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-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Omar Polo op at omarpolo.com
Fri Jul 2 08:20:01 BST 2021
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
charliebrownau <charliebrownau at protonmail.com> writes:
Gday Omar Polo
Hello :)
Could you please mirror Telescope on sourcehut
A large amount of people are migrating away
from git/github/gitlab
I don't think I can, sorry, at least for the moment. Don't get mewrong, I love sourcehut (from what I've seen from the outside at least)and think it's a great product. It would be probably very helpful, notonly for telescope but for gmid too, to have a mirror there. There is abuilt-in mailing list, and the CI supports even some BSDs from what I'veheard.
However, I have a personal VPS and I'm using GitHub only as a mirror andfile storage: it's possible to clone the code fromhttps://git.omarpolo.com/telescope and for issue/patches/feature requestI'm always available via email -- either on this address or attelescope@ <the same host>.
On github I'm hosting only the versioned tarballs and the binaries.Because I'm not trusting them enough, everything is also signed with mygpg and signify key too.
I was thinking (not too seriously) about mirroring the code on codebergtoo since I've ended up with creating and account there, if it wouldhelp someone.
Also please seriously consider releasing the program
as an appimage, even if its only major release milestones
I never used an appimage, but since I'm already providing theprecompiled binaries I guess I can try to provide an appimage too.
I'll check how to build one and eventually upload the 0.3 version.
Just a question, I'm assuming you are familiar with the appimages as auser, what's the benefit of an appimage/snap/... over astatically-linked executable? (from the POV of a user)
Its great to see programs walking away from
SystemD / Dbus / Pulseaudio &
Python / perl / dotnet
Thanks for your efforts, best of luck
Thanks! :)
Cheers,
Omar Polo
Regards
Charliebrownau
charliebrownau at protonmail.com
Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email.
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On Friday, July 2nd, 2021 at 12:04 AM, <gemini-request at lists.orbitalfox.eu> wrote:
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Today's Topics:
1. [users] [ANN] telescope -- yet another browser (Omar Polo)
2. Re: [users] [ANN] telescope -- yet another browser
(Jonathan McHugh)
3. Re: [users] [ANN] telescope -- yet another browser
(Jonathan McHugh)
4. Re: [users] [ANN] telescope -- yet another browser (Omar Polo)
5. Re: [users] [ANN] telescope -- yet another browser (Jonathan Lane)
6. Upload a file to gemlog.blue? (Brandon Taylor)
7. Re: Upload a file to gemlog.blue? (Andrew Singleton)
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 01 Jul 2021 18:51:33 +0200
From: Omar Polo op at omarpolo.com
To: Gemini application layer protocol gemini at lists.orbitalfox.eu
Subject: [users] [ANN] telescope -- yet another browser
Message-ID: 87im1ut1t6.fsf at omarpolo.com
Content-Type: text/plain
Hello everyone,
During the last 3/4 months I've been working on a yet another Gemini
ncurses client: telescope
=
gemini://telescope.omarpolo.com
=
https://telescope.omarpolo.com
It's obviously a project only for fun, in a very-WIP stage and with lots
of missing pieces, but it's improving and I've reached the point where I
think I can present it to a wider audience.
The main difference between telescope and others (I've only tried tinmop
and amfora as TUI clients) is the Emacs (and w3m) inspired interface:
instead of scrolling a page and typing a number to open a link, you have
a cursor you can move freely around the page.
The default keybindings are heavily inspired from Emacs, but I tried at
least to include some keys familiar to vi(1) users, so hjkl, gg, G, gT
etc. work. All the keybindings are customizable anyway.
The current list of features is honestly quite short:
- color and keybindings are customizable
- history
- rudimentary bookmark management
- tabs (on startup reloads the last set of tabs)
- streaming pages
- rich set of commands to move around the page
- splitted in three different process, each one is pledged (this only
on OpenBSD ofc; will add seccomp/landlock in the future, probably)
while the TODO list is ever-growing!
I know there are various annoyances still (I just fixed the resize
"jump" in the main branch for instance), but as I was saying, it has
now reached a point where I think it's starting to become "usable". I'd
love to receive feedbacks (and even more patches! :P)
Telescope 0.3 is available on guix, thanks to cage who did the work.
Precompiled binaries for linux amd64 and aarch64 are available from the
site, but it's very easy to compile from source since it only depends on
libevent, libncursesw, libtls and yacc/bison. It's known to compile and
run on FreeBSD too.
Cheers,
Omar Polo
Message: 2
Date: Thu, 01 Jul 2021 17:12:52 +0000
From: "Jonathan McHugh" indieterminacy at libre.brussels
To: "Omar Polo" op at omarpolo.com, "Gemini application layer protocol"
<gemini at lists.orbitalfox.eu>
Subject: Re: [users] [ANN] telescope -- yet another browser
Message-ID: abdda4069e4ae690a3f6d2b2217b46b5 at libre.brussels
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Hi Omar,
Thanks for your work.
Just a quick heads up, your Guix link featured on your HTTPS project homepage (I cant access Gemini on this device atm) is broken.
It links to version 0.2 (giving a server error on the Guix page^1, whereas 0.3 is now available (and
=
https://guix.gnu.org/en/packages/telescope-0.3/
I noticed the inputs into the system, nice and lightweight!
=
https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/guix.git/tree/gnu/packages/web-browsers.scm#n911
Im looking forward to testing it.
Btw, what your impression of tinmop? I havent tried it yet.
^1 I dont recall the Guix HTTP package page navigating by version number. It makes sense I suppose.
=======================================================================================================================================================================================================
Jonathan McHugh
indieterminacy at libre.brussels
July 1, 2021 6:52 PM, "Omar Polo" op at omarpolo.com wrote:
Hello everyone,
During the last 3/4 months I've been working on a yet another Gemini
ncurses client: telescope
=
gemini://telescope.omarpolo.com
=
https://telescope.omarpolo.com
It's obviously a project only for fun, in a very-WIP stage and with lots
of missing pieces, but it's improving and I've reached the point where I
think I can present it to a wider audience.
The main difference between telescope and others (I've only tried tinmop
and amfora as TUI clients) is the Emacs (and w3m) inspired interface:
instead of scrolling a page and typing a number to open a link, you have
a cursor you can move freely around the page.
The default keybindings are heavily inspired from Emacs, but I tried at
least to include some keys familiar to vi(1) users, so hjkl, gg, G, gT
etc. work. All the keybindings are customizable anyway.
The current list of features is honestly quite short:
- color and keybindings are customizable
- history
- rudimentary bookmark management
- tabs (on startup reloads the last set of tabs)
- streaming pages
- rich set of commands to move around the page
- splitted in three different process, each one is pledged (this only
on OpenBSD ofc; will add seccomp/landlock in the future, probably)
while the TODO list is ever-growing!
I know there are various annoyances still (I just fixed the resize
"jump" in the main branch for instance), but as I was saying, it has
now reached a point where I think it's starting to become "usable". I'd
love to receive feedbacks (and even more patches! :P)
Telescope 0.3 is available on guix, thanks to cage who did the work.
Precompiled binaries for linux amd64 and aarch64 are available from the
site, but it's very easy to compile from source since it only depends on
libevent, libncursesw, libtls and yacc/bison. It's known to compile and
run on FreeBSD too.
Cheers,
Omar Polo
--
Message: 3
Date: Thu, 01 Jul 2021 17:16:23 +0000
From: "Jonathan McHugh" indieterminacy at libre.brussels
To: "Omar Polo" op at omarpolo.com, "Gemini application layer protocol"
<gemini at lists.orbitalfox.eu>
Subject: Re: [users] [ANN] telescope -- yet another browser
Message-ID: 48478d02b5b0bb945dc193de6360c02f at libre.brussels
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Hi Omar,
Would you please mind elaborating on this bullet point please?
* splitted in three different process, each one is pledged (this only
on OpenBSD ofc; will add seccomp/landlock in the future, probably)
I feels like something I could just nod along to (without really/properly understanding) but I suspect it is probably an interesting design concept.
Kind regards,
======================================================================================================================================================================
Jonathan McHugh
indieterminacy at libre.brussels
July 1, 2021 6:52 PM, "Omar Polo" op at omarpolo.com wrote:
Hello everyone,
During the last 3/4 months I've been working on a yet another Gemini
ncurses client: telescope
=
gemini://telescope.omarpolo.com
=
https://telescope.omarpolo.com
It's obviously a project only for fun, in a very-WIP stage and with lots
of missing pieces, but it's improving and I've reached the point where I
think I can present it to a wider audience.
The main difference between telescope and others (I've only tried tinmop
and amfora as TUI clients) is the Emacs (and w3m) inspired interface:
instead of scrolling a page and typing a number to open a link, you have
a cursor you can move freely around the page.
The default keybindings are heavily inspired from Emacs, but I tried at
least to include some keys familiar to vi(1) users, so hjkl, gg, G, gT
etc. work. All the keybindings are customizable anyway.
The current list of features is honestly quite short:
- color and keybindings are customizable
- history
- rudimentary bookmark management
- tabs (on startup reloads the last set of tabs)
- streaming pages
- rich set of commands to move around the page
- splitted in three different process, each one is pledged (this only
on OpenBSD ofc; will add seccomp/landlock in the future, probably)
while the TODO list is ever-growing!
I know there are various annoyances still (I just fixed the resize
"jump" in the main branch for instance), but as I was saying, it has
now reached a point where I think it's starting to become "usable". I'd
love to receive feedbacks (and even more patches! :P)
Telescope 0.3 is available on guix, thanks to cage who did the work.
Precompiled binaries for linux amd64 and aarch64 are available from the
site, but it's very easy to compile from source since it only depends on
libevent, libncursesw, libtls and yacc/bison. It's known to compile and
run on FreeBSD too.
Cheers,
Omar Polo
--
Message: 4
Date: Thu, 01 Jul 2021 20:37:26 +0200
From: Omar Polo op at omarpolo.com
To: Jonathan McHugh indieterminacy at libre.brussels
Cc: Gemini application layer protocol gemini at lists.orbitalfox.eu
Subject: Re: [users] [ANN] telescope -- yet another browser
Message-ID: 87eechubh5.fsf at omarpolo.com
Content-Type: text/plain
Jonathan McHugh indieterminacy at libre.brussels writes:
Hi Omar,
Would you please mind elaborating on this bullet point please?
* splitted in three different process, each one is pledged (this only
on OpenBSD ofc; will add seccomp/landlock in the future, probably)
I feels like something I could just nod along to (without really/properly understanding) but I suspect it is probably an interesting design concept.
Probably I should have use the "privsep" term, but it felt a slightly
exaggeration.
Telescope forks as soon as it can into three processes, each one does
only one thing (conceptually) and they talk via IPC (using imsg from
OpenBSD' libutil in particular). Furthermore, on OpenBSD, each process
is sandboxed with pledge(2) [0]. It's on my todo-list to do the same
with seccomp on linux, but later, probably around the 1.0. Seccomp is
very low-level and in general annoying to work with.
This way, for e.g. the `client' process (the only one with the network
access) can't be tricked into reading your ssh keys, because the kernel
would kill it as soon as it tries to open(2).
Modern web browsers also do something similar to this, at least to my
understanding. (see firefox project electrolysis and fission)
This is usually considered a security technique and while that's true,
I find that it also encourages cleaner code that's simpler to reason
about, when writing C at least.
I wrote more about pledge/seccomp/capsicum here[1]: while the details
regarding the implementation of gmid have changed a bit, the overall
description of the different sandboxes is still relevant :)
Cheers,
Omar Polo
[0]: gemini://gemini.omarpolo.com/cgi/man/pledge or
https://man.openbsd.org/pledge
[1]: gemini://gemini.omarpolo.com/post/gmid-sandbox.gmi
P.S.: Thanks for noticing the wrong url. I fixed it in the gemini
version of the page when the patch for telescope 0.3 was
committed, but forgot to update it in http-land!
P.P.S: regarding tinmop: it's a very peculiar program -- in a good way.
It's both a pleroma AND gemini client! It's a complete client:
it has subscriptions support, a really cool history completion
UI, built-in help, IRI support (I haven't tested this one though)
and so on. And did I mention that it's also a pleroma client? :D
I'm a little bit biased though, because both cage and I are
usually on #gemini-it on libera.chat and talk frequently. He
(and the others there) have influenced telescope and I think I
can say that I did the same with tinmop.
Kind regards,
====================
Jonathan McHugh
indieterminacy at libre.brussels
July 1, 2021 6:52 PM, "Omar Polo" op at omarpolo.com wrote:
Hello everyone,
During the last 3/4 months I've been working on a yet another Gemini
ncurses client: telescope
=
gemini://telescope.omarpolo.com
=
https://telescope.omarpolo.com
It's obviously a project only for fun, in a very-WIP stage and with lots
of missing pieces, but it's improving and I've reached the point where I
think I can present it to a wider audience.
The main difference between telescope and others (I've only tried tinmop
and amfora as TUI clients) is the Emacs (and w3m) inspired interface:
instead of scrolling a page and typing a number to open a link, you have
a cursor you can move freely around the page.
The default keybindings are heavily inspired from Emacs, but I tried at
least to include some keys familiar to vi(1) users, so hjkl, gg, G, gT
etc. work. All the keybindings are customizable anyway.
The current list of features is honestly quite short:
- color and keybindings are customizable
- history
- rudimentary bookmark management
- tabs (on startup reloads the last set of tabs)
- streaming pages
- rich set of commands to move around the page
- splitted in three different process, each one is pledged (this only
on OpenBSD ofc; will add seccomp/landlock in the future, probably)
while the TODO list is ever-growing!
I know there are various annoyances still (I just fixed the resize
"jump" in the main branch for instance), but as I was saying, it has
now reached a point where I think it's starting to become "usable". I'd
love to receive feedbacks (and even more patches! :P)
Telescope 0.3 is available on guix, thanks to cage who did the work.
Precompiled binaries for linux amd64 and aarch64 are available from the
site, but it's very easy to compile from source since it only depends on
libevent, libncursesw, libtls and yacc/bison. It's known to compile and
run on FreeBSD too.
Cheers,
Omar Polo
--
Message: 5
Date: Thu, 1 Jul 2021 21:54:18 +0000
From: Jonathan Lane tidux at sdf.org
To: gemini at lists.orbitalfox.eu
Subject: Re: [users] [ANN] telescope -- yet another browser
Message-ID: 20210701215418.jmhcf4gqjh6jmfcs at faeroes.freeshell.org
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
On Thu, Jul 01, 2021 at 06:51:33PM +0200, Omar Polo wrote:
Hello everyone,
During the last 3/4 months I've been working on a yet another Gemini
ncurses client: telescope
=
gemini://telescope.omarpolo.com
=
https://telescope.omarpolo.com
It's obviously a project only for fun, in a very-WIP stage and with lots
of missing pieces, but it's improving and I've reached the point where I
think I can present it to a wider audience.
It looks great! I like it so far. The one missing feature that would
let me ditch Amfora completely is local file support.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tidux at sdf.org
SDF Public Access UNIX System - http://sdf.org
---------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Thu, 1 Jul 2021 18:33:49 -0500
From: Brandon Taylor br.ta.2818 at gmail.com
To: gemini at lists.orbitalfox.eu
Subject: Upload a file to gemlog.blue?
Message-ID:
CAMYTvdBHvifqAC-6ZM3BVzFWp+ptv4g=oJEWj6t1M-aYKb6HEA at mail.gmail.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
I know the maintainers of gemlog.blue intended their capsule to be a
quick-and-easy way for new Gemini protocol users to learn the basics of the
thing -- create an account, add a post, edit a post, delete a post. But my
question is, is there any way to do a direct upload of a Gemini file to
this capsule? If not, what would be a better Gemini capsule that would
accommodate for direct uploads?
Brandon Taylor
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Message: 7
Date: Fri, 2 Jul 2021 00:04:28 +0000 (UTC)
From: Andrew Singleton singletona082 at gmail.com
To: Brandon Taylor br.ta.2818 at gmail.com
Cc: gemini at lists.orbitalfox.eu
Subject: Re: Upload a file to gemlog.blue?
Message-ID: 21e78f27-4a5d-4876-9e4b-acc8d2e975d4 at gmail.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Flounder.online allows sftp access to your user directory. Their web tools on the http site are pretty meh, and they have a few here limits (128k max file size, I want to say a 104 or so file limit. 10mb userspace limit.)
They also mirror user content for html browsers, which is how I found the site out. So also doubles as easy way to advertise your content on the Big Web too. Not perfect, but it's letting me built a site up and get into the habit of maintaining it so if I end up migrating I can just take my backup and go elsewhere. Also the server maintainer and owner seems interested in allowing users to compress their sites to .gml files but I don't know if there's been any work yet on they front.
Apologies for sounding like an advertisement. The place is really nice as a 'getting your feet wet' option specially if, like me. You have no disposable income.
Jul 1, 2021 6:34:24 PM Brandon Taylor br.ta.2818 at gmail.com:
I know the maintainers of gemlog.blue intended their capsule to be a quick-and-easy way for new Gemini protocol users to learn the basics of the thing -- create an account, add a post, edit a post, delete a post. But my question is, is there any way to do a direct upload of a Gemini /file/?to this capsule? If not, what would be a better Gemini capsule that would accommodate for direct uploads?
Brandon Taylor
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