💾 Archived View for gemini.ctrl-c.club › ~phoebos › logs › kisslinux-2022-07-28.txt captured on 2023-01-29 at 03:46:30.
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[2022-07-28T00:00:04Z] <riteo> some people wanted to port it to meson but that PR is in limbo for now [2022-07-28T00:00:34Z] <riteo> in general I'd call it some very healthy software though, expecially thanks to the community [2022-07-28T00:01:13Z] <riteo> works on anything, lightweight, hackable, accessible, _very_ great community and all that [2022-07-28T00:01:47Z] <riteo> i'd add it to community probably if it isn't out of scope after my port is pushed [2022-07-28T00:01:58Z] <riteo> it'd be the new alpha though [2022-07-28T00:03:43Z] <illiliti> great community, but with CoC nonsense. sounds sus [2022-07-28T00:04:02Z] <riteo> nah, they aren't that severe tbh [2022-07-28T00:04:31Z] <riteo> the guys "at charge" are pretty based and know when and how to joke [2022-07-28T00:04:51Z] <riteo> no bad words filter nonsense, along with the main branch thing [2022-07-28T00:05:30Z] <illiliti> i see [2022-07-28T00:05:31Z] <riteo> (although I agree that it's shorter thus better, but enforcing it because of some sort of social issue sounds dumb) [2022-07-28T00:06:39Z] <riteo> also the "mods" aren't assholes, even the main developer's contributions goes through all community stuff and really everyone and I mean everyone is on a very leveled field [2022-07-28T00:07:29Z] <riteo> only once I saw a guy getting kicked IIRC, but they got some problems from what I heard which got exarcebated from the war since they're ucranian [2022-07-28T00:07:55Z] <riteo> and they got kicked because they argued for everything constantly, i.e. being extremely annoying [2022-07-28T00:08:22Z] <riteo> and still once they calm down they should be able to come back [2022-07-28T00:09:51Z] <riteo> so the CoC isn't an issue like you think, they're pretty much just the rules put into a file saying "don't mess with people ok thx" [2022-07-28T00:11:26Z] <illiliti> i just don't like when CoC contains too much bullshit nonsense. i always feel ... dumb when i read it, like it was written for dumb people(or trolls?) who don't understand how to interact with other people [2022-07-28T00:11:38Z] <illiliti> also this annoying regulation aspect... [2022-07-28T00:12:08Z] <riteo> ig it's just formality, luckily it isn't needed much if not at all, at least in the developer chat [2022-07-28T00:12:40Z] <riteo> I think it's just like those stupid impossible warning in stuff, like "don't give wine to your wii" [2022-07-28T00:12:58Z] <riteo> so just don't come people saying "but that wasn't in the rules!" [2022-07-28T00:13:54Z] <illiliti> you're not a punitive system to enforce those dumb rules... [2022-07-28T00:14:01Z] <illiliti> so it's pointless to have one [2022-07-28T00:15:42Z] <riteo> dunno, I think that it's kinda useless in the context of godot, but I don't know the darker parts of the community, expecially after the big unity exodus [2022-07-28T00:16:30Z] <riteo> I don't really mind it and they're really permissive, so who cares. They'll say something similar if you'll ask them probably [2022-07-28T00:16:50Z] <riteo> although I know that you really don't like them (and in some cases to good reason) [2022-07-28T00:17:42Z] <riteo> but seriously, these guys won't try to cancel you. Yeah, if you really bother some trans person because you clearly want to go against them they'll note, but they should note it whenever you bother someone IIRC [2022-07-28T00:17:58Z] <riteo> for any reason, I mean [2022-07-28T00:19:08Z] <illiliti> i would never attack anyone personally [2022-07-28T00:19:19Z] <riteo> then you'd be fine [2022-07-28T00:19:25Z] <riteo> that's literally what the CoC should say IIRC [2022-07-28T00:19:53Z] <illiliti> yeah [2022-07-28T00:19:59Z] <riteo> believe me, all rules eventually sound like being written for idiots [2022-07-28T00:20:10Z] <riteo> because those are the people you want to filter [2022-07-28T00:21:11Z] <riteo> a group where I stay has very silly rules (although is a bit more severe) and I notice that with time it's getting more uselessly specific expecially because of idiots [2022-07-28T00:21:16Z] <riteo> at least AFAICT [2022-07-28T00:21:50Z] <riteo> so yeah, godot's based [2022-07-28T00:22:05Z] <riteo> I should resurrect the game repo actually, has someone yet? [2022-07-28T00:22:21Z] <illiliti> nope [2022-07-28T00:22:55Z] <riteo> I think I will with the merging of the initial port [2022-07-28T00:23:14Z] <illiliti> fuck, you reminded me that i need to build stalker [2022-07-28T00:23:45Z] <riteo> what do you mean by build? [2022-07-28T00:23:54Z] <riteo> i recall a stalker but it's like proprietary [2022-07-28T00:24:01Z] <illiliti> https://github.com/OpenXRay/xray-16/issues/622 [2022-07-28T00:24:33Z] <riteo> oh, its engine's open [2022-07-28T00:24:41Z] <riteo> I don't think the assets are though, are they? [2022-07-28T00:24:49Z] <riteo> also it paid, ain't it? [2022-07-28T00:25:02Z] <riteo> s/it paid/it's paid/ [2022-07-28T00:25:09Z] <illiliti> you need to buy assets yeah [2022-07-28T00:25:16Z] <riteo> cool though [2022-07-28T00:25:23Z] <illiliti> or pirate, the only way for me btw [2022-07-28T00:25:44Z] <riteo> oof [2022-07-28T00:25:51Z] <riteo> i'm sorry [2022-07-28T00:28:08Z] <illiliti> i had a cd disk of shadow of chernobyl, but i accidentally broke it [2022-07-28T00:28:21Z] <riteo> oof [2022-07-28T00:28:39Z] <riteo> dda's a great game too, although not an fps [2022-07-28T00:31:14Z] <illiliti> does it support linux? [2022-07-28T00:35:14Z] <riteo> yeah [2022-07-28T00:35:39Z] <illiliti> and musl? [2022-07-28T00:36:42Z] <riteo> yup [2022-07-28T00:36:52Z] <riteo> no problem IIRC [2022-07-28T00:37:00Z] <riteo> it was packaged in the game repo [2022-07-28T00:37:06Z] <illiliti> excellent [2022-07-28T00:37:12Z] <riteo> although there might have been some unicode funkiness, not sure [2022-07-28T00:37:21Z] <riteo> it was surely playable though [2022-07-28T00:38:12Z] <riteo> no ok there are no musl issues on github [2022-07-28T00:38:14Z] <riteo> all closed [2022-07-28T00:38:18Z] <riteo> so it should work fine [2022-07-28T00:40:36Z] <riteo> haven't tested it in a while [2022-07-28T00:45:55Z] <illiliti> compare this CoC [2022-07-28T00:45:59Z] <illiliti> https://github.com/CleverRaven/Cataclysm-DDA/blob/master/CODE_OF_CONDUCT.md [2022-07-28T00:46:03Z] <illiliti> to this one [2022-07-28T00:46:05Z] <illiliti> https://web.archive.org/web/20220613054315/https://www.kill-9.xyz/COC [2022-07-28T00:46:43Z] <riteo> lmaoooo [2022-07-28T00:47:07Z] <riteo> the first's very very formal [2022-07-28T00:47:19Z] <riteo> the second doesn't care [2022-07-28T00:47:29Z] <riteo> both say the same thing [2022-07-28T00:48:38Z] <riteo> like the second coc said, these texts are meant to people who don't know how to be humans [2022-07-28T00:49:09Z] <riteo> they're like formal filters to assholes, just so someone can said, it's written there, you knew what you were going into [2022-07-28T00:49:19Z] <riteo> s/can said/can say/ [2022-07-28T00:49:38Z] <illiliti> > body size [2022-07-28T00:49:48Z] <illiliti> what else [2022-07-28T00:49:55Z] <riteo> ergo, not bully someone because of being fat [2022-07-28T00:49:56Z] <riteo> ergo [2022-07-28T00:50:00Z] <riteo> don't bother people [2022-07-28T00:50:34Z] <illiliti> just say don't attack anyone in any way and that's all [2022-07-28T00:50:42Z] <riteo> again, formality [2022-07-28T00:50:42Z] <illiliti> you don't need to enumerate this bullshit [2022-07-28T00:50:47Z] <riteo> i agree thougj [2022-07-28T00:50:58Z] <riteo> s/thougj/though/ [2022-07-28T00:51:12Z] <riteo> but if we have to there's probably a reason [2022-07-28T00:51:44Z] <illiliti> formality doesn't work here. you're not a law. you're not a punitive system. judge doesn't work here. [2022-07-28T00:52:47Z] <riteo> ehhhhh, I recall dumbasses wanting to find loopholes, although it's not a real state law it still makes the banned person know that the mods haven't gone crazy [2022-07-28T00:52:55Z] <riteo> tbh I'm neutral about this [2022-07-28T00:54:01Z] <riteo> I agree with your enumeration argument (there might be more loopholes paradoxically) but as long as the community isn't controlled by a bunch of SJWs I don't care [2022-07-28T00:54:22Z] <riteo> then you just fork. What are they gonna do, cancel you on twitter? [2022-07-28T00:56:00Z] <riteo> but in the end, who cares lol. Luckily I didn't yet stumble personally on dumb CoCs, which in the end are just the usual rules put into a funny sounding acryonim [2022-07-28T00:56:01Z] <illiliti> they can enforce trademark law against you xd [2022-07-28T00:56:08Z] <riteo> what, how [2022-07-28T00:56:13Z] <riteo> the license's a license [2022-07-28T00:56:53Z] <riteo> if you really want to be edgy, funny nad trolly you can make a sneed themed fork, forget it and make a serious one [2022-07-28T00:56:54Z] <illiliti> trademark can overlap license. see firefox(and now rust) case [2022-07-28T00:57:02Z] <riteo> who cares lol [2022-07-28T00:57:19Z] <riteo> wait [2022-07-28T00:57:20Z] <riteo> rust? [2022-07-28T00:57:28Z] <riteo> seriously? [2022-07-28T00:57:48Z] <riteo> how can you get angry over the trademark of a programming language? [2022-07-28T00:57:59Z] <riteo> the literal name and logo of a text only program [2022-07-28T00:58:53Z] <illiliti> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1013920 [2022-07-28T01:02:28Z] <riteo> lmaooooooo [2022-07-28T01:02:38Z] <riteo> 4chan must've gone crazy, hasn't it? [2022-07-28T01:03:17Z] <illiliti> xd [2022-07-28T01:04:22Z] <riteo> i swear, that place got an ungodly obsession with rust and firefox [2022-07-28T01:05:06Z] <riteo> I gave it up, two out of three days most posts are about it, and if they're not they'll find a way to talk about it [2022-07-28T01:06:19Z] <riteo> it's reddit, but with anonymous users [2022-07-28T01:06:33Z] <riteo> and way more trolls [2022-07-28T01:19:16Z] <illiliti> do you hate stale bots? [2022-07-28T01:19:23Z] <riteo> absolutely [2022-07-28T01:19:31Z] <riteo> useless annoying things [2022-07-28T01:20:00Z] <illiliti> i think it's time to add another clause to respectful-software regarding bots [2022-07-28T01:20:22Z] <riteo> what would it be? [2022-07-28T01:25:29Z] <illiliti> no automation should be used to close and lock people's bug reports(and MRs/PRs) unless issue author satisfied with provided resolution [2022-07-28T01:26:40Z] <riteo> that's kinda specific, but I get it [2022-07-28T01:27:40Z] <illiliti> i'll rephrase it to be less specific [2022-07-28T01:28:07Z] <illiliti> brain doesn't work well today [2022-07-28T01:28:31Z] <riteo> no worries [2022-07-28T01:34:55Z] <illiliti> https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/kind-communication.html is kinda nice [2022-07-28T01:35:03Z] <illiliti> it suggests what to do in various situations, that's really cool [2022-07-28T01:35:26Z] <illiliti> purpose section is shit though [2022-07-28T01:38:54Z] <riteo> holy fuck [2022-07-28T01:38:55Z] <riteo> based stallman [2022-07-28T01:39:19Z] <riteo> I had no idea he was so based [2022-07-28T01:40:07Z] <riteo> yeah the enumeration thing is done _everywhere_ and I agree that it's kinda stupid, just put `regardless of any characteristic` [2022-07-28T01:40:18Z] <riteo> boom, +%infinite inclusivity [2022-07-28T01:40:30Z] <riteo> "but does it include..." "yes" [2022-07-28T01:41:10Z] <riteo> wait [2022-07-28T01:41:16Z] <riteo> I think stallman made a based move [2022-07-28T01:41:21Z] <riteo> "and any other demographic characteristics" [2022-07-28T01:41:33Z] <riteo> crazy, I didn't directly quote that [2022-07-28T01:42:08Z] <illiliti> he forgot about body and dick size [2022-07-28T01:42:18Z] <illiliti> that's important [2022-07-28T01:42:34Z] <riteo> nah, stallman's based [2022-07-28T01:42:39Z] <riteo> it's all in the charateristics part [2022-07-28T01:43:38Z] <illiliti> i agree, it is less bullshit than rust or dda CoC [2022-07-28T01:48:27Z] <illiliti> hmm, i might mention it in respectful-software as alternative to CoC [2022-07-28T01:48:50Z] <illiliti> it is OK, not ideal of course [2022-07-28T01:49:59Z] <riteo> ehh, all CoC are not ideal, but I might argue as a useful tool against stupid trolls [2022-07-28T01:50:16Z] <illiliti> https://web.archive.org/web/20220613054315/https://www.kill-9.xyz/COC [2022-07-28T01:50:21Z] <illiliti> this one is ideal [2022-07-28T01:50:21Z] <riteo> I know [2022-07-28T01:50:55Z] <riteo> I agree with the document a lot, if you're having the need to read a document to know how to be human something's not quite right [2022-07-28T01:51:17Z] <riteo> but exactly that's the thing, you don't have to read the CoC if you're human [2022-07-28T01:51:28Z] <riteo> it's not like discord servers and IRC channels don't have rules per se [2022-07-28T01:56:20Z] <illiliti> i read every CoC to cringe [2022-07-28T01:56:27Z] <illiliti> > body size [2022-07-28T01:57:37Z] <riteo> I mean, that's not a bad thing to notice, it's still bullying [2022-07-28T01:57:49Z] <riteo> Do you critique it because it's overly specific? [2022-07-28T01:58:08Z] <illiliti> it sounds funny [2022-07-28T01:58:12Z] <illiliti> and dumb [2022-07-28T01:58:47Z] <riteo> tbh I'm not against noting when people bully fat/anorexic people [2022-07-28T01:59:11Z] <riteo> I do agree that it sounds extremely specific if that's what you mean [2022-07-28T01:59:52Z] <riteo> A list is dumb, period. What about blonde people? Lots of people say that blonde people are stupid, are they safe from the CoC? [2022-07-28T02:03:28Z] <ioraff> the CoC comes for all [2022-07-28T02:03:34Z] <illiliti> i read it as "are they safe from the cock" [2022-07-28T02:04:05Z] <riteo> yeah the acronym is super funny per se [2022-07-28T02:04:11Z] <riteo> so yeah, read our CoC [2022-07-28T02:04:27Z] <riteo> I should've quoted that [2022-07-28T02:04:55Z] <riteo> remember kids, the coc spares no one [2022-07-28T02:05:20Z] <riteo> Some software got really big cocs, others really small [2022-07-28T02:05:20Z] <ioraff> since seeing https://github.com/dylanaraps/promptless/pull/2, I can't not read it as "cock" [2022-07-28T02:05:23Z] <riteo> ok I'll stop [2022-07-28T02:05:41Z] <riteo> HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA [2022-07-28T02:05:47Z] <riteo> yeah the joke comes by itself [2022-07-28T02:08:47Z] <illiliti> https://github.com/dylanaraps/promptless/commit/f895387d49af754ac3424cafce718530380444a8 [2022-07-28T02:09:46Z] <illiliti> "be good" - fucking ideal [2022-07-28T02:10:03Z] <riteo> lmao [2022-07-28T02:12:00Z] <riteo> bruh how do I install the clang sanitized [2022-07-28T02:12:12Z] <riteo> it's not even there, and I can't find online if there's some cmake flag I should add [2022-07-28T02:13:12Z] <illiliti> -fsanitize stuff? [2022-07-28T02:13:22Z] <riteo> yeah [2022-07-28T02:18:37Z] <riteo> it can't find `libclang_rt.asan_static-x86_64.a:` [2022-07-28T02:18:42Z] <riteo> without the colon [2022-07-28T02:18:57Z] <riteo> yup I think I gotta enable all runtimes [2022-07-28T02:19:05Z] <riteo> I don't think this was voluntary, was it? [2022-07-28T02:20:56Z] <riteo> I think I gotta rebuild both LLVM and clang, as those runtime libraries are LLVM's while clang has them renamed to `libclang*` stuff [2022-07-28T02:21:44Z] <riteo> no ok they might be a separate project [2022-07-28T02:21:55Z] <riteo> if clang doesn't fail [2022-07-28T02:22:33Z] <riteo> not failing so far [2022-07-28T02:22:59Z] <riteo> were this to succeed, should I suggest this to whoever maintains the `clang` package or would this be considered unneeded? [2022-07-28T02:24:29Z] <ioraff> you need compiler-rt [2022-07-28T02:24:56Z] <riteo> oh, only that? [2022-07-28T02:25:00Z] <riteo> for safety I added them all [2022-07-28T02:25:06Z] <riteo> although that's surely overkill [2022-07-28T02:25:41Z] <riteo> yeah I think you're right [2022-07-28T02:25:49Z] <riteo> all of them are called libclang_rt [2022-07-28T02:26:11Z] <ioraff> sanitizers might require execinfo though [2022-07-28T02:26:18Z] <riteo> at build time? [2022-07-28T02:26:25Z] <ioraff> yes [2022-07-28T02:26:43Z] <riteo> so I should add a dependency to the clang package too? [2022-07-28T02:26:48Z] <riteo> my fork I mean [2022-07-28T02:27:48Z] <ioraff> it's a glibc header [2022-07-28T02:29:08Z] <riteo> no worries [2022-07-28T02:29:12Z] <riteo> there's libexecinfo [2022-07-28T02:29:39Z] <ioraff> right [2022-07-28T02:30:10Z] <riteo> I got it installed btw. After it's done compiling I'll see [2022-07-28T02:30:21Z] <riteo> btw how the hell does it miss my ccache cache everytime? [2022-07-28T02:30:28Z] <ioraff> compiler-rt? [2022-07-28T02:30:31Z] <riteo> do I have to seriously set the ccache cmake variable? [2022-07-28T02:31:09Z] <riteo> accidentally ctrl+c [2022-07-28T02:31:11Z] <riteo> I mean clang [2022-07-28T02:31:25Z] <riteo> should I make it a separate package? [2022-07-28T02:31:29Z] <riteo> can even I [2022-07-28T02:31:48Z] <riteo> oh nice I can [2022-07-28T02:31:56Z] <ioraff> absolute paths are why ccache doesn't work [2022-07-28T02:31:58Z] <riteo> I'll make a separate package then if y'all don't mind [2022-07-28T02:32:09Z] <riteo> oof, that's bad [2022-07-28T02:40:56Z] <dilyn> -> llvm looking for dependencies (using readelf) [2022-07-28T02:40:57Z] <dilyn> -> llvm Generating manifest [2022-07-28T02:40:57Z] <dilyn> -> llvm Generating etcsums [2022-07-28T02:40:58Z] <dilyn> -> llvm Creating tarball [2022-07-28T02:40:58Z] <dilyn> -> llvm Successfully created tarball [2022-07-28T02:40:59Z] <dilyn> -> Install built packages? [llvm] [2022-07-28T02:40:59Z] <dilyn> -> Continue?: Press Enter to continue or Ctrl+C to abort [2022-07-28T02:41:00Z] <dilyn> ^Cdilyn ~/git/me/core/llvm -> kiss i [2022-07-28T02:41:00Z] <dilyn> Using doas (to become root) [2022-07-28T02:41:01Z] <dilyn> -> llvm Checking if manifest valid [2022-07-28T02:41:01Z] <dilyn> -> llvm Checking if package installable [2022-07-28T02:41:02Z] <dilyn> -> llvm Checking for package conflicts [2022-07-28T02:41:02Z] <dilyn> -> llvm Installing package (llvm@15.0.0-1.tar.zst) [2022-07-28T02:41:03Z] <dilyn> mkdir: '/usr/include/c++/v1/__string/': File exists [2022-07-28T02:41:03Z] <dilyn> ERROR llvm Failed to install package. [2022-07-28T02:41:04Z] <dilyn> ERROR llvm Filesystem now dirty, manual repair needed. [2022-07-28T02:41:19Z] <dilyn> kiss will fail to update a package if 1) a file already exists at some path, but 2) that file is supposed to become a directory [2022-07-28T02:41:24Z] <dilyn> going from llvm 14.0.6 -> 15.0.0 [2022-07-28T02:43:24Z] <illiliti> that's known bug afaik [2022-07-28T02:43:33Z] <dilyn> I thought so [2022-07-28T02:44:33Z] <riteo> yeah I stumbled on that too [2022-07-28T02:44:42Z] <riteo> btw, it's been quite a while dilyn! [2022-07-28T02:44:50Z] <riteo> I couldn't greet you in time before you disappearing before [2022-07-28T02:45:14Z] <riteo> how has life been going? [2022-07-28T02:45:47Z] <dilyn> it has indeed! [2022-07-28T02:45:59Z] <riteo> crazy [2022-07-28T02:46:00Z] <dilyn> life has been insane haha. Been learning a lot about launchpad :thinking: [2022-07-28T02:46:19Z] <illiliti> cursed [2022-07-28T02:46:29Z] <riteo> do you perhaps work at canonical? [2022-07-28T02:46:35Z] <riteo> I saw that you did some ubuntu stuff [2022-07-28T02:47:40Z] <riteo> uh I got reminded of something, what do y'all think about NDAs? [2022-07-28T02:47:48Z] <riteo> are they avoidable in the work world? [2022-07-28T02:47:55Z] <riteo> s/work/job/ [2022-07-28T02:48:00Z] <illiliti> nda is ok [2022-07-28T02:48:43Z] <riteo> I have a really nice opportuinity for a stage as a firmware writer, but oh boy does the idea of an NDA scare me [2022-07-28T02:49:04Z] <dilyn> NDAs are not avoidable :\ [2022-07-28T02:49:09Z] <dilyn> I do indeed work at canonical! [2022-07-28T02:49:16Z] <riteo> would NDAs affect my OSS stuff? [2022-07-28T02:49:23Z] <riteo> dilyn: cool [2022-07-28T02:49:30Z] <dilyn> in what ways? [2022-07-28T02:49:45Z] <riteo> dunno, not being able to write it, or possible weird cease and desists [2022-07-28T02:49:57Z] <riteo> y'know, bad stuff that might put me in trouble for a buncha years [2022-07-28T02:50:08Z] <illiliti> it's ok, just don't share secret sauce and you'll be fine [2022-07-28T02:50:08Z] <dilyn> NDAs can only impact you if you've signed one [2022-07-28T02:50:15Z] <dilyn> ^ [2022-07-28T02:50:17Z] <riteo> yeah, but I might sign one [2022-07-28T02:50:41Z] <dilyn> ask a lawyer :v [2022-07-28T02:50:47Z] <riteo> Next year I got a chance of doing a stage at writing firmware, the guy was super available, even offering to teach me stuff [2022-07-28T02:50:58Z] <riteo> but boy those NDAs are really, really scary [2022-07-28T02:51:05Z] <dilyn> a bit intimidating [2022-07-28T02:51:11Z] <dilyn> legalese is opaque lol [2022-07-28T02:51:13Z] <riteo> I want to keep doing stuff, expecially if the stage lasts just like a single summer month [2022-07-28T02:51:23Z] <riteo> I don't want to die inside for two years [2022-07-28T02:51:53Z] <riteo> dilyn do you keep writing OSS? [2022-07-28T02:52:15Z] <riteo> If you say that those are unavoidable perhaps you've signed one (if you can't answer don't worry) [2022-07-28T02:52:55Z] <riteo> (ignore in case) [2022-07-28T02:53:02Z] <riteo> dunno, really really scared [2022-07-28T02:53:15Z] <riteo> BTW, the separate compiler_rt approach is not working [2022-07-28T02:53:34Z] <riteo> what I mean is that it's a bit sus [2022-07-28T02:54:01Z] <riteo> it strongly recommends using a monorepo, should I download the whole llvm repo for this or should I just like embed it inside of clang? [2022-07-28T02:56:16Z] <illiliti> keep doing stuff. don't connect your foss work to real life and stay anonymous if possible. this reduces the chances of being raped at work for violating nda xd [2022-07-28T02:56:23Z] <testuser[m]12> Hi [2022-07-28T02:56:44Z] <riteo> hi testuser[m]12 [2022-07-28T02:56:53Z] <riteo> illiliti: that would mean that I'd have to change nick [2022-07-28T02:56:58Z] <riteo> my current nick is pretty connected to me [2022-07-28T02:57:08Z] <riteo> due to historical reasons [2022-07-28T02:57:37Z] <riteo> I'm kinda fucked [2022-07-28T02:58:04Z] <riteo> I think I'll wait for the perfect OSS donation powered impossible job or become homeless [2022-07-28T02:58:57Z] <dilyn> wdym riteo? re: llvm [2022-07-28T02:59:01Z] <dilyn> you can peep my build https://github.com/dilyn-corner/KISS-me/tree/main/core/llvm [2022-07-28T02:59:18Z] <illiliti> sign nda riteo [2022-07-28T02:59:29Z] <dilyn> I don't so much write FLOSS, never really have. but my personal time is my own, in general:) [2022-07-28T02:59:57Z] <riteo> I mean, I don't know whether he would let me sign and NDA for 1 month of stage work in general, I should build the courage to ask [2022-07-28T03:00:12Z] <riteo> but even then, how much FLOSS work is competitive in regards to cash registers? [2022-07-28T03:00:45Z] <riteo> dilyn: there's this compiler_rt LLVM project I gotta build somewhere in order to use ASAN [2022-07-28T03:01:01Z] <riteo> and I thought about making a separate package, but it fusses a lot about wanting the LLVM source tree [2022-07-28T03:01:21Z] <riteo> at this point I might do the dumbity-dumb thing of building it with clang [2022-07-28T03:01:30Z] <riteo> I'd love to separate it, but kiss doesn't really allow that [2022-07-28T03:02:13Z] <riteo> oh, you've enabled it directly in LLVM [2022-07-28T03:02:19Z] <riteo> along with clang and whatnot [2022-07-28T03:02:43Z] <riteo> fuck it, I'll just enable it in clang like I wanted to do, I want just to fix my Wayland PR for Godot bruh [2022-07-28T03:03:16Z] <dilyn> It might be possible to build it standalone but I've never seen it :thinking: [2022-07-28T03:03:29Z] <riteo> it still sort of depends on LLVM [2022-07-28T03:03:34Z] <dilyn> ofc [2022-07-28T03:03:42Z] <riteo> it would've just been nice to split into a separate package, but this isn't Alpine [2022-07-28T03:05:18Z] <riteo> Uh, I remember another idea I had for my package system, which is also compatible with kiss [2022-07-28T03:05:29Z] <riteo> dunno if y'all got tired [2022-07-28T03:06:18Z] <illiliti> tell us [2022-07-28T03:06:46Z] <riteo> so basically if you want to make a split package on kiss you have to download the same source multiple times [2022-07-28T03:06:55Z] <riteo> what if the source is simply named after it's checksum and it looks for that? [2022-07-28T03:07:31Z] <riteo> bam, you can make as many split builds out of monorepos as you want and you're done. While that wouldn't acknowledge single builds to be split it would still be a nice improvement [2022-07-28T03:07:48Z] <illiliti> good idea [2022-07-28T03:08:06Z] <riteo> it'd be less navigable through the cache though [2022-07-28T03:08:22Z] <riteo> but I'm not sure how much that'd impact people, and worst case, just name the folder like the checksum [2022-07-28T03:08:37Z] <riteo> but meh, dunno how much people care about package source cache [2022-07-28T03:08:55Z] <riteo> also a dumb text file might be acceptable I think? [2022-07-28T03:09:12Z] <illiliti> for what? [2022-07-28T03:09:19Z] <riteo> for describing what's for [2022-07-28T03:09:21Z] <riteo> if people cared [2022-07-28T03:10:52Z] <illiliti> i don't think it is necessary [2022-07-28T03:11:12Z] <riteo> yeah you're right [2022-07-28T03:11:23Z] <riteo> if I really needed it I could simply look into the source file and look for the checksum [2022-07-28T03:11:39Z] <riteo> a bit tedious but it's not always needed and it might be a pretty big advantage [2022-07-28T03:13:36Z] <riteo> do y'all think that it's better to pass paths to the stdin or as args? [2022-07-28T03:13:56Z] <illiliti> depends [2022-07-28T03:14:28Z] <riteo> because I'm starting to think that perhaps I might make a packager process which takes the files' path [2022-07-28T03:15:06Z] <riteo> so you build, and send the built file path. What'd be the advandage? More of a silly idea, but which I think can show the way to more useful approaches [2022-07-28T03:15:46Z] <riteo> What if, and this is silly, I know, a single build could be packaged into multiple sub-packages by sending multiple files to the packager? [2022-07-28T03:16:33Z] <riteo> what I mean: imagine this huge package which builds once, you send the list of all files, but in the following order: package1 + extra stuff, SEPARATOR or something, package 2 + extra stuff [2022-07-28T03:17:01Z] <riteo> or something like that, it'd be great in general to avoid adding a tar dependency to the builder now that I think about it [2022-07-28T03:17:26Z] <riteo> it'd be great because you can make your own package from the CLI [2022-07-28T03:17:40Z] <riteo> now that I think about it I'm kinda dumb, you don't need the separator! Just run it multiple times [2022-07-28T03:17:58Z] <riteo> yeah sorry for the idea dump, but I think that perhaps cpio might always have been based [2022-07-28T03:18:10Z] <riteo> (interface wise) [2022-07-28T03:18:44Z] <illiliti> and pax, a cpio successor [2022-07-28T03:18:52Z] <riteo> oh right it got both interfaces [2022-07-28T03:18:55Z] <riteo> tar and cpio style [2022-07-28T03:19:05Z] <illiliti> interesting idea riteo [2022-07-28T03:19:09Z] <riteo> thanks [2022-07-28T03:19:36Z] <riteo> yeah this modular thing is really opening the door for some interesting and simple applications [2022-07-28T03:20:34Z] <riteo> I swear as much as I like apk it's really a mess, I recall having issues properly packaging fucking zpaq, I had to manually create folders which I think should've been there [2022-07-28T03:21:21Z] <riteo> instead of making multiple methods even a single text stream of files would be way simpler [2022-07-28T03:22:51Z] <riteo> oh thanks y'all for listening to my ideas, talking to someone for some reason really helps [2022-07-28T03:26:47Z] <illiliti> no problemo [2022-07-28T03:27:00Z] <illiliti> https://github.com/distr1/distri/ [2022-07-28T03:27:07Z] <illiliti> it might be interesting for you [2022-07-28T03:28:18Z] <riteo> cool! [2022-07-28T03:28:20Z] <riteo> I'll take a look [2022-07-28T03:29:44Z] <riteo> this is kinda against my principles tbh [2022-07-28T03:29:56Z] <riteo> I mean, interesting ideas, but duplicating dependencies inside squashfs images? [2022-07-28T03:30:05Z] <riteo> that just sounds like static linking with extra steps [2022-07-28T03:31:44Z] <illiliti> still, some ideas are interesting [2022-07-28T03:31:49Z] <riteo> yeah, I must admit so [2022-07-28T03:32:06Z] <riteo> but it's looking for different goals than ours [2022-07-28T03:32:29Z] <riteo> and also, most of this stuff can be fixed with static linking [2022-07-28T03:33:02Z] <riteo> regarding the issue with dependency solving and shared libraries being... not shared [2022-07-28T03:33:55Z] <riteo> althought parallel installations and atomic immutable packages are very interesting ideas, despite maybe having a bunch of weird issues to sort out (which I think he sorta did with excange directories)? [2022-07-28T03:34:07Z] <riteo> still, interesting read, thanks! [2022-07-28T03:34:25Z] <riteo> also there's this which'll come handy https://michael.stapelberg.ch/posts/2019-08-17-linux-package-managers-are-slow/ [2022-07-28T03:34:43Z] <riteo> although it'll be primarily source based, but ehhh [2022-07-28T03:35:05Z] <riteo> damn if apk's fasttt [2022-07-28T03:36:41Z] <riteo> > use compression which is light on CPU, as networks are fast (like apk) [2022-07-28T03:36:47Z] <riteo> yeah he surely has a different scope than mine [2022-07-28T03:36:57Z] <riteo> In my ideal the network is used as little as possible [2022-07-28T05:27:53Z] <riteo> well, I'll go, bye! [2022-07-28T06:16:49Z] <illiliti> ok, i added 9th clause about stale bots and mentioned gnu kcg as alternative to CoC [2022-07-28T12:09:19Z] <dilyn> ubuntu core and snaps solve that duplicated dependencies problem pretty well:)