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Date: 27 Nov 1995 01:09:28 -0500
Subject: jms resigns rastb5
I've been debating this step for, quite literally, months now.
What has finally tipped the balance is seeing the extent to which
rastb5 has been virtually taken hostage by a very few people
who have no interest in this forum except to tear down this show
in general, and me in particular.
To that effect, they lie, manufacture facts, speculate based on
premises that have no basis whatsoever in reality, engage in smear
campaigns, insult and abuse users of this area, drop innuendo when
they have nothing else to grab onto...they leap into threads that
should by all rights be reasonably safe from flame and turn them
into referendums on whether or not jms is a liar, in the kind of
logic that stems from "are you still beating your wife?" premises.
The progression is always the same: a smear message, or an outright
fabrication, gets posted; it generates heated replies from other
users; those users are then attacked for being unthinking followers
or sycophants (when the reality is that the original message was
bone-headed and simply *wrong), thus ensuring that the conversation
is not about the subject anymore, but rather the conversation becomes
about the conversation...and in that form, it can go on forever,
spreading out into more and more threads until all you see after a
while are flames in every direction.
I try to stay out of it as much as I can...but sooner or later
something so odious, so despicable, such an obvious, irredeemable lie
gets posted that I lose my temper and have to respond. I sit here,
and take sucker punches to the face, every single time I sign on from
some of the outrageous stuff that goes on here; I take it quietly,
but after you're punched in the face three, four, five times a day,
for weeks at a time, damn it sooner or later you're going to hit back,
and hard. And that's when the same cadre of imbeciles comes back and
says, "Gee, look at that, see how badly he behaves?"
More and more lately, I have been signing on here, and by the time I
log off, I'm furious. Furious for the unsubstantiated character
assassination directed against me...and over the course of the year
plus I've been here, not one -- not ONE -- of the allegations from
Fuller, Fuller or Thaxton have *ever* been proven out, but they just
forget that and move on to the next attack...as well as the attacks
on other users here who have chosen to defend me against these
baseless attacks.
In the past, where it's been just a few threads here and there, and
I knew what they were, I could just avoid them. But in their
ceaseless attacks, designed to provoke a response from me, they
have begun throwing their nets consistently wider, so that they're
all over the place; I can't avoid the hassles and the grief. And
if I see some of this crap, which is untrue and unfair and designed
for no other reason than to cause me grief...I get angry, and when
I get angry, I can't write, and that hurts the show.
And I will not allow the show to be hurt. When it crosses that
line...it stops. One way or another.
I've tried reasonable appeals; those were taken as signs of weakness,
turned into further attacks, and ultimately failed. I've asked
people here *not* to respond to these abusive individuals, because
if they get only silence for their efforts, they will go away; they
live for the echo of pain caused by their words; find validation and
reason to live in that echo. That failed. And now the level of
toxicity has risen to a level that can no longer be tolerated.
And before anyone even *tries* to turn this into "oh, joe just doesn't
want to hear negative stuff about his show, he doesn't want to hear
any criticism, he just wants to be god" (and you know who you are,
and fuck you too), it's got *nothing* to do with criticism of the
show, positive or negative, made from having genuinly thought out
the problems. I've always responded well to any kind of criticism
that is well-considered, and always will.
This has to do with a small handful of people who have, through
their incessant, stalking, compulsive behavior ruined this forum for
not only me but a great deal of other people who've emailed me to
say that they don't post here any more, because they've gotten
tired of being attacked, tired of reading the endless tirades and
smears and assaults on me and other users. The good people get
driven away, and the bad people refuse to go, or to moderate their
behavior, and there is no mechanism currently in place for others
here to moderate their behavior.
I have become, in many ways, the football used to pull others on
either side of the line into an ugly and destructive game. And
the only way to stop it is to remove the football.
So I am posting this as notice that I will be resigning from
rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5 effective the end of the month. To Ron
and the Rangers...stop sending me the list at that time.
Because the simple reality is that once I'm gone, the prime lure for
those who've turned this place into a constant flame zone for the
last year will have left. And in time, so will they. It's sad
when a handful of people can take something that is of value to
thousands, potentially tens of thousands, of users worldwide, and
chew away at it until there's nothing left, simply because of their
own twisted obsession.
I cannot go to bed, or get up in the morning, furious over the
latest offense committed here by the tyrannical few; I've lost
endless hours sitting here angry over the falsehoods and the
smears and the innuendo. I can't afford to do that anymore.
And just so they cannot weasel their way out of it later, cannot
say "well, it wasn't me, it was just the climate, it was the
fault of those guys over there...look, a comet...." I point the
finger squarely at the Theron Fuller, Deborah Fuller, and Ford
Thaxton, with a couple of other accomplices not worthy of comment.
I hope you enjoy seeing your names in a post by me, folks, since
that's what seems to excite you, because this particular message
is likely to be the last. You've finally succeeded in driving
me off rastb5, which was clearly your intent from the start.
I will continue to be present on CIS, Genie, AOL and a few other
places, which have more than their share of critical commentaries,
but are moderated to prevent this kind of abusive behavior. When
the rastb5-info group is open, I will post to that area, and take
questions via that forum. But I will no longer post to, or read
the main rastb5 area any longer. I simply can't afford the
heartache anymore.
The experiment in interaction between viewers and the makers of
B5 will continue; they just will continue in other places.
People ask why more producers don't come on-line. This is the
reason. Because there are some people out there who are obsessed
with anyone who has even the smallest celebrity (and there ain't
much smaller celebrity than being a producer); people who feel it
is their god-given obligation to tear down the other person, and
to make sure that there cannot *possibly* be anyone in their
universe more important than they themselves. They do not sow,
neither do they reap; they only shred and tear and abuse.
If you're ever going to see more producers on-line, you're going
to have to look seriously into ways to keep the least reputable
elements from turning it into a bloodbath. Because when some say,
as has been said here, "it's my right to say this, and you have to
take it," the response is, "No, I don't." If you stay, you become
an enabler, a co-dependent, who allows the abuse to continue by the
conscious decision to remain where you can be hit.
To the rest of you: I apologize for having to take this step.
Some of you know how difficult this decision has been for me, the
long months I've spent debating it back and forth with friends,
family and other netters. I have enjoyed the exchange, have learned
much from the commentaries, and the discussion, have made many
friends and acquaintances. Were there any way I could stay, be
sure that I would. But when I have to stare at a monitor, when
a script deadline is upon me, and all I can think of is, "That
goddamned liar is spreading the same old crap *again*," then
something has got to go. In this case, that's me.
Because sure as hell, they won't. Not until their punching bag
With the obvious exceptions, I will miss you greatly. As stated
above, I'll be here through the end of the month, just to finish
clearing out stuff, and ease this transition, though probably in
somewhat reduced capacity. I hope to see many of you via the new
info group. Though the discussion will not be quite so free
wheeling as it is here, because of the moderated structure there,
it will be good to look upon your faces (well, your pixels) in
the months to come there.
Again, my apologies. I wish this could be handled in some other
way, but that doesn't seem likely. You cannot know how your
words, and your efforts, on behalf of B5, have been appreciated
not just by me, but by everyone involved with the show. It's
been a great experience, a chance to learn, and a hell of a ride.
See you on the flip side.
With great affection,
J. Michael Straczynski
Date: 1 Dec 1995 04:39:47 -0500
Subject: from jms: benedictions
Tonight is the last night of my feed from rastb5, and I wanted to
send along a quick note to resolve the few last things remaining to be
discussed or addressed before that happens.
Since my note went up -- raggedly, here and there, due to some
problems with the server, apparently -- I have now logged slightly over
900 private email messages in my GEnie mailbox. This in addition to the
rest of the feed per se. I'm slogging through them as fast as I can,
trying to give personal responses to as many as I humanly can; if over
the course of the next week or so, if you've sent me a note, and don't
get a response, assume that either got crunched by the often cranky
GEnie newsreader system, or it didn't specifically seem to require a
response...or my hands fell off and rolled under the table.
Nonetheless, a general thank you to everyone who's sent in mail on
this. It's disturbing to realize that about 75% of all of the notes thus
far received begin with a variation on "I used to post on rastb5 (or I
just lurk on rastb5) but don't post because the atmosphere just got too
poisoned by the deranged few you mentioned." Literally hundreds of
people seem to have been driven from rastb5 by the rampage of a few
others who don't want to be attacked or abused by those few. This is
terribly saddening to realize. That they have been driven off is more of
a real issue than my being now in this position.
Anyway...to all those who wrote, I am moved and touched by your
words, and if there were any way around this, I'd take it. I know that
some are working behind the scenes to put together a moderated newsgroup,
but I don't know if that will happen or not. The goal of any such should
not be to eliminate criticism -- heck, there's never been a lack for that
here or on any of the other systems -- but just to keep out the truly
dysfunctional. That may be a very promising route, but I'm not holding
out much hope that it'll happen.
Surprisingly, the #1 comment that has come in is, "What on earth
TOOK you so long? If I were in your shoes I'd've been out of here MONTHS
ago." Glutton for punishment, I guess. Kept thinking we could work a
way around this. But as has been pointed out by others, I guess it was
inevitable. I didn't see that because I suppose I didn't really want to
see it, or cop to it, or realize that this was running out on me. I have
vastly enjoyed the open lines of communication, have met a great number of
interesting people both on-line exclusively and even in person in many
cases.
Anyway, I wish it could be otherwise. For the most part, you're a
cute bunch, and I won't even space you for being cute.
(Oh, and speaking of "for the most part," a sidelong glance in the
direction of Robert Holland is in order, whose latest poison pen letters
are wonderfully emblematic of the problem here from the start. He has
implied since this all came out that in leaving here, I'm somehow "getting
away with something," that it's nothing to do with him or his ilk here on
the system, nononononono, can't be that...it's just that I'm on AOL now
leaving tons of messages by his reckoning, and it'd happen regardless.
Which is so obviously boneheaded and stupid that it almost doesn't merit
response...but what the hell....
(The AOL B5 page has, maybe, 1/1,000th the number of users as rastb5;
I log on maybe every two-three days, and leave maybe a total of 5-10
messages in the course of a week. So much for his claim about the total
number of messages left. AOL is confined just to the US, and doesn't have
even a *fraction* of the coverage of rastb5. But Mr. Holland, in his usual
subliminal sleazosity, tries to find some subterfuge, some hidden agenda,
something he can point to in vague terms and wonder what I'm getting away
with. This is the game he and the others here play constantly; there is
nothing they can go after in reality, so they come up with vaguely worded
allegations with no real core to them, just designed to somehow cast a
shadow on this show or myself, specifically to get people, myself included,
to respond, defending when no real charge has been made. It's the oldest
trick in the book; get the other person to defend themselves against a
non-existent charge, in the hope of creating the illusion of smoke and
the perception of fire...and, of course, getting everyone upset in the
process. I fell for it too many times; we all did. This is the last time
I will do so. Mr. Holland belongs in the same company as the rest of his
associates. They will *always* find something to complain about, even if
it means manufacturing it themselves.)
But it's no longer my problem. Just as it's no longer the problem of
several hundred others who've logged off here in the last year due to the
hassles, and the others who have either left, or are about to leave for the
same reason: the tyranny of the petty dysfunctional.
So we turn back toward the light, and happier topics. This is, after
all, a benediction, not a jeremiad.
I'm told that the info area doesn't quite function as I'd thought,
so we'll see what can be done here. From time to time, I will try to put
together a letter from home, as it were, to send here to rastb5; I won't
see any of the responses to it that aren't emailed directly to me, but
the intent would be to send along information that might be useful from
time to time for folks to have. I'm not expecting to do this very often,
but will try to do it here and there as I'm able.
In other news...since this I guess kinda counts as such a letter...
I'm happy to note that the paperwork for the B5 fan club has finally,
FINALLY, come in in finished form. Once it's vetted by our people, we
hope to get it signed and get this long-overdue baby going. We've had
a number of discussions about this, and how to handle it, maybe a survey
of folks to see what kinds of limited-edition items they'd like to see us
make, maybe a web-page for the club, other options. (If we should start
selling limiteds on the EA pins, patches and stuff, what we'll probably
do is have them made by the same companies that supply us with the real
props used in the show, so they're absolutely identical in every way, not
just knockoffs. It's a little more expensive that way to make, and we
won't make much of anything off them because we'll keep the prices at a
reasonable level, but I think that's the way to go. Neither Doug nor I
are looking to make this into a profit center; if it can more or less pay
for itself, and help organize folks, give them something nifty from the
show, then that's sufficient.)
Oh...and we're investigating the possibility of licensing the damned
videotapes ourselves, producing them pretty much at cost. Don't know if
we can pull this off or not, but we're going to try.
Michael York is currently shooting with us in "A Late Delivery From
Avalon," and doing an amazing job. This may turn into one of our best
episodes, from a performance and emotion perspective. I had a few doubts
about the script -- it has a kind of writing style I don't use very often,
and very stylized in appearance -- but it's coming out great.
Script 15 is entitled "Interludes and Examinations," and has a plot
turn I hadn't seen coming, but which fits perfectly into the arc; I think
you're going to be stunned. (I was.) As I write this, I've just started
writing "War Without End, Part One," #316, the first part of the two
episodes that bring Sinclair to Babylon 5, which we'll shoot sometime
after the first of the year. It's been touch and go, but we've finally
been able to schedule all of the guest cast members from "Babylon Squared"
for this one, which is the flip side of that episode. It's probably going
to be the most expensive show we've done yet, due to the hideous production
requirements for this one. It's also the one I'm most nervous about
writing, even more than "Fall of Night," because an awful lot happens here,
and it has to be done just right. It's going to be probably the toughest
writing job of the series to date.
I'll be putting Sinclair and Sheridan together a lot, which is
shaping up to be an interesting combination. We're also going to see
Minbar for the first time.
(We just now got the finished copy of "Voices of Authority" in; man,
do I wish we'd had this early enough to run in place of PTG, great as that
one is. The EFX are terrific, eye-popping.)
Oh...speaking of eye-popping, I've gotten a copy of the B5 Screen
Saver/Limited Edition Entertainment CD Rom, and it's nifty. I suggest it
to everyone, with a caveat: if you're not a computer neep-neep kind of
person, have someone help you install the thing. It took me several
passes to figure everything out. And once you DO install it, even though
it says "do you want all the images?" and you say yes, it doesn't put them
all on. Once you've finished -- and I'm putting this here because as far
as I can tell this isn't documented *anywhere* -- go to the setup menu,
and hit install. Make sure your CDrom is in the drive. Go to the
Images subdirectory on the CDrom, and you'll suddenly see 150 or so
images that were *not* installed. Highlight all of them, copy them over
to the pdesk/images subdirectory on your hard disk, then add them, and
select them. Most neeps out there could probably figure this out, but I
couldn't, so I pass this along for those who are as computerchip
challenged as I am. Once it's all *there*, and actually even before that,
it's gorgeous...the images are crisp and brilliant, the full-motion video
stuff is terrific, there's music and sounds and other stuff...I can't
commend it highly enough. (Oh, yeah, I think it sometimes bumps up
against Norton Desktop, but it's only happening on one of my two Dell
machines running ND, so it may be something I'm doing wrong.)
For those who asked about books...there's going to be a Creating
Babylon 5 book out from Boxtree Books in the UK this summer. I just
finished proofing it, and it's pretty good. I think the photo selection
could be better, but the actual text is quite good.
(A pause while jms tries desperately to remember if there's any
other real hard news to pass along here...and the brain goes blank.)
We're going to be shooting through December 14th, at which point
we break for the Christmas hiatus through January 2nd. I hope to take
some of that time and catch up on scripts a bit. We'll probably debut
the first season 3 gag reel at the party. (Then run like hell.)
OH...yeah, and before I forget (again), to those who asked about
the Stephen Furst item in TV Guide...he's doing the Chicago Hope show in
a two-parter, he's not joining the cast of regulars. The piece in TV
Guide is ambiguous and can be read that way, much to Stephen's chagrin.
He'll be doing more shows for us this season.
There's a conference in the Compuserve Convention Center on Saturday
from 2-3 p.m. Pacific time. Just me at this point.
Knowing this is the last note I'll be sending for a while, I'm
tempted to keep shoving stuff in here. I just realized that I wish this
didn't have to stop. But it kinda does, doesn't it?
So...to those of you who have been terrifically helpful to me over
the term of this long experiment...to the Rangers for filtering out the
feed and protecting me from story ideas...to Sherry for the great analyses
of episodes, and Orso for his cogent thoughts...actually, I shouldn't be
singling people out because I've been forever astonished and gratified at
some of the brilliant and insightful observations that have floated across
my monitor in the last year or so. I've been delighted, amused, impressed,
floored, dumbfounded, intrigued, awakened, and occasionally horrified
(usually in a good way).
It is my abiding hope that in return, I've given something of use
here. I feel strongly that we cannot hope to control or influence o
improve a dragon with as many heads as TV until and unless we understand it
first. I hope that I've helped a little to demystify how it all works, so
that folks have a better chance of getting what they *want* rather than
what some producers or studios want to shove down your throats. If it has
served that purpose to any degree, then the exercise has been worthwhile.
My best to all of you. When I can, I'll try to post messages in a
bottle and send them along to the group as occasional updates. Meanwhile,
take care, don't fight, and remember: if you do not choose to lead, you
will forever be led by others. Find what scares you, and do it. And
you *can* make a difference, if you choose to do so.
Babylon Control, clear.
jms