gemini - kennedy.gemi.dev

💾 Archived View for gemini.ctrl-c.club › ~phoebos › logs › kisslinux-2021-06-29.txt captured on 2024-05-12 at 16:04:55.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-
[2021-06-29T00:34:15Z] <riteo> god invidious is so comfy
[2021-06-29T00:34:41Z] <riteo> youtube's stock player is so bad
[2021-06-29T00:35:59Z] <midfavila> now that you've taken the invidious pill, take the links2+tabbed pill
[2021-06-29T00:36:05Z] <riteo> thanks mid for enligthening me
[2021-06-29T00:36:11Z] <midfavila> np
[2021-06-29T00:36:50Z] <riteo> why links and not surf btw?
[2021-06-29T00:37:06Z] <midfavila> >webkit >gtk3 
[2021-06-29T00:37:18Z] <Guest28> Invidious is not comfy when the instance is overburdened and the video won't buffer
[2021-06-29T00:37:28Z] <midfavila> that's called "use a different instance"
[2021-06-29T00:37:37Z] <michael> x
[2021-06-29T00:37:39Z] <midfavila> or, alternatively
[2021-06-29T00:37:41Z] <riteo> yeah I'm using a very small one and it's extremely fast
[2021-06-29T00:37:44Z] <midfavila> "make a donation"
[2021-06-29T00:37:55Z] <midfavila> i imagine serving a few thousand people is kind of expensive.
[2021-06-29T00:38:20Z] <michael> surf is quite slow
[2021-06-29T00:38:29Z] <midfavila> also that.
[2021-06-29T00:40:15Z] <riteo> I see
[2021-06-29T00:40:38Z] <riteo> that sounds like the next step, although I'll surely have to step into JS-heavy pages, expecially when I'll get back to school
[2021-06-29T00:40:58Z] <michael> is indivious better than using mpv for youtube?
[2021-06-29T00:41:06Z] <riteo> it depends on what you want to do ig
[2021-06-29T00:41:12Z] <midfavila> i mean, i don't even bother with mpv, but
[2021-06-29T00:41:12Z] <dilyn> Guest28: you need EDID support for most things relating to the kernel knowing aything about your screen 
[2021-06-29T00:41:23Z] <dilyn> acheam: who the fuck needs to the know the time in ms...
[2021-06-29T00:41:27Z] <midfavila> as it stands I just pipe the contents of an invidious download to ffplay
[2021-06-29T00:41:37Z] <midfavila> dilyn you mean you don't have an atomic clock connected to your computer to measure boot times?
[2021-06-29T00:41:57Z] <riteo> mpv downloaded always the highest definition video, but I can't seem to find any way to get an hd video on js-free invidious
[2021-06-29T00:42:11Z] <dilyn> i know that they're sub 5 seconds, why do I need to know more :thinking: 
[2021-06-29T00:42:21Z] <midfavila> you have to download the video stream and combine it with the audio stream
[2021-06-29T00:42:37Z] <midfavila> combined, they only really offer 360 or 720, as far as I know
[2021-06-29T00:42:49Z] <riteo> that doesn't look 720 to me
[2021-06-29T00:43:09Z] <midfavila> check the stream dimensions then. idk.
[2021-06-29T00:44:07Z] <riteo> yup it's 360
[2021-06-29T00:44:22Z] <riteo> if I turn on JS it works fine
[2021-06-29T00:44:39Z] <midfavila> unrelated
[2021-06-29T00:44:43Z] <midfavila> acheam https://vid.puffyan.us/watch?v=cQTiUFH5Bcw
[2021-06-29T00:44:46Z] <midfavila> sotd suggestion
[2021-06-29T00:45:02Z] <riteo> funky
[2021-06-29T00:45:03Z] <Guest28> @dilyn So like xrandr would need EDID
[2021-06-29T00:45:10Z] <midfavila> yes, it does
[2021-06-29T00:45:17Z] <midfavila> or manual specification in your X config
[2021-06-29T01:35:19Z] <acheam> dilyn: I just thought second long increments were a lot when we're talking 1-5 seconds
[2021-06-29T01:35:34Z] <acheam> its more interesting to have some decimal places :)
[2021-06-29T01:39:44Z] <acheam> but it doesn't need to be upstream, I just kiss forked and added a sed call
[2021-06-29T01:40:54Z] <Guest28> ALSA recognze my RX 580 card after setting the default card to 1 but I am not sure what to do now... No volume settings in alsamixer just five "S/PDIF" options which can only be toggled
[2021-06-29T01:42:48Z] <Guest28> There are five HDMI devices, I need to find which is DisplayPort 2 because that's what I am connected to.
[2021-06-29T01:43:14Z] <necromansy> afaik you wont get a connection for DP
[2021-06-29T01:43:20Z] <necromansy> coz its not AV
[2021-06-29T01:43:47Z] <Guest28> What do you mean
[2021-06-29T01:43:59Z] <midfavila> DP in theory is capable of audio
[2021-06-29T01:44:04Z] <midfavila> but I've never had it work
[2021-06-29T01:44:07Z] * midfavila shrugs
[2021-06-29T01:44:16Z] <Guest28> I had it work on other distro using PulseAudio
[2021-06-29T01:44:38Z] <necromansy> well colour me shocked, i thought it was visual only
[2021-06-29T01:45:01Z] <midfavila> nope.
[2021-06-29T01:45:02Z] <Guest28> Nope. HDMI and DP both support audio but not DVI (unless you use a HDMI adapter)
[2021-06-29T01:45:05Z] <midfavila> it's capable of everything HDMI is
[2021-06-29T01:45:20Z] <necromansy> :| i hate this
[2021-06-29T01:45:23Z] <Guest28> DVI and vga no sound
[2021-06-29T01:46:16Z] <acheam> very successful day in kiss for me: switched to mdev, 
[2021-06-29T01:46:19Z] <necromansy> what does aplay -l return you?
[2021-06-29T01:46:38Z] <acheam> removed util-linux
[2021-06-29T01:46:44Z] <acheam> shaved a few megs off my kernel
[2021-06-29T01:47:16Z] <midfavila> what do you use in stead of fdisk?
[2021-06-29T01:47:24Z] <acheam> BUSYBOX
[2021-06-29T01:47:28Z] <midfavila> ew
[2021-06-29T01:47:34Z] <midfavila> i disapprove
[2021-06-29T01:47:41Z] <riteo> thinking about it, why doesn't busybox have pax?
[2021-06-29T01:47:54Z] <midfavila> because nobody cares about pax or cpio or ar
[2021-06-29T01:48:16Z] <riteo> well, considering it's in the POSIX standard people should care I think
[2021-06-29T01:48:21Z] <Guest28> necromansy https://ghostbin.com/paste/w5pLe
[2021-06-29T01:49:00Z] <Guest28> The card has two HDMI ports and two DP ports so im not sure what the other two are
[2021-06-29T01:50:19Z] <dilyn> who needs fdisk 
[2021-06-29T01:50:40Z] <dilyn> DP and HDMI are only toggleable; sound is controlled on the device itself 
[2021-06-29T01:50:54Z] <dilyn> they're basically SPDIF devices as far as alsamixer is concerned
[2021-06-29T01:51:03Z] <Guest28> Okay
[2021-06-29T01:51:08Z] <riteo> dilyn: wait, what do you use instead of fdisk?
[2021-06-29T01:51:19Z] <dilyn> am I regularly partitioning disks? 
[2021-06-29T01:51:27Z] <Guest28> Every day
[2021-06-29T01:51:34Z] <Guest28> Every waking moment
[2021-06-29T01:51:34Z] <riteo> oh that's what you meant
[2021-06-29T01:51:41Z] <dilyn> I mean, technically I now have util-linux installed. but I haven't partitioned a disk since... I installed KISS on this drive a year ago 
[2021-06-29T01:51:51Z] <dilyn> just don't make mistakes, ezclap
[2021-06-29T01:52:11Z] <acheam> I still technically have util linux installed, but just the libuuid part
[2021-06-29T01:52:16Z] <acheam> for syslinux
[2021-06-29T01:52:21Z] <acheam> at least until I can fork it
[2021-06-29T01:52:37Z] <acheam> and trim the UUID bloat
[2021-06-29T01:52:40Z] <dilyn> yeah i really only need util-linux for zfs, so I could definitely cut it up 
[2021-06-29T01:52:41Z] <necromansy> Guest28: http://0x0.st/-p6o.txt
[2021-06-29T01:52:57Z] <necromansy> try making an ~/.asound.conf and try diff device numbers
[2021-06-29T01:53:19Z] <dilyn> device number will correspond to whichever port you chose, but it isn't 1,2,3,4
[2021-06-29T01:53:22Z] <dilyn> mine are like, 3 7 10 11
[2021-06-29T01:53:26Z] <necromansy> yeah
[2021-06-29T01:53:34Z] <Guest28> Right. Will this make a different in alsamixer? Wouldn't I need to do speaker-test?
[2021-06-29T01:53:51Z] <necromansy> you can trial with speaker-test to see if it works
[2021-06-29T01:53:55Z] <dilyn> it just sets the default device 
[2021-06-29T01:54:09Z] <dilyn> well, a little more than that 
[2021-06-29T01:54:13Z] <dilyn> but that's the eli5 version
[2021-06-29T01:54:47Z] <Guest28> Also I am going to turn on FIRMWARE_EDID in the kernel I am not sure if that even needed
[2021-06-29T01:55:06Z] <dilyn> yes
[2021-06-29T01:55:22Z] <dilyn> you don't need to do anything else unless you wrote a custom EDID for your display
[2021-06-29T01:55:44Z] <dilyn> or have a screen that the kernel includes drivers and stuff for, but that's also unlikely 
[2021-06-29T01:55:57Z] <necromansy> ALSA is always a bane for me on new systems
[2021-06-29T01:56:06Z] <dilyn> alsa justwerks on KISS :v 
[2021-06-29T01:56:17Z] <Guest28> By anything else you mean that FIRMWARE_EDID is needed
[2021-06-29T01:56:51Z] <acheam> until you need balance recording streams and stuff
[2021-06-29T01:57:02Z] <dilyn> i mean it's not 'needed' but you'd definitely want to enable it (: 
[2021-06-29T01:57:42Z] <Guest28> ok
[2021-06-29T01:57:58Z] <Guest28> and btw alsa is the last hurdle i need to overcome lol
[2021-06-29T01:58:41Z] <dilyn> another one's made it lads 
[2021-06-29T01:58:51Z] <dilyn> bring out the confetti cannons 
[2021-06-29T01:58:57Z] <midfavila> jthe horde grows
[2021-06-29T01:59:11Z] <midfavila> prepare the hazing rituals, acheam
[2021-06-29T01:59:22Z] <necromansy> welcomewelcome
[2021-06-29T01:59:44Z] <Guest28> brb
[2021-06-29T02:01:26Z] * acheam pulls cling film around mid's face
[2021-06-29T02:01:44Z] * midfavila screams and flails
[2021-06-29T02:03:06Z] <Guest78> So when I do speaker-test what should happen? A sound plays?
[2021-06-29T02:03:16Z] <midfavila> static plays
[2021-06-29T02:03:47Z] <dilyn> like nails on a chalkboard 
[2021-06-29T02:03:52Z] <Guest78> My fan in my room is on so gonna turn that off 
[2021-06-29T02:03:54Z] <dilyn> I just open a browser instead :)  
[2021-06-29T02:03:57Z] <Guest78> It's summer here
[2021-06-29T02:05:23Z] <acheam> hmmm my media keys don't work with mdev
[2021-06-29T02:05:43Z] <acheam> according to xev, they dont output an xf* keycode anymore
[2021-06-29T02:05:52Z] <acheam> I guess I could just use the hex key code
[2021-06-29T02:07:05Z] <Guest78> No static from any device
[2021-06-29T02:09:02Z] <Guest78> When I added device <NUM> to my alsa config I got another bar in alsamixer that is labelled PCM
[2021-06-29T02:09:14Z] <Guest78> And I can change the "percentage"
[2021-06-29T02:11:16Z] <Guest78> Or maybe that was because of speaker-test
[2021-06-29T02:26:12Z] <kimerus> You used what guide for alsa?
[2021-06-29T02:26:26Z] <kimerus> Guest78: 
[2021-06-29T02:27:20Z] <Guest78> None specifically, just did a bit of Googling
[2021-06-29T02:27:35Z] <Guest78> Mostly Arch Wiki I guess
[2021-06-29T02:27:43Z] <kimerus> What are the lines in your asoundrc?
[2021-06-29T02:27:59Z] <Guest78> defaults.pcm.!card 1
[2021-06-29T02:28:00Z] <Guest78> defaults.ctl.!card 1
[2021-06-29T02:28:00Z] <Guest78> defaults.pcm.!device 3
[2021-06-29T02:28:01Z] <Guest78> defaults.ctl.!device 3
[2021-06-29T02:28:14Z] <Guest78> The available devices are 3, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11
[2021-06-29T02:28:38Z] <kimerus> I guesse the problem is that have two ctl devices
[2021-06-29T02:28:57Z] <Guest78> One is card and the other is device
[2021-06-29T02:29:52Z] <kimerus> Try remove the ctl device
[2021-06-29T02:30:31Z] <Guest78> Ok
[2021-06-29T02:30:35Z] <midfavila> have you checked if your refrigerator is running
[2021-06-29T02:31:32Z] <Guest78> Wondering if I should install pulse audio
[2021-06-29T02:31:46Z] <kimerus> Better out of the box
[2021-06-29T02:31:53Z] <kimerus> But i don't need
[2021-06-29T02:31:58Z] <kimerus> Just works fine with alsa
[2021-06-29T02:32:15Z] <kimerus> Only problem is firefox with the mic
[2021-06-29T02:32:30Z] <kimerus> But i don't use 
[2021-06-29T02:32:51Z] <Guest78> Well I'd install it to trouble shoot
[2021-06-29T02:33:08Z] <midfavila> layering stuff on top of the issue makes the issue harder to figure out
[2021-06-29T02:33:59Z] <kimerus> Guest78: 
[2021-06-29T02:34:20Z] <kimerus> What are the path of you asoundrc?
[2021-06-29T02:34:35Z] <riteo> midfavila: also pulseaudio is way more weird and unreliable than ALSA IMO
[2021-06-29T02:34:43Z] <Guest78> I was using the system-wide one at /etc/asound.conf
[2021-06-29T02:34:55Z] <kimerus> Strange
[2021-06-29T02:34:59Z] <kimerus> Is okay
[2021-06-29T02:35:05Z] <midfavila> check your default sound device
[2021-06-29T02:35:10Z] <kimerus> Yeah
[2021-06-29T02:35:12Z] <midfavila> it's probably pointing at your onboard sound card
[2021-06-29T02:35:16Z] <midfavila> as opposed to the gpu
[2021-06-29T02:35:27Z] <kimerus> Can you send your aplay -L?
[2021-06-29T02:35:29Z] <Guest78> The only card iis 1
[2021-06-29T02:36:03Z] <kimerus> But the devices?
[2021-06-29T02:36:08Z] <Guest78> https://ghostbin.com/paste/fRI1Q
[2021-06-29T02:36:29Z] <Guest78> 3, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11 are the device nums
[2021-06-29T02:37:05Z] <Guest78> Based on some forum posts online HDA ATI HDMI does represent the RX 580 card I am using
[2021-06-29T02:38:18Z] <kimerus> You tested if other devices works?
[2021-06-29T02:38:47Z] <Guest78> The motherboard audio on my PC is actually broken so thats' why I am using the GPU
[2021-06-29T02:39:48Z] <Guest78> And it did work on Arch w/ pulse
[2021-06-29T02:39:57Z] <Guest78> the GPU that is
[2021-06-29T02:40:19Z] <Guest78> The motherboard audio problem is hardware AFAIK, probably short circuit or something like that
[2021-06-29T02:42:53Z] <Guest78> Hmm, maybe if I use an ubuntu livecd or something like that I can see what alsa says there
[2021-06-29T02:43:09Z] <Guest78> Because the audio works out of box on Ubuntu
[2021-06-29T02:45:57Z] <kimerus> Did you build the drivers in kernel?
[2021-06-29T02:46:04Z] <kimerus> For alsa
[2021-06-29T02:46:15Z] <kimerus> And sound cards
[2021-06-29T02:47:07Z] <Guest78> Err I see stuff like VIDEO_TM6000_ALSA disabled
[2021-06-29T02:47:22Z] <Guest78> I think these are device-specific tho
[2021-06-29T02:47:23Z] <kimerus> I mean
[2021-06-29T02:47:30Z] <kimerus> The codecs
[2021-06-29T02:47:34Z] <Guest78> Yes
[2021-06-29T02:47:45Z] <Guest78> I did intel and hdmi 
[2021-06-29T02:49:11Z] <kimerus> Well
[2021-06-29T02:49:26Z] <kimerus> I not see any about intel in kernel
[2021-06-29T02:49:44Z] <kimerus> Can you see the HD-Audio section in kernel menuconfig?
[2021-06-29T02:50:09Z] <Guest78> What do you mean?
[2021-06-29T02:50:23Z] <acheam> under device drivers then audio drivers then HD audio
[2021-06-29T02:50:27Z] <acheam> or something like thay
[2021-06-29T02:50:42Z] <acheam> you might need to check off the right box for your chipsey
[2021-06-29T02:51:15Z] <Guest78> Chip in alsa says ATI R6xx HDMI
[2021-06-29T02:51:22Z] <Guest78> I Will see if i can find something like that
[2021-06-29T02:51:55Z] <kimerus> ALSA - Gentoo Wiki – https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/ALSA
[2021-06-29T02:52:02Z] <kimerus> Check this
[2021-06-29T02:52:09Z] <kimerus> See the kernel section
[2021-06-29T02:52:24Z] <kimerus> In HD-Audio
[2021-06-29T02:54:55Z] <Guest78> In HD Audio the one I had enabled was Build HDMI/DisplayPort HD-audio codec support
[2021-06-29T02:56:14Z] <kimerus> Enable the realtek one
[2021-06-29T02:56:23Z] <kimerus> Just see if changes your aplay 
[2021-06-29T02:56:43Z] <Guest78> The gentoo wiki says to enable all and let the generic HD-audio codec parser pick the right one. Shoulds I do that?
[2021-06-29T02:56:52Z] <Guest78> Or just Realtek for now?
[2021-06-29T02:57:10Z] <kimerus> Just realtek for noe
[2021-06-29T02:57:22Z] <kimerus> But you can try what the wiki says
[2021-06-29T02:57:25Z] <kimerus> Maybe is better
[2021-06-29T03:05:59Z] <Guest28> Yeah my aplay is different now hang on
[2021-06-29T03:06:20Z] <Guest28> https://ghostbin.com/paste/hM9mq
[2021-06-29T03:07:10Z] <kimerus> Yeah
[2021-06-29T03:07:19Z] <kimerus> You correct device is 0
[2021-06-29T03:09:27Z] <Guest28> Thats the onboard right ?
[2021-06-29T03:09:56Z] <kimerus> Don't know
[2021-06-29T03:10:15Z] <kimerus> But the gentoo wiki says to use the front card
[2021-06-29T03:10:48Z] <Guest28> I need the graphics card (HDA ATI HDMI) 
[2021-06-29T03:12:33Z] <Guest28> The HDA Intel PCH is the onboard which doesnt work
[2021-06-29T03:36:30Z] <midfavila> acheam you mentioned nyxt can't be packaged for kiss because of something to do with gio and glibc right?
[2021-06-29T03:36:59Z] <acheam> gtk introspection
[2021-06-29T03:37:07Z] <midfavila> https://pkgs.alpinelinux.org/package/edge/testing/x86/nyxt
[2021-06-29T03:37:14Z] <midfavila> just found this.
[2021-06-29T03:37:21Z] <acheam> its not a glibc problem
[2021-06-29T03:37:32Z] <acheam> its a problem with how gtk3 is built on kiss
[2021-06-29T03:37:42Z] <midfavila> oh. that's trivial to fix then.
[2021-06-29T03:37:50Z] <acheam> somewhat
[2021-06-29T03:38:07Z] <acheam> because everything depends on everything it can be a PITA
[2021-06-29T03:38:19Z] <acheam> I never got around to doing it
[2021-06-29T03:38:37Z] <midfavila> if it had a non-GTK3 GUI I might take a stab at it
[2021-06-29T03:38:37Z] <acheam> but you can nab gobject-introspection from my repo, which you'll need along the way
[2021-06-29T03:38:56Z] <acheam> nyxt does have a qt option
[2021-06-29T03:39:00Z] <acheam> but thats qt
[2021-06-29T03:39:03Z] <midfavila> i was going to say
[2021-06-29T03:39:03Z] <acheam> and blink
[2021-06-29T03:39:06Z] <midfavila> when i said non-gtk
[2021-06-29T03:39:08Z] <midfavila> i meant non-shit
[2021-06-29T03:39:28Z] <midfavila> an fltk interface or a mcclim one would be nice
[2021-06-29T03:39:35Z] <midfavila> particularly mcclim
[2021-06-29T03:39:48Z] <midfavila> then it wouldn't need to depend on C for its GUI. or, at least as much.
[2021-06-29T03:41:36Z] <acheam> uhh why would this just fail without any relevant logs?
[2021-06-29T03:41:53Z] <midfavila> radiation
[2021-06-29T03:41:55Z] <acheam> https://l.armaanb.net/llvm
[2021-06-29T03:41:59Z] <midfavila> it's the five geez
[2021-06-29T03:42:04Z] <midfavila> they're flippin' your bits
[2021-06-29T03:42:18Z] <acheam> trying to build libxx, log title is semi misleading
[2021-06-29T03:42:53Z] <midfavila> "error: unknown rune table"?
[2021-06-29T03:43:12Z] <midfavila> i don't really touch llvm, clang, or anything like that
[2021-06-29T03:43:42Z] <midfavila> yeah, looks like it has some kind of error limit...
[2021-06-29T03:44:04Z] <midfavila> "fatal error: too many errors emitted, stopping now [-ferror-limit-]"
[2021-06-29T03:44:05Z] <acheam> I'm just going to try building it with ninja
[2021-06-29T03:44:07Z] <midfavila> not sure if you saw that
[2021-06-29T03:44:12Z] <acheam> oh no I didnt
[2021-06-29T03:44:32Z] <riteo> rune table sounds very misterious and mystic
[2021-06-29T03:44:35Z] <midfavila> there are also complaints about "mask" being an unknown type name
[2021-06-29T03:44:38Z] <acheam> Thanks
[2021-06-29T03:45:06Z] <acheam> ah yeah same error with ninja but it MUCH more conveniently pointed them out
[2021-06-29T03:45:11Z] <riteo> s/misterious/mysterious/
[2021-06-29T03:45:16Z] <midfavila> cmake is kind of dogshit
[2021-06-29T03:45:21Z] <midfavila> and by kind of I mean it's absolutely horrendous
[2021-06-29T03:46:02Z] <midfavila> whatever you're trying to build, it's full of bugs
[2021-06-29T03:48:10Z] <midfavila> unrelated note, has any progress been made on the graph generation and manipulation routines for KISS?
[2021-06-29T03:48:23Z] <acheam> its llvms stdlibc++ replacement
[2021-06-29T03:48:26Z] <acheam> and yes its bad
[2021-06-29T03:48:29Z] <midfavila> oh, ew
[2021-06-29T03:48:33Z] <midfavila> ewewewewewewewewewewewewew
[2021-06-29T03:48:33Z] <dylanaraps> midfavila: https://github.com/kiss-community/kiss/pull/43
[2021-06-29T03:48:42Z] <midfavila> thanks dylan
[2021-06-29T03:48:46Z] <dylanaraps> I /should/ have fixed all open dependency issues
[2021-06-29T03:48:52Z] <midfavila> i really need to look on the gh more...
[2021-06-29T03:49:16Z] <dylanaraps> Look at the other PRs I opened too
[2021-06-29T03:49:32Z] <acheam> the problem is that you can't get email notifications without an accouny
[2021-06-29T03:49:43Z] <acheam> IIRC
[2021-06-29T03:49:50Z] <midfavila> Yeah, I'll look through them all. 
[2021-06-29T03:49:50Z] <midfavila> and I technically *have* an account... it's just frozen 
[2021-06-29T03:49:55Z] <midfavila> so fuck me I guess
[2021-06-29T03:49:58Z] <acheam> which ruins the point of email notifications for me
[2021-06-29T03:50:57Z] <Guest28> Well I am on ubuntu in alsamixer and when I mute S/PDIF 5 my sound is muted
[2021-06-29T03:50:59Z] <midfavila> you know, totally unrelated, but I just want to say, dylanaraps: you're a really cool dude.
[2021-06-29T03:51:11Z] <Guest28> So I think it involves S/PDIF 5?
[2021-06-29T03:51:17Z] <midfavila> i've learned a lot about unix from tinkering with KISS, and I appreciate the effort you put into it.
[2021-06-29T03:51:28Z] <midfavila> same with the rest of you guys, honestly
[2021-06-29T03:52:04Z] <Guest28> By the way the Card and Chip show up HDA ATI HDMI and ATI R6xx HDMI, respectively
[2021-06-29T03:52:04Z] <midfavila> glad I could meet you all. 
[2021-06-29T03:52:05Z] <midfavila> [end of irlpost]
[2021-06-29T03:52:22Z] <Guest28> midfavila I love you too bae
[2021-06-29T03:52:30Z] <midfavila> = w=
[2021-06-29T03:53:12Z] <riteo> ok since this is time for being all cuddly and honest: mid if it weren't for you I probably wouldn't have sticked up that much on here
[2021-06-29T03:53:43Z] <riteo> not because everybody's bad or anything, but mid's shitposting really made that spark
[2021-06-29T03:54:10Z] <riteo> we all love you :3
[2021-06-29T03:54:55Z] <riteo> also talking about weird hardware at 6 AM is really nice
[2021-06-29T03:55:08Z] <midfavila> my two redeeming traits
[2021-06-29T03:55:12Z] <Guest28> So asoundrc just sets defaults... Muting S/PDIF 5 in alsamixer  mutes my volume so it'd be the same in KISS
[2021-06-29T03:55:12Z] <riteo> yes
[2021-06-29T03:55:14Z] <midfavila> esoteric hardware knowledge and shitposting
[2021-06-29T03:55:44Z] <Guest28> So if asoundrc just sets defaults, maybe it has something to do with the kernel? I don't know at this point
[2021-06-29T03:56:28Z] <Guest28> I need to find a way to "select" HDMI / DisplayPort 6 - Ellesmere HDMI Audio from KISS
[2021-06-29T03:56:40Z] <midfavila> have you tried using alsamixer?
[2021-06-29T03:56:48Z] <midfavila> it allows you to change your output device.
[2021-06-29T03:56:51Z] <Guest28> Yes, it lets me select the card 
[2021-06-29T03:56:58Z] <Guest28> But no sound
[2021-06-29T03:57:00Z] <midfavila> hold on one sec...
[2021-06-29T03:57:05Z] <midfavila> there's a way to set it as default
[2021-06-29T03:57:12Z] <Guest28> I tried that too
[2021-06-29T03:57:39Z] <midfavila> hmm
[2021-06-29T03:57:41Z] <Guest28> It lets me go into alsamixer and select, but there's no sound
[2021-06-29T03:57:49Z] <Guest28> Which makes me think is kernel-related
[2021-06-29T03:58:06Z] <Guest28> In Ubuntu I just go to Sound -> Output -> Output Device
[2021-06-29T03:58:32Z] <Guest28> But here's the thing, in alsamixer on Ubuntu when I change cards it doesn't change cards in the Sound settings
[2021-06-29T03:59:09Z] <midfavila> i don't know anything about Ubuntu's configuration framework or how it would map to regular utilities, honestly... nor do I have experience with audio over media cables like DP and HDMI
[2021-06-29T03:59:18Z] <midfavila> i'll look into it though, since I haven't got anything better to do
[2021-06-29T03:59:19Z] <Guest28> So I'm wonder if there's a way to "select" the output device in alsa
[2021-06-29T03:59:49Z] <midfavila> yes, it's to set the particular card as default
[2021-06-29T04:00:06Z] <midfavila> you should also make sure that it's unmuted
[2021-06-29T04:00:11Z] <midfavila> that's... tripped me up a few times, honestly
[2021-06-29T04:00:13Z] <Guest28> Yeah I tried that
[2021-06-29T04:00:18Z] <Guest28> I went from MM to OO
[2021-06-29T04:00:28Z] <midfavila> and still nothing?
[2021-06-29T04:00:28Z] <Guest28> "I switch devices by commenting and uncommenting out the relevant lines for selecting what device I want. Switching a default device by configuration file requires restarting the process that uses sound. For playing Youtube videos in your browser, this means restarting the browser whenever you switch an audio device. (There might be a better way to
[2021-06-29T04:00:29Z] <Guest28> do this, I haven’t figured it out yet.) "
[2021-06-29T04:00:40Z] <Guest28> "For playing Youtube videos in your browser, this means restarting the browser whenever you switch an audio device."
[2021-06-29T04:00:49Z] <Guest28> Maybe it's as simple as restarting the browser
[2021-06-29T04:01:14Z] <midfavila> uh, yeah, if you're making changes in config files, I'd close everything using your sound card and then alsactl restart or w/e
[2021-06-29T04:01:23Z] <dilyn> I dont' have a strong grasp on how sound devices come up in Linux but it might be volatile, so you aren't guaranteed that device 5 is the right one 
[2021-06-29T04:01:49Z] <midfavila> this is why I bought a mobo without onboard audio and disabled my GPU's audio... it's such a pain
[2021-06-29T04:02:05Z] <dilyn> eh
[2021-06-29T04:02:08Z] <midfavila> honestly, if people spent half as much effort on making ALSA not shit, instead of layering more crap on top, it'd probably be a lot better
[2021-06-29T04:02:15Z] <dilyn> it's like, two commands to figure out what the device numbers are 
[2021-06-29T04:02:25Z] <dilyn> alsa is... very good...
[2021-06-29T04:02:57Z] <midfavila> the documentation is non-existent, which is kind of a problem. audio input is handled oddly at times, especially if you have a mono mic
[2021-06-29T04:03:11Z] <dilyn> that doesn't make alsa bad
[2021-06-29T04:03:20Z] <midfavila> and then there's the whole killer feature of PA, which is "wow I can control volume on a per-program level", or so I've heard
[2021-06-29T04:03:27Z] <dilyn> isn't that what jack is for
[2021-06-29T04:03:37Z] <riteo> wasn't jack made for low latency and music making
[2021-06-29T04:03:39Z] <midfavila> dilyn if nobody can figure out how to use your software, your software isn't exactly useful.
[2021-06-29T04:03:47Z] <Guest28> Okay at least I know that the default device should be 11
[2021-06-29T04:03:48Z] <midfavila> and yeah, jack is for audio engineering work, afaik...
[2021-06-29T04:04:33Z] <Guest28> What was that alsactl command you typed?
[2021-06-29T04:04:49Z] <Guest28> My history is gone
[2021-06-29T04:04:53Z] <GalaxyNova> any1 know how to modify a global variable from inside a function in posix shell
[2021-06-29T04:06:03Z] <midfavila> try alsactl init. that *should* force it to reload your config file... as far as I'm aware.
[2021-06-29T04:08:00Z] <Guest28> https://ghostbin.com/paste/QnaCI
[2021-06-29T04:09:02Z] <midfavila> cool... hm. how did you try to set the GPU's sound card as the default, by the by?
[2021-06-29T04:09:19Z] <Guest28> In /etc/asound.conf
[2021-06-29T04:09:32Z] <Guest28> defaults.pcm.!card 1
[2021-06-29T04:09:32Z] <Guest28> defaults.ctl.!card 1
[2021-06-29T04:09:33Z] <Guest28> defaults.pcm.!device 11
[2021-06-29T04:09:33Z] <Guest28> defaults.ctl.!device 11
[2021-06-29T04:10:07Z] <midfavila> ...hm...
[2021-06-29T04:10:08Z] <Guest28> Device 11 is the last one, when I was on Ubuntu S/PDIF 5 (the last one) affected the volume
[2021-06-29T04:10:18Z] <acheam> GalaxyNova: aren't all variables global?
[2021-06-29T04:10:26Z] <acheam> dont use the local keyword
[2021-06-29T04:10:30Z] <acheam> its nonstandard
[2021-06-29T04:10:32Z] <midfavila> honestly, Guest28, I dunno
[2021-06-29T04:11:32Z] <GalaxyNova> acheam: All i know is that what O
[2021-06-29T04:11:37Z] <GalaxyNova> I'm trying to do isn't working
[2021-06-29T04:11:48Z] <midfavila> looking at some stackoverflow suggestions, the ! doesnt seem to show up...
[2021-06-29T04:12:04Z] <midfavila> https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/93128/alsa-how-can-i-tell-my-default-audio-output-is-card-2-and-device-0-not-hdmi
[2021-06-29T04:12:04Z] <midfavila> check this out, maybe?
[2021-06-29T04:13:23Z] <GalaxyNova> acheam: Specifically I have a `failed` global variable that gets set to 1 by the error function and then tested in the main function.
[2021-06-29T04:13:43Z] <GalaxyNova> and it always stays 0
[2021-06-29T04:15:55Z] <GalaxyNova> here's an idea of what I am trying to do acheam: https://0x0.st/-p6J.sh
[2021-06-29T04:16:25Z] <acheam> will look at this in the morning
[2021-06-29T04:16:46Z] <riteo> GalaxyNova: can't you export it?
[2021-06-29T04:16:57Z] <Guest28> When I type aplay -L it still says default:CARD=PCH
[2021-06-29T04:16:57Z] <Guest28>     HDA Intel PCH, ALC898 Analog
[2021-06-29T04:16:58Z] <Guest28>     Default Audio Device
[2021-06-29T04:17:05Z] <Guest28> This is so baffling
[2021-06-29T04:17:19Z] <GalaxyNova> dylan02?
[2021-06-29T04:22:05Z] <Guest28> Okay guys I got static in the left ear with the command "speaker-test -D hw:1,11 -c 2"
[2021-06-29T04:22:20Z] <Guest28> Which means it's not a kernel problem
[2021-06-29T04:22:26Z] <dylan02> GalaxyNova: ???
[2021-06-29T04:22:47Z] <Guest28> Oh static in both ears, it alternates
[2021-06-29T04:23:31Z] <riteo> dylan02: I think they're referring to that script example they wanted to make work
[2021-06-29T04:23:31Z] <Guest28> So I literally just need a way to change the output device for good
[2021-06-29T04:23:44Z] <riteo> dylan02: this one: https://0x0.st/-p6J.sh
[2021-06-29T04:23:54Z] <GalaxyNova> wait what
[2021-06-29T04:23:58Z] <GalaxyNova> i just tested it and it now works
[2021-06-29T04:24:02Z] <GalaxyNova> I am thourougly confused
[2021-06-29T04:24:14Z] <riteo> what
[2021-06-29T04:24:23Z] <GalaxyNova> but my original problem still doesn't work for some reason
[2021-06-29T04:24:25Z] <riteo> I ran it myself and it didn't work
[2021-06-29T04:24:33Z] <riteo> it returns 0
[2021-06-29T04:24:45Z] <riteo> I recall it doing the thing you wanted in one of my scripts though
[2021-06-29T04:24:47Z] <GalaxyNova> that's because i forgot to call the function in the example
[2021-06-29T04:25:00Z] <riteo> wait 
[2021-06-29T04:25:02Z] <GalaxyNova> in my real usage case i do call the function and it still doesn't work
[2021-06-29T04:25:05Z] <GalaxyNova> here
[2021-06-29T04:25:10Z] <riteo> oh right you didn't call it
[2021-06-29T04:25:17Z] <riteo> now that makes sense
[2021-06-29T04:26:33Z] <GalaxyNova> riteo: https://0x0.st/-p6J.sh
[2021-06-29T04:26:44Z] <riteo> it's the same url galaxy
[2021-06-29T04:26:53Z] <GalaxyNova> wait
[2021-06-29T04:27:21Z] <GalaxyNova> https://0x0.st/-p6y.sh
[2021-06-29T04:27:24Z] <GalaxyNova> here
[2021-06-29T04:27:35Z] <GalaxyNova> this is the actual script where I'm having the problem
[2021-06-29T04:27:58Z] <GalaxyNova> failed should turn to 1 when the err() function runs
[2021-06-29T04:28:02Z] <riteo> oh it's that package linter thing?
[2021-06-29T04:28:17Z] <GalaxyNova> yes
[2021-06-29T04:28:34Z] <riteo> cool
[2021-06-29T04:28:36Z] <riteo> lemme check
[2021-06-29T04:29:39Z] <riteo> mhh, I think it's because you're calling the function inside a while loop
[2021-06-29T04:29:44Z] <riteo> or an if
[2021-06-29T04:29:49Z] <riteo> or both
[2021-06-29T04:30:00Z] <riteo> inside any of those the variables are scoped IIRC
[2021-06-29T04:30:19Z] <riteo> lemme try putting an err right at the start of the function
[2021-06-29T04:30:31Z] <GalaxyNova> oh
[2021-06-29T04:31:04Z] <riteo> yep
[2021-06-29T04:31:16Z] <riteo> it returns an empty-ish error, a one and failed
[2021-06-29T04:31:26Z] <GalaxyNova> how can i get around that
[2021-06-29T04:31:38Z] <riteo> i added `err "epic"` at the start of the main function if you want to replicate it
[2021-06-29T04:32:20Z] <midfavila> ...oh, shit. screw using s9. gauche seems way more capable
[2021-06-29T04:32:22Z] <GalaxyNova> yep i can replicate it
[2021-06-29T04:32:26Z] <midfavila> http://practical-scheme.net/gauche/features.html
[2021-06-29T04:32:29Z] <midfavila> check this out
[2021-06-29T04:32:32Z] <GalaxyNova> it's weird
[2021-06-29T04:32:40Z] <GalaxyNova> I never considered if statements and loops scopes
[2021-06-29T04:32:46Z] <GalaxyNova> is there any way to get around this?
[2021-06-29T04:32:48Z] <riteo> I feel you
[2021-06-29T04:32:56Z] <riteo> I've been in similar situations with minekiss
[2021-06-29T04:33:20Z] <riteo> mhh, I think exporting might work
[2021-06-29T04:33:29Z] <riteo> I don't think it's the best option though
[2021-06-29T04:33:29Z] <midfavila> exporting does seem like a sensible option, I agree
[2021-06-29T04:33:45Z] <GalaxyNova> exporting it where
[2021-06-29T04:33:45Z] <midfavila> well, shell is the definition of "not the best option"
[2021-06-29T04:33:50Z] <riteo> good point
[2021-06-29T04:33:52Z] <midfavila> just... export it?
[2021-06-29T04:33:53Z] <midfavila> like
[2021-06-29T04:33:58Z] <midfavila> export thing=foo
[2021-06-29T04:34:03Z] <riteo> yeah like that
[2021-06-29T04:34:08Z] <GalaxyNova> like in the original definition or inside the function?
[2021-06-29T04:34:11Z] <GalaxyNova> or both?
[2021-06-29T04:34:16Z] <riteo> in the function
[2021-06-29T04:34:18Z] <midfavila> ...probably inside the function?
[2021-06-29T04:34:55Z] <riteo> the thing though is that it's in the enviroment of the successive commands too though and I feel there might be a better way
[2021-06-29T04:35:19Z] <GalaxyNova> exporting it doesn't do a thing
[2021-06-29T04:35:26Z] <riteo> mhhh
[2021-06-29T04:36:04Z] <riteo> wait, I don't think if blocks are scoped actually
[2021-06-29T04:36:20Z] <riteo> before saying wrong stuff lemme try something
[2021-06-29T04:36:57Z] <GalaxyNova> if you want to test it on a real script you can try community/most/build and it should complain about the spacing and print failed
[2021-06-29T04:37:18Z] <riteo> I'll try and tell you
[2021-06-29T04:38:03Z] <Guest28> I am going insane
[2021-06-29T04:38:16Z] <GalaxyNova> why are you going insane
[2021-06-29T04:38:38Z] <Guest28> Because I can't change the output device in ALSA
[2021-06-29T04:38:50Z] <GalaxyNova> oh lol
[2021-06-29T04:39:06Z] <acheam> oof
[2021-06-29T04:39:16Z] <GalaxyNova> > installs pulseaudio
[2021-06-29T04:39:58Z] <acheam> "Unlike other well-known paging programs most supports multiple windows and can scroll left and right. Why settle for less?"
[2021-06-29T04:40:11Z] <acheam> ba dum tsss
[2021-06-29T04:40:11Z] <riteo> ok that's genious
[2021-06-29T04:40:27Z] <riteo> s/genious/genial/
[2021-06-29T04:40:46Z] <riteo> wait how do you say that in english
[2021-06-29T04:41:12Z] <midfavila> genius
[2021-06-29T04:41:17Z] <midfavila> and yes, most is a very good pager
[2021-06-29T04:41:22Z] <GalaxyNova> acheam: I use it every day :)
[2021-06-29T04:41:26Z] <midfavila> it integrates exceptionally well with jed
[2021-06-29T04:41:29Z] <midfavila> which is a very good editor
[2021-06-29T04:41:34Z] <GalaxyNova> and I maintain it
[2021-06-29T04:41:46Z] <midfavila> nice. you must be handy with S-Lang then?
[2021-06-29T04:41:58Z] <acheam> busybox less works for me, except for Git
[2021-06-29T04:42:15Z] <GalaxyNova> I maintain S-Lang in the community repository too but I have no idea how to use use it
[2021-06-29T04:42:33Z] <midfavila> oh, rip
[2021-06-29T04:42:39Z] <midfavila> younger me was vaguely interested in it for a time
[2021-06-29T04:42:41Z] <midfavila> but then I realized
[2021-06-29T04:42:43Z] <midfavila> "wait a sec"
[2021-06-29T04:42:48Z] <midfavila> "this is only used in like two programs"
[2021-06-29T04:42:53Z] <GalaxyNova> lol
[2021-06-29T04:43:03Z] <midfavila> at least ELisp applies generally
[2021-06-29T04:43:08Z] <midfavila> since... you know...
[2021-06-29T04:43:11Z] <midfavila> it's just LISP.
[2021-06-29T04:43:13Z] <Guest28> Yay Firefox is playing sound now
[2021-06-29T04:43:17Z] <GalaxyNova> nice
[2021-06-29T04:43:29Z] <Guest28> "alsactl restore" as root I think did the trick
[2021-06-29T04:43:40Z] <Guest28> I am not sure if it will stay this way when I reboot
[2021-06-29T04:43:50Z] <acheam> alsactl restore is a wonder command
[2021-06-29T04:43:56Z] <midfavila> it should. if not, just add alsactl restore to your init scripts
[2021-06-29T04:43:58Z] <riteo> I'm starting to think that the variables are scoped by the process in the for/while loop more than the block itself
[2021-06-29T04:44:41Z] <midfavila> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/18597697/posix-compliant-way-to-scope-variables-to-a-function-in-a-shell-script
[2021-06-29T04:44:44Z] <GalaxyNova> what does that mean
[2021-06-29T04:44:59Z] <midfavila> through the power of five seconds of searching, I bring to you a solution
[2021-06-29T04:45:03Z] <midfavila> apparently "local" *is* posix
[2021-06-29T04:45:16Z] <midfavila> oh, no, it's *not*
[2021-06-29T04:45:17Z] <midfavila> fuck
[2021-06-29T04:45:25Z] <midfavila> i need to actually read articles completely before talking about them
[2021-06-29T04:45:29Z] <midfavila> now I feel like an idiot
[2021-06-29T04:45:39Z] <riteo> no worries, this is all a mess
[2021-06-29T04:45:40Z] <GalaxyNova> local is not posix
[2021-06-29T04:45:46Z] <GalaxyNova> mfw
[2021-06-29T04:45:48Z] <midfavila> you'll notice that I corrected myself
[2021-06-29T04:46:03Z] <GalaxyNova> oh alright xD
[2021-06-29T04:46:05Z] <midfavila> looks like a suggestion is to use a subshell instead of a function
[2021-06-29T04:46:06Z] <riteo> oh the only way I can think of quickly is only one and it's a mess
[2021-06-29T04:46:13Z] <riteo> touch a file
[2021-06-29T04:46:22Z] <midfavila> there's also another suggestion
[2021-06-29T04:46:23Z] <midfavila> which is
[2021-06-29T04:46:27Z] <midfavila> "implement local yourself"
[2021-06-29T04:46:30Z] <Guest28> Okay so I have to type alsactl restore when rebooting.
[2021-06-29T04:46:41Z] <midfavila> Guest28 just put it in your init scripts
[2021-06-29T04:46:45Z] <riteo> midfavila: I'm pretty sure that the lastest of resorts
[2021-06-29T04:47:01Z] <GalaxyNova> mifavila: lol
[2021-06-29T04:47:04Z] <riteo> regarding the local reimplementation, not the alsa thing
[2021-06-29T04:47:11Z] <GalaxyNova> I've lost so many braincells trying to figure this out
[2021-06-29T04:47:18Z] <GalaxyNova> the scoping makes 0 sense
[2021-06-29T04:47:38Z] <riteo> wait lemme try something
[2021-06-29T04:47:59Z] <midfavila> what are you even doing, where the scoping of the shell's variables would matter significantly?
[2021-06-29T04:48:45Z] <GalaxyNova> so basically i have a global 'failed' variable that is supposed to be changed to 1 by the err() function while inside a loop itterating through each line of a file
[2021-06-29T04:49:04Z] <midfavila> does the function do anything else?
[2021-06-29T04:49:12Z] <midfavila> or does it just change the value of the variable?
[2021-06-29T04:49:17Z] <GalaxyNova> it does a bunch of other things ofc lol
[2021-06-29T04:49:21Z] <riteo> it also prints some stuff
[2021-06-29T04:49:44Z] <midfavila> this is a crazy radical solution but
[2021-06-29T04:49:47Z] <midfavila> have you considered just
[2021-06-29T04:49:49Z] <midfavila> not using a function
[2021-06-29T04:49:53Z] <GalaxyNova> I woudn't make a whole function just to change 1 variable
[2021-06-29T04:49:56Z] <riteo> mid that won't change anything
[2021-06-29T04:50:06Z] <GalaxyNova> midfavila: And copy paste everything 50 times?
[2021-06-29T04:50:10Z] <riteo> the function acts exactly as copypasting that stuff
[2021-06-29T04:50:21Z] * midfavila shrugs helplessly
[2021-06-29T04:50:22Z] <riteo> the issue is scoping and I think I got it
[2021-06-29T04:50:30Z] <riteo> hear me out
[2021-06-29T04:50:35Z] <midfavila> you two have fun
[2021-06-29T04:50:54Z] <riteo> variables are scoped around processes (think of subshells and piped stuff)
[2021-06-29T04:51:43Z] <riteo> so in fors and ifs variable changes are allright, but in stuff like `cat epicfile | while read a` will actually scope everything to read
[2021-06-29T04:52:05Z] <riteo> I think I read a stackoverflow post about that
[2021-06-29T04:52:08Z] <acheam> mid's 2am brain isnt at its finest for shell debugging I see
[2021-06-29T04:52:08Z] <GalaxyNova> could i fix it by removing the cat?
[2021-06-29T04:52:24Z] <midfavila> acheam i can't debug a script I can't see
[2021-06-29T04:52:27Z] <GalaxyNova> and redirecting the input from the file directly
[2021-06-29T04:52:37Z] <acheam> they sent it
[2021-06-29T04:52:41Z] <midfavila> nor, to be honest, do I feel particularly passionate about shell scoping
[2021-06-29T04:52:57Z] <riteo> there's this: https://stackoverflow.com/questions/4667509/shell-variables-set-inside-while-loop-not-visible-outside-of-it
[2021-06-29T04:52:57Z] <GalaxyNova> midfavila: here it is https://0x0.st/-p6y.sh
[2021-06-29T04:52:59Z] <acheam> *gasp*
[2021-06-29T04:53:02Z] <midfavila> if I was writing a sufficiently complex script where that mattered, I'd not use shell
[2021-06-29T04:53:04Z] <riteo> I don't think it can help you that much though
[2021-06-29T04:53:18Z] <midfavila> or i'd be stupidly pedantic when it comes to not modifying global variables from within functions
[2021-06-29T04:53:35Z] <GalaxyNova> riteo: process substitution isn't posix
[2021-06-29T04:53:38Z] <riteo> ikk
[2021-06-29T04:53:44Z] <riteo> look under it
[2021-06-29T04:53:56Z] <GalaxyNova> oohhhh
[2021-06-29T04:53:59Z] <riteo> apparently you can actually do stuff after the while
[2021-06-29T04:54:18Z] <riteo> I think the real culprit here is the piping
[2021-06-29T04:54:32Z] <riteo> I recall echo asd | read bruh not working because of that
[2021-06-29T04:54:55Z] <Guest28> +
[2021-06-29T04:54:59Z] <riteo> yep https://backreference.org/2010/10/23/on-pipes-subshells-and-descriptors/
[2021-06-29T04:55:09Z] <riteo> "each command of a multi-command pipeline is in a subshell environment; as an extension, however, any or all commands in a pipeline may be executed in the current environment."
[2021-06-29T04:55:22Z] <riteo> wait what does that second part mean
[2021-06-29T04:56:00Z] <riteo> oh I think it means that curly bracket thing
[2021-06-29T04:56:18Z] <riteo> reading the article further makes me think so
[2021-06-29T04:56:41Z] <midfavila> that's mentioned in the SO post I mentioned...
[2021-06-29T04:56:41Z] <GalaxyNova> OH
[2021-06-29T04:56:48Z] <GalaxyNova> i fixed it by removing the cat entirely
[2021-06-29T04:57:03Z] <GalaxyNova> and replacing it by feeding the file directly into the loop
[2021-06-29T04:57:09Z] <GalaxyNova> i should have listened to shellcheck
[2021-06-29T04:57:16Z] <riteo> yesss
[2021-06-29T04:57:17Z] <GalaxyNova> thank you riteo
[2021-06-29T04:57:20Z] <GalaxyNova> :D
[2021-06-29T04:57:32Z] <riteo> you're welcome :)
[2021-06-29T04:57:50Z] <riteo> also I freshened up my memory on this stuff once again
[2021-06-29T04:57:59Z] <riteo> eventually it'll stick, I swear
[2021-06-29T04:58:07Z] <riteo> damn pipes
[2021-06-29T04:58:35Z] <Guest28> Write your script and pipe every command
[2021-06-29T04:58:41Z] <Guest28> One long chain of pipes
[2021-06-29T04:59:36Z] <GalaxyNova> Guest28: Otherwise can you even call it unix smh
[2021-06-29T05:00:20Z] <testuser[m]1> Hi
[2021-06-29T05:00:30Z] <GalaxyNova> hi
[2021-06-29T05:00:55Z] <riteo> hi!
[2021-06-29T05:05:14Z] <Guest28> How is the firefox binary handled? Is there some dedicated machine that is just compiling every new version and releasing it on Github?
[2021-06-29T05:05:26Z] <midfavila> p sure dilyn compiles them
[2021-06-29T05:10:28Z] <testuser[m]1> https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Clang-PGO-Linux-5.14
[2021-06-29T05:13:20Z] <GalaxyNova> what the...
[2021-06-29T05:14:14Z] <testuser[m]1> Yes
[2021-06-29T05:15:10Z] <testuser[m]1> Umm looks like the bridge broke
[2021-06-29T05:20:12Z] <sad_plan> what is this __thread support that libelf requires? Im in the middle of trying to build a static kiss, and when building libelf, it gives me that error. or do I not need libelf after all?
[2021-06-29T05:21:30Z] <sad_plan> I know its a dependency of mesa, but thats something that Ill worry about later, when I get there anyway :p
[2021-06-29T05:22:02Z] <riteo> ok guys I need a quick suggestion
[2021-06-29T05:22:52Z] <riteo> so basically the guys at mojang distribute their native libraries in the weirdest of ways by packing them into a .jar with sometimes their git hash and sha1 checksum
[2021-06-29T05:23:26Z] <riteo> the idea of the sha1 checksum is to verify whether the native library is damaged or not, but ignored that zip already has a CRC of every file inside
[2021-06-29T05:23:38Z] <Guest28> Mojang made Minecraft right?
[2021-06-29T05:23:41Z] <riteo> yep
[2021-06-29T05:24:02Z] <Guest28> DAng that game was so fun, I played the beta in 2008 or so
[2021-06-29T05:24:06Z] <riteo> depending on the crc would require like, 1 command, while depending on the not always present sha1sum quite a few more
[2021-06-29T05:24:20Z] <riteo> Guest28: it's evolved a lot, I'm making a POSIX shell launcher for it
[2021-06-29T05:25:15Z] <riteo> would there be a good reason to go the more complex route of checking for the checksum file and calculating the sha1sum or should I stay with zip's builtin CRC for simplicity?
[2021-06-29T05:28:07Z] <riteo> you know what, considering there won't always be that file it's probably easier to just use the CRC
[2021-06-29T05:28:30Z] <riteo> I mean, it's not like under normal circumstances the file will get corrupted or anything
[2021-06-29T05:28:37Z] <riteo> epic
[2021-06-29T05:28:44Z] <riteo> gn mid
[2021-06-29T05:33:14Z] <riteo> oh I think I'm an idiot
[2021-06-29T05:34:02Z] <riteo> that think I was talking about is slightly more complex, I thought that -t (test archive integrity) would test whether the uncompressed crc matched with the compressed one
[2021-06-29T05:34:09Z] <riteo> s/think/thing/
[2021-06-29T05:36:36Z] <michael> ^think^thing
[2021-06-29T05:39:47Z] <Guest28> riteo Thought yyou needed to use Microsoft's launcher or whatever
[2021-06-29T05:40:03Z] <Guest28> Or is that only the MS account you need
[2021-06-29T05:40:21Z] <Guest28> I don't know I haven't touched that game in ages
[2021-06-29T05:42:53Z] <riteo> Guest28: I feel like you're talking about bedrock/win10 edition
[2021-06-29T05:43:20Z] <riteo> although lately mojang's been adding microsoft account support for their game and are slowly migrating to it
[2021-06-29T05:44:04Z] <riteo> although I'm mad at it not that much because it's m$ but for its obligatory web browser dependency
[2021-06-29T05:44:10Z] <GalaxyNova> yeah i hate the migration
[2021-06-29T05:44:18Z] <GalaxyNova> it hasn't happened yet hasn't it?
[2021-06-29T05:44:26Z] <GalaxyNova> I'm still using my mojang account
[2021-06-29T05:44:46Z] <riteo> luckily it hasn't yet, although new accounts are automatically microsoft's
[2021-06-29T05:45:17Z] <riteo> When the time will come that browser requirement will have to get over my body
[2021-06-29T05:45:40Z] <riteo> there will be two outcomes then: either I workaround it, or...
[2021-06-29T05:45:52Z] <riteo> https://vid.puffyan.us/watch?v=i8ju_10NkGY
[2021-06-29T05:46:24Z] <GalaxyNova> ffs why does microsoft have to ruin everything
[2021-06-29T05:46:41Z] <riteo> I mean
[2021-06-29T05:46:47Z] <riteo> mojang's still mojang
[2021-06-29T05:46:54Z] <riteo> that's the weird thing for me
[2021-06-29T05:46:58Z] <GalaxyNova> riteo: Who's going to be playing minecraft on a computer without a web browser
[2021-06-29T05:47:11Z] <riteo> nobody, it's not like I'm without a web browser
[2021-06-29T05:47:21Z] <riteo> also, who's going to be playing minecraft through a posix shell script?
[2021-06-29T05:47:26Z] <GalaxyNova> lol
[2021-06-29T05:47:59Z] <riteo> it's a thing of principle
[2021-06-29T05:48:37Z] <riteo> I'll do everything in my power to avoid the inevitable before I migrate to something else somehow
[2021-06-29T05:48:48Z] <GalaxyNova> As long as it's not going to become bedrock edition i'm happy
[2021-06-29T05:48:52Z] <GalaxyNova> bedrock editiong is cancer
[2021-06-29T05:49:00Z] <riteo> it's literally PE
[2021-06-29T05:49:20Z] <riteo> microsoft literally bought mojang just for that
[2021-06-29T05:49:20Z] <GalaxyNova> if it was a 1:1 port of the game it would be ok
[2021-06-29T05:49:38Z] <riteo> I guess Mojang wanted to avoid some security issues/save some money
[2021-06-29T05:50:00Z] <GalaxyNova> They added dumb "features" likes emotes
[2021-06-29T05:50:02Z] <riteo> IIRC Mojang accounts still don't support 2FA
[2021-06-29T05:50:02Z] <Guest28> Oh I read this last year and thought it was for all players https://www.theverge.com/2020/10/22/21527647/minecraft-microsoft-account-mojang-java
[2021-06-29T05:50:15Z] <riteo> it is
[2021-06-29T05:50:49Z] <GalaxyNova> So many in game purchases and other BS
[2021-06-29T05:51:04Z] <GalaxyNova> also the lack of proper modding
[2021-06-29T05:51:09Z] <Guest28> Really, so it's like a blocky version of Fortnite
[2021-06-29T05:51:15Z] <GalaxyNova> ^^^
[2021-06-29T05:51:29Z] <riteo> talking about that announcement, aren't we gonna talk about how mojang directly acknowledged modding?
[2021-06-29T05:51:42Z] <GalaxyNova> yeah that was suprising
[2021-06-29T05:52:06Z] <GalaxyNova> it's because they know it's a large part of the appeal of java edition
[2021-06-29T05:52:26Z] <riteo> I mean, they literally obfuscated the jar
[2021-06-29T05:52:56Z] <GalaxyNova> isn't it incredibly easy to de-obfuscate it?
[2021-06-29T05:53:00Z] <riteo> the java programs that use proguard are likke, 2
[2021-06-29T05:53:16Z] <riteo> yeah, they even recentely (thanks to our lord dinnerbone) release development deobfuscation maps
[2021-06-29T05:53:28Z] <riteo> but, the principle behind stays
[2021-06-29T05:53:48Z] <riteo> let's remember that dinnerbone literally got hired for the mcp
[2021-06-29T05:53:53Z] <GalaxyNova> Since it's made in Java they can never fully hide the source code
[2021-06-29T05:54:39Z] <riteo> I wonder if it's jens' fault if the code's still obfuscated
[2021-06-29T05:55:16Z] <GalaxyNova> why would it be his fault
[2021-06-29T05:55:40Z] <riteo> one day he said this: "We obfuscate Minecraft to show that it's not open source" or something like that
[2021-06-29T05:55:50Z] <riteo> like if not obfuscating it implied it
[2021-06-29T05:56:19Z] <riteo> after all dinnerbone after quite a lot of work was able to pull the deobfuscation maps thing
[2021-06-29T05:56:29Z] <riteo> without him probably this would've never happened
[2021-06-29T05:57:27Z] <GalaxyNova> bruh
[2021-06-29T05:57:40Z] <GalaxyNova> -100 respect for jens
[2021-06-29T05:59:52Z] <GalaxyNova> Minecraft should be open source
[2021-06-29T06:00:16Z] <riteo> I can't find that quote though
[2021-06-29T06:00:26Z] <riteo> also: https://i.gyazo.com/d86a3dceb1dbf2c1734f6f83b0490bae.png
[2021-06-29T06:01:04Z] <GalaxyNova> press x to doubt
[2021-06-29T06:01:31Z] <GalaxyNova> now that he doesn't own the game anymore it's unlikely that that will happen any time soon
[2021-06-29T06:01:46Z] <GalaxyNova> also are you the original recipient of the email? That's cool
[2021-06-29T06:02:12Z] <Guest28> Well for multiplayer FPS/competitive games and the sort I'd argue closed source is probably "better" due to hacking, but since Minecraft is a game where you basically sandbox I'd say that open source is better. Minecraft is also probably more simplistic than most games in its code base so less opportunity to exploit
[2021-06-29T06:02:21Z] <riteo> GalaxyNova: no I'm not, I found it somewhere
[2021-06-29T06:02:49Z] <Guest28> And closed source means don't play it
[2021-06-29T06:03:02Z] <GalaxyNova> Guest28: That's the same argument Windows users say when they argue that their operating system is more secure
[2021-06-29T06:03:12Z] <GalaxyNova> security through obscurity is a fallacy
[2021-06-29T06:03:47Z] <GalaxyNova> They could have made a decent server side anti cheat and solved that problem if they really wanted to
[2021-06-29T06:04:22Z] <riteo> oh I found that quote
[2021-06-29T06:04:38Z] <riteo> but quite surprisingly it wasn't jens that said it, at least not directly
[2021-06-29T06:04:46Z] <riteo> https://nitter.kavin.rocks/dinnerbone/status/1169242801508376582
[2021-06-29T06:04:59Z] <Guest28> Well I used to program cheats for Valve games (TF2, CS:GO) and I feel open source would have made that much easier. VAC is pretty terrible though
[2021-06-29T06:07:54Z] <GalaxyNova> imagine what could be done if minecraft what open source
[2021-06-29T06:08:41Z] <riteo> probably minetest could get a tiny bit closer to that point if its main method of content delivery wasn't lua
[2021-06-29T06:08:55Z] <riteo> like bruh, what did you expect
[2021-06-29T06:09:26Z] <GalaxyNova> also lots of forks of the game
[2021-06-29T06:09:40Z] <riteo> huh, really? I didn't know that
[2021-06-29T06:09:55Z] <riteo> are you talking about the engine or the "game" like in the data files?
[2021-06-29T06:10:32Z] <GalaxyNova> if the game was open source there would be
[2021-06-29T06:10:56Z] <riteo> oh you meant that
[2021-06-29T06:11:10Z] <Guest28> Actually on second thought just make all video games open source. Honestly most anti cheat systems are garbage and don't prevent cheating. A better solution would be to have a good dev team that patches exploits quickly and bans hackers fast.
[2021-06-29T06:11:28Z] <riteo> also please make architectures that make cheating harder by design
[2021-06-29T06:11:36Z] <riteo> valve knows this very well
[2021-06-29T06:11:42Z] <riteo> mojang on the other hand...
[2021-06-29T06:14:04Z] <riteo> I'm genuinely thinking about learning about C very in depth by making a minecraft clone
[2021-06-29T06:14:34Z] <riteo> the idea is to make it my ideal minecraft clone, as minetest is very disappointing under the technical aspect
[2021-06-29T06:15:54Z] <riteo> irssi messed up
[2021-06-29T06:16:06Z] <riteo> I was saying: minekiss is very very disappointing under the technical aspect
[2021-06-29T06:16:33Z] <riteo> like, bruh, you got a lean "modular" c++ engine and you're limiting yourself to 1 chunk of height?
[2021-06-29T06:17:15Z] <riteo> its killer feature would be out-of-the-box complex stuff like cubic chunks
[2021-06-29T06:17:16Z] <GalaxyNova> doesn't minecraft also have 1 chunk of height?
[2021-06-29T06:17:21Z] <riteo> yes, but it's minecraft
[2021-06-29T06:17:30Z] <GalaxyNova> lol
[2021-06-29T06:17:41Z] <riteo> minetest is like 1% of what it could be
[2021-06-29T06:18:05Z] <GalaxyNova> some guy made it into a sphere world
[2021-06-29T06:18:15Z] <Guest28> Found this. https://github.com/justinmeiners/c-craft 
[2021-06-29T06:18:45Z] <Guest28> It would be cool to do a full version
[2021-06-29T06:18:52Z] <riteo> bruh is it using minecraft's actual textures
[2021-06-29T06:18:54Z] <GalaxyNova> mfw you add the whole project in "initial commit"
[2021-06-29T06:19:17Z] <riteo> I guess that's the public repo
[2021-06-29T06:19:27Z] <riteo> do you make public repos with incomplete software?
[2021-06-29T06:19:45Z] <GalaxyNova> uhh
[2021-06-29T06:19:46Z] <Guest28> All software is incomplete :)
[2021-06-29T06:19:56Z] <GalaxyNova> riteo: should i not?
[2021-06-29T06:20:00Z] <riteo> yeah, but not working software is way more incomplete IMO
[2021-06-29T06:20:11Z] <riteo> GalaxyNova: it's more a personal thing than anything
[2021-06-29T06:20:45Z] <riteo> I just don't do it to avoid creating a 10 year old empty repo
[2021-06-29T06:20:54Z] <riteo> I've actually found them multiple times
[2021-06-29T06:21:15Z] <riteo> >Random name - Interesting description of exactly what you need
[2021-06-29T06:21:24Z] <riteo> >Initial commit
[2021-06-29T06:21:42Z] <riteo> >empty repo
[2021-06-29T06:22:13Z] <GalaxyNova> 99% of my repos
[2021-06-29T06:22:42Z] <GalaxyNova> I'm considering privating them to save myself from the embarrasment
[2021-06-29T06:23:52Z] <riteo> If you work on them and you don't mind it being public I don't see why not
[2021-06-29T06:24:03Z] <riteo> some people find it interesting to see a program slowly growing
[2021-06-29T06:24:19Z] <riteo> s/growing/grow/
[2021-06-29T06:27:09Z] <Guest28> whats wrong with growing. am i just bad at english
[2021-06-29T06:27:23Z] <riteo> I don't know
[2021-06-29T06:27:29Z] <riteo> I'm always scared of writing the wrong thing
[2021-06-29T06:28:07Z] <Guest28> me too, even in real life I am scared of speaking because I suck at grammar
[2021-06-29T06:28:10Z] <GalaxyNova> Guest28: past tense
[2021-06-29T06:28:18Z] <GalaxyNova> actually
[2021-06-29T06:28:34Z] <GalaxyNova> it's the infinitive of the verb
[2021-06-29T06:28:38Z] <GalaxyNova> or something like that
[2021-06-29T06:29:05Z] <Guest28> Infinitive is to grow
[2021-06-29T06:29:23Z] <Guest28> I think growing is the imperfect tense here.
[2021-06-29T06:30:23Z] <Guest28> Never mind it's the present progressive
[2021-06-29T06:30:57Z] <GalaxyNova> honestly I don't even think about conjucation at all most of the time
[2021-06-29T06:31:17Z] <GalaxyNova> i just use whatever tense "sounds" best
[2021-06-29T06:31:22Z] <riteo> same thing
[2021-06-29T06:31:38Z] <riteo> I'm pretty sure we haven't studied those tenses yet at school
[2021-06-29T06:31:55Z] <Guest28> Same, but doesn't stop me from second guessing myself
[2021-06-29T06:32:25Z] <Guest28> I am done school and I don't remember learning anything other than present/past/future
[2021-06-29T06:34:21Z] <riteo> does anyone know if unzip/zipinfo's output is the same on all platforms?
[2021-06-29T06:58:01Z] <dylan33> riteo: very doubtful. I don't think it's standardized (as a utility)(?)
[2021-06-29T06:58:50Z] <riteo> mhh
[2021-06-29T06:59:11Z] <riteo> I'm very tempted to just ditch native library verification altoghether and just overwrite them fresh from the jars
[2021-06-29T06:59:20Z] <dylan33> I don't know how many implementations there are however. 
[2021-06-29T06:59:37Z] <riteo> they're like instantaneous do decompress and fetching the right sha1 from the jar, calculating everything and deciding what to do might actually be slower
[2021-06-29T06:59:42Z] <dylan33> If you're lucky there's just the one (on Linux at least).
[2021-06-29T07:00:10Z] <riteo> the idea is to make it portable, so I don't think that's a good idea
[2021-06-29T07:00:39Z] <dylan33> If that's the requirement I'd look elsewhere 
[2021-06-29T07:00:47Z] <riteo> I think I'll just overwrite the libraries on each start everytime, it's the fastest and simplest solution
[2021-06-29T07:01:46Z] <riteo> the other solution would be to look for a .sha1 file for each library, check it and if wrong or not here decompress everything
[2021-06-29T07:01:58Z] <riteo> the issue is that it's not here for everything and they're formatted weirdly
[2021-06-29T07:02:54Z] <riteo> like, a library is only its .so, there's not even the sha1
[2021-06-29T07:03:49Z] <technoznc> dylan33: I saw you updated the kisslinux repo.. nice :D
[2021-06-29T07:04:14Z] <dylan33> Idea: store the libraries elsewhere with the sha1 as part of the filename. Then symlink them to /usr/lib (or wherever)
[2021-06-29T07:04:52Z] <riteo> mhh
[2021-06-29T07:05:32Z] <riteo> Minecraft's native library distribution system is weird
[2021-06-29T07:06:13Z] <riteo> the libraries are not versioned (no number at the end) and the libraries for each versions are in their own path specified at runtime
[2021-06-29T07:06:24Z] <riteo> also the jars distributing them are aleady checksummed
[2021-06-29T07:06:48Z] <riteo> like, they're part of the usual library validation
[2021-06-29T07:07:07Z] <riteo> oh I see what you meant now
[2021-06-29T07:07:26Z] <riteo> the symlink idea is interesting
[2021-06-29T07:08:43Z] <riteo> I'll try it out
[2021-06-29T07:35:32Z] <testuser[m]1> if i do something like `gcc test.c -O3 -O2`, will O3 Optimizations take priority or O2 ?
[2021-06-29T07:40:10Z] <dylan33> O2 
[2021-06-29T07:42:18Z] <dylan33> > If you use multiple -O options, with or without level numbers, the last such option is the one that is effective.
[2021-06-29T07:42:28Z] <dylan33> https://gcc.gnu.org/onlinedocs/gnat_ugn/Optimization-Levels.html
[2021-06-29T07:42:31Z] <dylan33> "If you use multiple -O options, with or without level numbers, the last such option is the one that is effective.
[2021-06-29T07:43:35Z] <dylan33> oops, sent twice ;)
[2021-06-29T07:55:21Z] <riteo> gtg, dylan33 thanks a lot for the suggestion! I'll finish trying it when I come back, do some tests and tell you!
[2021-06-29T07:55:26Z] <riteo> bye everyone!
[2021-06-29T07:57:42Z] <testuser[m]1> thanks
[2021-06-29T07:57:54Z] <dylan33> o/
[2021-06-29T07:58:25Z] <testuser[m]1> konimex: can you see the irc messages coming in this room ? It's working only 1 side for me, have to check logs and reply.
[2021-06-29T08:02:44Z] <konimex> nope, looks like irc->matrix doesn't work
[2021-06-29T08:03:13Z] <testuser[m]1> hmm, other channels are working fine though
[2021-06-29T08:05:33Z] <konimex> from my logs, not in #libera-matrix
[2021-06-29T08:05:33Z] <testuser[m]1> oh
[2021-06-29T08:05:34Z] <konimex> it also broke there and the guy running the bridge attribute it to "the wider federation is still having issues, please be patient."
[2021-06-29T10:03:50Z] <cem> dilyn: I just merged the freenode logs of #kisslinux to my logger so the archives can be searched with scooper
[2021-06-29T10:06:01Z] <claudia> o/
[2021-06-29T10:27:50Z] <phoebos> hei dylan33, nice to see you back
[2021-06-29T10:28:23Z] <phoebos> i wasn't active in irc until after the fall, but still.
[2021-06-29T10:28:55Z] <phoebos> been using kiss for about 10 months now
[2021-06-29T10:30:32Z] <dylan33> Thanks
[2021-06-29T10:30:36Z] <dylan33> Glad to hear it 
[2021-06-29T10:35:16Z] <paradigm> I'm similarly happy to see your return
[2021-06-29T10:55:08Z] <dylan33> :)
[2021-06-29T14:58:53Z] <mmatongo> Dilyn, my laptop broke ಥ_ಥ
[2021-06-29T15:00:17Z] <mmatongo> ಥ_ಥ ಥ_ಥ ಥ_ಥ
[2021-06-29T15:00:31Z] <mmatongo> More like I dropped my HDD
[2021-06-29T15:01:03Z] <mmatongo> Won’t be able to update my packages for a while.
[2021-06-29T15:02:05Z] <mmatongo> Like a week or 3 days, I had exams this month so I’ve been held up plus I’m moving so until I get all settled I’m gonna be 
[2021-06-29T15:02:12Z] <mmatongo> MIA
[2021-06-29T15:54:10Z] <dilyn> mmatongo noooooooooo
[2021-06-29T15:54:40Z] <midfavila> the great betrayer
[2021-06-29T15:57:53Z] <midfavila> ...ugh, disgusting. with humidity, it's 38C today, according to the local airport
[2021-06-29T16:08:20Z] <dilyn> yeah real feel here is the same, and it's "just" 60% humidity 
[2021-06-29T16:08:24Z] <dilyn> kill me (: 
[2021-06-29T16:08:46Z] <midfavila> i think that's about what the report for my area said
[2021-06-29T16:08:55Z] <midfavila> it's been like this for weeks
[2021-06-29T16:08:58Z] <midfavila> expected for at least one more
[2021-06-29T16:09:19Z] <dilyn> last week we broke our humidity streak for like, a day or two with absolutely massive thunderstorms 
[2021-06-29T16:09:21Z] <midfavila> yeah, 63% humidity and rising...
[2021-06-29T16:09:31Z] <dilyn> but it didn't last long :v 
[2021-06-29T16:09:44Z] <dilyn> north america is on fire, and yet covered in water. send help, eurofriends
[2021-06-29T16:10:39Z] <midfavila> i just wish my landlord wasn't such an asshole and would let me install my AC unit
[2021-06-29T16:11:11Z] <dilyn> central air is bae 
[2021-06-29T16:11:30Z] <dilyn> 20 degrees. mmmmmmm
[2021-06-29T16:11:46Z] <midfavila> if I have a choice I usually drop it to around 15
[2021-06-29T16:12:05Z] <dilyn> alright that's a little cool for me XD
[2021-06-29T16:12:26Z] <midfavila> i'm very much the stereotypical canadian when it comes to temperature preference
[2021-06-29T16:12:32Z] <midfavila> -5C is shorts weather
[2021-06-29T16:12:34Z] <midfavila> don't @ me
[2021-06-29T16:13:07Z] <midfavila> unrelated note
[2021-06-29T16:13:27Z] <midfavila> mentioned this before, not sure if it went unnoticed, but can git-bruh be asked to remove the -t from uthash if it's not needed?
[2021-06-29T16:13:33Z] <midfavila> causes breakage with suckless tools
[2021-06-29T16:14:34Z] <midfavila> builds and installs fine sans -t though
[2021-06-29T16:16:45Z] <rio6> I feel humanity on earth will only last for a few more years
[2021-06-29T16:17:01Z] <rio6> all these heat, flood, storm, virus keep coming
[2021-06-29T16:17:17Z] <midfavila> well, hasn't the ice at the poles started melting or something
[2021-06-29T16:17:27Z] <midfavila> that was kind of the end of the line
[2021-06-29T16:17:42Z] <dilyn> opened an issue as your proxy mid
[2021-06-29T16:18:23Z] <midfavila> kk
[2021-06-29T16:18:27Z] <midfavila> email issue tracker when
[2021-06-29T16:21:13Z] <midfavila> also wow nice subtle roast, dilyn
[2021-06-29T16:21:14Z] <midfavila> smh
[2021-06-29T16:21:35Z] <dilyn> #roastem
[2021-06-29T16:21:41Z] <midfavila> i'm already hot enough
[2021-06-29T16:21:45Z] <midfavila> have mercy just this once
[2021-06-29T16:22:02Z] <dilyn> the community ML is the closest you'll be getting :P  
[2021-06-29T16:22:12Z] <midfavila> bleh
[2021-06-29T16:22:15Z] <dilyn> you will find no mercy here
[2021-06-29T16:22:31Z] <midfavila> you know what
[2021-06-29T16:22:32Z] <midfavila> fine then
[2021-06-29T16:22:45Z] <midfavila> i'll confiscate your pumpkin spice lattes
[2021-06-29T16:22:48Z] <midfavila> what say you now
[2021-06-29T16:29:07Z] <testuser> midfavila i forgot about it
[2021-06-29T16:32:23Z] <testuser> w
[2021-06-29T16:35:46Z] <dilyn> don't you dare threaten my PSLs lad 
[2021-06-29T16:35:52Z] <midfavila> too late
[2021-06-29T16:36:05Z] <midfavila> they've already been dumped down the drain
[2021-06-29T16:36:13Z] <midfavila> pray that I don't come after your local apple store next
[2021-06-29T16:36:19Z] <dilyn> :'(  
[2021-06-29T16:54:32Z] <jslick> midfavila , I think testuser was responding to you about -t : https://libera.irclog.whitequark.org/kisslinux/2021-06-26#30157967
[2021-06-29T16:55:29Z] <midfavila> oh, I didn't see that
[2021-06-29T16:55:49Z] <midfavila> sbase install's docs claim to have -t, but it doesn't seem to work... 
[2021-06-29T17:02:22Z] <dilyn> i wouldn't be surprised if none of install was portable :v 
[2021-06-29T17:02:41Z] <midfavila> well, it doesn't appear to be
[2021-06-29T17:19:02Z] <testuser-broken> illiliti said it wasnt
[2021-06-29T17:19:03Z] <testuser-broken> so it isnt
[2021-06-29T17:27:25Z] <acheam> dylanaraps: hey, whats this? https://github.com/DCVIII
[2021-06-29T17:28:38Z] <acheam> Stumbled upon it looking for a more maintained version of the portable openbsd userland
[2021-06-29T17:28:40Z] <dylanaraps> acheam: It's a place for me to keep forks of software contained.
[2021-06-29T17:29:11Z] <dylanaraps> I'm not using busybox right now. I've been using a mix of baseutils, sbase/ubase, etc for a while.
[2021-06-29T17:30:11Z] <acheam> nice!
[2021-06-29T17:30:12Z] <dylanaraps> baseutils is more incomplete than its documentation makes it out to be (or I'm experiencing something weird). Some utilities still need to be made portable(?). 
[2021-06-29T17:30:21Z] <acheam> hmm thanks
[2021-06-29T17:33:07Z] <dilyn> I need to play with seatd...
[2021-06-29T17:33:22Z] <dylanaraps> acheam: I forked sway to remove some of its dependencies (cairo, pango, pcre, json-c), bubblewrap to remove libcap (and related functionality),
[2021-06-29T17:33:44Z] <dylanaraps> baseutils to make 'find' work (more commits to follow) and seatd to make rootless built-in seatd work with sway.
[2021-06-29T17:33:57Z] <acheam> how does your sway handle fonts now?
[2021-06-29T17:34:06Z] <dylanaraps> It doesn't when they're disabled.
[2021-06-29T17:34:14Z] <acheam> so no bar?
[2021-06-29T17:34:19Z] <dylanaraps> Exactly
[2021-06-29T17:34:33Z] <acheam> thats the best way
[2021-06-29T17:34:35Z] <dilyn> the superior desktop layout
[2021-06-29T17:34:35Z] <dylanaraps> I'm using it more or less like a window manager
[2021-06-29T17:36:49Z] <dylanaraps> My sway is /almost/ fully statically linked too. The only remaining libraries are from mesa.
[2021-06-29T17:37:57Z] <dilyn> don't make me switch to sway
[2021-06-29T17:38:40Z] <midfavila> switch to shod instead
[2021-06-29T17:38:46Z] <dylanaraps> It's not all perfect
[2021-06-29T17:39:01Z] <dilyn> yeah, for starters it's a tiler 
[2021-06-29T17:39:01Z] <dylanaraps> I don't like how wallpapers (and setting hex color as bg) requires a separate daemon.
[2021-06-29T17:39:50Z] <rio6> I can't leave awesomewm thus x :P
[2021-06-29T17:39:57Z] <rio6> spent too much time on the config
[2021-06-29T17:40:11Z] <midfavila> i've seen some pretty crazy awesomewm configs
[2021-06-29T17:41:02Z] <armin> awesome is actually a great wm, once it's configured
[2021-06-29T17:41:23Z] <dylanaraps> I sent an email to Martin Stransky (Red Hat guy doing most of the Linux leg work) about Firefox and its plans for X11 support. Basically, when LTS distributions swap to Wayland, Firefox will start moving away from Xorg.
[2021-06-29T17:42:31Z] <dilyn> so we've got at least a year before that process begins 
[2021-06-29T17:42:42Z] <dilyn> and probably fifteen after that before they finally finish it 
[2021-06-29T17:43:13Z] <dylanaraps> Basically
[2021-06-29T17:45:05Z] <rio6> merging compositors and wms tho
[2021-06-29T17:45:12Z] <rio6> in wayland compositors
[2021-06-29T17:45:28Z] <rio6> although I don't use compositor so :P
[2021-06-29T17:45:55Z] <dylanaraps> I've never like calling them "wayland compositor" since they do so much more than that.
[2021-06-29T17:46:22Z] <dylanaraps> "window manager" is also inaccurate (on wayland) for the same reason.
[2021-06-29T17:46:39Z] <dylanaraps> Maybe "wayland display server" or something along these lines(?)
[2021-06-29T17:49:14Z] <armin> if "wayland wm" implies that it's a compositor, too, anyways, why bother? the lines between a DE and a WM are blurry, likewise.
[2021-06-29T17:49:21Z] <rio6> hopefully things like "I made this cool fancy window effect but it only works on wayfire so if you use anything else you can't use it" won't happen
[2021-06-29T17:50:54Z] <dylanaraps> It will happen and already happens. rio6:
[2021-06-29T17:51:47Z] <rio6> :|
[2021-06-29T17:52:05Z] <dylanaraps> The concept of "Linux desktop environment as a singular development platform" has existed for a long time.
[2021-06-29T17:52:41Z] <dylanaraps> rio6: Have a look at "GNOME Circle" for example.
[2021-06-29T17:52:55Z] <dylanaraps> https://circle.gnome.org/
[2021-06-29T17:54:10Z] <rio6> can't say I like that
[2021-06-29T17:54:35Z] <testuser-broken> dylanaraps btw about firefox, i have a maintained version of this patch https://github.com/dylanaraps/wayland-experiment/issues/1
[2021-06-29T17:55:02Z] <midfavila> the gnome circle logo is such a meme
[2021-06-29T17:55:49Z] <rio6> developers need to write the same program multiple times for different environments; users are locked into environment specific programs. These things don't really need to happen but they do anyways.
[2021-06-29T17:55:52Z] <dylanaraps> testuser-broken: Very nice. Thanks for letting me know.
[2021-06-29T17:56:43Z] <dylanaraps> rio6: The "lock in" is the intention. How else do you solve the wild-west we have now? :P
[2021-06-29T17:56:52Z] <dilyn> have those wayland patches still not landed?? smh 
[2021-06-29T17:56:59Z] <rio6> midfavila: I thought it's a meme site like those systemd bad websites out there until I saw the domain
[2021-06-29T17:57:31Z] <rio6> becuause of that image
[2021-06-29T17:59:02Z] <rio6> dylanaraps: I like being a cowboy using a duct taped system
[2021-06-29T18:00:11Z] <dylanaraps> rio6: So do I. 
[2021-06-29T18:09:37Z] <testuser-broken> dilyn: even the gtk 2 patchset was backed out cuz of breakage so i wouldnt ezpect this anytime soon
[2021-06-29T18:11:09Z] <testuser-broken> idk if they readded it later
[2021-06-29T18:13:08Z] <dilyn> smh
[2021-06-29T18:13:17Z] <dilyn> firefox is forever disappointing 
[2021-06-29T20:56:26Z] <Guest88> When I kiss update I got error fatal: Commit bff5fd14 does not have a GPG signature. For this I assume https://github.com/kiss-community/repo/commits/master
[2021-06-29T20:57:55Z] <acheam> don't gpg verify the repo commits
[2021-06-29T20:58:27Z] <Guest88> Ok.
[2021-06-29T22:56:04Z] <msk_1411[m]> I just got PMed by ChanServ so I'm guessing that something changed?
[2021-06-29T22:57:45Z] <michael> Do you folks only use ALSA for sound? How much of a hassle is it to configure?
[2021-06-29T22:59:04Z] <Guest88> I got it working yesterday actually
[2021-06-29T22:59:33Z] <Guest88> For me I only needed to add four lines to my ALSA config. 
[2021-06-29T22:59:56Z] <Guest88> I typed alsactl store to save these settings then have to run "alsactl restore" which i put into script at boot
[2021-06-29T23:00:26Z] <Guest88> To be safe, you should make sure various codecs are enabled in the kernel
[2021-06-29T23:01:04Z] <Guest88> Also I am managiong volume using alsamixer for now, still have to write scripts to adjust via bindings
[2021-06-29T23:01:45Z] <michael> Can't you use amixer for that?
[2021-06-29T23:02:14Z] <michael> It's a CLI instead of alsamixer's TUI
[2021-06-29T23:02:28Z] <Guest88> Dunno haven't tested it yet
[2021-06-29T23:14:07Z] <acheam> any viable "gnu as" replacements?
[2021-06-29T23:16:04Z] <dilyn> llvm-as kekw
[2021-06-29T23:16:46Z] <dilyn> those are the only two I have ever heard anyone say can actually do things 
[2021-06-29T23:16:52Z] <dilyn> others are incomplete or... not good 
[2021-06-29T23:17:16Z] <acheam> llvm-as 
[2021-06-29T23:18:20Z] <acheam> I thought llvm-as was just for internal clang usage and stuff 
[2021-06-29T23:19:25Z] <dilyn> probably 
[2021-06-29T23:19:26Z] <dilyn> :)  
[2021-06-29T23:19:35Z] <dilyn> https://github.com/rui314/mold/releases/tag/v0.9 so much progress on mold! 
[2021-06-29T23:24:37Z] <acheam> at 22 gnu packages at this point, mt of the just make dependencies
[2021-06-29T23:24:44Z] <acheam> s/mt/many/g
[2021-06-29T23:25:08Z] <acheam> is mold actually usable?
[2021-06-29T23:25:32Z] <acheam> as a sole ld implementation
[2021-06-29T23:25:45Z] <acheam> I dont like having multiple linkers, multiple compilers, etc lying around
[2021-06-29T23:26:35Z] <dilyn> on gentoo it is, apparently 
[2021-06-29T23:26:44Z] <dilyn> it can't build compiler-rt still, I don't think
[2021-06-29T23:28:07Z] <dilyn> I have... two GNU packages? 
[2021-06-29T23:28:12Z] <dilyn> gmake and gnupg
[2021-06-29T23:39:02Z] <illiliti> and linux