaid_02> We now have openssl. I'm not sure.
[2021-07-13T15:17:48Z] <acheam> give it a shot?
[2021-07-13T15:18:59Z] <dilyn> it'd take about ten seconds to find out probably :V
[2021-07-13T15:19:16Z] <dilyn> if rust is broken you'll know reaaaaaallll quiiiiccckkkkk
[2021-07-13T15:20:57Z] <acheam> has anyone played around with sndio?
[2021-07-13T15:23:55Z] <akira01> sway need the user do input group?
[2021-07-13T15:29:10Z] <msk[m]> yay, I am successfully typing this in wayland
[2021-07-13T15:29:51Z] <msk[m]> testuser the export LIBSEAT and -g video worked for me as well
[2021-07-13T15:30:09Z] <msk[m]> the font doesn't look right, though
[2021-07-13T15:30:13Z] <acheam> nice
[2021-07-13T15:30:25Z] <acheam> I got dwl installed earlier, am yet to really play with it
[2021-07-13T15:30:46Z] <acheam> my problem is that 90% of the time I'm messing with linux, its while im simultaneously in a zoom call
[2021-07-13T15:30:52Z] <acheam> so I can't restart my session
[2021-07-13T15:36:54Z] <akira01> wish i can typing something in wayland
[2021-07-13T15:37:06Z] <akira01> can init this damn thing
[2021-07-13T15:37:18Z] <akira01> cant*
[2021-07-13T15:39:56Z] <dilyn> try sway -d akira01
[2021-07-13T15:43:50Z] <acheam> https://binaryoutcast.com/projects/borealis/
[2021-07-13T15:45:41Z] <acheam> looks interesting, kind of like a ground up pale moon
[2021-07-13T15:45:50Z] <acheam> the maintainer is rather.... stubborn
[2021-07-13T15:46:12Z] <dilyn> that aero theme tho
[2021-07-13T15:46:22Z] <dilyn> takes me back to my longhorn days hachi machi
[2021-07-13T15:50:11Z] <sad_plan> acheam & mid, would you care to give your 2 cents on your distaste for openssl? seeing as you both kinda made your own fork :p
[2021-07-13T15:50:22Z] <acheam> its hefty
[2021-07-13T15:50:28Z] <acheam> and I like diversity
[2021-07-13T15:50:35Z] <acheam> nothing particularly against openssl
[2021-07-13T15:50:42Z] <acheam> mid hasn't been around for a while
[2021-07-13T15:50:58Z] <msk[m]> anyone know if firefox in bin/bin has wayland support?
[2021-07-13T15:51:06Z] <acheam> dilyn:
[2021-07-13T15:51:15Z] <dilyn> no
[2021-07-13T15:51:36Z] <dilyn> https://github.com/kiss-community/bin/blob/main/bin/firefox/depends
[2021-07-13T15:52:32Z] <sad_plan> acheam: sure, I can absolutely support software diversity. not having options isnt exacly great imo.
[2021-07-13T15:54:45Z] <humaid_02> It's been hours compiling rust, that's why I asked. I'll give it a shot.
[2021-07-13T15:55:25Z] <dilyn> no good way to make that any faster (:
[2021-07-13T15:55:42Z] <akira01> okay now i had a good log
[2021-07-13T15:55:56Z] <akira01> https://termbin.com/c6gc
[2021-07-13T15:56:12Z] <akira01> i think is the xdg_runtime_dir
[2021-07-13T15:56:24Z] <akira01> but maybe i was wrong
[2021-07-13T15:56:35Z] <akira01> only know that the problem is seat
[2021-07-13T15:56:43Z] <acheam> its a perms issue
[2021-07-13T15:56:45Z] <dilyn> did you set XDG_TMP_DIR?
[2021-07-13T15:56:55Z] <humaid_02> How are dylin?
[2021-07-13T15:56:58Z] <dilyn> XDG_RUNTIME_DIR*
[2021-07-13T15:57:21Z] <humaid_02> The latest blog post helped very much.
[2021-07-13T16:00:25Z] <sad_plan> you mean Dylan. he probably fine. hasnt been on here much afaik.
[2021-07-13T16:01:40Z] <dilyn> https://github.com/kisslinux/repo/commit/af45221e10d4e20ec42f4e979b3e673f3a650ae9 interesting
[2021-07-13T16:02:14Z] <soliwilos> Is the kernel 5.12 fix needed for 5.13 as well?
[2021-07-13T16:03:07Z] <acheam> not to my knowlege
[2021-07-13T16:05:34Z] <msk[m]> I'm getting http://0x0.st/-Ovd.txt
[2021-07-13T16:06:23Z] <akira01> dilyn: i set xdg_runtime
[2021-07-13T16:06:32Z] <akira01> set like the wiki said
[2021-07-13T16:06:46Z] <akira01> in /run/user/
[2021-07-13T16:07:06Z] <dilyn> msk: is that when running firefox?
[2021-07-13T16:07:10Z] <dilyn> is that the whole log?
[2021-07-13T16:07:26Z] <akira01> soliwilos: yeah
[2021-07-13T16:07:41Z] <dilyn> akira01: well it says it can't open it, so it either doesn't exist or the permissions are wrong. does it exist, and what are the permissions?
[2021-07-13T16:07:55Z] <akira01> since 5.12 the kernel need fix
[2021-07-13T16:08:33Z] <soliwilos> Ok, thank you.
[2021-07-13T16:08:36Z] <soliwilos> Good to know.
[2021-07-13T16:10:12Z] <akira01> dilyn: drwx------
[2021-07-13T16:10:27Z] <akira01> and dont know why i had to make the dir again
[2021-07-13T16:10:30Z] <dilyn> the whole line
[2021-07-13T16:10:38Z] <dilyn> owner/group
[2021-07-13T16:11:01Z] <akira01> not have lol
[2021-07-13T16:12:02Z] <akira01> onwner is roor
[2021-07-13T16:12:06Z] <akira01> root*
[2021-07-13T16:12:15Z] <akira01> but i cant do the dir without root
[2021-07-13T16:12:30Z] <akira01> so what i said maybe is the local of xdg_runtime
[2021-07-13T16:13:18Z] <dilyn> well, are you logged in as root or some nonroot user?
[2021-07-13T16:13:41Z] <soliwilos> akira01: Your /run is perhaps a tmpfs and is cleared every reboot? (regarding you having to make the dir again)
[2021-07-13T16:13:49Z] <akira01> dilyn: nonroot
[2021-07-13T16:13:59Z] <dilyn> so it's a permissions issue. just change them
[2021-07-13T16:14:23Z] <dilyn> permissions should be $whoami:root
[2021-07-13T16:14:45Z] <akira01> okay
[2021-07-13T16:15:42Z] <akira01> damn
[2021-07-13T16:16:06Z] <acheam> dilyn: wait what browser do you use?
[2021-07-13T16:16:19Z] <akira01> segmentation faultfailed to add default include path /usr/share/X11/xkb
[2021-07-13T16:16:45Z] <dilyn> i use chromium obvi
[2021-07-13T16:16:57Z] <acheam> I cant find it in your repo
[2021-07-13T16:17:13Z] <dilyn> https://github.com/dilyn-corner/KISS-me/tree/master/extra/chromium
[2021-07-13T16:17:21Z] <dilyn> akira01: hohum harumph
[2021-07-13T16:17:31Z] <dilyn> hmhmhmhm
[2021-07-13T16:17:44Z] <acheam> oop I was checked out to a really old commit whoops
[2021-07-13T16:18:03Z] <acheam> and have 1682 and 1735 different commits each, respectively.
[2021-07-13T16:18:24Z] <akira01> https://termbin.com/82ak
[2021-07-13T16:18:24Z] <humaid_02> dylin are you planning to include that chromium in bin?
[2021-07-13T16:18:37Z] <humaid_02> would be much appreciated.
[2021-07-13T16:18:49Z] <acheam> dilyn: your git email is blank, is that intentional?
[2021-07-13T16:19:21Z] <akira01> dilyn is a misterious man
[2021-07-13T16:19:42Z] <dilyn> my email in what?
[2021-07-13T16:19:46Z] <acheam> git log
[2021-07-13T16:19:47Z] <dilyn> that repo got overwritten by fossil
[2021-07-13T16:19:53Z] <acheam> oh
[2021-07-13T16:19:53Z] <dilyn> lost a lot of metadata
[2021-07-13T16:20:01Z] <dilyn> I could technically fix it if you really wanted it my email :P
[2021-07-13T16:20:12Z] <acheam> nah just the most recent commits dont have it
[2021-07-13T16:20:15Z] <dilyn> hm
[2021-07-13T16:20:25Z] <dilyn> they're pushed from fossil, so that's probably why
[2021-07-13T16:20:28Z] <acheam> commit e0310f83103a42f0c64c9ebec0c08ef8c447d7d1 (HEAD -> master, origin/master, origin/HEAD)
[2021-07-13T16:20:29Z] <acheam> Author: dilyn <>
[2021-07-13T16:20:29Z] <acheam> Date: Sun Jul 11 21:31:16 2021 +0000
[2021-07-13T16:20:29Z] <acheam> kiss: bump to 5.4.11
[2021-07-13T16:20:29Z] <acheam> FossilOrigin-Name: 12f2a8ccb83fd48437b18d0034c3b75b913a9543589a7c745e8eb36b86368307
[2021-07-13T16:20:50Z] <acheam> oops
[2021-07-13T16:21:03Z] <dilyn> lol
[2021-07-13T16:21:28Z] <dilyn> humaid_02: maybe, but my chromium build is different from the one that would (eventually) be in community
[2021-07-13T16:21:30Z] <acheam> xsel failed me
[2021-07-13T16:21:39Z] <dilyn> wl-copy is the way
[2021-07-13T16:21:45Z] <acheam> maybe soon
[2021-07-13T16:21:47Z] <acheam> maybe soon
[2021-07-13T16:22:38Z] <dilyn> akira01: you're so close now
[2021-07-13T16:22:53Z] <dilyn> does /usr/share/X11/xkb exist?
[2021-07-13T16:23:16Z] <akira01> no
[2021-07-13T16:23:20Z] <dilyn> install xkeyboard-config
[2021-07-13T16:23:34Z] <akira01> gosh
[2021-07-13T16:23:37Z] <akira01> if works
[2021-07-13T16:23:44Z] <akira01> i had to email dylan again
[2021-07-13T16:23:48Z] <akira01> another missing dep
[2021-07-13T16:23:55Z] <dilyn> yeah
[2021-07-13T16:24:07Z] <akira01> yeah
[2021-07-13T16:24:09Z] <akira01> now work
[2021-07-13T16:24:53Z] <dilyn> either libxkbcommon or wlroots or sway should depend on xkeyboard-config << @dylan (:
[2021-07-13T16:24:57Z] <dilyn> yey
[2021-07-13T16:26:53Z] <akira01> Emailed he
[2021-07-13T16:27:04Z] <akira01> also mentioned that sway-tiny need tty permissions
[2021-07-13T16:27:14Z] <akira01> so is good idea to mention it in wiki
[2021-07-13T16:27:40Z] <dilyn> much easier to just use seatd (:
[2021-07-13T16:27:48Z] <akira01> lol
[2021-07-13T16:28:01Z] <akira01> so
[2021-07-13T16:28:16Z] <akira01> i unfamiliar with sway
[2021-07-13T16:28:22Z] <akira01> how can i start term?
[2021-07-13T16:28:57Z] <dilyn> it's similar to i3 so presumably mod4+enter or mod4+shift+enter
[2021-07-13T16:30:03Z] <illiliti> s/mod4/super
[2021-07-13T16:30:38Z] <dilyn> it's all keycodes to me
[2021-07-13T16:31:54Z] <akira01> whats the best place to put xdg_runtime?
[2021-07-13T16:32:02Z] <akira01> run is not a good idea
[2021-07-13T16:32:10Z] <akira01> delete the dir everytime
[2021-07-13T16:32:22Z] <dilyn> add mkdir $XDG_RUNTIME_DIR to your .profile
[2021-07-13T16:32:28Z] <dilyn> possibly mkdir -p
[2021-07-13T16:32:36Z] <akira01> i already did it
[2021-07-13T16:32:39Z] <dilyn> mkdir -p -m 0700 ...
[2021-07-13T16:32:48Z] <akira01> not did mkdir in .profile
[2021-07-13T16:32:54Z] <akira01> will do
[2021-07-13T16:34:52Z] <akira01> yeah not good idea
[2021-07-13T16:35:00Z] <akira01> it will need root permissions
[2021-07-13T16:35:10Z] <akira01> and in login session
[2021-07-13T16:35:37Z] <dilyn> i mean well
[2021-07-13T16:35:51Z] <akira01> can /tmp be a better place to set?
[2021-07-13T16:35:53Z] <dilyn> you can put it all in /etc/profile and chown $whoami:root, or you can put it in /tmp
[2021-07-13T16:36:08Z] <dilyn> there are many places it can go. basically anywhere tbh
[2021-07-13T16:36:34Z] <dilyn> UNLESS sway would be so picky as to demand it be some place more canonical... but I don't know about that
[2021-07-13T16:40:12Z] <akira01> mouse okay
[2021-07-13T16:40:18Z] <akira01> but nothing about term
[2021-07-13T16:40:42Z] <akira01> debug again
[2021-07-13T16:43:47Z] <acheam> hmmmm mandoc segfaults on sphinx-generated roff tables
[2021-07-13T16:43:49Z] <acheam> thats fun
[2021-07-13T16:43:53Z] <dilyn> I could never get my trackpad to work in sway, that's why i never used it
[2021-07-13T16:44:09Z] <acheam> sway specifically or any wlroots compositor
[2021-07-13T16:46:24Z] <schillingklaus> what is the major point of wlroots?
[2021-07-13T16:46:49Z] <acheam> wayland is just a protocol
[2021-07-13T16:46:49Z] <omanom> the original goal was to create a codebase of boilerplate that people could then use and build off of
[2021-07-13T16:46:58Z] <acheam> a lot of the stuff that xorg implements isnt implemented by wayland
[2021-07-13T16:47:07Z] <acheam> so instead of having every project implementing the same stuff
[2021-07-13T16:47:11Z] <omanom> "you're going to be writing these xxx lines of code anyways, so we made wlroots to generalize those lines"
[2021-07-13T16:47:13Z] <acheam> wlroots implements it as a library
[2021-07-13T16:47:19Z] <msk[m]> setting GDK_BACKEND to wayland and/or setting MOZ_ENABLE_WAYLAND to 1 did not help
[2021-07-13T16:48:14Z] <dilyn> acheam: sway specifically
[2021-07-13T16:48:20Z] <acheam> interesting
[2021-07-13T16:48:50Z] <dilyn> yeah. it was a very frustrating time
[2021-07-13T16:49:01Z] <dilyn> neither on KISS nor with Arch, which I thought was interesting.
[2021-07-13T16:49:24Z] <dilyn> you'd think that would mean it's my fault, but I'm a genius so that's obviously not it...
[2021-07-13T16:50:41Z] <dilyn> "(/usr/lib/firefox/firefox:1497): GLib-GIO-WARNING **: 12:04:03.231: Failed to create file monitor for /home/michael/.config/glib-2.0/settings/keyfile: Unable to find default local file monitor type" same problem msk?
[2021-07-13T16:50:48Z] <dilyn> i've never seen that one before
[2021-07-13T16:51:06Z] <msk[m]> something is happening to my client, sorry, nothing is loading
[2021-07-13T16:51:41Z] <akira01> damn iam fucking gonna explode sway
[2021-07-13T16:52:01Z] <dilyn> hikari 'justwerked' :v
[2021-07-13T16:52:01Z] <msk[m]> I'll try irssi
[2021-07-13T16:53:24Z] <dilyn> "glxtest: libEGL initialize failed (t=0.535061) |[2][GFX1-]: glxtest: Unable to open a connection to the X server" this is ofc v bad if you're using wayland?
[2021-07-13T16:58:08Z] <michael> back on irssi
[2021-07-13T16:58:13Z] <michael> the log I sent was the full one
[2021-07-13T16:58:17Z] <akira01> sway need to config keyboard?
[2021-07-13T16:58:18Z] <michael> (this is msk)
[2021-07-13T16:58:27Z] <akira01> because it fucking launch nothing
[2021-07-13T17:00:00Z] <testuser[m]> msk repo-bin was last updated half a month ago
[2021-07-13T17:00:02Z] <testuser[m]> So no
[2021-07-13T17:00:27Z] <michael> so I need to get firefox from the official repo?
[2021-07-13T17:00:44Z] <michael> qt5-webengine has an update so I would need to wait a long time either way
[2021-07-13T17:01:29Z] <dilyn> are you running wayland?
[2021-07-13T17:01:37Z] <michael> yeah, this is inside dwl
[2021-07-13T17:01:37Z] <dilyn> how did you manage to install firefox from repo-bin
[2021-07-13T17:01:43Z] <dilyn> are you still using kiss-community/repo?
[2021-07-13T17:01:51Z] <dilyn> you now have dozens of Xlibs installed my man
[2021-07-13T17:02:08Z] <michael> yesterday I cloned dylan's repo
[2021-07-13T17:02:12Z] <michael> not everything has updated
[2021-07-13T17:02:16Z] <michael> but most things
[2021-07-13T17:02:47Z] <michael> dhcpcd, nodejs, openssh, qt5* and wpa_supplicant need updates, that's it
[2021-07-13T17:04:23Z] <michael> this firefox came from kiss-community/bin
[2021-07-13T17:05:36Z] <dilyn> right but that package depends on no less than 13 Xlibs
[2021-07-13T17:06:16Z] <schillingklaus> rust is contagious, I avoid it rigorously
[2021-07-13T17:06:47Z] <michael> I still have xorg installed
[2021-07-13T17:06:57Z] <acheam> hello from dwl
[2021-07-13T17:06:57Z] <dilyn> hng
[2021-07-13T17:07:00Z] <michael> but I would need the firefox package from dylan's repo, then
[2021-07-13T17:07:08Z] <michael> to use wayland with it
[2021-07-13T17:07:16Z] <dilyn> are you using wayland?
[2021-07-13T17:07:24Z] <michael> yeah, I'm inside dwl
[2021-07-13T17:07:31Z] <acheam> as am i
[2021-07-13T17:07:37Z] <dilyn> did you build mesa with x11 & wayland platforms?
[2021-07-13T17:07:46Z] <dilyn> did you enable xwayland in your xorg-server build script?
[2021-07-13T17:08:02Z] <michael> no, I don't have xwayland, I thought firefox could do it natively?
[2021-07-13T17:08:32Z] <dilyn> it *can*
[2021-07-13T17:08:41Z] <dilyn> but that's why you're getting that error with repo-bin's firefox
[2021-07-13T17:09:00Z] <dilyn> if you build mesa with x11 and you build xorg-server with xwayland you don't have to build rust & firefox lol
[2021-07-13T17:09:57Z] <michael> I only wanted firefox-bin as a quick way to test a browser, I'm planning on using qt5-webengine
[2021-07-13T17:10:10Z] <michael> would that also need xwayland to work easily?
[2021-07-13T17:11:23Z] <dilyn> no, if you plan on using falkon it'll install qt5-wayland
[2021-07-13T17:11:38Z] <dilyn> and then you'll just have to specify QPA platform and it should "justwerk"
[2021-07-13T17:12:27Z] <michael> is falkon special that it can use qt5-wayland, or should that be possible for any qt5-webengine browser?
[2021-07-13T17:12:35Z] <michael> I was going to use qutebrowser
[2021-07-13T17:12:57Z] <dilyn> falkon's special in that it's the only one i've ever tested
[2021-07-13T17:13:13Z] <jstnas> finally got sway to work
[2021-07-13T17:13:17Z] <dilyn> but I assume that any browser using webengine just defers to qt for the graphics plugin it should use
[2021-07-13T17:13:41Z] <jstnas> now to get it looking like this https://github.com/jstnas/dots/blob/master/scrots/cerasus.png
[2021-07-13T17:13:55Z] <michael> so it may work by just replacing qt5-webengine with qt5-wayland in the depends file?
[2021-07-13T17:14:22Z] <dilyn> no you need both
[2021-07-13T17:14:47Z] <michael> oh, it's not a replacement for anything
[2021-07-13T17:14:50Z] <dilyn> qt5 is normally responsible for providing the plugin backend (xcb, gles, w/e), but if you use wayland you have to have qt5-wayland to provide EGL
[2021-07-13T17:15:12Z] <dilyn> webengine is the 'browser' part of falkon -- falkon is basically just some KDE fun splashed on top
[2021-07-13T17:16:00Z] <jstnas> /run/user/$(id -u) did not work as $XDG_RUNTIME_DIR, /tmp/$(id -u) was suggested by gentoo
[2021-07-13T17:16:01Z] <dilyn> i believe i pushed my update for qt5* yesterday, so it should be as easy as kiss b qt5-webengine qt5-wayland
[2021-07-13T17:17:41Z] <michael> I only see subtractions in the qt5-webengine package, so shouldn't it work if I just build qt5-wayland?
[2021-07-13T17:18:01Z] <michael> qt5-webengine is going to take all day
[2021-07-13T17:18:11Z] <michael> I'd rather update it later
[2021-07-13T17:20:07Z] <michael> or is qt5-wayland a big one as well?
[2021-07-13T17:25:09Z] <michael> alright, thanks a million dilyn, I'll let it compile and go do my chores
[2021-07-13T17:27:17Z] <claudia> Hm, I have not quite found out what I have to do "to be the first to call DRMSetMaster"
[2021-07-13T17:28:11Z] <claudia> A syscall in this direction was introduced with linux 5.8, I guess. So for unprevileged users it was possible to become the 'drm master'
[2021-07-13T17:28:36Z] <claudia> I have a kernel which is able to do this :v
[2021-07-13T17:30:21Z] <akira01> testuser[m]: i need to config the keyboard in sway to make it work?
[2021-07-13T17:30:55Z] <dilyn> michael: qt5-webengine shouldn't need a rebuild, afaik
[2021-07-13T17:31:04Z] <dilyn> qt5-wayland should be relatively quick; about as long as qt5-declarative to build
[2021-07-13T17:32:53Z] <akira01> now i know
[2021-07-13T17:32:58Z] <akira01> the keyboard work
[2021-07-13T17:33:15Z] <akira01> thanks duckduckgo to keys how move the mouse
[2021-07-13T17:33:25Z] <akira01> but fuck
[2021-07-13T17:33:36Z] <akira01> foot wont launch :€
[2021-07-13T17:37:14Z] <akira01> Gosh
[2021-07-13T17:37:16Z] <akira01> Is fonts
[2021-07-13T17:37:46Z] <omanom> do you have fontconfig installed?
[2021-07-13T17:38:12Z] <akira01> yeah
[2021-07-13T17:38:23Z] <akira01> Is something with fonts in foot
[2021-07-13T17:40:39Z] <acheam> do you have a font installed?
[2021-07-13T17:40:41Z] <akira01> Prettt dumb liberation fonts fault
[2021-07-13T17:40:42Z] <kqz`> test
[2021-07-13T17:40:49Z] <acheam> test passed kqz`
[2021-07-13T17:41:03Z] <akira01> acheam: i had nothing is because of it foot wont launch
[2021-07-13T17:41:08Z] <kqz`> lol think the matrix bridge is borked, not seeing irc messages
[2021-07-13T17:41:22Z] <acheam> akira01: so drop to the tty and isntall a font then
[2021-07-13T17:41:39Z] <akira01> installed
[2021-07-13T17:41:42Z] <akira01> but man
[2021-07-13T17:41:52Z] <akira01> this is much wierd
[2021-07-13T17:42:09Z] <akira01> the font is so tiny
[2021-07-13T17:42:13Z] <akira01> so little
[2021-07-13T17:42:29Z] <dilyn> https://github.com/dilyn-corner/dotfiles/blob/master/.config/foot/foot.ini
[2021-07-13T17:42:37Z] <dilyn> font size in foot is set similar to how fontconfig reads things
[2021-07-13T17:42:50Z] <dilyn> or rather, they're syntactically similar
[2021-07-13T17:43:18Z] <akira01> oh so i can put a .config file to change it?
[2021-07-13T17:43:27Z] <acheam> dilyn: did you choose #dcdcdc as your foreground because its your initials? lol
[2021-07-13T17:43:48Z] <dilyn> clever if true
[2021-07-13T17:43:50Z] <dilyn> but no
[2021-07-13T17:44:07Z] <dilyn> yes akira; idr the defaults foot uses
[2021-07-13T17:44:13Z] <acheam> I am judging you very hard for having so many things in ~
[2021-07-13T17:44:28Z] <acheam> also dotfiles in ~/.cache
[2021-07-13T17:44:54Z] <kqz> test 2
[2021-07-13T17:45:01Z] <dilyn> those test past
[2021-07-13T17:45:18Z] <kqz`> ok so its passing the messages to the channel but not back to matrix
[2021-07-13T17:45:20Z] <dilyn> acheam: cleaning ~ is hard :(
[2021-07-13T17:45:34Z] <dilyn> I stopped using ccache shortly before ccache.conf moved to .config, sue me :P
[2021-07-13T17:45:47Z] <acheam> see you in small claims court, mister
[2021-07-13T17:46:21Z] <dilyn> just 22 files :'(
[2021-07-13T17:46:46Z] <acheam> but some easy improvements: .shrc can go anywhere, .profile can be merged with .shrc, .gitconfig can go to .config/git/config, .asoundrc can be specified at a custom location, you can not use the BLOAT of vim, and .system/* can be moved to .local/
[2021-07-13T17:46:52Z] <dilyn> and most of them are just temporary to serve as reminders
[2021-07-13T17:47:01Z] <acheam> lol yeah I do that too
[2021-07-13T17:47:18Z] <acheam> I usually have a todo, tmp1, tmp2, and tmp3 file
[2021-07-13T17:47:33Z] <dilyn> most of the files in that repo aren't even on disk anymore
[2021-07-13T17:47:40Z] <dilyn> that's why they're in there xD
[2021-07-13T17:47:51Z] <dilyn> I like keeping .shrc separate from .profile :X
[2021-07-13T17:48:03Z] <acheam> but why
[2021-07-13T17:48:21Z] <acheam> also what is the advantage of running foot as client/server?
[2021-07-13T17:49:18Z] <dilyn> less ram usage per terminal
[2021-07-13T17:49:25Z] <dilyn> tho if the server crashes, all your terms die
[2021-07-13T17:49:34Z] <acheam> how often does that happen?
[2021-07-13T17:50:10Z] <dilyn> it's happened once in the last four months or something?
[2021-07-13T17:50:12Z] <micro_O> dilyn: the way i've cleaned ~/ is by changing permissions to read-only :)
[2021-07-13T17:50:16Z] <dilyn> lmfao
[2021-07-13T17:50:32Z] <acheam> dilyn: i think I can take that risk lol
[2021-07-13T17:50:39Z] <dilyn> most of my things live in /mnt/share, and half the things in ~ are symlinks to there
[2021-07-13T17:50:42Z] <micro_O> and used https://github.com/doron-cohen/antidot to move things to sane-r directories
[2021-07-13T17:51:17Z] <acheam> if you need antidot you have too many damn programs
[2021-07-13T17:52:13Z] <dilyn> clean home: rm -rf ~
[2021-07-13T17:52:23Z] <acheam> ~/*
[2021-07-13T17:52:29Z] <micro_O> ?? antidot just lets makes it so i don't have to look at the changelog of every app every time they decide to add sane XDG support
[2021-07-13T17:52:31Z] <acheam> ~ is owned by root
[2021-07-13T17:52:38Z] <acheam> c
[2021-07-13T17:52:52Z] <dilyn> you've bunged something if ~ is owned by root
[2021-07-13T17:52:55Z] <acheam> micro_O: it was a half-joke
[2021-07-13T17:53:00Z] <cem> acheam: what if I have been keeping the same home directory for the last 5 years spanning over a bunch of distros?
[2021-07-13T17:53:07Z] <acheam> dilyn: oop youre right
[2021-07-13T17:53:14Z] <acheam> cem: dont?
[2021-07-13T17:53:21Z] <micro_O> hard to tell here, some people are a bit die-hard with muh minimalism
[2021-07-13T17:53:27Z] <dilyn> ln -sv /dev/null /home/$whoami
[2021-07-13T17:53:27Z] <micro_O> also, maybe im cranky
[2021-07-13T17:53:35Z] <acheam> micro_O: do you think so?
[2021-07-13T17:53:39Z] <cem> zpool destroy
[2021-07-13T17:54:03Z] <micro_O> cem i'd love to see some optional zfs awareness for kiss
[2021-07-13T17:54:13Z] <micro_O> would be super dope for updating packages atomically
[2021-07-13T17:54:26Z] <cem> a new pool for each package
[2021-07-13T17:54:27Z] <micro_O> currently, if something goes wrong during the merge process you are left with a dirty fs
[2021-07-13T17:54:58Z] <dilyn> you're just describing snaps micro
[2021-07-13T17:55:08Z] <micro_O> cem there is some linux distro, i cant remember the name, where literally every package is a unionfs
[2021-07-13T17:55:10Z] <micro_O> and its not snap
[2021-07-13T17:55:18Z] <micro_O> but yeah, snap does a similar thing
[2021-07-13T17:55:19Z] <cem> nix?
[2021-07-13T17:55:29Z] <dilyn> silverblue
[2021-07-13T17:55:33Z] <cem> oasis
[2021-07-13T17:55:40Z] <acheam> UBUNTU
[2021-07-13T17:55:52Z] <micro_O> distri
[2021-07-13T17:55:54Z] <dilyn> rebecca black OS
[2021-07-13T17:56:04Z] <cem> dilyn: cringe
[2021-07-13T17:56:09Z] <cem> hannah montana linux
[2021-07-13T17:56:16Z] <dilyn> drakememe.jpg
[2021-07-13T17:56:21Z] <micro_O> https://distr1.org > distri is a proof-of-concept implementation of the simplest¹ linux distribution I can think of that is still useful²
[2021-07-13T17:56:28Z] <schillingklaus> the woooooorrrrst of both worlds
[2021-07-13T17:56:58Z] <acheam> micro_O: hmm that looks pretty cool
[2021-07-13T17:57:09Z] <cem> schillingklaus: we have been jumping through lots of software you have to be specific :D
[2021-07-13T17:57:45Z] <schillingklaus> hannah montana linux contains systemd
[2021-07-13T17:57:48Z] <micro_O> yeah, its definitely unique and I am happy to see that kind of experimentation
[2021-07-13T17:59:01Z] <cem> I only see one problem with hannah montana linux, then
[2021-07-13T17:59:18Z] <cem> you can't always reach perfection
[2021-07-13T17:59:44Z] <cem> does the bootloader play songs?
[2021-07-13T17:59:53Z] <akira01> it plays in grub
[2021-07-13T18:00:04Z] <akira01> also in flac
[2021-07-13T18:00:17Z] <cem> okay, I retract my words
[2021-07-13T18:00:27Z] <cem> it is THE perfect distro
[2021-07-13T18:00:52Z] <GalaxyNova> dilyn: For some reason I still have the old kiss community kiss help pages instead of dylan's
[2021-07-13T18:01:25Z] <dilyn> kiss l kiss ?
[2021-07-13T18:01:45Z] <acheam> whats the difference between plan9port and 9base?
[2021-07-13T18:02:16Z] <cem> 9base is from suckless
[2021-07-13T18:02:22Z] <cem> overall less and basic tools
[2021-07-13T18:02:29Z] <acheam> gotcha
[2021-07-13T18:02:46Z] <cem> plan9port is the port of the entire userspace iirc
[2021-07-13T18:03:03Z] <schillingklaus> plan9 from userspace
[2021-07-13T18:06:50Z] <ang> that's correct, cem
[2021-07-13T18:06:58Z] <GalaxyNova> dilyn: kiss 5.4.11 1
[2021-07-13T18:07:10Z] <dilyn> update kiss
[2021-07-13T18:07:38Z] <ang> btw cem, you are using dwm, aren't you?
[2021-07-13T18:08:48Z] <GalaxyNova> i did update kiss, even rebuilt the kiss package.
[2021-07-13T18:09:19Z] <dilyn> ... kiss u?
[2021-07-13T18:09:28Z] <phoebos> dilyn: kiss v
[2021-07-13T18:09:50Z] <phoebos> kiss l kiss smh
[2021-07-13T18:09:53Z] <dilyn> kiss v will report 5.4.11 which is correct, but the package's version in kiss-community is now 9999
[2021-07-13T18:10:03Z] <dilyn> ;)
[2021-07-13T18:10:08Z] <phoebos> ah oof
[2021-07-13T18:10:32Z] <GalaxyNova> because https://kisslinux.xyz/wiki/ looks different from kiss h wiki
[2021-07-13T18:10:35Z] <GalaxyNova> or is it supposed to?
[2021-07-13T18:11:17Z] <GalaxyNova> my offline documentation doesn't have the wayland section
[2021-07-13T18:13:37Z] <dilyn> correct...
[2021-07-13T18:13:52Z] <dilyn> are you installing kiss from kiss-community/repo? if yes, you need to update the repo
[2021-07-13T18:15:11Z] <cem> ang: I have switched to sway, but I was using dwm until recently
[2021-07-13T18:15:44Z] <cem> By recently I mean ~3 months
[2021-07-13T18:15:49Z] <ang> I see
[2021-07-13T18:16:08Z] <cem> you're using dwm?
[2021-07-13T18:16:29Z] <ang> yeah, that's the main reason I hate the switch to wayland
[2021-07-13T18:16:55Z] <schillingklaus> i'm the last x11 unicorn
[2021-07-13T18:16:59Z] <ang> there is dwl but it's missing a bar
[2021-07-13T18:17:09Z] <ang> I haven't switched yet, klaus
[2021-07-13T18:17:54Z] <ang> still contemplating whether or not to just 1) switch and use dwl, 2) maintain Xorg stuff or 3) switch to openbsd
[2021-07-13T18:18:09Z] <cem> yeah I want to use dwl too, but it's not complete enough for me
[2021-07-13T18:18:19Z] <ang> yep :/
[2021-07-13T18:18:40Z] <cem> yambar has a script for dwl, buuutt
[2021-07-13T18:18:43Z] <cem> It requires bash
[2021-07-13T18:18:44Z] <ang> My biggest problem with maintaining xorg stuff is a browser
[2021-07-13T18:18:47Z] <cem> and I don't have bash
[2021-07-13T18:18:53Z] <ang> I really cba building one with this machine
[2021-07-13T18:18:57Z] <schillingklaus> I already multiboot with openbsd
[2021-07-13T18:19:03Z] <ang> ugh, didn't even know that
[2021-07-13T18:19:05Z] <akira01> The non github kiss-community repo still works?
[2021-07-13T18:20:09Z] <ang> cem, probably easy to port to a portable script
[2021-07-13T18:20:46Z] <cem> yeah, it probably wouldn't be that hard
[2021-07-13T18:21:44Z] <cem> I just don't want to bother much
[2021-07-13T18:21:53Z] <cem> That's why I kept on sway
[2021-07-13T18:22:05Z] <cem> it just werks
[2021-07-13T18:22:39Z] <ang> I always disliked i3
[2021-07-13T18:23:19Z] <cem> yeah I like dwm style window management a lot more too
[2021-07-13T18:23:22Z] <akira01> Me too
[2021-07-13T18:23:27Z] <schillingklaus> sway pretends to be keyboard friendly, but it does not allow for simulating mouseclicks with scripts
[2021-07-13T18:23:30Z] <akira01> but sway-tiny is so tiny
[2021-07-13T18:23:32Z] <cem> You can also try velox
[2021-07-13T18:23:33Z] <ang> my main problem with openbsd is that I think you can't set battery charge thresholds
[2021-07-13T18:23:49Z] <ang> and I'm also not sure how battery life is compared to linux
[2021-07-13T18:24:05Z] <akira01> i hope dylan make some sowm wayland version
[2021-07-13T18:24:11Z] <akira01> i love this wm
[2021-07-13T18:24:31Z] <ang> cem, thanks, will check it out
[2021-07-13T18:24:42Z] <schillingklaus> sowm is anti-keyboard, so not for me
[2021-07-13T18:25:03Z] <ang> oh it's from mfc, nice
[2021-07-13T18:25:08Z] <ang> mcf*
[2021-07-13T18:25:32Z] <schillingklaus> michael forney of oasis fame
[2021-07-13T18:25:39Z] <ang> aye
[2021-07-13T18:25:56Z] <GalaxyNova> hm
[2021-07-13T18:26:08Z] <GalaxyNova> it seems like this is a problem with the kiss package itself
[2021-07-13T18:26:13Z] <dilyn> bring amdgpu support to wld pls
[2021-07-13T18:26:57Z] <GalaxyNova> the sources it pulls in seem to be different from the website
[2021-07-13T18:27:06Z] <GalaxyNova> can anyone else confirm this?
[2021-07-13T18:27:14Z] <GalaxyNova> kiss h wiki
[2021-07-13T18:27:22Z] <GalaxyNova> wayland is empty but on the website there are some links
[2021-07-13T18:28:07Z] <dilyn> cat /var/db/kiss/installed/kiss/sources
[2021-07-13T18:28:33Z] <claudia> ang: when you are talking about thinkpad charge threshold you can prob use ectool https://www.coreboot.org/Board:lenovo/x230 -> last paragraph
[2021-07-13T18:28:58Z] <GalaxyNova> https://github.com/kisslinux/kiss/archive/5.4.11.tar.gz
[2021-07-13T18:29:00Z] <GalaxyNova> https://github.com/kisslinux/website/archive/242b7b60d824f4c8ace259405f602ff05ddfef31.tar.gz docs
[2021-07-13T18:29:02Z] <GalaxyNova> https://github.com/kisslinux/wiki/archive/ad8b8f780f88d50060b1feef88b78528d9abba2e.tar.gz wikiyyyyyy
[2021-07-13T18:29:57Z] <GalaxyNova> downloaded the sources and there are some differences from the website
[2021-07-13T18:30:02Z] <ang> claudia: nice!
[2021-07-13T18:30:09Z] <ang> do I need coreboot though?
[2021-07-13T18:30:39Z] <dilyn> they're only different from the website because dylan hasn't pushed a new release of kiss that includes the latest commits to the site
[2021-07-13T18:30:46Z] <claudia> dunno. I just a corebooted machine :p
[2021-07-13T18:30:53Z] <claudia> needs to be tested on non coreboot
[2021-07-13T18:31:06Z] <claudia> *I have just
[2021-07-13T18:31:25Z] <GalaxyNova> oh that makes sense :P
[2021-07-13T18:31:53Z] <claudia> Writing some hexcode to you computer internals, what could go wrong (:
[2021-07-13T18:32:17Z] <ang> exactly what I just thought, lol
[2021-07-13T18:32:56Z] <claudia> But I used this codes and got sucess.
[2021-07-13T18:32:56Z] <akira01> i fucking chocked
[2021-07-13T18:33:14Z] <claudia> On a x200 though.
[2021-07-13T18:33:16Z] <akira01> sway-tiny is need less more ram than my xorg sowm
[2021-07-13T18:33:35Z] <claudia> akira01: Can you rephrase this?
[2021-07-13T18:33:45Z] <ang> claudia: without coreboot?
[2021-07-13T18:33:49Z] <ang> that's brave
[2021-07-13T18:33:50Z] <claudia> librebooted.
[2021-07-13T18:33:54Z] <ang> ah
[2021-07-13T18:34:00Z] <akira01> sway-tiny need less ram than my old xorg/sowm
[2021-07-13T18:34:50Z] <akira01> is quite the same but little less
[2021-07-13T18:36:37Z] <ang> velox does seem to have a bar \o/
[2021-07-13T18:37:06Z] <ang> gotta love mcf, he ported st too
[2021-07-13T18:38:38Z] <dilyn> and dmenu
[2021-07-13T18:38:57Z] <ang> crisis averted
[2021-07-13T18:39:05Z] <dilyn> and firefox 'works'
[2021-07-13T18:39:20Z] <ang> nicu
[2021-07-13T18:40:21Z] <claudia> But its a limited ecosystem compared to wlroots.
[2021-07-13T18:40:49Z] <ang> btw dilyn, there's a patch dropping posix-man-pages on the ml
[2021-07-13T18:40:58Z] <dilyn> i saw!
[2021-07-13T18:40:59Z] <dilyn> it's broken :v
[2021-07-13T18:41:05Z] <claudia> All the fancy stuff is build around wlroots, or swc just has not implemented it.(protocols)
[2021-07-13T18:41:07Z] <ang> wut, how
[2021-07-13T18:41:37Z] <dilyn> idk, it won't really tell me
[2021-07-13T18:41:40Z] <ang> hmm, what does that mean for me exactly, claudia?
[2021-07-13T18:41:50Z] <claudia> E.g bars.
[2021-07-13T18:42:00Z] <claudia> they need the layerhshell? protocols.
[2021-07-13T18:42:09Z] <ang> if velox comes with a bar I'm gucci really
[2021-07-13T18:42:18Z] <claudia> This is something relatively new.
[2021-07-13T18:42:36Z] <claudia> And I think foot does not work :(
[2021-07-13T18:42:45Z] <claudia> protocols whatever incompatibility.
[2021-07-13T18:42:55Z] <ang> dilyn, weird
[2021-07-13T18:43:06Z] <ang> I just git rm -r'd the dir
[2021-07-13T18:43:24Z] <akira01> zathura works in wayland?
[2021-07-13T18:43:42Z] <claudia> The bar is a c program iirc. Can prob be modified.
[2021-07-13T18:43:48Z] <ang> claudia, gotcha
[2021-07-13T18:44:04Z] <ang> I don't mind being locked into mcf land really
[2021-07-13T18:44:45Z] <claudia> I think you are locked in a land of pitch black background ^^
[2021-07-13T18:44:49Z] <ang> a browser, dwm, dmenu, st, mpv is all I the graphical stuff I need
[2021-07-13T18:45:04Z] <ang> s/ I//
[2021-07-13T18:45:16Z] <ang> perfect :>
[2021-07-13T18:45:23Z] <ang> I never see my desktop anyway
[2021-07-13T18:45:35Z] <claudia> There are some open PR in swc you need to make gui toolkit programms work.
[2021-07-13T18:45:55Z] <dilyn> ang: weird indeed. I think the patch is being word split
[2021-07-13T18:46:27Z] <dilyn> it looks like the sources part splits .tar.xz onto two lines
[2021-07-13T18:47:17Z] <ang> claudia, that does not include ff/mpv, does it?
[2021-07-13T18:47:53Z] <claudia> This works perfectly fine.
[2021-07-13T18:47:54Z] <ang> dilyn, looking at the source of the mail
[2021-07-13T18:48:03Z] <ang> there is some weird splitting indeed
[2021-07-13T18:48:03Z] <claudia> But I think you cant make real fullscreen afaic.
[2021-07-13T18:48:21Z] <ang> man-pages-posi=\n :thinking:
[2021-07-13T18:48:38Z] <acheam> my install is slowly turning into openbsd lol
[2021-07-13T18:48:43Z] <acheam> just replaced ash with oksh
[2021-07-13T18:48:44Z] <ang> or is that just git a git line wrapping format code?
[2021-07-13T18:49:11Z] <ang> claudia, I see. Sounds good enough for me then
[2021-07-13T18:49:23Z] <dilyn> oBSD is the way
[2021-07-13T18:49:26Z] <ang> definitely feel alot better about the whole tihng now
[2021-07-13T18:49:28Z] <dilyn> ang: I can just delete it if you'd like XD
[2021-07-13T18:49:42Z] <dilyn> it's weird that it would happen tho... hm...
[2021-07-13T18:49:43Z] <ang> yeah, probably easiest at this point
[2021-07-13T18:50:19Z] <acheam> heres a fun wc -l game
[2021-07-13T18:50:23Z] <acheam> busybox --list | wc -l
[2021-07-13T18:50:25Z] <ang> I pipe straight to xsel too, so no way I messed something up
[2021-07-13T18:50:25Z] <acheam> 255 for me
[2021-07-13T18:51:09Z] <ang> 289 with the default install
[2021-07-13T18:52:06Z] <dilyn> `busybox --list`
[2021-07-13T18:52:08Z] <dilyn> :'(
[2021-07-13T18:52:12Z] <dilyn> /bin/ksh: busybox: not found
[2021-07-13T18:52:15Z] <acheam> toybox --list ?
[2021-07-13T18:52:20Z] <claudia> ang: When you have rust on your hand and looking for a fancy terminal, maybe alacritty is a good shot. This works at least without problems.
[2021-07-13T18:52:57Z] <ang> I have to see how mcf's st works
[2021-07-13T18:52:59Z] <dilyn> just toybox
[2021-07-13T18:53:09Z] <ang> I don't need scrollback and all the other fancy stuff
[2021-07-13T18:53:22Z] <dilyn> 268 tho
[2021-07-13T18:54:01Z] <claudia> I always had ugly fonts with it. And I think this is related to wld on intel hardware. But not totaly sure.
[2021-07-13T18:54:30Z] <cem> dilyn: toybox doesn't have that many stable commands
[2021-07-13T18:54:43Z] <ang> oh thanks for reminding me, I need my terminus
[2021-07-13T18:54:56Z] <ang> but that's a bitmap font
[2021-07-13T18:55:53Z] <dilyn> cem: I live on the edge(tm)
[2021-07-13T18:56:02Z] <dilyn> also most of those commands aren't used :X but I'm too lazy to vet
[2021-07-13T18:56:23Z] <acheam> dilyn: what do you use to provide sha256sum on toybox?
[2021-07-13T18:56:27Z] <cem> dilyn: link toysh to /bin/sh, I dare you
[2021-07-13T18:56:35Z] <acheam> toysh?
[2021-07-13T18:56:35Z] <dilyn> toybox has sha*
[2021-07-13T18:56:39Z] <dilyn> but I'm using b3
[2021-07-13T18:56:45Z] <dilyn> cem: NO
[2021-07-13T18:56:46Z] <acheam> oh the website says the opposite
[2021-07-13T18:56:50Z] <dilyn> i don't even have sh enabled
[2021-07-13T18:56:59Z] <cem> acheam: it's toybox's wip shell
[2021-07-13T18:57:07Z] <acheam> ah
[2021-07-13T18:57:10Z] <cem> And it's real wip
[2021-07-13T18:57:23Z] <dilyn> it can build toybox tho last i heard, no?
[2021-07-13T18:57:29Z] <cem> can it?
[2021-07-13T18:57:38Z] <acheam> dilyn: why tf do you use /usr/share/LICENSES but not /usr/share/doc
[2021-07-13T18:57:55Z] <dilyn> because fuck FHS
[2021-07-13T18:58:03Z] <cem> landley's fantasy finally came true?
[2021-07-13T18:58:05Z] <dilyn> I thought I had heard so, but idk
[2021-07-13T18:58:08Z] <acheam> you have odd priorities my guy
[2021-07-13T18:58:27Z] <cem> "Using bash for build scripts is intentional because I want toysh to be a bash replacement"
[2021-07-13T18:58:31Z] <cem> thanks but no thanks
[2021-07-13T18:58:36Z] <dilyn> https://github.com/landley/toybox/issues/131
[2021-07-13T18:58:51Z] <dilyn> docs are banned, acheam
[2021-07-13T18:59:06Z] <acheam> lol yeah I just saw POSIX.patch
[2021-07-13T18:59:16Z] <acheam> thank you lord E5ten[m] for all of the amazing patches
[2021-07-13T18:59:50Z] <acheam> omg dilyn has cat -v enabled
[2021-07-13T18:59:55Z] <acheam> get the unix police
[2021-07-13T19:00:52Z] <cem> Rob Pike came here to slap dilyn
[2021-07-13T19:03:12Z] <dilyn> i hide these trinkets for you little POSIX hunters
[2021-07-13T19:03:17Z] <dilyn> congratulations, you've found me gold
[2021-07-13T19:04:08Z] <dilyn> also cem, specifically this comment https://github.com/landley/toybox/pull/190#issuecomment-621449915 makes me think toybox can build toybox, where the first 'toybox' includes toysh
[2021-07-13T19:04:14Z] <dilyn> but I could be mishtaken
[2021-07-13T19:06:11Z] <illiliti> egg and chicken problem
[2021-07-13T19:06:21Z] <illiliti> landley what the hell are you doin...
[2021-07-13T19:06:42Z] <dilyn> the only thing landley adamantly believes in is bootstrapping
[2021-07-13T19:06:50Z] <dilyn> also that the GPL is bad
[2021-07-13T19:06:52Z] <dilyn> BUT MOSTLY
[2021-07-13T19:06:53Z] <dilyn> bootstrapping
[2021-07-13T19:17:42Z] <msk> what's the most minimal statusbar? On xorg+dwm I just used xsetroot, which was simple and easy
[2021-07-13T19:17:56Z] <msk> (for wayland, I mean)
[2021-07-13T19:18:16Z] <noocsharp> depends on the compositor
[2021-07-13T19:18:23Z] <msk> I'm using dwl
[2021-07-13T19:18:38Z] <msk> I thought it would have one-built in because the config had tag names
[2021-07-13T19:20:18Z] <msk> the statusbars listed on the wiki have modules and stuff which is way too much for me
[2021-07-13T19:20:46Z] <cem> dilyn: and also bash
[2021-07-13T19:21:33Z] <dilyn> God can't be perfect, cem :'(
[2021-07-13T19:21:40Z] <cem> every script he writes is bash
[2021-07-13T19:21:40Z] <noocsharp> msk: i'm not sure
[2021-07-13T19:22:05Z] <cem> like it doesn't take much to use [ ] instead of [[ ]]
[2021-07-13T19:22:18Z] <ang> msk, we literally just had this discussion
[2021-07-13T19:22:25Z] <ang> check the logs
[2021-07-13T19:22:32Z] <cem> If he used crap like arrays or something, I would be kind of okay with that
[2021-07-13T19:22:41Z] <ang> verdict: velox instead of dwl
[2021-07-13T19:22:49Z] <cem> At least it's not POSIX for _some_ reason
[2021-07-13T19:23:20Z] <dilyn> preachin' to the choir
[2021-07-13T19:23:21Z] <cem> But no, it's almost completely minor bashisms that he insists on keeping
[2021-07-13T19:23:29Z] <msk> ang: I searched "statusbar" in the logs prior to asking
[2021-07-13T19:23:38Z] <msk> did I miss it completely?
[2021-07-13T19:24:08Z] <ang> search for velox and mcf
[2021-07-13T19:25:33Z] <msk> velox instead of dwl, and mcf instead of wterm?
[2021-07-13T19:25:42Z] <msk> I just finished making the dwl config
[2021-07-13T19:26:30Z] <noocsharp> mcf is a person who has wayland ports of st and dmenu
[2021-07-13T19:26:31Z] <ang> mcf is michael fourney, the author of velow, I just meant to search for it so you will find the relevant lines in the log ;)
[2021-07-13T19:26:41Z] <ang> s/velow/velox/
[2021-07-13T19:27:32Z] <msk> ah
[2021-07-13T19:28:12Z] <claudia> dwl made me lane that "§" translate to XKB_KEY_section
[2021-07-13T19:28:16Z] <claudia> *learn
[2021-07-13T19:29:01Z] <claudia> Its config is qwerty keyboard specific. And switching tags does just not work on a qwertz keyboard.
[2021-07-13T19:29:53Z] <claudia> The alternative shift keys on the number row are different.
[2021-07-13T19:30:22Z] <ang> german qwerty layout is awful
[2021-07-13T19:30:36Z] <ang> rip matrix
[2021-07-13T19:31:21Z] <ang> first thing I did when I received this used thinkpad was to buy a replacement keyboard
[2021-07-13T19:31:41Z] <ang> with us ansi layout that is
[2021-07-13T19:33:27Z] <claudia> Ansi ist just a small enter button?
[2021-07-13T19:33:32Z] <claudia> How discusting^^
[2021-07-13T19:34:17Z] <ang> matter of perspective
[2021-07-13T19:34:22Z] <msk> velox has weird configuration, though
[2021-07-13T19:34:32Z] <ang> I hit the small enter key on the very left
[2021-07-13T19:34:42Z] <ang> which fucks me up on keyboards with a big enter
[2021-07-13T19:35:07Z] <ang> msk, how's that
[2021-07-13T19:35:17Z] <ang> I haven't looked into velox too deeply
[2021-07-13T19:35:50Z] <claudia> Hm I cant find an example with enter on the left. Got link?
[2021-07-13T19:36:12Z] <msk> you don't edit config.h, they have their own configuration syntax
[2021-07-13T19:36:27Z] <ang> no, I mean the enter on the right, but my pinky tends to hit it on the left side of it
[2021-07-13T19:36:32Z] <msk> and the location doesn't even follow xdg base
[2021-07-13T19:36:53Z] <ang> in a place which is another key on a layout with a big enter key
[2021-07-13T19:36:53Z] <claudia> ah gotcha.
[2021-07-13T19:37:06Z] <ang> ;)
[2021-07-13T19:37:41Z] <ang> msk: I don't mind a config
[2021-07-13T19:37:54Z] <ang> is it reading it from ~ or ~/.config?
[2021-07-13T19:38:00Z] <claudia> I like the aproach to use just "broad" hardware. This way I am not completely lost when on another machine.
[2021-07-13T19:38:15Z] <msk> ~/.velox.conf it says
[2021-07-13T19:38:39Z] <ang> ok. not optimal but no deal breaker tbh
[2021-07-13T19:38:59Z] <acheam> usually thats literaly just one sed call to fix
[2021-07-13T19:39:00Z] * claudia ls -lah | wc -l -> 56
[2021-07-13T19:39:02Z] <claudia> :D
[2021-07-13T19:39:14Z] <claudia> from $HOME that is
[2021-07-13T19:39:18Z] <dilyn> smdh
[2021-07-13T19:39:21Z] <acheam> I patch correct dirs into llvm and links
[2021-07-13T19:39:51Z] <acheam> 14 for me
[2021-07-13T19:39:52Z] <claudia> Whats invisible, is not there. ezpz
[2021-07-13T19:39:55Z] <acheam> and 3 of them are reminders
[2021-07-13T19:41:10Z] <msk> velox also seems to have no community patches, unlike dwl which has at least a few
[2021-07-13T19:41:42Z] <ang> I don't really need any fortunately
[2021-07-13T19:43:44Z] <cem> Only patch I need is gaps tbh
[2021-07-13T19:45:32Z] <cem> I find the screen really convoluted without any gaps
[2021-07-13T19:46:01Z] <ang> it's nice when you really make use of tiling I guess
[2021-07-13T19:46:25Z] <msk> for me it looks better without gaps
[2021-07-13T19:46:52Z] <msk> which is lucky since they eat screen real estate
[2021-07-13T19:47:46Z] <ang> only patch I really like is the one which removes borders when there's only one window
[2021-07-13T19:47:48Z] <dilyn> floating is the way
[2021-07-13T19:47:56Z] <ang> get outta here
[2021-07-13T19:48:06Z] <cem> I only need a small amount of gaps so I can have that visual
[2021-07-13T19:48:13Z] <cem> dilyn: what the actual fuck?
[2021-07-13T19:48:21Z] <dilyn> https://github.com/dilyn-corner/dotfiles/blob/master/scrots/dilyn-corner.png?raw=true
[2021-07-13T19:48:21Z] <ang> actually no, floating sucks, but so does tiling
[2021-07-13T19:48:29Z] <ang> fullscreen everything is king
[2021-07-13T19:48:37Z] <dilyn> fullscreen is trash
[2021-07-13T19:48:41Z] <dilyn> I have a wallpaper for a reason
[2021-07-13T19:48:51Z] <ang> s m h
[2021-07-13T19:48:56Z] <dilyn> shake harder
[2021-07-13T19:49:02Z] <dilyn> maybe then you'll see that I'm RIGHT
[2021-07-13T19:49:09Z] <ang> never
[2021-07-13T19:49:09Z] <cem> dilyn: mouse peasent
[2021-07-13T19:49:22Z] <dilyn> i bought a nice mouse i'll be damned if i don't use it sometimes
[2021-07-13T19:49:32Z] <cem> Using a mouse is only excusable if you are playing games
[2021-07-13T19:49:37Z] <cem> no wait
[2021-07-13T19:49:40Z] <cem> there is no excuse
[2021-07-13T19:49:47Z] <dilyn> lol
[2021-07-13T19:50:14Z] <msk> since games themselves have no excuse
[2021-07-13T19:50:15Z] <cem> I bet you'd use a mouse
[2021-07-13T19:50:17Z] <cem> in an mmo
[2021-07-13T19:50:22Z] <msk> except games that don't need a mouse like nethack
[2021-07-13T19:52:53Z] <cem> jokes aside, after using dwm for two years, I seriously don't understand why anyone would use floating wms
[2021-07-13T19:53:29Z] <cem> do you hate yourself that much?
[2021-07-13T19:54:14Z] <cem> well, that wasn't much of a "jokes aside"
[2021-07-13T19:54:21Z] <msk> cem: they're just too lazy to learn the dwm bindings
[2021-07-13T19:54:57Z] <msk> are you using dwl?
[2021-07-13T19:55:49Z] <cem> I'm using sway right now, but I'm planning on switching to dwl whenver I can setup my workflow
[2021-07-13T19:56:23Z] <ang> why don't you use velox?
[2021-07-13T19:57:27Z] <msk> ang: velox's only benefit is that it has a working statusbar, right?
[2021-07-13T19:57:34Z] <cem> Because I find wlroots to be more stable than swc
[2021-07-13T19:57:54Z] <ang> msk, yeah
[2021-07-13T19:58:14Z] <ang> the one and only thing which is holding me up from switching to wayland
[2021-07-13T19:58:41Z] <ang> and as I said, the other cons are no cons for me fortunately
[2021-07-13T19:58:44Z] <cem> I have also had some issues with input
[2021-07-13T19:58:44Z] <ang> cem: I see
[2021-07-13T19:58:49Z] <cem> using velox
[2021-07-13T19:59:59Z] <thebuzzing> I dunno, I prefer to have the option of using a mouse.
[2021-07-13T20:00:37Z] <thebuzzing> Sometimes, my keyboard is over there, and I'm over here, with the mouse right there...
[2021-07-13T20:00:54Z] <cem> and I'm in a position where I don't want to spend much time breaking my workflow, I didn't spend much time with either velox nor dwl
[2021-07-13T20:01:11Z] <cem> and I have been meaning to try wayland since last year
[2021-07-13T20:01:22Z] <cem> I only recently had the time to switch
[2021-07-13T20:01:30Z] <thebuzzing> I like river for wayland, or hikari.
[2021-07-13T20:02:04Z] <cem> river was like dwm too, right?
[2021-07-13T20:02:29Z] <thebuzzing> Kinda bspwm-ish.
[2021-07-13T20:03:04Z] <cem> Ah alright
[2021-07-13T20:03:21Z] <thebuzzing> In fairness, a lot of my choices for software revolve around how much I like the naming scheme.
[2021-07-13T20:03:41Z] <thebuzzing> I use herbstluftwm on Xorg, cos that name is beautiful.
[2021-07-13T20:04:13Z] <cem> I literally mispell it every time lol
[2021-07-13T20:04:54Z] <thebuzzing> Hah. That's part of the fun.
[2021-07-13T20:05:13Z] <ang> I must admit, not a fan of german software names (as a german)
[2021-07-13T20:05:45Z] <ang> cem, time to write sucukwm
[2021-07-13T20:07:21Z] <jslick> I have been switching my dwm machines over to hlwm. Is there an equivalent to herbstluftwm in wayland? Maybe sway is the closest
[2021-07-13T20:09:50Z] <cem> ang: falafelwm is where it's at
[2021-07-13T20:09:56Z] <thebuzzing> I haven't seen anything that would directly correlate, no. Sway works, especially if you're used to i3.
[2021-07-13T20:10:07Z] <acheam> I wonder what other obsd things I can use....
[2021-07-13T20:10:15Z] <cem> acheam: cwm
[2021-07-13T20:10:16Z] <ang> cem: lol, make it happen
[2021-07-13T20:10:23Z] <acheam> cem: wayland tho
[2021-07-13T20:10:49Z] <thebuzzing> If you write it, I'll shill it in my network of 3 people, 2 of which use windows.
[2021-07-13T20:11:01Z] <ang> sndio, acheam
[2021-07-13T20:11:14Z] <acheam> ang: yeah I asked about that around here earlier today
[2021-07-13T20:11:23Z] <acheam> the thing is, I dont really have a use for it
[2021-07-13T20:11:28Z] <acheam> pure alsa works well enough
[2021-07-13T20:11:33Z] <ang> yeh, rather pointless most of the time
[2021-07-13T20:11:49Z] <acheam> I guess I could replace busybox ntp with openntpd
[2021-07-13T20:11:54Z] <ang> I was planning to use it for streaming audio over the network
[2021-07-13T20:12:02Z] <cem> acheam: leah has lots of openbsd software ports maybe check out her github?
[2021-07-13T20:12:11Z] <ang> but god damn mpv dropped support for sndio ;_;
[2021-07-13T20:12:12Z] <cem> https://github.com/leahneukirchen
[2021-07-13T20:12:39Z] <ang> openntpd is nice
[2021-07-13T20:12:47Z] <acheam> yeah i'm familiar with her work
[2021-07-13T20:14:59Z] <acheam> this looks really cool
[2021-07-13T20:15:00Z] <acheam> http://www.openbgpd.org/
[2021-07-13T20:17:11Z] <msk> is there something like sxhkd for wayland?
[2021-07-13T20:17:28Z] <msk> or does that have to be implemented in your compositor
[2021-07-13T20:17:40Z] <dilyn> afaik any keybinding things go through the compositor
[2021-07-13T20:18:03Z] <cem> https://git.alemauri.eu/alema/hkd
[2021-07-13T20:18:07Z] <msk> aw, I really liked bspwm's style of having that separated
[2021-07-13T20:18:14Z] <dilyn> https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxquestions/comments/5sw60t/eli5_why_wouldnt_a_program_such_as_sxhkd_work/
[2021-07-13T20:20:08Z] <cem> I tried hkd on dwl, it worked pretty well for me
[2021-07-13T20:20:51Z] <msk> I'm trying to copy the url in wterm but can't, rip
[2021-07-13T20:21:18Z] <cem> rip
[2021-07-13T20:21:33Z] <ang> I really liked the bspwm/sxhkd separation until I switched to dwm
[2021-07-13T20:21:38Z] <ang> no need to tinker with so much shit
[2021-07-13T20:22:02Z] <msk> I used dwm wth sxhkd
[2021-07-13T20:22:10Z] <schillingklaus> buut the distinction is very kiss-ish and unixy
[2021-07-13T20:22:15Z] <msk> exactly
[2021-07-13T20:22:45Z] <msk> I'm checking out cem's hkd
[2021-07-13T20:22:52Z] <msk> it says it will even work in a tty, which would be awesome
[2021-07-13T20:22:57Z] <ang> that's fine if you need a lot of special hotkeys
[2021-07-13T20:23:07Z] <ang> I don't so for me it was all just needless bikeshedding
[2021-07-13T20:23:31Z] <msk> I used it for dmenu scripts and many apps to launch
[2021-07-13T20:23:43Z] <msk> the "super + {w,m}" etc. syntax was great
[2021-07-13T20:23:58Z] <cem> yeah, I also have a bunch of hotkeys
[2021-07-13T20:25:08Z] <cem> when I was using dwm, I continued using sxhkd for any binding not wm-related
[2021-07-13T20:25:15Z] <ang> I just a plumber-like script for the most part
[2021-07-13T20:25:26Z] <ang> *I just use
[2021-07-13T20:27:02Z] <ang> what are your most used ones, cem?
[2021-07-13T20:27:29Z] <ang> msk too
[2021-07-13T20:27:40Z] <phoebos> if i right-shift a char which has it's biggest bit (128) a 1, then the bits pushed in are 1's too. ugh why
[2021-07-13T20:28:56Z] <phoebos> is there any way to put zeroes in
[2021-07-13T20:28:59Z] <cem> I have four main bindings, emacs, terminal, browser, and the launcher, I usually use them
[2021-07-13T20:29:25Z] <phoebos> ig just & it with 128
[2021-07-13T20:29:36Z] <phoebos> no wut
[2021-07-13T20:30:30Z] <phoebos> with 127
[2021-07-13T20:30:43Z] <ang> cem: if you never close those apps, there's no need for those hotkeys :p
[2021-07-13T20:31:22Z] <cem> what if I'm always spawning more instances :D
[2021-07-13T20:31:55Z] <ang> fuck, one entire emacs is not enough?
[2021-07-13T20:32:03Z] <msk> ang: here's mine: http://0x0.st/-Oxy.txt
[2021-07-13T20:32:05Z] <phoebos> or use unsigned chars
[2021-07-13T20:32:21Z] <cem> no man you need to spawn emacsclients that connect to the emacs server
[2021-07-13T20:32:33Z] <GalaxyNova> Anyone here packaged clangd?
[2021-07-13T20:32:58Z] <cem> I usually run separate emacs instances for separate projects
[2021-07-13T20:34:14Z] <cem> mfw editing 50 buffers at the same time
[2021-07-13T20:34:31Z] <ang> hah ok, I concede
[2021-07-13T20:35:01Z] <cem> I'll defend my hotkeys til I die
[2021-07-13T20:35:35Z] <cem> I have power menus nightmode menus and all sorts of crap
[2021-07-13T20:36:39Z] <dilyn> galaxynova: there's ccls, but not clangd
[2021-07-13T20:36:48Z] <dilyn> it isn't hard tho
[2021-07-13T20:41:08Z] <noocsharp> if y'all haven't seen this, it's worth the time: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pW-SOdj4Kkk
[2021-07-13T20:52:10Z] <kyxor> Jon Blow
[2021-07-13T20:52:25Z] <kyxor> Amazing dude, also watch Casey Muratori
[2021-07-13T20:53:12Z] <noocsharp> d'you see his terminal emulator made just to spite the windows terminal people?
[2021-07-13T20:53:25Z] <kyxor> yeah I saw that
[2021-07-13T20:55:07Z] <kyxor> Actually I've been handmade network lurker for very long time, though last year I burned out and left, I still have my Pbr vulkan game engine that I wrote from scratch though
[2021-07-13T20:56:13Z] <kyxor> That code base is pretty solid, pure c99, rewrote it 3 times over span of 2 years. Interesting experience.
[2021-07-13T20:56:36Z] <kyxor> Learned a lot of things
[2021-07-13T20:56:40Z] <noocsharp> neat, you have a link?
[2021-07-13T20:57:44Z] <kyxor> Nah, it's private I think I might come back to it again some time, maybe make it public
[2021-07-13T21:00:45Z] <kyxor> I am currently working on this library https://github.com/kyx0r/pikevm the goal is to create fastest regex implementation in the world? Xd but with 0 bloat and all resonable features
[2021-07-13T21:06:37Z] <acheam> heads up to all you non-gnu-ers, you can replace GNU m4 with obsd m4 from https://github.com/ibara/baseutils
[2021-07-13T21:14:32Z] <msk> anyone else having their font break on foot, but work fine on other emulators?
[2021-07-13T21:16:10Z] <msk> nvm, finally fixed it
[2021-07-13T21:29:26Z] <noocsharp> kyxor: can i ask why there are semicolons right after colons on case labels?
[2021-07-13T21:30:22Z] <kyxor> scope, it's equalent to case 'a': {}
[2021-07-13T21:30:59Z] <kyxor> when you create varibles inside switch cases they have to be scoped
[2021-07-13T21:31:34Z] <kyxor> or you can just make then outside of the switch case, I am pretty sure compilers optimize those the same way
[2021-07-13T21:32:25Z] <noocsharp> ah, i've always just used braces, didn't realize the semicolon did the same thing
[2021-07-13T21:32:38Z] <kyxor> semicolon is cleaner because you don't have to make new lines, less loc
[2021-07-13T21:34:12Z] <noocsharp> good to know
[2021-07-13T21:38:27Z] <acheam> goddamn it someone take rm -rf away from me
[2021-07-13T21:39:15Z] <kyxor> why? I had an alias rm = rm -rf for years now, never made a mistake in deleting something
[2021-07-13T21:39:54Z] <dilyn> rm="rm -i"
[2021-07-13T21:42:30Z] <kyxor> prompts are annoying, well it's interesting though, that if you do alias rm to always -Rf, then you never make mistakes because you know that this command is deadly, so you always check before you commit
[2021-07-13T21:43:29Z] <kyxor> its a psychological thing
[2021-07-13T21:43:57Z] <noocsharp> see, i just think of rm as dangerous so i don't need that
[2021-07-13T21:45:49Z] <kiedtl> heya all
[2021-07-13T21:46:01Z] <kiedtl> corrupted filesystem took me offline for two days, what'd i miss?
[2021-07-13T21:46:36Z] <dilyn> lol
[2021-07-13T21:46:37Z] <dilyn> a lot
[2021-07-13T21:47:02Z] <kiedtl> did kisslinux merge into fsf?
[2021-07-13T21:47:49Z] <kiedtl> ohhhhh
[2021-07-13T21:47:56Z] <kiedtl> dylan's back, veyr nice
[2021-07-13T21:48:39Z] <claudia> We are now 21st century linux.
[2021-07-13T21:48:41Z] <kiedtl> so it looks like stuff from kiss-community's kiss/repo "fork" is being merged back upstream after all?
[2021-07-13T21:48:59Z] <kiedtl> what about the wiki? unless im missing something there's no mention of that in the posts
[2021-07-13T21:49:02Z] <kyxor> no, dylan is doing his own thing
[2021-07-13T21:49:06Z] <kiedtl> damn
[2021-07-13T21:49:08Z] <acheam> lol hi kiedtl
[2021-07-13T21:49:13Z] <kiedtl> heay
[2021-07-13T21:49:14Z] <kyxor> wayland is not the meta
[2021-07-13T21:49:16Z] <kiedtl> heya
[2021-07-13T21:49:21Z] <acheam> heay
[2021-07-13T21:49:25Z] <kyxor> now*
[2021-07-13T21:49:28Z] <kiedtl> yeah, I can't stand wayland
[2021-07-13T21:49:48Z] <kiedtl> which probably means I won't use KISS again even if I get the chance, but well it was fun while it lasted
[2021-07-13T21:49:54Z] <kiedtl> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
[2021-07-13T21:50:24Z] <acheam> you can use KISS without the main repo!
[2021-07-13T21:50:26Z] <acheam> thats what i'm doing
[2021-07-13T21:50:32Z] <kyxor> honestly I don't even know, wayland might be actually less efficient than Xorg, because everything has to go though gpu, and compositor
[2021-07-13T21:50:38Z] <kiedtl> ^^
[2021-07-13T21:50:42Z] <kiedtl> that's one of th emain things
[2021-07-13T21:51:14Z] <kiedtl> acheam: yeah... I'm kinda at the stage where I don't really want to fiddle too much with my distro anymore, and just kind of want to use the defaults and get some actual work done :p
[2021-07-13T21:51:31Z] <dilyn> ubuntu gang
[2021-07-13T21:51:32Z] <kiedtl> so unless there's a reliable kiss-xorg repo I dunno if that'd work
[2021-07-13T21:51:32Z] <acheam> thats the path most people take lol
[2021-07-13T21:51:38Z] <acheam> there will be im sure
[2021-07-13T21:51:39Z] <kiedtl> I mean, I still use alpine
[2021-07-13T21:51:43Z] <dilyn> there IS a kiss-xorg repo
[2021-07-13T21:51:49Z] <kiedtl> ah, nice
[2021-07-13T21:51:49Z] <dilyn> you could also take over kiss-community/repo
[2021-07-13T21:52:01Z] <dilyn> which I am going to turn into a kiss-xorg+libressl repo at the end of the month
[2021-07-13T21:52:19Z] <kiedtl> but then I'd have to blame myself for screwed up packages :(
[2021-07-13T21:52:26Z] <dilyn> :)
[2021-07-13T21:52:49Z] <kiedtl> I'd rather take peace in the thought that I can always just come here and howl when I find a borken package
[2021-07-13T21:53:08Z] <acheam> I will say, ive tried way more new things now that i've hard forked
[2021-07-13T21:53:18Z] <kiedtl> but I'm just spoiled, lol
[2021-07-13T21:53:27Z] <kiedtl> Yeah, KISS is a really nice learning experience
[2021-07-13T21:53:28Z] <akira01> guys
[2021-07-13T21:53:38Z] <akira01> now that kiss is wayland pure
[2021-07-13T21:53:50Z] <kiedtl> but now that I'm kind of disillusioned with the whole simplicity thing I'm beginning to wonder if that's the only thing it's good at :(
[2021-07-13T21:53:50Z] <akira01> chroot is not more a option right?
[2021-07-13T21:54:01Z] <kiedtl> ...?
[2021-07-13T21:54:21Z] <acheam> you can launch wayland programs from within a chroot so long that XDG_RUNTIME_DIR is mounted
[2021-07-13T21:54:52Z] <akira01> but i mean X programs
[2021-07-13T21:54:57Z] <kyxor> but sadly not x11 programs, like I run blender from arch-chroot
[2021-07-13T21:55:04Z] <akira01> yeah
[2021-07-13T21:55:08Z] <akira01> that what i mean
[2021-07-13T21:55:28Z] <akira01> someone pls do xwayland package in community for community sake
[2021-07-13T21:55:43Z] <kiedtl> you go ahead :)
[2021-07-13T21:56:03Z] <dilyn> xwayland not allowed
[2021-07-13T21:56:14Z] <akira01> but dilyn :(
[2021-07-13T21:56:22Z] <kiedtl> tf? Do the repos have to be *that* pure of x11?
[2021-07-13T21:56:26Z] <acheam> if youre using xwayland just use xorg
[2021-07-13T21:56:46Z] <dilyn> ^
[2021-07-13T21:56:48Z] <akira01> I just need xwayland for steam and nothing more
[2021-07-13T21:57:00Z] <dilyn> so build xorg-server with xwayland enabled
[2021-07-13T21:57:04Z] <dilyn> and mesa with the x11 platform
[2021-07-13T21:57:21Z] <dilyn> ezclap
[2021-07-13T22:00:27Z] <noocsharp> crazy that dylan's decision caused so many people to move to wayland
[2021-07-13T22:00:45Z] <soliwilos> Pretty sure you'd also need to do things like build wlroots with xwayland support. If you use a compositor which relies on it.
[2021-07-13T22:01:32Z] <dilyn> yes also that
[2021-07-13T22:02:26Z] <thebuzzing> Without the intent of starting a war, why did we decide wayland is an okay redhat decision, but like, pulseaudio is satan?
[2021-07-13T22:04:12Z] <noocsharp> wayland is simpler than its predecessor, pulseaudio is more complicated
[2021-07-13T22:04:26Z] <noocsharp> it has nothing to do with red hat afaic
[2021-07-13T22:05:15Z] <soliwilos> Didn't more or less the majority of Xorg devs leave the project to make something simpler/better?
[2021-07-13T22:05:21Z] <thebuzzing> Makes sense, it's just about simplicity?
[2021-07-13T22:05:40Z] <noocsharp> keep it simple stupid
[2021-07-13T22:06:32Z] <kiedtl> it is true, wayland is free of a lot of legacy trash from xorg
[2021-07-13T22:06:35Z] <thebuzzing> A few months back, prior to Dylan taking a break, the room was talking about how Redhat devs had posted a blog saying they were basically the sole maintainers of Xorg, and they were no longer interested in it, so they were going to dump it and we had to either like it or lump it.
[2021-07-13T22:06:54Z] <kiedtl> I mean yes
[2021-07-13T22:07:04Z] <thebuzzing> I remember the room being sorta mad about it, but since then we've obviously had a change of heart, just wondered what the turning point was.
[2021-07-13T22:07:22Z] <kiedtl> when you're the maintainer of an ancient codebase nobody blames you when you decide to quit
[2021-07-13T22:07:33Z] <kyxor> but now redhat is gone, it was bought by other company right?
[2021-07-13T22:07:36Z] <kiedtl> at least, I don't blame them
[2021-07-13T22:07:49Z] <kiedtl> erm, they're not really gone
[2021-07-13T22:07:53Z] <thebuzzing> IBM, but I think they let them basically continue as before.
[2021-07-13T22:07:56Z] <kiedtl> ^^
[2021-07-13T22:08:36Z] <thebuzzing> I guess I don't blame them either. I don't even want to maintain my own systems, let alone legacy other peoples systems.
[2021-07-13T22:13:04Z] <acheam> ok I give in
[2021-07-13T22:13:09Z] <acheam> im installing chromium
[2021-07-13T22:13:21Z] <kyxor> oh yehaaa
[2021-07-13T22:13:46Z] <acheam> I find it funny that chromium needs node to build
[2021-07-13T22:14:04Z] <acheam> like, you need to compile a part of chromium to build that same part of chromium again
[2021-07-13T22:14:15Z] <kyxor> yeah lets build that V8 js engine twice
[2021-07-13T22:15:26Z] <thebuzzing> Hey, if you install chromium you can enjoy the unparalleled joy of laggy gaming on various streaming platforms!
[2021-07-13T22:15:29Z] <kiedtl> acheam: what happened? too many firefox issues?
[2021-07-13T22:15:35Z] <acheam> too many webkit issues
[2021-07-13T22:15:39Z] <acheam> I never used firefox on kiss
[2021-07-13T22:15:39Z] <kiedtl> ouch
[2021-07-13T22:16:04Z] <acheam> more just that I dont want to keep gtk, ruby, ruby, and some GNU libraries around for my browser
[2021-07-13T22:16:23Z] <acheam> s/ruby/perl
[2021-07-13T22:18:20Z] <kyxor> rusty firefox < fat chromium
[2021-07-13T22:19:14Z] <acheam> indeed
[2021-07-13T22:19:26Z] <acheam> I dont even have words to describe webkit
[2021-07-13T22:19:43Z] <acheam> I was considering palememe
[2021-07-13T22:19:47Z] <rio6> I kinda want gcc to be able to compile rust so I don't need to install llvm, but at the same time compile time for gcc would be even slower
[2021-07-13T22:19:47Z] <acheam> but that requires gtk3
[2021-07-13T22:19:58Z] <acheam> rio6: boy do I have news for you
[2021-07-13T22:20:18Z] <noocsharp> webkit has 2 million lines of c++
[2021-07-13T22:21:37Z] <acheam> and ruby
[2021-07-13T22:21:38Z] <acheam> and perl
[2021-07-13T22:21:52Z] <rio6> heh https://rust-gcc.github.io/
[2021-07-13T22:23:02Z] <kyxor> this is bad, if gcc gets rusty, then chances of kernel getting rusty is even higher than before
[2021-07-13T22:23:12Z] <acheam> kernel is getting rusty
[2021-07-13T22:23:19Z] <acheam> thats not a question in my mind
[2021-07-13T22:23:24Z] <acheam> but at least it will be sloooooow
[2021-07-13T22:23:47Z] <acheam> it will mostly be obscure device drivers at first
[2021-07-13T22:23:55Z] <acheam> nobody really wants to rewrite ELF loading in rust
[2021-07-13T22:24:00Z] <noocsharp> i wonder how many files of code can be deleted in the major browser engines without anyone noticing
[2021-07-13T22:24:37Z] <noocsharp> i don't think rust's gonna become super popular in the kernel at all
[2021-07-13T22:25:06Z] <rio6> there will be people pushing for it
[2021-07-13T22:25:13Z] <GalaxyNova> I would really not like rust in the kernel
[2021-07-13T22:25:17Z] <GalaxyNova> rust takes ages to compile
[2021-07-13T22:25:18Z] <noocsharp> and there will be more pushing back probably
[2021-07-13T22:25:24Z] <GalaxyNova> nah
[2021-07-13T22:25:27Z] <GalaxyNova> we're the minority
[2021-07-13T22:25:41Z] <GalaxyNova> most people don't care about compile times because other people do the compilling for them
[2021-07-13T22:25:58Z] <thebuzzing> I doubt most people are pushing back, most people just have no strong feelings either way.
[2021-07-13T22:26:03Z] <noocsharp> but kernel developers do, and they will be pushing back
[2021-07-13T22:26:30Z] <rio6> yeah rust compilation is really slow
[2021-07-13T22:26:36Z] <kyxor> the problem I see with rust is that its a parasite, they don't just rewrite everything from ground up, they use up all C and C++ stuff, require wrappers and create bloat. Just the fact that rust uses llvm instead of making their own llvm written in rust, is terrible.
[2021-07-13T22:26:37Z] <GalaxyNova> not only that
[2021-07-13T22:26:44Z] <GalaxyNova> compilling rustc and cargo also takes a lot of time
[2021-07-13T22:26:50Z] <kiedtl> too slow? no, don't you see, you just have too many lines of code!
[2021-07-13T22:26:58Z] <GalaxyNova> and rustc is a frontend to llvm so that's also pulled in as a dep...
[2021-07-13T22:27:01Z] <acheam> was waiting for kiedtl's input lol
[2021-07-13T22:27:06Z] <kiedtl> (/s)
[2021-07-13T22:27:19Z] <acheam> rustc can soon be a frontend to gcc
[2021-07-13T22:27:22Z] <kiedtl> and yes, I am silently celebrating at the thought of a Rust frontend for gcc
[2021-07-13T22:27:34Z] <kiedtl> and for Rust inclusion in the kernel, hehe
[2021-07-13T22:27:37Z] <GalaxyNova> that's a relatively new development
[2021-07-13T22:27:57Z] <acheam> it is indeed
[2021-07-13T22:28:18Z] <rio6> I don't think the kernel even has c++
[2021-07-13T22:28:28Z] <noocsharp> acheam: chromium has python instead of ruby/perl
[2021-07-13T22:28:33Z] <kyxor> people think making more layers of abstraction makes the program simpler, while in reality it is a complete opposite.
[2021-07-13T22:28:40Z] <GalaxyNova> ^^^
[2021-07-13T22:28:52Z] <acheam> noocsharp: id rather have python2 over ruby/perl
[2021-07-13T22:29:05Z] <noocsharp> fair
[2021-07-13T22:29:39Z] <cem> they are all dead languages after all
[2021-07-13T22:30:12Z] <kiedtl> not ruby
[2021-07-13T22:30:44Z] <cem> ruby is as alive as perl
[2021-07-13T22:30:54Z] <noocsharp> they all *should be dead languages
[2021-07-13T22:30:54Z] <kiedtl> ruby is used quite a bit in the webdev sector
[2021-07-13T22:31:08Z] <acheam> perl would be honestly cool if it was still well adopted, and python didnt exist
[2021-07-13T22:31:11Z] <kiedtl> now whether they deserve to be dead is another question
[2021-07-13T22:31:21Z] <acheam> like, I wouldnt mind the combo of C + sh + perl
[2021-07-13T22:31:45Z] <noocsharp> great way to make an ugly language
[2021-07-13T22:31:49Z] <kiedtl> acheam: I dunno, I've tried perl and it just wasn't great
[2021-07-13T22:31:54Z] <cem> interpreted languages were a mistake
[2021-07-13T22:32:02Z] <cem> with the exception of sh and awk
[2021-07-13T22:32:06Z] <acheam> thank god
[2021-07-13T22:32:19Z] <kyxor> cem: shell is pretty good
[2021-07-13T22:32:42Z] <kyxor> as interpreted language, everything else not needed
[2021-07-13T22:32:49Z] <kiedtl> lol
[2021-07-13T22:32:50Z] <noocsharp> i still think using a low-level language in a shell is not a bad idea
[2021-07-13T22:33:07Z] <kiedtl> something like an interpreted C?
[2021-07-13T22:33:09Z] <kyxor> I like the idea of TempleOs shell
[2021-07-13T22:33:14Z] <cem> noocsharp: just pipe into gcc
[2021-07-13T22:33:16Z] <noocsharp> yeah, holyc is waht i was thinking
[2021-07-13T22:33:19Z] <kiedtl> TempleOS shell sounds really cool
[2021-07-13T22:33:26Z] <kiedtl> ought to try that sometime
[2021-07-13T22:34:15Z] <noocsharp> i started writing a parser for a language that may or may not be complete in several years, for that purpose
[2021-07-13T22:35:06Z] <GalaxyNova> noocsharp: compiller would be horribly slow
[2021-07-13T22:35:17Z] <GalaxyNova> and the code would be full of hacks
[2021-07-13T22:35:26Z] <noocsharp> wdym?
[2021-07-13T22:35:28Z] <kiedtl> What makes you think so?
[2021-07-13T22:35:38Z] <noocsharp> the templeos jit compiler is super fast
[2021-07-13T22:36:04Z] <kiedtl> it's not necessarily compiling a full binary, it's just running the code
[2021-07-13T22:38:02Z] <rio6> some sort of jit
[2021-07-13T22:39:08Z] <kyxor> you do guys ever get a bug in kirc when you reach the end of terminal window size, the text starts to wrap to new lines and displays corrupted symbols. doesn't always happen, probably depends on the last character
[2021-07-13T22:41:32Z] <acheam> mcpcpc_: ^
[2021-07-13T22:41:56Z] <kyxor> https://0x0.st/-O3g.png
[2021-07-13T22:41:59Z] <kyxor> see this?
[2021-07-13T22:42:01Z] <noocsharp> i think you mean: ^^^ MCPCPC ^^^
[2021-07-13T22:42:11Z] <GalaxyNova> buffer overflow?
[2021-07-13T22:42:14Z] <GalaxyNova> maybe?
[2021-07-13T22:42:31Z] <acheam> noocsharp: :)
[2021-07-13T22:43:04Z] <kyxor> Well I think it somehow also gets ascii new line control character, cause why would the line wrap like that
[2021-07-13T22:43:18Z] <kiedtl> kyxor: looks like a bug in the input code
[2021-07-13T22:43:29Z] <kiedtl> but without looking at the code one can't be sure
[2021-07-13T22:44:00Z] <kyxor> it's so weird, you guys get that also? kirc-0.2.6
[2021-07-13T22:44:20Z] <kyxor> Becuase if you don't get this bug it may be a bug in the terminal too, but I doubt that
[2021-07-13T22:48:19Z] <acheam> wait how didn't I realize that chromium has a perl make dep
[2021-07-13T22:48:35Z] <acheam> i thought dilyn didnt have perl installed :(
[2021-07-13T22:49:13Z] <thebuzzing> lynx or bust.
[2021-07-13T22:49:24Z] <acheam> I do use lynx
[2021-07-13T22:49:32Z] <acheam> its the default browser in my repo
[2021-07-13T22:51:35Z] <mcpcpc_> kyxor: will take a look later. getting dinner ^^
[2021-07-13T22:52:26Z] <acheam> ah i didnt realize it because its actually a dep of nss, not chromium
[2021-07-13T22:54:19Z] <acheam> as usual mcpcpc_ is working on the go
[2021-07-13T22:55:52Z] <mcpcpc_> ^^
[2021-07-13T22:57:20Z] <msk> Anyone else getting http://0x0.st/-O36.txt when building qt5?
[2021-07-13T22:59:45Z] <acheam> uh do you have openssl or libressl installed?
[2021-07-13T23:00:00Z] <msk> I have both
[2021-07-13T23:00:07Z] <acheam> that sounds problematic
[2021-07-13T23:00:42Z] <msk> I still have a lot of packages that require libressl
[2021-07-13T23:02:14Z] <msk> some of which have new version with openssl, but qt5 is the first to update, and it fails the build
[2021-07-13T23:11:34Z] <GalaxyNova> msk: Purge libressl
[2021-07-13T23:11:57Z] <GalaxyNova> you can kiss-fork the packages to change the dependencies if they hard depend on libressl
[2021-07-13T23:15:24Z] <msk> won't some of them break if I do that?
[2021-07-13T23:16:30Z] <msk> I'll try it, though
[2021-07-13T23:16:46Z] <acheam> probably not
[2021-07-13T23:16:52Z] <GalaxyNova> that's what I did and it worked
[2021-07-13T23:17:28Z] <GalaxyNova> it's pretty unlikely that some package would explicitly need libressl and not have support for openssl
[2021-07-13T23:17:56Z] <acheam> catgirl hard deps on libressl
[2021-07-13T23:18:06Z] <acheam> but libtls works as a between
[2021-07-13T23:18:16Z] <GalaxyNova> does it not work with open?
[2021-07-13T23:18:24Z] <acheam> not to my knowlege
[2021-07-13T23:18:52Z] <GalaxyNova> tried it on void w/ openssl and it worked just fine
[2021-07-13T23:19:08Z] <acheam> without libtls?
[2021-07-13T23:19:15Z] <GalaxyNova> with libtls
[2021-07-13T23:19:21Z] <acheam> yeah thats what I meant
[2021-07-13T23:19:34Z] <acheam> it works on openssl with libtls
[2021-07-13T23:19:38Z] <acheam> it works on libressl without it
[2021-07-13T23:19:43Z] <GalaxyNova> oh i see
[2021-07-13T23:26:56Z] <dilyn> catgirl requires libtls, that's the only special part of libressl it likes
[2021-07-13T23:27:00Z] <dilyn> that's why june made libtls...
[2021-07-13T23:27:28Z] <noocsharp> libretls
[2021-07-13T23:27:40Z] <dilyn> libretls*
[2021-07-13T23:27:58Z] <thebuzzing> June's on BSD normally aren't they?
[2021-07-13T23:28:20Z] <dilyn> i believe so
[2021-07-13T23:29:19Z] <thebuzzing> I could never get any of the BSD's to work the way I wanted. Maybe I ought to try again now I'm older and probably dumber...
[2021-07-13T23:34:38Z] <acheam> libretls*
[2021-07-13T23:35:09Z] <acheam> how is it possible that chromium has 47737 build steps
[2021-07-13T23:35:29Z] <acheam> I literally didnt realize that it was in the range of 40000, and not 4000
[2021-07-13T23:35:45Z] <kyxor> it used to be 42k about 6 month's ago
[2021-07-13T23:36:00Z] <acheam> this isnt the build in community
[2021-07-13T23:36:01Z] <kyxor> its growing by 2k each new version
[2021-07-13T23:36:08Z] <acheam> so that +/- might not be a version thing
[2021-07-13T23:36:29Z] <kyxor> perhaps