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LIST FILE ON MARGIN IS 126 STATUS: ALL ALLOWED NUMBER OF LINES: 629 1 If you are in need of help, you need but ask.... 2 *********************** REMOVED: 15 SEP 83 *************************** 3 Welcome to BWMS (BackWater Message System) Mike Day System operator 4 ************************************************************ 5 GENERAL DISCLAIMER: BWMS IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY INFORMATION PLACED ON 6 THIS SYSTEM. 7 BWMS was created as an electronic bill board. BWMS is a privatly owned 8 and operated system which is currently open for use by the general public. 9 No restrictions are placed on the use of the system. 10 It is intended that the system be normally used for messages and 11 advertisments by the users. As the system is privatly owned, I retain the 12 right to remove any and all messages which I may find offensive 13 to me. Additionally because of the limited size of the system, it will be 14 periodically purged of older messages. (only 629 lines of data can be saved) 15 The saved information will be cycled to drive 'B' while the information on 16 drive 'B' will be archived, and a fresh disk will be installed in drive 'A'. 17 To leave a message, type 'ENTER' and use ctrl/C or break to get out 18 of the enter mode. The message is automaticly stored. 19 If after entering the message you find you made a mistake, 20 use the replace command to replace the line. 21 To exit from the system, type 'OFF' then hang up. 22 Type 'HELP' to see other commands that are available on the system. 23 ======================================== 24 25 %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% 26 MIKEY, first of all, you were correct,I was speaking ONLY of women 27 who have been RAPED. Many men have also been RAPED..not only homosexuals but 28 a surprising number of heterosexuals as well. 29 Now to your definition // By the ORS,163.305. the felony of Rape is 30 decided by many factors. The most common condition is that of which you 31 spoke concerning permission. 32 The terminology in the Oregon Revised Statue is "Forcible Compulsion." I 33 will refrain from the entire definition unless you request it. 34 Our work as I indicated earlier, is to assist women in deterring Rape in 35 many fashions. There has been a successin the Portland area in this 36 endeavor. 37 38 Charlotte 39 40 DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~ 41 42 Returning zero for a number divided by 43 zero would yeild very eroneous results 44 unless unless you subscribe to TRON's 45 theory that zero is infinite. 46 47 Well, on to more important things, does anyone out there know how to 48 make makizushi? I cannot seem to master the art of rolling the damn 49 things..........HELP 50 Sushi-holic, 51 Dirty Ol' Man 52 53 DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~ 55 56 NO, PIONEER, YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND HOW AUTOPILOTS WORK. IT IS TRUE THAT FOR 57 LANDING THE PLANES RESPOND TO EXTERNAL SIGNALS, BUT THE 747 AND MANY MODERN PLANES HAVE INERTIAL GUIDANCE SYSTEMS THAT ARE 58 INDEPENDANT OF EXTERNALS. OVER A 2000 MILE FLIGHT, THESE THINGS ARE ACCURATE TO LESS THAN 1 MILE. 59 OF COURSE, AS YOU SAID, IF THE WRONG COORDINATES WERE LOCKED INTO THE SYSTEM, THE PLANE WOULD (NATURALLY) GO ASTRAY. 60 AS FAR AS I KNOW, THE 747 HAS THE ORDINARY COMPLEMENT OF 3 IN THE COCKPIT: PILOT, COPILOT, AND NAVIGATOR. 61 INTERESTINGLY ENOUGH, THE 747 HAS LESS NEED FOR CREW THAN SMALLER, OLDER PLANES. IN FACT, I AM TOLD THAT THE 727 CAN TAKE 62 OFF, FLY, AND LAND WITHOUT HUMAN INTERVENTION. (I WOULDN'T RECOMMEND THIS, HOWEVER) 63 %Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z%Z% 64 WELL NOW! 65 ONE REASON BRIGHT PEOPLE GET SUCH BIG EGO'S IS THAT DUE TO THE DISTRIBUTION 66 OF THESE PEOPLE MOST OF THEM DON'T RUN ACROSS EACH OTHER VERY OFTEN UNTILL 67 THEY ARE OLDER, WHEN THEY MIGHT JOIN A CHESS CLUB, WORK FOR A HIGH TECH COM- 68 PANY, GET RICH, OR WHATEVER. AT THAT POINT THEY BEGIN A PROCESS OF LEARNING 69 GOOD MANNERS AND SOCIAL SKILLS THAT OTHER PEOPLE GO THROUGH MUCH EARLIER. 70 THIS CONTRIBUTES TO THE 'NERD EFFECT' THAT MAKES YOU WANT TO SIGN 71 COMMITMENT PAPERS FOR PEOPLE LIKE THE UNSIGNED BOOB WHO HAS BEEN HAUNTING 72 THIS SYSTEM OF LATE. IF 'UNSIGNED' IS STILL YOUNG ENOUGH, WHICH I SUSPECT HE 73 IS, RESOLUTION OF THIS PROBLEM WILL COME WITH TIME, HOPEFULLY. EVEN 74 HARDENED CRIMINALS MELLOW OUT UNLESS THEY MAKE IT TO THE TOP, MOST OF THE 75 TIME. INSTINCT TELLS ME THAT 'UNSIGNED' ISN'T GOING TO MAKE IT TO THE TOP 76 IN THE NEAR FUTURE. PEOPLE WHO AUTOMATICALLY REJECT OTHER PEOPLE'S IDEAS 77 USUALLY DON'T. 78 GETTING OUT AMONG PEOPLE WHO ARE IN THE SAME SITUATION MAY PARADOXICALLY 79 NOT BE NOTICED AT FIRST BY AN INIVIDUAL LIKE THIS, BECAUSE AUTOMATIC REJEC- 80 TION OF OTHER PEOPLE'S IDEAS MAY HAVE SET IN. SO USED TO SMOWING EVERYONE 81 IN SIGHT WITH FAST-TALKING B.S, OUR 'GENIUS' MAKES A FOOL OF HIM/HER SELF 82 IN THE PRESENCE OF PEERS (OR MAYBE SUPERIORS) 83 DEAR MIKEY- IBM HAS JUST CHANGED SOME OF THEIR SOFTWARE TO SET RESULTS 84 EQUAL TO ZERO ON A DIVIDE BY ZERO INSTEAD OF ISSUING AN ERROR. I AGREE THAT 85 THIS IS USEFUL. AGREEING THAT PARRALLEL LINES CONVERGE IS USEFUL IN PHOTO- 86 GRAPHY TOO. MATHEMATICAL RESEARCHERS HAVE MADE MUCH PROGRESS OVER THE 87 YEARS BY CONCENTRATING ON SUCH CONUNDRUMS, CREATING SYSTEMS WHERE THE 88 NON-COMMONSENSICAL IS TRUE. IMAGINARY NUMBERS HAD THE STATUS OF A JOKE 89 TO NON-CREATIVE TYPE MATHEMATICIANS AT ONE POINT TOO. 90 DEAR UNSIGNED - LOOK IT UP IN YOUR CRC, DUMMY - IT'S A TRIVIAL PROBLEM 91 (THAT'S THE CHEM RUBBER BOOK,YOU KNOW?). OH, BY THE WAY, LIMITS AND REAL 92 NUMBER CONCEPTS DON'T REQUIRE CALCULUS - CONSULT YOUR ARCHIMEDES. 93 DEAR DOCTOR - KEEP IT UP. YOUR INQUIRY IS IN THE BEST TRADITION 94 OF THEORECTICAL SCIENCE. UNSIGNED HAS THE SOUL OF A SHOE CLERK. 95 ))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))BATPOOP, THE MAGNIFICENT++++++++++++++ 96 97 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] 98 RE: THE FLIGHT 007 QUESTION, I KNOW THAT ALL AIRLINES REFUSE TO ALLOW PASSENGERS TO USE CALCULATORS OR PORTABLE 99 COMPUTERS ON AIRPLANES DUE TO THEIR BAD TENDENCY TO EMIT R.F. INTERFERRENCE. DO THESE EMISSIONS AFFECT THE FLIGHT 100 CONTROLS, AND COULD SOMEONE USING A P.C. OR CALCULATOR CAUSE A PROBLEM LIKE THIS? HMMMM??? 101 102 [][][][][][][][][][][][]PAM.[][][][][][] 103 ^^-^^^-^^^^^-^^^^^^^-^^^^^^^^^^^-^^^^^^^^^^^^^-^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^-^^-^^^-^^^^^ 104 Batpoop: A thousand thanks. I was starting to feel rather lonely. 105 106 To defend myself for the last time: I did not bring up black holes. My 107 response to the first inquiry was to refer queries to an article of Scientific 108 American. The only thing I claim as my own is the set of unreal numbers. 109 110 PAM: 747's use a triple set of inertial guidance devices. These are 111 supposedly unaffected <sp?> by radio frequency interference. So I don't 112 think that would be a factor. 113 114 I have a few questions of my own: 115 116 1. Was 007's actual flight path shorter than the one they were supposed to be 117 on? 118 2. It is not that uncommon, however very against company rules and results in 119 termination if discovered, for pilots to sleep while on long oversea 120 flights. Could one or more of the pilots been asleep? 121 3. Does anybody know the procedure used for flying that route? Especially, 122 when flying by (or over?) Japan, do they switch to VOR navigation? If so, 123 then the RFI theory may need to be looked into. 124 125 BYE THE DOCTOR 126 ^^-^^^-^^^^^-^^^^^^^-^^^^^^^^^^^-^^^^^^^^^^^^^-^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^-^^-^^^-^^^^^ 127 128 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] 129 AH, DOC, THAT ANSWERS SOME OF IT. AS TO "AFFECT" VERSUS "EFFECT", AFFECT IS WHAT I WOULD DO TO SOMETHING, EFFECT IS 130 WHAT WOULD HAPPEN. EXAMPLE, " I HAVE AFFECTED IT, AND THE EFFECT IS OBVIOUS."COMPRENDE? 131 132 [][][][][][][][][][][][][]PAM.[][][][][] 133 134 For Sale 135 Vic-20 Modem Datasette Superexpander 136 All for $165.00 137 Call 138 l 139 140 For For Sale: Vic 20,modem,datasette,superexpander 141 All for $165.00 142 For more info Call 143 Mike Roland 227-0631 144 **************************************** 145 146 147 Well, Batpoop, you've done it again. Unfortunately, your assumptions about me are only true if you are correct that 148 I am wrong in my information. If I am correct and you are wrong, then the tables are turned. 149 I do not 'automatically reject' other people's ideas. I only reject those ideas which are wrong, illogical, 150 internally inconsistent, or incredible. In fact, I also recognize that people often have the right ideas but very wrong 151 reasons. 152 A most enjoyable activity of mine is to be able to discuss (intelligently) a scientific subject with a person 153 (or persons) who are sufficiently qualified to express original thought. I spent a few years at a place where people were 154 selected for their interest in science and technology, and I found that to be close to heaven on earth: At last, I was 155 among my peers. Perhaps not surprising, each person was able to contribute to practically any discussion that went 156 on, even if it was not their primary field. 157 I remember no conversation where anyone overstepped his qualifications, and no-one tried to impress the others with 158 his knowledge, since each was comfortable with his own position. We could all accept the fact that the EE was better 159 able to convolve a time-domain signal, the biologist was best in designing a DNA synthesis reaction, the CS was more 160 experienced in explaining a program dealing in artificial intelligence, the mathematician was better integrating a 161 trancendental function, and the organic chemist knew better than anyone how to analyze a binary mixture. 162 Each knew, however, that he was outclassed by each of the others in their respective fields; More importantly, he 163 knew that each knew enough about the other fields to be able to detect bullshit and doubletalk. You couldn't even 164 begin to pull the wool over their eyes, and you didn't try. 165 But now, in the REAL WORLD, experts are few and far between. A person can recite parrotted material and pass himself off 166 as, if not an expert, a cognoscenti in a particular area. He can express poorly grounded opinions secure in the knowledge 167 that nobody around knows enough about the particular field to be able to detectit. And if anyone does come around that 168 points this out, he can use personal attacks to restore his position of respectability in the group. Since no 169 commonly-respected expert will likely come around to expose him, that person is generally safe from embarrassment. 170 I will not present myself as an expert in any particular field, though I probably qualify in a few. That's because 171 I have found that the more one learns on any subject, the more one recognizes how little he really knows about the rest 172 of the world. The more I learn, the less I feel I know. 173 But please return the favor and tone down your technical discussions. While you may prefer playing with your 174 toroidal black holes and such, you might as well be talking about magic. If you really want to even the score, we 175 could have a heated discussion on one of the following topics: 176 1. 1983 Fashion on Alpha Centauri. 177 2. The sex life of electrons, protons, and neutrons. 178 3. The world 25 minutes BEFORE the big bang. 179 4. Interstellar golf tournaments 180 181 I freely admit knowing absolutely nothing about the preceeding topics, and I'm sure you will too. This means 182 that we're equally qualified to discuss them, so we can debate them till the cows come home without fear of being proven 183 wrong. 184 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Signed<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< 185 AND NOW FOR SOMETHING COMPLETELY DIFFERENT.... 186 <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> 187 signed: 188 another (and well earned!) BRAVO! 189 190 PAM: 191 a hullo, -------can we talk? 192 193 signed (addendum): 194 i seem to remember Kinsey interviewing a few thousand adolescent 195 sub-atomic particles, it seems that current sexual mores among atomic 196 domains has remained unchanged through the past 20 ns, yet disruption 197 of the nuclear family (groan!) will probably lead to degenerate sexual 198 perversions becoming prevelent within the next 1 or 2 ms; lots of that 199 kinky mu-pion stuff! 200 201 Dave: 202 any comments regarding above and Violence in America ? 203 204 in a humorus vein, 205 Aaron 206 <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> 207 HEY, ENOUGH ABOUT THIS SPACE-CADET STUFF. WHAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR IS A GOOD 208 HOT TOPIC, RIGHT? WELL, LEBANON IS STARING US RIGHT IN THE FACE! HERE WE 209 HAVE A THOUSAND OR MORE MARINES STUCK OVER THERE, GETTING RAINED ON WITH 210 LEAD AND STEEL, AND WE SIT HERE FLAPPING OUR JAWS (EXCUSE ME, FINGERS) ABOUT 211 BUCK ROGERS. 212 SHOULD WE BE IN LEBANON? SHOULD THE SYRIANS BE IN LEBANON? SHOULD THE 213 ISRAELIS BE IN LEBANON? SHOULD THE LEBANESE BE IN LEBANON? SHOULD THE 214 CEDARS BE IN LEBANON? WHY AM I ASKING THESE STUPID QUESTIONS? AND 215 WHO ASKED YOU, ANYWAY? 216 WELL, WHADDA YA SAY? ALL YOU HAVE TO DO TO BE AN EXPERT ON LEBANON IS TO 217 READ THE PAPERS, WATCH THE 6 O'CLOCK NEWS, AND BE ABLE TO POINT TO BEIRUT 218 ON A MAP. 219 HAFEZ AL ASSAD 220 [_]-[_]-[_]-[_]-[_]-[_]-[_]-[_]-[_]-[_]-[_]-[_]-[_]-[_]-[_]-[_]-[_]-[_]-[_] 221 DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~ 222 223 Signed: Well put! It is sometimes entertaining to watch people make 224 fools of themselves, but it does get tiresome. I am totally in favor of 225 the freedom of expression afforded on BWMS but the bullshit does get a littl 226 thick sometimes. Perhaps as these persons become more aware that their 227 comments are recognized for what they are, they will tend to stick to subj- 228 jects in which they are more knowledgeable. I have found that the key to 229 successful bullshitting is infrequency. When exercised with extreme caution 230 and only in the event of an emergency (such as when you get pulled over forr 231 a traffic violation), it is often successful, but when it becomes a 232 routine, the listener (reader) will generally catch on eventually re- 233 gardless of his/her knowledge of the subject. 234 235 Hafez: Yes, we should definitely be in Lebanon. After all, military ex- 236 pansionism is the American way, is it not? 237 238 NOTE: 239 The above is an opinion of an unqualified individual. I do not 240 read newspapers (its depressing), my TV is broken, and I didn't realize 241 Lebanon was on the map (unless, of course, you were speaking of Lebanon 242 Oregon). 243 244 Mikey, a better way of dealing with division by zero in basic is through 245 error control; in other words, the ability to transfer to a particular 246 line in the event of an error, rather than printing an error message. I 247 have found this capability very useful but I am not sure what other PC's 248 support this other than TI. 249 Dirty Ol' Man 250 251 DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~ 252 253 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++k 254 I hope you 126 character liners realize that my hardware only allows me to 255 read the first 80 of them, and the rest is gone. I suppose that is OK, tho 256 as most of what is here is only 2/3 real anyway. 257 Division by zero: in calculus we went to great lengths to define it, usually 258 as "undefined", and the 0/0 was pointed out as ambiguous and could be 259 anything: this is how the proofs that 1=2 work. 260 As to flight 7; the people who knew what happened are dead, I suspect we will 261 never know why, don't let this stop us from imagining reasons. 262 In Lebanon the people who have a hereditary right to the land are being\ 263 pushed out and oppressed. Of course this has happened about 1000 times, so 264 some 1000 different groups have hereditary rights tot the land. blow it off 265 the map before they do. 266 ////////////////////////////////////////////////BAD\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ 267 DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~ 268 269 Having an MSSS (Master of Science in Subatomic Sexuality), I would be 270 happy to render my services as an authority on the subject. First, I 271 think a general description of the terminology is important. 272 273 PROTON--He is the "head" of the atomhold and is most often found 274 sitting around the atom looking at perverted electron magazines. 275 276 ELECTRON--She is typically running around the atom seeing to the needs 277 of the proton (except one). Although she often complains of a head ache, 278 such is not always the case, as is evidenced by the neutrinos which 279 are constantly running in and out of the atom. 280 281 NEUTRINO--Analogous to bambino. 282 283 NEUTRON--He is not quite as picky as to the company he keeps, but he 284 preferth to hang around with the boyth. In the event that he can't find 285 any "boyth" to hang around with, he will often just go off by himself 286 and get his quarks off. 287 288 NEXT LESSON: "The Cosmic Orgy" 289 a treatice on nuclear fission. 290 291 292 Dirty Ol' Man 293 294 DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~ 295 <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> 296 BAD: join the 80 col. club; would you agree that MA 76 is a good number 297 for us 80's to use? (rational: 3 digits+1 space + 76 char =80).... 298 299 crucial that we talk, do you have my p# on file someplace? 300 301 302 DOM: 303 clear thinkers club memebership card being sent to you; endorsement 304 for a relativly (groan!) good sense of humor included.... 305 306 aaron 307 <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> 308 Aaron: My singular response to you for your DB comment on my absurdity com- 309 prises these two lines. I won't enter into comic dialog. Dave 310 0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 311 Doctor: I'll look for the black hole info. 312 Signed: My sources for MY comments about black holes range from 313 Scientific American to several books on the subject (by PHDs). I 314 DON'T claim to understand all of the math, but I DO know that 315 such things as toroidal black holes ARE possible according to 316 many of the theories (mostly the theories that allow "naked" 317 singularities). Besides, if Hawking's work on the quantum physics 318 of black holes is correct, ANYTHING can happen! I realize that 319 you won't take MY word for it, so why don't you check out Hawking's 320 "The Breakdown of Physics in the Region of Space-Time Singularities". 321 In this he says (regarding quantum decay of black holes) "they 322 emit all possible configurations with equal probability." Think 323 THAT over for awhile! The apparent cosequences of this are probably 324 quite distressing to people with rigid thought patterns. 325 ___________________________Leonard_________________________ 326 I totally disagree with all of your theories on subatomic sexuality. I 327 talked to an electron just the other day and she said she never got enough! 328 I invited her to my orbital, and we oscillated all night! 329 ---------------------- 330 <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> 331 it seems you already have,Dave Aaron 332 333 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] 334 SIGNED: I THINK THAT YOU MISS THE POINT OF THOSE THAT ARE OFFENDED BY YOU. ITS NOT THAT THEY DON'T LIKE TO BE PROVED 335 WRONG, AS YOU MADE NO ATTEMPT TO PROVE OR DISPROVE ANYTHING. ITS THAT, INSTEAD OF SPELLING OUT EXACTLY WHAT YOU FOUND 336 INCORRECT, YOU LOWERED YOURSELF TO THE PERSONAL INSULT AND INVECTIVE THAT YOU MENTIONED IN YOUR LAST MESSAGE. IF YOU 337 KNOW THE ANSWER, OR KNOW WHERE SOMEONE MADE A LOGICAL OR FACTUAL ERROR, TELL US INSTEAD OF TALKING ABOUT HOW GREAT YOU 338 ARE. THAT DOES NOTHING FOR ILLUMINATING THE DARKNESS OF THE MIND, SINCE IT SUPPLIES NO INFORMATION, AND IT DOES 339 INFURIATE PEOPLE. SO PLEASE, NEXT TIME YOU SEE SOMETHING YOU DISAGREE WITH, LET US KNOW WHY AND WHAT INFORMATION YOU 340 HAVE THAT SHOWS WHY. ARGUMENTS FOLLOWING THE LINE OF "NYAA, NYAA, YOU'RE JUST A MORON!!!" AREN'T TERRIBLY HELPFUL. 341 AARON, I HAVE BEEN RUDE. SOME TIME AGO YOU EXTENDED ME A PROPER WELCOME 345 AND I DIDN'T RESPOND. I ASK YOUR PARDON AND WISH TO SAY 346 *************************************** 347 * * 348 * THANK YOU * 349 * * 350 * SO MUCH * 351 * * 352 * OH, KIND SIR! * 353 * * 354 *************************************** 355 356 I ACCEPT! THAT IS, IF YOU DON'T MIND TALKING TO SOMEONE ONLY SEMI-LITERATE IN COMPUTER JARGON. 357 358 [][][][][][][][][][][][][]PAM.[][][][][] 359 DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~ 360 361 TO whomever that was in lines 326--328: 362 Obviously, you have mistaken a neutron for an electron.............. 363 .......you thilly boy! 364 365 Incidentally, while obtaining my MSSS, my minor was in microtheology. Per- 366 haps I can also offer some information of general interest in that area. 367 For example, were you aware that there is a growing cult of amoebae who wor- 368 ship a ball of lint? Its true! In belly buttons around the world, re- 369 spectable bacteria are being forced out by these "wee beasties" who first 370 take over, then begin to cultivate viruses and establish navel academies 371 to promote the divine word of their leader. Although the little fuzz ball 372 never speaks, his followers insist that he communicates spiritual mes- 373 sages to them telepathically (presumably in GERMan). 374 375 Dirty Ol' Man 376 377 DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~ 378 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 379 - Well, I should have known that anyone who insults people in the first place - 380 - wasn't going to take a civil reply. I can safely say that I tried my best, - 381 - though. - 382 - I don't have much to say about Lebanon - somehow it just doesn't belong - 383 - on the BackWater Inn, though it has seen so much. (Fantasy, Science, Crud, - 384 - etc...) - 385 - Think I'll just lay off 'til something interesting shows up......Pioneer - 386 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 387 I THINK SEX BETWEEN UNMARRIED SUBATOMIC PARTICLES SHOULD BE BANNED! CAN'T THEY 388 LEARN TO WAIT ONE PICOSECOND LIKE THE REST? 389 .............................................................................. 390 i have a confession to make............(un)signed, aka aaron 391 ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- 392 WELL NOW! 393 BY SHEER AND UTTER COINCIDENCE, ONE OF THE ENGINEERS FOR THE GUIDANCE 394 SYSTEM ON THAT 747 WAS AT MY HOUSE THE OTHER NIGHT. ACCORDING TO HIM, IT'S 395 A GARBAGE IN GARBAGE OUT SYSTEM. ACCORDING TO A PILOT ON CABLE TV SATURDAY, 396 AMERICAN PILOTS CHECK THE NUMBERS PUNCHED IN 5 TIMES, BUT HE DIDN'T THINK 397 "THIRD WORLD" PILOTS DID THAT AND ALSO ALLUDED TO THE DICTATORIAL CAPTAIN 398 THEORY TO EXPLAIN WHY SUCH A MISTAKE COULD OCCUR. ACCORDING TO THIS GUY, 399 PLANES OVER THE PACIFIC ARE TYPICALLY OUT OF RADIO CONTACT FOR HOURS AND 400 COMPLETELY DEPEND ON THE ONBOARD NAVIGATION SYSTEM AT NIGHT WITH REGULARITY. 401 AS I UNDERSTAND IT, MOST OF THE NUCLEAR STUFF THE USSR CAN HIT US WITH 402 IS ON THEIR EAST COAST(WONDER HOW MANY MINUTES AFTER LAUNCH WE HAVE HERE 403 IN PORTLAND. LATELY IN WEAPONS CIRCLES A VERY HOT TOPIC HAS BEEN EMF( EMP?) 404 WHICH IS THE IDEA THAT A SINGLE NUCLEAR EXPLOSION COULD DESTROY ALL 405 ELECTRONIC EQUIPMENT WITHIN A RADIUS OF THOUSANDS OF MILES, THUS ELIMINATING 406 ANY DETERRENT THREAT IF ONE OR TWO BOMBS ARE SNEAKED INTO POSITION AND SET 407 OFF. BOTH SIDES ARE PRETTY PARANOID ABOUT THIS, THE RUSSIANS MORE SO THAN 408 OURSELVES. THIS PROBABLY HAS SOMETHING TO DO WITH THEIR ACTIONS IN THIS 409 MATTER. 410 TO PAM - WISH WE COULD GET BACK TO AFFECT AND EFFECT INSTEAD OF USING 411 VARIATIONS ON "IMPACTED ON, IMPACT OF,ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT", ETC. THOSE 412 PHRASES REALLY MAKE ME GRIND MY MOLARS. 413 TO (UN)SIGNED - 1) YOUR DISCUSSION OF YOUR OWN DEBATING TACTICS IS PRETTY 414 ACCURATE IN THOSE SECTIONS THAT ARE LUCID IN YOUR LAST STATEMENT. 415 2) ARE YOU SAYING THAT ONLY SPECIALISTS ARE QUALIFIED TO 416 DISCUSS A PARTICULAR FIELD? IF SO, SINCE YOU HAVE (I THINK) ADMITTED THAT 417 YOU ARE NOT A SPECIALIST THEN WHY DON'T YOU TELL US YOUR SPECIALTY SO 418 WE WILL KNOW WHEN TO LISTEN TO YOU. ON THE OTHER HAND, IF YOU MEANT TO 419 SAY THAT YOU ARE 'PROBABLY' AN EXPERT IN SEVERAL SCIENCES, (WHEN DID YOU 420 WIN YOUR NOBEL PRIZE!?) HOW MANY PHD'S DO YOU HAVE. IF YOU DON'T RECOGNIZE 421 DEGREES AS QUALIFYING ONE FOR DISCUSSING A PARTICULAR SUBJECT (AS WELL YOU 422 MIGHT NOT), WHY DON'T YOU DISCUSS WITH US YOUR STANDARDS FOR DETERMINING 423 JUST WHEN SOMEONE IS A REAL EXPERT IN A FIELD AND TELL US HOW THESE 424 STANDARDS QUALIFY YOU AND NOT THE REST OF US (EXCEPT AARON-HO HO). ON 425 THE OTHER HAND, IF YOU ONLY MEANT THAT YOU ARE SMARTER THAN THE REST OF 426 US AND QUALIFIED TO SIT IN JUDGEMENT ON US, WHY DON'T YOU LIST SOME OF 427 YOUR MORE MONUMENTAL ACCOMPLISHMENTS FOR US SO WE CAN BE PROPERLY IN AWE 428 OF YOU. YOUR LAST CONTRIBUTION WAS QUITE AMBIGUOUS ON THIS POINT. I CAN 429 WELL UNDERSTAND AFTER THE PERFORMANCE YOU JUST TURNED IN THAT YOU WOULD 430 LIKE TO DISCUSS THINGS THAT YOU'RE SURE NOBODY CAN CALL YOU ON. 431 3) THE ATTEMPT TO TURN THE TABLES AND SUDDENLY BECOME 432 THE VOICE OF REASON HERE WAS A GOOD THOUGHT - WHY DON'T YOU TRY IT AGAIN 433 WHEN YOU LEARN WHAT THE VOICE OF REASON SOUNDS LIKE. I'M AFRAID YOU HAVE 434 FAILED MISERABLY THIS TIME - YOU SHOULD NEVER HAVE BROUGHT UP "INTERNAL 435 CONTRADICTIONS" IN A NOTE SO FULL OF THEM. 436 4) I AM AMAZED THAT YOU CONTINUE TO REMARK ABOUT 437 PEOPLES QUALIFICATIONS WITHOUT SUBSTANTIATION. HAVE YOU CHECKED THEIR QUALI- 438 FICATIONS? HAVE THEY CHECKED YOURS? WOULD THEY CARE EITHER WAY. LETS GET IT 439 ALL OUT IN THE OPEN. FIRST WE COULD DISCUSS WHETHER A PERSON SHOULD ONLY DISC 440 US THAT FIELD HE IS EXPERT IN. MAYBE WE COULD RESOLVE TO CUT OUT THE 441 TONGUES OF EVERYONE WITHOUT PHD'S. SECOND, MAKE THOSE PEOPLE WITH PHD'S 442 ONLY TALK TO OTHER PHD'S IN THE SAME FIELD, OTHERWISE SOMEONE WOULD BE 443 OUT OF THEIR FIELD. THEN LET'S CUT OUT THE TONGUES OF THE STUDENTS WHO 444 HAVEN'T YET GOTTEN THEIR PHD'S, LEST THEY QUESTION THEIR PROFESSORS TOO 445 SORELY. 446 5) YOU SEEM TO BE ALLEDGING THAT MANY OF THE TECHNICAL 447 STATEMENTS I HAVE MADE ARE NOT FACTUAL OR WORTHWHILE - LETS GET 448 SPECIFIC. I THINK I CAN BEAR IT IF I TURN OUT TO BE WRONG ON SOMETHING. 449 SO LETS HEAR WHICH POINTS YOU WANT TO DISPUTE. 450 6) YOU ALMOST OPENED UP WITH 'THERE YOU GO AGAIN'! 451 DID YOU FILCH MY BRIEFING BOOK? AND HOW COME IF YOU DID YOU'RE STILL 452 LOSING THE DEBATE? HAR HAR HAR HAR. 453 yr hmbl.& obedt. svt, 454 )))))))))))))))))))))))))))BBATPOOP, THE MAGNIFICENT+++++++++++++++++++++++++ 455 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ 456 Why is it that I don't think that unsigned was Aaron, despite the remark 457 in line 390? I know that Aaron has had some problems in the past with 458 people (if that word can be used for such sub-humans) using his name, 459 and the style didn't really seem to be his. OK, Aaron, was that you, or 460 is the Neanderthal back again? 461 462 /Elberich\ 463 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ 464 <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> 465 yes, Elberich, pre-human seems to have struck again......maybe 466 wer'e in full moon or something.....thanks for the observation...... 467 468 OFFICIAL AND FOR THE RECORD(S): 469 470 I am not un(signed), nor do I plan to become so in the near future. 471 472 I am sure that un(signed) does not plan on becoming me, eithier. 473 474 Pam: 475 thank YOU ! 476 I keep the compu-drivel and various sub-tounges (electro-drivel, 477 digi-drivel, and telecomunicata-drivel) reserved for choice moments 478 such as bumping into Knuth in a public restroom. Note that I don't 479 even speak Knuth's sub tounge of algorithy-drivel. I think we will 480 get along fine........ 481 482 What shall we talk about? 483 484 Aaron (I) 485 <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> 486 Why do I think we're ready for a new disk? 487 [][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][] 488 the best thing to do with this dribble is to press the break 489 key and type OFF 490 491 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 12 Sep 83 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< 492 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 20:34 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< 493 She sits in an unnoticed corner, eyes all alight, chin cupped in 494 her hands, with a glass of liqueur forgotten beside her...instead of 495 sweet liquid, a merry chortle tickles her throat at the wild banter 496 betwix egos of the intellectual types, and she listens with affection: 497 laughing at the strut and ceremonious dress of the one who dares not 498 name himself...marveling at the insights displayed by a man whose name 499 alone reveals the ludicrousness of putting on airs--for what 'stately 500 grandeur' can be discovered in excreta?--and admiring the truce he's 501 managed to instituted between himself and his own ego, a balance Few 502 are able to strike when possessed of such intelligence...gaining ever 503 more respect for this female who needs no more embellishment than the 504 name of Pam...and curiously enough, the girl in the corner remains 505 content to merely listen, enjoy and learn. 506 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> d <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< 507 AND NOW, AS SOMEONE SAID, FOR SOMETHING COMPLETELY DIFFERENT. 508 HOW MANY OTHERS HERE PAY FOR USE OF THE SOURCE, COMPUSERVE,ETC. 509 DOES IT SEEM LIKE TOO MUCH MONEY. DO YOU RESENT THE FACT THAT TAXPAYERS 510 PAY FOR TENS OF THOUSANDS OF STUDIES AND THOUSANDS OF DATABASES 511 PRODUCED BY GOVERNMENT AND THEN HAVE TO PAY 100 BUCKS AN HOUR TO 512 ACCESS THEM ON DIALOG. THIS EFFECTIVELY SHUTS ALL BUT THE POWERFUL 513 FROM THIS VALUABLE DATA. WE HAVE CBBS'S,RCPM'S, ETC BUT ARE THERE 514 ANY VOLUNTEER INFORMATION SERVICES ON A LARGER SCALE. WHAT KIND OF 515 CORPORATE BACKING MIGHT ONE GET FOR SUCH A PROJECT. WHAT KIND OF 516 EQUIPMENT WOULD DO THE JOB. COULD WE BORROW IT AT NIGHT, MAYBE. 517 THE COMMERCIAL OUTFITS ARE NOT PROVIDING THE KIND OF EDUCATIONAL 518 AND DATA FACILITIES THEY I WOULD LIKE. WHAT DO YOU ALL THINK 519 ))))))))))))))))))))))))))))BATPOOP, THE MAGNIFICENT++++++++++++++++++ 520 521 DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~ 522 523 BATPOOP: Good greif, where do you get your facts?? (from your high school 524 electronics teacher?) The fact is that the source is generally $5.75 525 per hour at night, $7.75/hr evenings, and $20.75 during prime time. I am 526 a Source user (at night) and find it well worth $5.75. These prices may 527 have increased slightly recently, but certainly not to $100 . I understand 528 Compuserve is even cheaper at night but more expensive during the day. 529 STC is great for practical and informational purposes (no I don't work 530 for them) but nothing can compare to BWMS for entertainment. 531 532 Dirty Ol' Man 533 534 DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~ 535 DOM: suggest you be more carfull in reading. Batpoop was speaking of the 536 $100/hr on dialog not compuserve et al. 537 It seems to have been a VERY busy day here. To those who responded to my 538 comment about division by zero, please note that I was not indicating 539 if using a answer of zero was right or wrong by the current definition 540 that the mathmaticians have given it, rather I was speaking of a much 541 more important issue. What is the most practical and useful answer for 542 day to day use. Most notibly math within computer programs. Should we 543 require a bomb out error, or is it more practical to just return a value 544 of zero? This as I say is not to be based on what the current definition 545 has been given the condition, but what is most useful in real live use. 546 To: unsigned: While those who are 'qualified' in a particular area do 547 indeed tend to know far more about what they have defined that area to 548 be, I would like to point out that a rather significant number of major 549 advances are made by people who are not considered 'qualified' by the 550 'insiders' of a particular area. This is because they have not become 551 totally caught up in their work that they refuse to explore outlaying 552 areas because it is obviously worthless to consider. If you would like 553 an example, consider Tesla (the father of AC electricity) he was told 554 a multitude of times that his ideas were all wet that DC was the only 555 proper way to send electricity. One of these people was Thomas Edison. 556 But he was able to sufficiently prove his idea to Westinghouse that 557 He decided to take a chance. Need I say what the results were? I see no 558 point in discarding someones idea just because it is not the accepted 559 answer, who's to say the accepted answer is correct? 560 ******** CISTOP MIKEY ******** 13 SEPT 83 ******* 2:30 AM ********** 561 Gad! what am I doing up at this late hour! 562 **********************************************************************: 563 P.S. I see that a guest has wandered in without my notice. Since I now 564 o so notice; Welcome once more to this fair Inn. I hope the banter has 565 not put you off too much.. 566 ********************************************************************* 567 Mike: somewhere I saw a better answer to division by zero. I think it was 568 on a honeywell, but i could be wrong. It returned the largest possible 569 number, which was also available under the name of 'infinity'. Another 570 possiblity is to test for /0 and jump to an error routine, but you have 571 to provide this routine. Returning 0 is not good, usually, because other 572 valid inputs do this, and /0 is seldom a valid procedure. If 0 is returned, 573 a prior test is still needed, to protect you from getting a 'valid' result 574 with garbage input. As I remember, the IBM PC gave a for a/0, and they 575 admitted it is a bug.(early version of IBM basic) 576 For further thought on strange but useful results read the current Dr. Dobbs 577 issue on Forth, an article on integer division noted the unusual results 578 from dividing a negative number by a positive (or vice versa), and how 579 this is unsymmetrical with the more common +/+ case. The 1983 'standard' 580 forth recommends the so called bottom function, in which the result is 581 always the next smaller or next most negative integer, and the remainder 582 is always a positive fnumber. -5/3 = -2, remainder 1 (rather than =-1, 583 remainder= -2) This question arises because integer division is not really 584 an intuitive process, and differs from normal arithmatic which is continuous 585 ////////////////////////////////BAD\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ 586 set 587 your 588 own 589 margins 590 !!!!!!! 591 DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~ 592 593 Batpoop: Pardon if I have misread your message, I will try again later 594 (when I'm awake). 595 596 BAD: Very good explanation of div by zero problem on PC's. I failed to 597 mention that returning maxint or minint is also appropriate (and 598 practical). I'm still curious, though; which PC's on the market 599 support error control (besides TI). Doesn't IBM? I still prefer this 600 approach where possible because if 601 0/0 gives an intermediate result, 602 (of maxint) then further calculations may, in some cases, bring the final 603 result into a range that it cannot be distinguished from data which is not 604 the result of an overflow. 605 ACCIDENT: "0/0" above should have been "anything/0" 606 Error control also has other applications. Suppose, for example, 607 that for one reason or another memory oerflows during the execution of a 608 program; I believe the typical response of a PC is to issue a nasty little 609 error message, and in most cases halt program execution. With ec active, 610 though, it is possible to transfer to your own subroutine which "performs" 611 garbage collection or stores some of the data on disk or whatever to make 612 more memory space available, then returns to the main program to con- 613 tinue execution. 614 615 Dirty Ol' Man 616 617 DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~DOM~ 618 TO: Et al RE:x/0 619 Actually I would be most happy if people who write the high level 620 langauges would give a little more thought to error conditions when 621 they write stuff so that I don't have to.(I could have sworn that that 622 was the purpose of a high level langauge to remove the burden of that 623 sort of hassle off the programmer!) But in exchange for not properly 624 handling the errors, I would be quite happy to just have the value 625 returned as something useful instead of falling into shuddering fits 626 when it happens. I suggested the return zero value as I found that 627 this seemed to be what I wanted as an answer 99.9% of the time. I am 628 fully aware of the mathmatically incorect implications of this, but I 629 don't consider the current method to be any more valid. *** CISTOP MIKEY ***