💾 Archived View for gemini.ctrl-c.club › ~phoebos › logs › kisslinux-2021-07-19.txt captured on 2023-01-29 at 03:54:34.
⬅️ Previous capture (2021-12-17)
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[2021-07-19T00:09:11Z] <dilyn> `make install` is just a long way to type cp
[2021-07-19T00:09:51Z] <sad_plan> I suppose it is. its way more convinient anyway
[2021-07-19T00:16:37Z] <sad_plan> in any case, its been fruitless as of yet.
[2021-07-19T00:16:55Z] <claudia> what is the problem?
[2021-07-19T00:17:19Z] <sad_plan> the package im trying to create is onetrueawk. and it only produces an executable called a.out.
[2021-07-19T00:18:55Z] <sad_plan> currently now its this bs permissions as always. cp cant create the dir it needs. classic
[2021-07-19T00:20:54Z] <claudia_> when using 'cp' in a buildfile, you need to create the dir first
[2021-07-19T00:21:07Z] <claudia_> mkdir -p "$1/fofoofofo"
[2021-07-19T00:21:07Z] <sad_plan> that ive done
[2021-07-19T00:21:56Z] <sad_plan> looksie here
[2021-07-19T00:21:57Z] <sad_plan> http://0x0.st/-VmW.sh
[2021-07-19T00:23:32Z] <claudia_> cp a.out "$1/usr/bin/onetrueawk"
[2021-07-19T00:24:54Z] <sad_plan> how could I forget.
[2021-07-19T00:25:16Z] <claudia_> http://ix.io/3to1
[2021-07-19T00:28:36Z] <claudia_> when double clicking on a link in foot, it just selects everything but the https://
[2021-07-19T00:28:43Z] <sad_plan> I must say, the filename is rather unfortunate. I cant open it or anything. lol
[2021-07-19T00:29:16Z] <dilyn> ln -sf a.out /usr/bin/awk that's just a broken link
[2021-07-19T00:29:21Z] <dilyn> you renamed a.out
[2021-07-19T00:29:27Z] <sad_plan> had to redownload and rename it beforehand
[2021-07-19T00:29:29Z] <sad_plan> aah
[2021-07-19T00:29:29Z] <claudia_> has one maybe found a config option, to select all? This is one thing I like very on 'st'
[2021-07-19T00:30:00Z] <dilyn> foot recently had a rework on links and interacting with them. or something
[2021-07-19T00:30:05Z] <dilyn> i don't know, i didn't read the changelog lol
[2021-07-19T00:30:20Z] <claudia_> I use the keybind to open in browser extensively.
[2021-07-19T00:30:28Z] <dilyn> ew
[2021-07-19T00:31:07Z] <claudia_> :(
[2021-07-19T00:31:32Z] <sad_plan> so I have to rename it first, then symlink? I want it to work with kiss a anyway
[2021-07-19T00:32:19Z] <sad_plan> fuckin hell, the file you sent is really annoying. its called -VmW.sh. I cant seem to either rename, remove it or anything..
[2021-07-19T00:33:20Z] <illiliti> rm -- -VmW.sh
[2021-07-19T00:33:48Z] <sad_plan> amazing
[2021-07-19T00:34:40Z] <sad_plan> what are the -- for? I mean, what do they do? havent seen them before in any help files or anything
[2021-07-19T00:35:04Z] <dilyn> they specify that the next parts of the argument are not option flags
[2021-07-19T00:36:00Z] <sad_plan> cool
[2021-07-19T00:36:08Z] <dilyn> http://ix.io/3to2
[2021-07-19T00:36:46Z] <dilyn> so if you avoid install, just mkdir -p "$1/usr/bin", cp (or mv) a.out "$1/usr/bin/nawk", ln -s nawk "$1/usr/bin/awk"
[2021-07-19T00:39:39Z] <claudia_> 'show-urls-copy=' is what I am looking for.
[2021-07-19T00:40:36Z] <sad_plan> it worked. cheers again
[2021-07-19T00:43:33Z] <sad_plan> dilyn: when building statically, Ive notied that alot of buildscripts in your repos, sometimes only use --disable-shared, while not using --enable-static. is it sufficient to just disable shared, or whats the reason for the difference? package breakage?
[2021-07-19T00:44:46Z] <dilyn> it just depends on what the authors of the package's build system sets as the default options
[2021-07-19T00:45:16Z] <dilyn> some set both --enable-{static,shared}, some set --enable-static & --disable-shared, some set --enable-shared & --disable-static
[2021-07-19T00:45:25Z] <dilyn> so you just have to check
[2021-07-19T00:45:45Z] <dilyn> more often than not the default is to build both though, so you just need --disable-shared
[2021-07-19T00:46:54Z] <sad_plan> ah, I was under the impression that most of the time its built only dynamically, but oh well. probably why Ive had alot of breakage when trying to build gcc/binutils statically earlier. usually just ended up with ld not working..
[2021-07-19T00:47:27Z] <dilyn> of course that's only for building the library itself; if you want the binary to be built statically you'll have to pass -static or --static, sometimes there's an option in the build system to build the binary statically (less common)
[2021-07-19T00:47:49Z] <dilyn> yeah building a static gcc and binutils is... not obvious
[2021-07-19T00:47:50Z] <dilyn> :)
[2021-07-19T00:49:05Z] <sad_plan> is those listed in the configure scripts help list, or do I need to open it, and find it manually?
[2021-07-19T00:49:28Z] <sad_plan> I figured as much. spent way too much time trying to build anything after building them, and not being able to.
[2021-07-19T00:50:18Z] <dilyn> USUALLY you can find all the build options available by passing ./configure --help (or meson configure, or... cmake has one, i forget what it is tho; -G or something?)
[2021-07-19T00:50:23Z] <sad_plan> was peeking at wyverkiss' llvm script, and got abit sad, as it was already set to static. felt like cheating tbh :p and here I am trying to build binutils/gcc statically when theres a massive shortcut right there
[2021-07-19T00:50:30Z] <dilyn> other times you'd have to look through it yourself to see what it checks for...
[2021-07-19T00:50:39Z] <sad_plan> nice
[2021-07-19T00:50:48Z] <dilyn> ah, llvm is harder to build statically than you might think
[2021-07-19T00:51:36Z] <sad_plan> but someone else had already configured it so, so I wouldnt have to. altough Im unfamiliar with other building systems, so Id probably got stuck before Ive even began anyway :p
[2021-07-19T00:51:43Z] <dilyn> it got 'easier' with llvm 12 because now libc++abi can just be static and built into libc++, which is great. but building any libLLVM* statically can be hard (specifically LTO, Remarks, a few others)
[2021-07-19T00:52:02Z] <dilyn> it's mostly just trial and error to force a static object out of a build system lmao
[2021-07-19T00:52:15Z] <dilyn> CFLAGS=-static didn't work? Try --static! libtool fucking womps
[2021-07-19T00:53:47Z] <sad_plan> thats nice though. always great when updates actually makes things easier for oneself, and not the other way around.
[2021-07-19T00:54:18Z] <sad_plan> is lto/pgo even harder with static linking? I seem to recall statically linking was mentioned when I was reading about it the other day..
[2021-07-19T00:55:05Z] <sad_plan> I dont recall, but I did a quick build of some packages in a wyverkiss chroot, with -static as CFLAGS, and I was just sitting there, wondering; where are all the errors? why is nothing failing? lol
[2021-07-19T00:55:09Z] <dilyn> they shouldn't really be any harder, I don't know specifics on how it would impact performance
[2021-07-19T00:55:25Z] <dilyn> if I understand LTO/PGO correctly, things should *only* get EVEN faster
[2021-07-19T00:55:48Z] <sad_plan> even better
[2021-07-19T00:56:17Z] <dilyn> ah, that's because nothing cares about libLLVM :P just libc++ and libc. it's pretty neat
[2021-07-19T00:57:42Z] <dilyn> it's all very wonky. I don't trust people who make Makefiles any more.
[2021-07-19T00:57:43Z] <sad_plan> well looks like im going in for a nice ride when I eventually go over to llvm/clang instead of binutils/gcc. instead of a bumpy ride I mean.
[2021-07-19T00:57:53Z] <dilyn> sometimes it's just easier to make all the objects files and ar them yourself lmfao
[2021-07-19T00:58:03Z] <dilyn> llvm is the way :V
[2021-07-19T00:58:05Z] <sad_plan> I get that. makefiles are messy sometimes
[2021-07-19T01:01:07Z] <sad_plan> yeah :D
[2021-07-19T01:01:26Z] <konimex> > it's all very wonky. I don't trust people who make Makefiles any more.
[2021-07-19T01:01:28Z] <konimex> hear hear
[2021-07-19T01:01:30Z] <sad_plan> do you even use clang for that much stuff? I noticed clang isnt even packaged in the wyverkiss' repo.
[2021-07-19T01:01:48Z] <konimex> clang is a part of llvm
[2021-07-19T01:02:31Z] <sad_plan> aah
[2021-07-19T01:12:33Z] <sad_plan> ok so im peeking binutils help page, and is it safe to assume when a feature is listed, the oposite is default? i.e. --enalbe-lto is listed, but its disabled by default, yes?
[2021-07-19T01:13:44Z] <sad_plan> unless its specified on the text i mean
[2021-07-19T01:17:33Z] <dilyn> i usually assume that when they list --enable-foo, foo is disabled by default. though some will list whether or not it's on or off by default
[2021-07-19T01:17:52Z] <dilyn> a lot of things default to auto and do a check of some kind as well
[2021-07-19T01:18:30Z] <sad_plan> yeah, I noticed static libs were auto, or something, for gcc I belive, or both, I dont recall at the top of my head
[2021-07-19T01:34:21Z] <sad_plan> dilyn, do you use CFLAGs -static, or do you run without it? does it even matter really? I mean, its specified in the buildscript anyway, so wouldnt it be redundant to have it both places?
[2021-07-19T01:36:40Z] <dilyn> -static in CFLAGS is fun
[2021-07-19T01:36:41Z] <dilyn> https://gcc.gnu.org/legacy-ml/gcc/2000-05/msg00517.html
[2021-07-19T01:36:56Z] <dilyn> so it depends on whether or not I have shared libraries on my system, and if the thing I'm building is a shared library
[2021-07-19T01:37:22Z] <dilyn> you can specify linking against a static library (CFLAGS=-l:libfoo.a), though this results in a lot of unecessary (unused for smart linkers) flags
[2021-07-19T01:39:21Z] <dilyn> but there isn't a one-flag-is-all-you-need rule. for instance, vim
[2021-07-19T01:39:54Z] <dilyn> if I only specify -static in CFLAGS for vim's build, I get this when I ldd /usr/bin/vim http://ix.io/3tod
[2021-07-19T01:40:43Z] <dilyn> if i use -static in LDFLAGS, however, I get "ldd: /usr/bin/vim: Not a valid dynamic program"
[2021-07-19T01:41:43Z] <sad_plan> Ive notied that some builds have specific cflags exported in their buildscripts, so I figured.
[2021-07-19T01:43:10Z] <sad_plan> so even though you specify cflags -static, it still doesnt?
[2021-07-19T01:43:16Z] <dilyn> the real kicker is that -static is a linker flag ;)
[2021-07-19T01:44:05Z] <dilyn> so if -static never gets passed to your linker in whatever way, the linker won't... do the thing
[2021-07-19T01:45:30Z] <sad_plan> lemme get this straight, setting -static as cflags i.e. for vim in this case, does not make it buid static libs, so its basically useless, but if you use it as LDFLAGS instead, it works?
[2021-07-19T01:49:21Z] <dilyn> I should have written all this down when I was embarking on this madlad of a project huh
[2021-07-19T01:49:36Z] <sad_plan> yep
[2021-07-19T01:49:43Z] <sad_plan> :p
[2021-07-19T01:49:44Z] <dilyn> so -static is a linker flag that specifies the ways in which an object should be linked
[2021-07-19T01:50:15Z] <dilyn> a static library is literally just an archive full of object files which contain symbols; a shared library is more like... a pointer, though that is the wrong (confusing) word
[2021-07-19T01:50:48Z] <dilyn> a static library will have all the symbols a program which links to it would need in order to execute all of the things that program would expect to have access to by linking to that library
[2021-07-19T01:51:25Z] <dilyn> as such, -static is simply a command for the linker. so sometimes, adding -static to CFLAGS works because $CFLAGS get prepended to $LDFLAGS, or get added to the $(LD) command in a Makefile.
[2021-07-19T01:52:04Z] <dilyn> but not everyone does that (some Makefiles you'll see things like $(LD) $CFLAGS $CXXFLAGS $LDFLAGS, others you'll just see $(LD) $LDFLAGS, or whatever)
[2021-07-19T01:52:36Z] <dilyn> you can use something like '-Wl,' to pass a flag directly to the linker, in which case you might have been better off just using LDFLAGS (though NOT ALWAYS)
[2021-07-19T01:53:00Z] <dilyn> for instance, CFLAGS="$CFLAGS -Wl,-static" in our vim example also doesn't work
[2021-07-19T01:53:10Z] <sad_plan> why not?
[2021-07-19T01:53:35Z] <dilyn> I'm not sure; I'd have to read the Makefile to see what's going on; presumably the build system isn't calling cc for the link step, but rather ld directly
[2021-07-19T01:53:50Z] <dilyn> if clang is called during the link step, it's plenty smart and will do all the magic for you
[2021-07-19T01:55:24Z] <dilyn> to get even more fucky with you, -static doesn't guarantee that the outcome of your operation will be static in the case of a library. you can slam static objects into shared libraries if you like
[2021-07-19T01:55:46Z] <dilyn> it doesn't go the other way, however, unless you compile that shared library with -fPIC
[2021-07-19T01:56:24Z] <sad_plan> I was compiling stuff with that flag, what exacly does that do? I seem to recall it being about shared libs
[2021-07-19T01:56:33Z] <dilyn> to get a standard library out of your building, that's when something like --disable-shared during the configure step is useful. because now if the build system supports that option, the build system will avoid making a shared object and JUST create your static archive
[2021-07-19T01:57:03Z] <dilyn> it's for position independent code; it's a whole other thing I don't quite understand
[2021-07-19T01:57:16Z] <dilyn> on a surface level it makes your compiled objects bigger :P
[2021-07-19T01:58:46Z] <dilyn> it 'avoids the limits of the global offset table', which means roughly that all of your symbol locations are now relative to this table instead of being set while building
[2021-07-19T01:58:56Z] <dilyn> the linker does a LOT of work. it's the unsung hero of our modern era
[2021-07-19T01:59:08Z] <sad_plan> ok :p I have a feeling that statically linking is an absolute mess. Im also starting to get why mcf bypasses the makefiles altogether. so he doesnt have to mess with peoples bs makefiles :p
[2021-07-19T01:59:23Z] <dilyn> oh almost certainly that is a part of the reason why he did it...
[2021-07-19T01:59:36Z] <dilyn> it's only a mess because nobody knows how to write proper Makefiles :'(
[2021-07-19T02:00:46Z] <sad_plan> for sure. ive been starting to view alot of makefiles as of late, seeing as Im trying to package stuff from time to time, and theyre an aboslute mess all of them..
[2021-07-19T02:01:41Z] <sad_plan> should be a somewhat of a standard instead. oor that would perhaps just make people create more standards, and we be in the same situation as with some package managment software... im looking at you red hat..
[2021-07-19T02:02:41Z] <necromansy> yeah idk about making a standard but rather reinforcing a good base template for simple products
[2021-07-19T02:02:52Z] <necromansy> then making sane extensions :P
[2021-07-19T02:03:07Z] <necromansy> makefiles are neat in concept but a fucking mess irl
[2021-07-19T02:03:28Z] <dilyn> honestly meson is pretty fucking tight
[2021-07-19T02:03:32Z] <dilyn> very readable
[2021-07-19T02:05:52Z] <noocsharp> is that boson fork ready yet?
[2021-07-19T02:06:34Z] <noocsharp> first repo when you visit sr.ht: https://butts.tech/
[2021-07-19T02:10:46Z] <dilyn> amazing
[2021-07-19T02:10:52Z] <dilyn> muon is more ready than boson afaik
[2021-07-19T02:13:34Z] <sad_plan> necromansy: that would be a great start obviously :p
[2021-07-19T02:15:38Z] <sad_plan> dilyn, is that why you use meson in your repo?
[2021-07-19T02:18:03Z] <dilyn> eh
[2021-07-19T02:18:12Z] <dilyn> i use meson when it makes sense to or when I want to avoid gmake
[2021-07-19T02:18:34Z] <dilyn> for instance if I can usually guarantee that meson will already be available when building some package, i'll default to using meson for it
[2021-07-19T02:19:30Z] <sad_plan> and how does one know if you can use meson for said package or not?
[2021-07-19T02:20:10Z] <dilyn> if it has a dependency that requires meson I'll take that as being sufficient
[2021-07-19T02:20:22Z] <dilyn> this is a very loose sense of 'guarantee'
[2021-07-19T02:20:33Z] <sad_plan> sounds resonable :p
[2021-07-19T02:21:37Z] <sad_plan> why are you using gmake anyway? when make is bsd licences anyway
[2021-07-19T02:28:49Z] <sad_plan> or rather bmake is..
[2021-07-19T02:32:53Z] <dilyn> because some people don't know how to write makefiles!
[2021-07-19T02:33:01Z] <dilyn> ifneq is not understood by bmake (:
[2021-07-19T02:33:21Z] <sad_plan> I see
[2021-07-19T02:33:36Z] <necromansy> is there actually any reason that people choose certain makes?
[2021-07-19T02:33:45Z] <dilyn> portability, pretension...
[2021-07-19T02:33:51Z] <dilyn> choose your indoctrination
[2021-07-19T02:34:00Z] <necromansy> i thought make was very portable?
[2021-07-19T02:34:01Z] <dilyn> you ever feel incredibly powerful? https://github.com/dilyn-corner/Programming/blob/main/c/ch1/1.6/length_hist.c http://ix.io/3toq
[2021-07-19T02:34:03Z] <dilyn> I feel like a god
[2021-07-19T02:34:11Z] <necromansy> i mean im just asking out of legit curiosity
[2021-07-19T02:34:28Z] <necromansy> ive only ever written barebones make files for simple C and groff projects
[2021-07-19T02:34:30Z] <dilyn> gmake, like most GNU things, has gnuisms that are not shared by other *makes
[2021-07-19T02:34:31Z] * necromansy shrugs
[2021-07-19T02:34:49Z] <dilyn> gmake is... perhaps more powerful, especially for larger projects
[2021-07-19T02:35:20Z] <dilyn> I don't know enough about make to really be able to tell you; I imagine it has very good build-order dependency resolution, but I don't know how much better that could be over something like bmake
[2021-07-19T02:35:49Z] <dilyn> i just know that gmake has a larger syntax than bmake, and a lot of makefiles leverage that syntax whether out of ignorance or fanboyism i do not know :X
[2021-07-19T02:36:01Z] <dilyn> konimex: maybe knows what gmake can do better than bmake
[2021-07-19T02:36:03Z] <necromansy> fair fair
[2021-07-19T02:45:50Z] <noocsharp> dilyn: are you a fucking animal?
[2021-07-19T02:45:55Z] <noocsharp> put return types on your functions
[2021-07-19T02:46:08Z] <dilyn> k&r baybeee
[2021-07-19T02:46:17Z] <dilyn> ALE is not a fan :V
[2021-07-19T02:46:26Z] <dilyn> int main() so boring tho
[2021-07-19T02:48:48Z] <dilyn> the next question is a histogram for character frequency instead of word length and I want to be an absolute mad lad and use divide and conquer to determine which letter it is instead of like... a sane way
[2021-07-19T02:49:29Z] <sad_plan> where did you find that course? :') it looks.. simple :p
[2021-07-19T02:49:50Z] <dilyn> I'm just reading through K&R
[2021-07-19T02:50:00Z] <necromansy> picking up where mid left off
[2021-07-19T02:50:03Z] <dilyn> lmao
[2021-07-19T02:50:15Z] <sad_plan> k&r?
[2021-07-19T02:50:20Z] <sad_plan> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
[2021-07-19T02:50:22Z] <dilyn> for now, at least. I might find something very interesting to do before I finish and switch to a different book
[2021-07-19T02:50:38Z] <dilyn> the c programming language by kernighan and ritchie
[2021-07-19T02:50:50Z] <sad_plan> aaah
[2021-07-19T02:51:10Z] <dilyn> it's been in my backpack or on my desk for about two years, and i'm finally cracking it open
[2021-07-19T02:51:21Z] <sad_plan> about time :p
[2021-07-19T02:51:25Z] <dilyn> xD
[2021-07-19T02:51:45Z] <noocsharp> i was gonna say, the only way you can justify using it to use c is if you own a physiscal copy
[2021-07-19T02:51:53Z] <noocsharp> to learn c*
[2021-07-19T02:52:00Z] <dilyn> c#
[2021-07-19T02:52:26Z] <noocsharp> c--
[2021-07-19T02:52:59Z] <sad_plan> D!
[2021-07-19T02:53:43Z] <riteo> hiiiii!
[2021-07-19T02:53:48Z] <necromansy> heyhey
[2021-07-19T02:53:52Z] <sad_plan> hey
[2021-07-19T03:03:51Z] <dilyn> o/
[2021-07-19T03:10:05Z] <riteo> does anybody know if there's a POSIX solution to disable pipe buffering?
[2021-07-19T03:11:13Z] <riteo> I'm trying to make curl's output nicer by passing it through some filter, but even with just tee piped right after it the output comes out in chunks
[2021-07-19T03:15:50Z] <dilyn> http://ix.io/3tox this is... slightly off
[2021-07-19T03:17:06Z] <riteo> I feel like this could be shorter and simpler, somehow
[2021-07-19T03:24:20Z] <dilyn> perhaps
[2021-07-19T03:24:33Z] <dilyn> most of the character counts are right, and some are wrong. which I find hilarious.
[2021-07-19T03:25:09Z] <dilyn> oh no, it's right
[2021-07-19T03:25:31Z] <dilyn> smfh i conflated A and a. vim is just case sensitive with its search
[2021-07-19T03:25:37Z] <dilyn> am dumb
[2021-07-19T03:25:42Z] <riteo> epic
[2021-07-19T03:26:01Z] <riteo> so the offness you were talking about was about the result?
[2021-07-19T03:26:15Z] <riteo> I thought it was about the code itself, like, in the way it read
[2021-07-19T03:26:42Z] <dilyn> oh, no the result lol
[2021-07-19T03:26:49Z] <riteo> oh
[2021-07-19T03:27:06Z] <dilyn> I was staring at all these indices and loops for so long and couldn't figure it out, and then i put a A in the code and realized my mistake XD
[2021-07-19T03:27:51Z] <riteo> lol
[2021-07-19T03:28:03Z] <dilyn> i'm so proud of me
[2021-07-19T03:28:07Z] <dilyn> next step, a compiler
[2021-07-19T03:28:14Z] <riteo> yes
[2021-07-19T03:28:22Z] <riteo> I should properly learn C too
[2021-07-19T03:28:35Z] <riteo> probably I'll make minek lol
[2021-07-19T03:29:05Z] <dilyn> lol
[2021-07-19T03:29:27Z] <dilyn> you learn about file operations in chapter 7 of k&r. soooooo...
[2021-07-19T03:29:35Z] <dilyn> this is gonna be a while i think
[2021-07-19T03:29:57Z] <riteo> it's gonna be worth it though
[2021-07-19T03:30:35Z] <riteo> just imagine: a minecraft launcher slightly faster than a properly optimized script, at hundreds time the size
[2021-07-19T03:30:43Z] <riteo> aren't you exited?
[2021-07-19T03:30:51Z] <riteo> s/exited/excited/
[2021-07-19T03:31:20Z] <noocsharp> i imagine it will be hundreds of times faster if properly optimized
[2021-07-19T03:31:51Z] <riteo> we'll see
[2021-07-19T03:32:02Z] <noocsharp> i think you underestimate the toll that an interpreter takes
[2021-07-19T03:32:07Z] <riteo> yes
[2021-07-19T03:32:30Z] <riteo> but I have no sense of scale yet
[2021-07-19T03:33:24Z] <riteo> writing c programs will probably help me allieviate that
[2021-07-19T03:36:44Z] <riteo> now I feel like I'll start earlier than expected, you actually made me properly question my perception of shell scripts and C programs
[2021-07-19T03:37:16Z] <riteo> thanks!
[2021-07-19T03:39:26Z] <noocsharp> no problem: remember an interpreter has to convert the language to machine code on the fly, and then execute the machine code
[2021-07-19T03:39:33Z] <noocsharp> an executable just has to run the machine code
[2021-07-19T03:39:56Z] <riteo> I know that, but now I feel like I really understated that
[2021-07-19T03:40:11Z] <riteo> thinking about it I already got said something similar not too long ago
[2021-07-19T03:41:24Z] <riteo> epic
[2021-07-19T03:50:34Z] <testuser[m]> Hi
[2021-07-19T03:50:43Z] <riteo> hi!
[2021-07-19T03:54:45Z] <riteo> god is pipe buffering even defined in the POSIX standard
[2021-07-19T03:56:12Z] <riteo> http://expect.sourceforge.net/example/unbuffer.man.html >bugs: the man page is longer than the program
[2021-07-19T03:56:15Z] <riteo> lmao
[2021-07-19T04:02:17Z] <riteo> I think I might've found the longest SO answer ever: https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/401956/how-do-i-unbuffer-the-output-passed-from-an-interactive-command-into-a-pipeline
[2021-07-19T04:06:56Z] <riteo> I'm starting to feel like that any attempt of prettyfing in real time any command's output on POSIX alone is impossible
[2021-07-19T04:11:32Z] <noocsharp> such things may require a real programming language
[2021-07-19T04:11:53Z] <riteo> well, in that case you might ditch altoghether the command being prettified
[2021-07-19T04:12:00Z] <riteo> and just use a lib or w/e
[2021-07-19T04:13:40Z] <riteo> fuck it, I'll keep the output chunky
[2021-07-19T04:14:14Z] <testuser[m]> Riteo where's the minekiss repo
[2021-07-19T04:14:24Z] <riteo> repo?
[2021-07-19T04:14:29Z] <riteo> oooh right
[2021-07-19T04:14:30Z] <dilyn> i got to what i thought was about halfway through that answer and... not even a quarter lmao
[2021-07-19T04:14:52Z] <riteo> I'm dumb, I though like, kiss the package manager's concept of repos
[2021-07-19T04:14:58Z] <riteo> it's still not out yet
[2021-07-19T04:15:24Z] <riteo> it's still bad
[2021-07-19T04:15:44Z] <riteo> if you want I can share it though
[2021-07-19T04:18:12Z] <riteo> let me make a gitdab account and I'll share the link
[2021-07-19T04:19:19Z] <testuser[m]> Why not put it on shithub directly
[2021-07-19T04:19:23Z] <testuser[m]> No one is gonna bully you
[2021-07-19T04:19:36Z] <riteo> well because I wanted to slowly migrate to gitdab
[2021-07-19T04:20:02Z] <riteo> exactly because shithub's what it is, shit
[2021-07-19T04:20:10Z] <riteo> ok I'll put it on shithub
[2021-07-19T04:20:27Z] <testuser[m]> which one is gonna survive longer than the next 10 years though
[2021-07-19T04:20:31Z] <riteo> right
[2021-07-19T04:20:35Z] <riteo> with or without the whole extra shitty repo history?
[2021-07-19T04:20:36Z] <acheam> sr.ht
[2021-07-19T04:20:43Z] <acheam> because its foss
[2021-07-19T04:20:47Z] <acheam> and emails last forever
[2021-07-19T04:20:56Z] <testuser[m]> With history
[2021-07-19T04:21:15Z] <riteo> ohoh prepare for shit
[2021-07-19T04:21:16Z] <acheam> gitlab dies when they run out out of venture capital
[2021-07-19T04:21:30Z] <riteo> acheam you don't get it
[2021-07-19T04:21:33Z] <riteo> it's gitdab
[2021-07-19T04:21:34Z] <riteo> with a d
[2021-07-19T04:21:42Z] <riteo> it's an actual service based on git tea
[2021-07-19T04:21:50Z] <riteo> https://gitdab.com/
[2021-07-19T04:21:59Z] <acheam> oh yeah you linked that earlier
[2021-07-19T04:22:02Z] <dilyn> >emails last forever
[2021-07-19T04:22:06Z] <dilyn> I delete all of my emails
[2021-07-19T04:22:20Z] <acheam> yeah gitdab is the dabbity dabbity
[2021-07-19T04:22:42Z] <riteo> dilyn forgot to mention that he does that obliterating time itself
[2021-07-19T04:22:52Z] <dilyn> truly
[2021-07-19T04:23:02Z] <dilyn> the world was created on a thursday, and is destroyed every wednesday
[2021-07-19T04:23:09Z] <acheam> dilyn: do you also shred your bills?
[2021-07-19T04:23:13Z] <dilyn> ofc
[2021-07-19T04:24:27Z] <testuser[m]> I delete all of my emails too
[2021-07-19T04:24:59Z] <dilyn> the past is a hindrance to all future progress
[2021-07-19T04:25:57Z] <riteo> god I feel so anxious
[2021-07-19T04:26:10Z] <noocsharp> dilyn: i don't think that argument would hold up in court
[2021-07-19T04:26:44Z] <dilyn> no mortal laws can contain me
[2021-07-19T04:26:47Z] <riteo> that's because court doesn't foster the power of simplicity as dilyn does
[2021-07-19T04:26:51Z] <riteo> exactly
[2021-07-19T04:26:52Z] <dilyn> I am a fractal of the universe
[2021-07-19T04:27:24Z] <riteo> dilyn is a rationalization of the power of the universe in a form that our puny human brains can comprehend
[2021-07-19T04:27:54Z] <noocsharp> dilyn: irc xor acid
[2021-07-19T04:27:59Z] <dilyn> i am a way for the cosmos to know itself
[2021-07-19T04:28:18Z] <riteo> aaaaaaaaaa I'm gonna make the repo public
[2021-07-19T04:28:32Z] <riteo> why is it so hard
[2021-07-19T04:28:57Z] <testuser[m]> i see you stole mid's joke about shithub statuses
[2021-07-19T04:29:03Z] <dilyn> you are the only hindrance to yourself
[2021-07-19T04:29:06Z] <dilyn> man is condemned to be free
[2021-07-19T04:29:24Z] <riteo> testuser[m]: not quite, I actually started it if we're talking about the same one
[2021-07-19T04:29:46Z] <riteo> mid surely added something to it though
[2021-07-19T04:30:27Z] <riteo> the scariest thing is that I have no memory if I left anything that shouldn't be published into the repo
[2021-07-19T04:31:06Z] <riteo> it doesn't look like that, expecially since I wrote the script and the commit messages in english
[2021-07-19T04:31:54Z] <riteo> in case you find my nudes or something like that tell me
[2021-07-19T04:31:56Z] <riteo> ok here it goes
[2021-07-19T04:32:39Z] <riteo> it's live now
[2021-07-19T04:33:05Z] <testuser[m]> Nice
[2021-07-19T04:33:25Z] <riteo> btw, would you mind if while it downloaded the game assets the output would be... chunky?
[2021-07-19T04:33:28Z] <riteo> like, buffered?
[2021-07-19T04:33:53Z] <riteo> or would you prefer a less user-friendly but interactive output?
[2021-07-19T04:34:32Z] <noocsharp> riteo: link?
[2021-07-19T04:34:49Z] <riteo> you see, I'm making an optimization which makes the assets downloading way faster at the cost of a trickier output to manage, and in order to prettify it while parsing the assets names from the hashes the output gets buffered
[2021-07-19T04:34:55Z] <riteo> noocsharp: aaaaaaaaaaaa here it comes
[2021-07-19T04:35:03Z] <riteo> I warned you: https://github.com/Riteo/minekiss
[2021-07-19T04:35:10Z] <riteo> it's still in alpha quality
[2021-07-19T04:35:14Z] <testuser[m]> How does it look like when buffered
[2021-07-19T04:35:29Z] <riteo> 30/40 lines of
[2021-07-19T04:35:36Z] <riteo> aaaa entered to quickly
[2021-07-19T04:35:37Z] <riteo> I said:
[2021-07-19T04:35:55Z] <riteo> *silence* 30/40 lines of "downloaded x" *silence* and so on
[2021-07-19T04:36:40Z] <testuser[m]> Seems fine
[2021-07-19T04:36:50Z] <riteo> meanwhile the other option could be: "downloaded *undecipherable hashes*"
[2021-07-19T04:37:37Z] <riteo> so, who will try it?
[2021-07-19T04:39:37Z] <noocsharp> i would if i had java on this system
[2021-07-19T04:39:38Z] <testuser[m]> I don't play minecraft i just wanted to see what your launcher looked like :p
[2021-07-19T04:39:49Z] <riteo> I see
[2021-07-19T04:40:04Z] <riteo> noocsharp: kiss linux install?
[2021-07-19T04:40:23Z] <riteo> I actually plan after doing this to work both on the nvidia drivers and java support on kiss
[2021-07-19T04:40:34Z] <riteo> I'll make kiss linux the minecraft distro
[2021-07-19T04:43:15Z] <riteo> wew, this was so sudden
[2021-07-19T04:43:37Z] <riteo> I literally gave you my intimate relationship with one of my project all of a sudden
[2021-07-19T04:44:16Z] <riteo> also, I've already been working on it for more than a month
[2021-07-19T04:44:30Z] <riteo> "what did you do in summer?" "I made a shitty minecraft launcher in POSIX shell"
[2021-07-19T04:51:41Z] <riteo> bruh there are literally duplicate entries into the asset index
[2021-07-19T04:52:04Z] <riteo> ok I'll ditch directly the chunky prettifying for now, get ready for undeciferable sha1sums
[2021-07-19T04:57:03Z] <riteo> testuser[m]: was it you that was working on the package linter?
[2021-07-19T04:57:26Z] <testuser[m]> GalaxyNova
[2021-07-19T04:57:32Z] <riteo> oh ok
[2021-07-19T05:34:47Z] <noocsharp> riteo: indeed
[2021-07-19T05:35:04Z] <riteo> indeed what
[2021-07-19T05:38:29Z] <riteo> noocsharp: indeed what
[2021-07-19T05:39:40Z] <msk[m]> "kiss linux install?" ?
[2021-07-19T05:40:15Z] <testuser[m]> indeed
[2021-07-19T05:40:17Z] <noocsharp> msk[m]: indeed
[2021-07-19T05:40:25Z] <riteo> indeed
[2021-07-19T06:35:08Z] <testuser[m]> is 'mv dir1 dir2 /destdir/' portable ? Is the last directory treated as the target in all implementations of mv ?
[2021-07-19T06:38:10Z] <dilyn> https://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9699919799/ yes
[2021-07-19T06:53:45Z] <GalaxyNova> yay
[2021-07-19T06:53:53Z] <GalaxyNova> sway is broken now after the update :D
[2021-07-19T06:54:14Z] <testuser[m]> define broken
[2021-07-19T06:54:18Z] <GalaxyNova> the keyboard seems to not be responding
[2021-07-19T06:54:29Z] <GalaxyNova> I can't open anything
[2021-07-19T06:54:55Z] <necromansy> check the config file/defaults
[2021-07-19T06:55:16Z] <GalaxyNova> i hightly doubt it's the config
[2021-07-19T06:55:20Z] <GalaxyNova> it was working just fine before
[2021-07-19T06:55:33Z] <GalaxyNova> here's the sway log https://0x0.st/-VBN.log
[2021-07-19T06:55:38Z] <GalaxyNova> everything looks normal
[2021-07-19T06:55:58Z] <riteo> oh hi GalaxyNova!
[2021-07-19T06:56:02Z] <GalaxyNova> hey
[2021-07-19T06:56:08Z] <GalaxyNova> on tty rn
[2021-07-19T06:56:20Z] <riteo> how's that package linter going?
[2021-07-19T06:56:43Z] <GalaxyNova> it works!
[2021-07-19T06:56:47Z] <riteo> cool!
[2021-07-19T06:56:49Z] <GalaxyNova> ye
[2021-07-19T06:57:13Z] <riteo> I don't remember if you cared, but I published the code for minekiss on github
[2021-07-19T06:57:20Z] <GalaxyNova> oh cool
[2021-07-19T06:57:27Z] <GalaxyNova> link?
[2021-07-19T06:57:38Z] <riteo> https://github.com/Riteo/minekiss
[2021-07-19T06:57:47Z] <testuser[m]> Galaxynova is this regular sway or sway-tiny or no-seat
[2021-07-19T06:57:50Z] <GalaxyNova> Unfortunately for me I have a nvidia card so performance will probably be trash
[2021-07-19T06:57:56Z] <GalaxyNova> testuser[m]: regular sway
[2021-07-19T06:58:00Z] <GalaxyNova> seatd is running
[2021-07-19T06:58:05Z] <testuser[m]> Hmm
[2021-07-19T06:58:13Z] <testuser[m]> So it launches and then just exits ?
[2021-07-19T06:58:22Z] <GalaxyNova> riteo: nevertheless I'll still check it out when I get sway to work
[2021-07-19T06:58:32Z] <riteo> epic
[2021-07-19T06:58:33Z] <GalaxyNova> testuser[m]: No, I killed it because there was no other way
[2021-07-19T06:58:41Z] <GalaxyNova> the exit keybind didn't work
[2021-07-19T06:58:54Z] <testuser[m]> Stuck on a blanks screen ? You gave the log but not what the issue is
[2021-07-19T06:59:03Z] <testuser[m]> Ah
[2021-07-19T06:59:06Z] <GalaxyNova> the keyboard doesn't work
[2021-07-19T06:59:06Z] <testuser[m]> Sorry didnt read
[2021-07-19T06:59:22Z] <testuser[m]> So it displays your wallpaper and stuff
[2021-07-19T06:59:32Z] <testuser[m]> Might be related to dylan's new iteration of the libevdev patch
[2021-07-19T06:59:42Z] <testuser[m]> It was changed to fix audio keyss
[2021-07-19T06:59:57Z] <GalaxyNova> oof
[2021-07-19T07:00:02Z] <GalaxyNova> that's what i was suspecting too
[2021-07-19T07:00:23Z] <testuser[m]> Raise it on kisslinux/repo
[2021-07-19T07:00:24Z] <GalaxyNova> guess I should roll back my repository
[2021-07-19T07:09:43Z] <GalaxyNova> ok
[2021-07-19T07:09:50Z] <GalaxyNova> rolled back to an old version of the repositories
[2021-07-19T07:09:56Z] <GalaxyNova> the keyboard still doesn't work
[2021-07-19T07:09:59Z] <GalaxyNova> this must be my fault
[2021-07-19T07:10:01Z] <riteo> bruh
[2021-07-19T07:10:21Z] * GalaxyNova sighs
[2021-07-19T07:10:42Z] <GalaxyNova> SWAY ISN'T GIVING ANY ERRORS
[2021-07-19T07:10:44Z] <GalaxyNova> AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
[2021-07-19T07:10:46Z] <riteo> can you recall anything recent you did with the device manager?
[2021-07-19T07:11:07Z] <GalaxyNova> I didn't touch the device manager at all
[2021-07-19T07:11:16Z] <riteo> wait, how did you roll back?
[2021-07-19T07:11:16Z] <GalaxyNova> all i did was enable the seatd service
[2021-07-19T07:11:22Z] <GalaxyNova> git checkout
[2021-07-19T07:11:26Z] <riteo> and?
[2021-07-19T07:11:35Z] <GalaxyNova> and it's the same
[2021-07-19T07:11:40Z] <riteo> I mean
[2021-07-19T07:11:51Z] <riteo> after git checkout did you rebuild the packages or run kiss update?
[2021-07-19T07:11:58Z] <GalaxyNova> rebuild the packages
[2021-07-19T07:12:08Z] <riteo> ok
[2021-07-19T07:12:18Z] <riteo> did it rebuild their libraries too?
[2021-07-19T07:12:21Z] <GalaxyNova> yes
[2021-07-19T07:12:35Z] <riteo> I see
[2021-07-19T07:12:49Z] <riteo> so the issue is seatd
[2021-07-19T07:12:52Z] <riteo> right?
[2021-07-19T07:13:37Z] <GalaxyNova> idk
[2021-07-19T07:13:43Z] <GalaxyNova> before i was just running "doas seatd &"
[2021-07-19T07:13:57Z] <GalaxyNova> then manually chowning /run/seatd.sock to my user
[2021-07-19T07:14:24Z] <GalaxyNova> because i was too lazy to enable the service
[2021-07-19T07:14:59Z] <riteo> have you looked into the service?
[2021-07-19T07:15:01Z] <riteo> what does it do?
[2021-07-19T07:15:09Z] <riteo> maybe it does something differently
[2021-07-19T07:15:25Z] <GalaxyNova> it runs seatd -g video
[2021-07-19T07:15:35Z] <GalaxyNova> that shoudn't matter though because i am in the video group anyway
[2021-07-19T07:16:06Z] <GalaxyNova> what's annoying me is that there are no error messages whatsoever
[2021-07-19T07:16:21Z] <riteo> that sounds horrible
[2021-07-19T07:16:29Z] <riteo> does sway have a debug option?
[2021-07-19T07:16:32Z] <GalaxyNova> yes
[2021-07-19T07:16:36Z] <GalaxyNova> it's how it generated the log
[2021-07-19T07:16:44Z] <riteo> bruh
[2021-07-19T07:17:32Z] <GalaxyNova> I'll try plugging in a PS2 keyboard to see if that works
[2021-07-19T07:18:51Z] <GalaxyNova> the mouse works just fine
[2021-07-19T07:19:04Z] <riteo> wait, is the mouse ps/2
[2021-07-19T07:19:17Z] <GalaxyNova> it's a USB mouse
[2021-07-19T07:19:31Z] <riteo> this is confusing
[2021-07-19T07:19:38Z] <GalaxyNova> idk maybe it's some weird driver thing
[2021-07-19T07:19:48Z] <GalaxyNova> didn't touch my kernel though
[2021-07-19T07:19:51Z] <riteo> so usb works but not for the keyboard and only on sway
[2021-07-19T07:20:02Z] <riteo> s/sway/tty/
[2021-07-19T07:20:09Z] <GalaxyNova> the keyboard works on tty
[2021-07-19T07:20:31Z] <GalaxyNova> is there any way I can open a program inside sway?
[2021-07-19T07:20:37Z] <GalaxyNova> from the tty
[2021-07-19T07:20:44Z] <riteo> could it be that the seat doesn't have a keyboard defined?
[2021-07-19T07:21:04Z] <GalaxyNova> tried removing sway and installing sway-no-seat, same result
[2021-07-19T07:21:09Z] <GalaxyNova> i'll try that again actually
[2021-07-19T07:21:11Z] <GalaxyNova> brb
[2021-07-19T07:23:49Z] <GalaxyNova> riteo: Ok
[2021-07-19T07:23:56Z] <GalaxyNova> installed sway-no-seat, same effect
[2021-07-19T07:24:04Z] <GalaxyNova> removed my config file, same effect
[2021-07-19T07:24:14Z] <riteo> wtf
[2021-07-19T07:24:50Z] <riteo> you installed the older version of sway-no-seat, right?
[2021-07-19T07:24:57Z] <necromansy> completely off the cuff suggestion, try rebuilding libxkbcommon?
[2021-07-19T07:25:06Z] <GalaxyNova> no, the new one
[2021-07-19T07:25:12Z] <riteo> necromansy: GalaxyNova is on wayland
[2021-07-19T07:25:18Z] <necromansy> yeah
[2021-07-19T07:25:24Z] <necromansy> its a wayland dep too
[2021-07-19T07:25:27Z] <riteo> oh
[2021-07-19T07:25:50Z] <necromansy> yeah dw its one of two x packages thats been moved to wayland
[2021-07-19T07:26:59Z] <GalaxyNova> installed the old version of sway-no-seat, same effect
[2021-07-19T07:27:01Z] <GalaxyNova> wtf
[2021-07-19T07:27:18Z] <GalaxyNova> is my install borked???
[2021-07-19T07:27:33Z] <riteo> > installed debian, same effect
[2021-07-19T07:27:33Z] <GalaxyNova> rebuild libxkbcommon and that didn't make a difference either
[2021-07-19T07:27:39Z] <GalaxyNova> riteo: lmao
[2021-07-19T07:27:52Z] <GalaxyNova> it was working fine yesterday
[2021-07-19T07:27:56Z] <necromansy> heck
[2021-07-19T07:28:13Z] <GalaxyNova> time to install Ubuntu
[2021-07-19T07:28:17Z] <GalaxyNova> kek
[2021-07-19T07:28:25Z] <riteo> red hat won again
[2021-07-19T07:29:12Z] <riteo> GalaxyNova: rollback to a few days ago and rebuild everything
[2021-07-19T07:29:41Z] <riteo> if even then it doesn't work, red hat hacked your cpu to make it work only on fedora
[2021-07-19T07:30:06Z] <schillingklaus> make what work only on fetor-a?
[2021-07-19T07:30:07Z] <GalaxyNova> bruuhh
[2021-07-19T07:30:13Z] <GalaxyNova> that's going to take hours
[2021-07-19T07:30:18Z] <GalaxyNova> i have firefox installed
[2021-07-19T07:30:25Z] * GalaxyNova cries
[2021-07-19T07:30:44Z] <riteo> well, then build everything except firefox
[2021-07-19T07:30:53Z] <testuser[m]> no
[2021-07-19T07:31:04Z] <testuser[m]> rebuild only stuff from repo/ayyland
[2021-07-19T07:31:11Z] <necromansy> ^
[2021-07-19T07:31:39Z] <riteo> yeah, good idea
[2021-07-19T07:31:50Z] <riteo> mine was like, the last resort
[2021-07-19T07:32:47Z] <testuser[m]> thats the windows way riteo
[2021-07-19T07:32:59Z] <riteo> yeah, you're right
[2021-07-19T07:33:13Z] <GalaxyNova> oh wait
[2021-07-19T07:33:31Z] <GalaxyNova> kiss-depends libinput returns libevdev
[2021-07-19T07:33:44Z] <GalaxyNova> is that bad?
[2021-07-19T07:34:03Z] <testuser[m]> yes
[2021-07-19T07:34:05Z] <testuser[m]> rebuild it
[2021-07-19T07:34:08Z] <testuser[m]> purge evdev
[2021-07-19T07:34:25Z] <testuser[m]> have you been doing partial upgrades
[2021-07-19T07:37:07Z] <GalaxyNova> maybe
[2021-07-19T07:37:45Z] <riteo> oh my god
[2021-07-19T07:37:57Z] <riteo> is the ascii art character on kiss' website tux?
[2021-07-19T07:38:09Z] <testuser[m]> yeah
[2021-07-19T07:38:19Z] <riteo> why did it took so long for me to figure that out
[2021-07-19T07:38:43Z] <riteo> I always thought it was someone like, talking with an exaggerated open mouth, you know, cartoonishly
[2021-07-19T07:38:59Z] <riteo> I feel so dumb rn
[2021-07-19T07:45:02Z] <riteo> oh dylan updated the quote from "A camel is a horse designed by a commitee." to "A camel is still a horse designed by a commitee."
[2021-07-19T07:45:05Z] <riteo> lmao
[2021-07-19T07:45:13Z] <riteo> that's a really nice touch
[2021-07-19T08:21:55Z] <riteo> well, gtg, bye everyone!
[2021-07-19T08:58:47Z] <testuser[m]> https://github.com/termbox/termbox
[2021-07-19T09:42:47Z] <schillingklaus> a dilyn is a dylan designed by a test user
[2021-07-19T10:07:17Z] <schillingklaus> the famous mobinmob who wrote many comments for sysdfree... i remember the disputev with cynwulf
[2021-07-19T10:10:25Z] <testuser[m]> Wat
[2021-07-19T10:25:46Z] <travankor> is schillingklaus midfavila in disguise?
[2021-07-19T10:30:55Z] <schillingklaus> no, I have nothing in common with midfavila
[2021-07-19T10:50:52Z] <claudia> yes, this distro is developed, maintained and used, all by one person.
[2021-07-19T10:53:48Z] <testuser[m]> ?
[2021-07-19T10:58:24Z] <schillingklaus> and this person is?
[2021-07-19T11:00:05Z] <mrlix> I'm pretty sure there's at least 5 kiss linux users
[2021-07-19T11:05:14Z] <schillingklaus> as opposed to netbsd, where the sets of users and of developers is almost disjoint
[2021-07-19T11:13:38Z] <travankor> that's sort of true for all bsd's
[2021-07-19T11:15:34Z] <travankor> especially freebsd
[2021-07-19T12:25:00Z] <mrlix> and yet freebsd has less bugs and poorly made libraries
[2021-07-19T12:31:12Z] <claudia> Hey, I use 'kiss a' to swap all alternatives to toybox, but get the following error: ERROR File '/usr/bin/[' exists on filesystem but isn't owned
[2021-07-19T12:31:19Z] <claudia> http://ix.io/3tqd
[2021-07-19T12:31:24Z] <claudia> Can sombody reproduce?
[2021-07-19T12:32:17Z] <necromansy> yes
[2021-07-19T12:32:21Z] <necromansy> got it with sbase
[2021-07-19T12:32:45Z] <necromansy> you on version 5.5.9?
[2021-07-19T12:32:48Z] <claudia> kiss b foo/ gives the same.
[2021-07-19T12:32:54Z] <claudia> yes 5.5.9
[2021-07-19T12:33:10Z] <claudia> I think dylan prohibet usage of special signs as input.
[2021-07-19T12:33:42Z] <testuser[m]> Seems like a nonportable grep pattern
[2021-07-19T12:33:53Z] <necromansy> looks like an issue needs to be raised
[2021-07-19T12:34:08Z] <claudia> on it
[2021-07-19T13:24:59Z] <necromansy> https://github.com/dylanaraps/pfetch/issues/125
[2021-07-19T13:25:14Z] <necromansy> i just
[2021-07-19T13:25:15Z] <necromansy> what
[2021-07-19T13:28:21Z] <dilyn> lmfaooooooo
[2021-07-19T13:28:37Z] <cot> ...
[2021-07-19T13:28:44Z] <testuser[m]> their other issues are like that too
[2021-07-19T13:28:45Z] <testuser[m]> probably troll
[2021-07-19T13:28:54Z] <testuser[m]> https://github.com/kovidgoyal/kitty/issues/3643
[2021-07-19T13:28:58Z] <dilyn> When your nit-picky opinions aren't even clearly conveyed because you can't be bothered to use quotes or linebreaks
[2021-07-19T13:28:59Z] <cot> >What is an information tool? That phrase is way, way, way too vague
[2021-07-19T13:29:00Z] <testuser[m]> https://github.com/florentc/xob/issues/31
[2021-07-19T13:29:08Z] <cot> LOL
[2021-07-19T13:29:09Z] <necromansy> omg they do this to other people too?
[2021-07-19T13:29:17Z] <necromansy> for sure a troll then
[2021-07-19T13:29:53Z] <testuser[m]> how much time have they got lol they're writing pages worth of comments
[2021-07-19T13:29:53Z] <cot> >I have never made a pull request in my life. I'm not an engineer. I've never used pfetch nor
[2021-07-19T13:29:56Z] <cot> do I intend to use it. I'm not even sure what pfetch does. I simply contributed some
[2021-07-19T13:29:58Z] <cot> editorial changes after glancing at Pfetch: Everyone's Favourite System Info Tool.
[2021-07-19T13:30:16Z] <dilyn> "What about an empty black screen with a blinking cursors screams I am a point and grunt interface suitable for gorillas to you?" dude gets fucking bodied in a github comment
[2021-07-19T13:30:25Z] <necromansy> im crying ahah
[2021-07-19T13:31:42Z] <testuser[m]> > You have been blocked. Dont let the door hit your fat ass on the way out.
[2021-07-19T13:31:43Z] <testuser[m]> lol
[2021-07-19T13:32:02Z] <cot> hah
[2021-07-19T13:32:30Z] <cot> LOL @ them telling a commenter that one of the sentences in their messages is a run-on sentence
[2021-07-19T13:32:44Z] <cot> 13yo grammar police on steroids
[2021-07-19T13:33:01Z] <necromansy> either a troll or a very self-absorbed prick
[2021-07-19T13:33:03Z] <necromansy> either way
[2021-07-19T13:33:20Z] <necromansy> some late night hilarity
[2021-07-19T13:38:24Z] <dilyn> this dude has to be like, 65 years old
[2021-07-19T13:38:49Z] <cot> nah, 12-13
[2021-07-19T13:38:59Z] <cot> I can't imagine an adult acting like that.
[2021-07-19T13:39:06Z] <necromansy> oh man
[2021-07-19T13:39:10Z] <necromansy> you sweet summer child
[2021-07-19T13:39:17Z] <cot> lol
[2021-07-19T13:39:18Z] <testuser[m]> seen ddevault ?
[2021-07-19T13:39:41Z] <cot> ddevault's behaviour is, um, more adult-y, for lack of a better term.
[2021-07-19T13:39:44Z] <schillingklaus> i am 55 and can act worse
[2021-07-19T13:39:56Z] <cot> This guy reminds me too much of some young adolescents I've met in the past.
[2021-07-19T13:39:57Z] <necromansy> well i now no longer feel like an old fart
[2021-07-19T13:40:02Z] <necromansy> thank you schillingklaus
[2021-07-19T13:41:44Z] <dilyn> finally, i am a young one
[2021-07-19T13:41:50Z] <necromansy> ^
[2021-07-19T14:22:38Z] <raph_ael> youth is a question of mind
[2021-07-19T14:23:16Z] <dilyn> my mind old as fuq dude
[2021-07-19T14:23:22Z] <necromansy> big mood
[2021-07-19T14:24:46Z] <dilyn> some times I think about learning something new and I'll remember that because I'm not 9 anymore my brain has become super inelastic and it will only be orders of magnitude harder for me to learn and so i resign myself to cursing my age
[2021-07-19T14:25:13Z] <dilyn> life is ruff
[2021-07-19T14:25:26Z] <necromansy> i more so think about how taking the time to overcome that new learning difficulty eats into my other things
[2021-07-19T14:25:28Z] <necromansy> :<
[2021-07-19T14:26:32Z] <dilyn> 'do one thing and do it well', because you're old as fuck and won't be able to do more than one thing in the 24 hours you've got
[2021-07-19T14:26:46Z] <necromansy> precisely
[2021-07-19T15:31:33Z] <acheam> > awk is gone.
[2021-07-19T15:31:35Z] <acheam> :(
[2021-07-19T15:36:26Z] <dilyn> say what
[2021-07-19T15:36:46Z] <dilyn> rip awk
[2021-07-19T15:38:30Z] <testuser[m]> Gone ?
[2021-07-19T15:38:31Z] <testuser[m]> Wat
[2021-07-19T15:38:36Z] <testuser[m]> Where'd it go
[2021-07-19T15:38:59Z] <dilyn> dylan eliminated its need in `kiss`
[2021-07-19T15:39:02Z] <dilyn> also, this is cute https://github.com/kisslinux/kiss/commit/c4481c928380f2f2f322635d4ed78663a24fb9ee
[2021-07-19T15:39:19Z] <dilyn> can we implement such a thing in irc
[2021-07-19T15:42:23Z] <testuser[m]> you can implement what you want but no use if none's gonna follow it :p
[2021-07-19T15:42:54Z] <dilyn> :'(
[2021-07-19T15:52:05Z] <acheam> hmm dylan took down the guidestones
[2021-07-19T16:25:44Z] <micro_O> interesting, awk never was part of the base image anyway. gotta check that all my depends are in order
[2021-07-19T16:26:12Z] <micro_O> also I guess any build scripts that use awk need to add it to their depends as well? or can we assume busybox awk will still be available
[2021-07-19T16:27:16Z] <riteo> hiiiii!
[2021-07-19T16:27:21Z] <micro_O> o/
[2021-07-19T16:29:19Z] <acheam> micro_O: because awk is in busybox
[2021-07-19T16:29:27Z] <acheam> yeah it will still be in the busybox package im sure
[2021-07-19T16:29:30Z] <acheam> its posix, after all
[2021-07-19T16:29:42Z] <acheam> its usage was just removed from the package manager
[2021-07-19T16:40:30Z] <dilyn> http://ix.io/3trz noocsharp: are you happy now
[2021-07-19T16:41:17Z] <dilyn> micro_O: i went by the rule that anything provided by busybox could be assumed; a competent coreutils is... important to have in general
[2021-07-19T16:41:25Z] <dilyn> users who don't have awk should know it, or will find out quick lmfao
[2021-07-19T16:42:19Z] <noocsharp> about time
[2021-07-19T16:42:22Z] <acheam> oh no
[2021-07-19T16:42:29Z] <acheam> dilyn doesn't put return type on a new line
[2021-07-19T16:42:37Z] <dilyn> ?
[2021-07-19T16:42:41Z] <acheam> is this the causal.agency style?
[2021-07-19T16:43:15Z] <acheam> like this: https://l.armaanb.net/tmp
[2021-07-19T16:43:20Z] <noocsharp> hey, at least he's putting return types in now
[2021-07-19T16:43:23Z] <acheam> lol
[2021-07-19T16:43:32Z] <cem> awk is specified by POSIX after all, and I don't expect any POSIX to come without awk installed
[2021-07-19T16:43:39Z] <acheam> it lets you grep for function definitions easily
[2021-07-19T16:43:43Z] <dilyn> why the FUCK would i do an abomination like int\ main(void)
[2021-07-19T16:43:48Z] <dilyn> int\n*
[2021-07-19T16:43:52Z] <dilyn> that can go directly to hell
[2021-07-19T16:43:57Z] <acheam> because then you can grep '^main'
[2021-07-19T16:44:06Z] <acheam> and find the definition nice and quick
[2021-07-19T16:44:08Z] <dilyn> no
[2021-07-19T16:44:11Z] <acheam> instead of just where its called
[2021-07-19T16:44:12Z] <cem> Yeah, it's super useful when you are actually debugging code
[2021-07-19T16:44:16Z] <dilyn> vim foo.c; /main(
[2021-07-19T16:44:22Z] <cem> And I hate it whenever someone doesn't do that
[2021-07-19T16:44:24Z] <acheam> for main that works
[2021-07-19T16:44:27Z] <acheam> but for other functions it wont
[2021-07-19T16:44:33Z] <acheam> say you call a function 15 times
[2021-07-19T16:44:42Z] <dilyn> this is disgusting syntax and I will never obey it
[2021-07-19T16:44:43Z] <acheam> you'll have to search through 15 instances to find the definition
[2021-07-19T16:44:51Z] <acheam> have fun
[2021-07-19T16:44:59Z] <cem> dilyn: you don't deserve to code in C
[2021-07-19T16:45:06Z] <dilyn> you're all criminals
[2021-07-19T16:45:08Z] <acheam> just clang-format this SOB
[2021-07-19T16:45:11Z] <cem> no YOU are
[2021-07-19T16:45:14Z] <dilyn> :(
[2021-07-19T16:45:19Z] <cem> I'll sue you
[2021-07-19T16:45:45Z] <dilyn> https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/000/266/no_u_for_knowyourmeme.jpg
[2021-07-19T16:45:47Z] <riteo> what are my eyes seeing
[2021-07-19T16:46:06Z] <cem> dilyn: wow okay huh easy there
[2021-07-19T16:46:13Z] <dilyn> no
[2021-07-19T16:46:17Z] <dilyn> i have strong feelings about this
[2021-07-19T16:46:19Z] <riteo> I don't see either why one would do this
[2021-07-19T16:46:22Z] <dilyn> i'm a real programmer, finally
[2021-07-19T16:46:33Z] <cem> you have wrong strong feelings
[2021-07-19T16:46:42Z] <dilyn> that's just like, your opinion man
[2021-07-19T16:46:46Z] <cem> and that's the worst kind of strong feelings
[2021-07-19T16:47:05Z] <cem> dilyn: it's the law
[2021-07-19T16:47:13Z] <riteo> I mean, if you want to find the definition just make a regex that looks for main and an ending {
[2021-07-19T16:47:42Z] <dilyn> if the law is unjust, the only just thing to do is to be a criminal
[2021-07-19T16:47:56Z] <cem> I agree with the sentiment
[2021-07-19T16:47:57Z] <cem> but no
[2021-07-19T16:48:23Z] <acheam> riteo: that wont necesarily work
[2021-07-19T16:48:33Z] <acheam> what about "if (function()) {"
[2021-07-19T16:48:47Z] <acheam> also { belong on a separate line, dont @ me
[2021-07-19T16:48:56Z] <acheam> int\nmain(void)\n{
[2021-07-19T16:49:05Z] <riteo> ok now I lost all respect for you
[2021-07-19T16:49:17Z] <acheam> this is the way!
[2021-07-19T16:49:58Z] <noocsharp> ^
[2021-07-19T16:49:59Z] <cem> acheam: I agree 100 percent
[2021-07-19T16:50:48Z] <acheam> although i've been considering switching to just using the Linux style
[2021-07-19T16:50:59Z] <testuser[m]> { on newline only for functions
[2021-07-19T16:51:03Z] <acheam> which is int main(void)\n{
[2021-07-19T16:51:09Z] <acheam> so you can still grep it easily
[2021-07-19T16:51:12Z] <riteo> are we and dilyn the only ones here to not put everything in a newline
[2021-07-19T16:51:14Z] <dilyn> main() { printf("Eat my shorts"); }
[2021-07-19T16:51:19Z] <riteo> based
[2021-07-19T16:51:37Z] <dilyn> newlines are bloat
[2021-07-19T16:51:42Z] <dilyn> compilers don't read them, why do i need them
[2021-07-19T16:51:44Z] <dilyn> save the char
[2021-07-19T16:52:26Z] <noocsharp> says the animal using spaces for indentation
[2021-07-19T16:52:36Z] <dilyn> it's for the disrespect
[2021-07-19T16:52:36Z] <riteo> dilyn does WHAT
[2021-07-19T16:52:39Z] <acheam> spaces for indent isn't /that/ bad
[2021-07-19T16:52:43Z] <testuser[m]> What's the rationale for putting return type newline function name
[2021-07-19T16:52:46Z] <acheam> because then its consistent at least
[2021-07-19T16:52:52Z] <acheam> testuser[m]: easy grepability
[2021-07-19T16:52:59Z] <acheam> grep '^function'
[2021-07-19T16:53:01Z] <acheam> to find the definition
[2021-07-19T16:53:06Z] <acheam> it also makes it stand out a bit more
[2021-07-19T16:53:38Z] <testuser[m]> Use zero width spaces for indentation
[2021-07-19T16:53:45Z] <acheam> wut
[2021-07-19T16:53:48Z] <acheam> no
[2021-07-19T16:53:50Z] <riteo> this is the right choice
[2021-07-19T16:54:03Z] <riteo> couldn't agree more
[2021-07-19T16:54:07Z] <dilyn> there is no choice
[2021-07-19T16:54:10Z] <dilyn> it's the only option
[2021-07-19T16:54:34Z] <cem> dilyn: newlines are good because someone will need to read your crappy code eventually?
[2021-07-19T16:54:44Z] <riteo> cem I think dilyn was joking
[2021-07-19T16:54:52Z] <cem> I'm also joking
[2021-07-19T16:54:54Z] <acheam> single line ifs are nice
[2021-07-19T16:54:56Z] <riteo> fuck
[2021-07-19T16:55:00Z] <cem> lmao
[2021-07-19T16:55:14Z] <acheam> they're good for quick checks
[2021-07-19T16:55:19Z] <acheam> like seeing if a malloc failed
[2021-07-19T16:55:22Z] <riteo> yes
[2021-07-19T16:55:31Z] <acheam> if (!var) exit(1);
[2021-07-19T16:55:37Z] <acheam> as compared to
[2021-07-19T16:55:38Z] <riteo> the 80 char rule shall apply once again
[2021-07-19T16:55:40Z] <acheam> if (!var) {
[2021-07-19T16:55:43Z] <acheam> exit(1);
[2021-07-19T16:55:43Z] <acheam> }
[2021-07-19T16:55:52Z] <acheam> here's the real question
[2021-07-19T16:55:54Z] <acheam> 80 char
[2021-07-19T16:55:56Z] <acheam> or 79 char
[2021-07-19T16:55:56Z] <noocsharp> you don't need braces on that
[2021-07-19T16:56:00Z] <acheam> noocsharp: i know
[2021-07-19T16:56:11Z] <acheam> but some style guides enforce no single line ifs, and no braceless ifs
[2021-07-19T16:56:13Z] <riteo> why would you want 79 chars?
[2021-07-19T16:56:17Z] <acheam> idk python does it
[2021-07-19T16:56:20Z] <riteo> if you need extra space for stuff use 72
[2021-07-19T16:56:21Z] <acheam> maybe to leave room for the newline char?
[2021-07-19T16:56:32Z] <riteo> I thought 80 chars included it
[2021-07-19T16:56:34Z] <noocsharp> i use 80 chars most of the time, and 150 chars when it's convenient
[2021-07-19T16:56:43Z] <acheam> when is that ever convinient!
[2021-07-19T16:56:48Z] <acheam> go away
[2021-07-19T16:56:50Z] <acheam> leave this place!
[2021-07-19T16:57:11Z] <riteo> I think when you use variable names which are 30 chars long each
[2021-07-19T16:57:18Z] <noocsharp> like wayland
[2021-07-19T16:57:29Z] <acheam> tbf, it was near impossible in some places to make 80char lines in chorizo
[2021-07-19T16:57:39Z] <acheam> because some of the webkitgtk function names were literally 50 chars long
[2021-07-19T16:57:46Z] <acheam> add in 16 chars of indent
[2021-07-19T16:57:52Z] <acheam> and you dont have all that much room
[2021-07-19T16:58:11Z] <dilyn> http://0x0.st/-VQx.c
[2021-07-19T16:58:12Z] <dilyn> fight me
[2021-07-19T16:58:24Z] <acheam> my man just hit J a bunch of times
[2021-07-19T16:58:39Z] <riteo> the definitive code
[2021-07-19T16:59:29Z] <dilyn> we can make it one line if we try harder
[2021-07-19T17:00:33Z] <riteo> remove all whitespace that can be removed
[2021-07-19T17:01:28Z] <riteo> new idea: a c compiler that switches spaces with _
[2021-07-19T17:01:40Z] <riteo> so you can have variables with space
[2021-07-19T17:01:49Z] <riteo> s/space/spaces/
[2021-07-19T17:02:00Z] <acheam> that would break
[2021-07-19T17:02:02Z] <acheam> so
[2021-07-19T17:02:03Z] <acheam> much
[2021-07-19T17:02:04Z] <acheam> stuff
[2021-07-19T17:02:07Z] <riteo> yes
[2021-07-19T17:02:13Z] <riteo> that's part of the learning experience
[2021-07-19T17:02:24Z] <riteo> learn its quirks
[2021-07-19T17:02:25Z] <acheam> "First off, I'd suggest printing out a copy of the GNU coding standards, and NOT read it. Burn them, it's a great symbolic gesture.
[2021-07-19T17:02:26Z] <acheam> "
[2021-07-19T17:02:26Z] <riteo> embrace the power
[2021-07-19T17:02:35Z] <cem> dilyn: curl -L http://0x0.st/-VQx.c | gcc -x c - -o crap
[2021-07-19T17:02:39Z] <cem> Technically oneline
[2021-07-19T17:02:42Z] <acheam> above is from linus torvalds
[2021-07-19T17:02:54Z] <acheam> why tf do you know the gcc flags that well
[2021-07-19T17:03:10Z] <cem> I just read the manpage
[2021-07-19T17:03:17Z] <cem> I don't
[2021-07-19T17:06:54Z] <cem> Alright, here it is
[2021-07-19T17:06:55Z] <cem> https://termbin.com/yzzy
[2021-07-19T17:07:20Z] <acheam> now do it with a line width of 20
[2021-07-19T17:07:25Z] <riteo> you forgot something
[2021-07-19T17:07:30Z] <riteo> https://termbin.com/yzzy | sh
[2021-07-19T17:07:43Z] <riteo> wait
[2021-07-19T17:07:44Z] <riteo> I'm dumb
[2021-07-19T17:07:47Z] <riteo> curl https://termbin.com/yzzy | sh
[2021-07-19T17:08:38Z] <cem> Reminds me of my favourite one-line project
[2021-07-19T17:08:45Z] <testuser[m]> Ijit
[2021-07-19T17:08:46Z] <testuser[m]> Init
[2021-07-19T17:08:52Z] <cem> https://github.com/cemkeylan/sc
[2021-07-19T17:09:50Z] <cem> license and readme is generated from the code too
[2021-07-19T17:10:06Z] <noocsharp> wow, very impressive
[2021-07-19T17:10:32Z] <riteo> absolutely crazy
[2021-07-19T17:10:58Z] <riteo> lmao the end part
[2021-07-19T17:11:05Z] <riteo> "please install systemd"
[2021-07-19T17:11:27Z] <cem> truly minimalist
[2021-07-19T17:11:29Z] <noocsharp> not sure how one expects to have proper service management on linux without systemd
[2021-07-19T17:11:50Z] <cem> not possible
[2021-07-19T17:11:56Z] <noocsharp> for what systemd does, it is extremely minimal
[2021-07-19T17:12:03Z] <testuser[m]> schillingklaus:
[2021-07-19T17:13:02Z] <noocsharp> people who say that systemd is bloat just don't understand the sophistication underlying system
[2021-07-19T17:13:27Z] <riteo> systemd is the ideal software
[2021-07-19T17:13:32Z] <riteo> it is the pinnacle of computing
[2021-07-19T17:14:03Z] <riteo> anything past it is all downhill
[2021-07-19T17:14:09Z] <mrlix> https://www.theregister.com/2017/06/29/systemd_pwned_by_dns_query/
[2021-07-19T17:14:11Z] <mrlix> yikes
[2021-07-19T17:14:35Z] <riteo> did you even have to share that link
[2021-07-19T17:14:46Z] <riteo> it is the first thing everybody thinks when someone says systemd
[2021-07-19T17:14:56Z] <mrlix> lol
[2021-07-19T17:15:11Z] <cem> It does NOT reflect on the entire softwareeee
[2021-07-19T17:15:19Z] <cem> It's the only problem
[2021-07-19T17:15:20Z] <cem> trust me
[2021-07-19T17:15:20Z] <testuser[m]> Why is the discovery of a vulnerability a problem
[2021-07-19T17:15:29Z] <mrlix> I hate how dependent on systemd a lot of stuff is becoming
[2021-07-19T17:15:37Z] <testuser[m]> Fork that stuff then
[2021-07-19T17:15:44Z] <cem> eresolved
[2021-07-19T17:16:05Z] <mrlix> theres already forks for it
[2021-07-19T17:16:05Z] <testuser[m]> Or provide youe own alternatives
[2021-07-19T17:16:16Z] <riteo> testuser[m]: the problem isn't the vulnerability itself, but its nature
[2021-07-19T17:16:26Z] <riteo> how does a service manager mess up so badly with a dns server?
[2021-07-19T17:16:36Z] <riteo> this shows a greater picture
[2021-07-19T17:17:11Z] <cem> riteo: It doesn't affect the service manager part
[2021-07-19T17:17:22Z] <dilyn> calling systemd "a service manager" is a disingenuous portrayal of systemd
[2021-07-19T17:17:41Z] <riteo> cem: that's the issue lmao
[2021-07-19T17:17:45Z] <riteo> it isn't a service manager anymore
[2021-07-19T17:17:52Z] <riteo> it's an operating system framework
[2021-07-19T17:17:54Z] <riteo> lmao
[2021-07-19T17:17:59Z] <dilyn> that's like saying the dictionary provides the definition for words from albacore to apple
[2021-07-19T17:18:05Z] <dilyn> you're not wrong, but you're certainly wrong
[2021-07-19T17:18:28Z] <mrlix> arch linux uses systemd-boot by default instead of grub now
[2021-07-19T17:18:37Z] <riteo> bruh
[2021-07-19T17:18:38Z] <dilyn> as one should
[2021-07-19T17:18:38Z] <mrlix> you can change it by just pressing a number but hmm
[2021-07-19T17:18:41Z] <dilyn> grub is garbagio
[2021-07-19T17:18:46Z] <riteo> true
[2021-07-19T17:18:52Z] <mrlix> you can rice grub tho
[2021-07-19T17:18:58Z] <riteo> the real based option is efi
[2021-07-19T17:19:08Z] <mrlix> I saw someone on unix porn make it like anime girls and stuff
[2021-07-19T17:19:10Z] <riteo> the only option I might dare to say
[2021-07-19T17:19:15Z] <dilyn> mmm yes let me rice the thing i never want to see
[2021-07-19T17:19:18Z] <cem> systemd can be defined as a suite of system management tools sharing the same namespace
[2021-07-19T17:19:47Z] <riteo> didn't they all depend on one another?
[2021-07-19T17:19:56Z] <dilyn> presumably not
[2021-07-19T17:19:58Z] <cem> Not really
[2021-07-19T17:20:08Z] <dilyn> considering they tout its 'modularity', they'd be outright lying if that were true
[2021-07-19T17:20:15Z] <cem> they all depend on init
[2021-07-19T17:20:29Z] <dilyn> which is reasonable
[2021-07-19T17:20:43Z] <cem> because systemd is built upon abusing PID 1 permissions
[2021-07-19T17:20:50Z] <cem> and that's why it's an insecure crap
[2021-07-19T17:20:52Z] <mrlix> honestly
[2021-07-19T17:21:09Z] <mrlix> I see systemd branching out and making their own shit in the future
[2021-07-19T17:21:23Z] <mrlix> like making utilities like busybox
[2021-07-19T17:21:31Z] <cem> systemd-kerneld
[2021-07-19T17:21:39Z] <testuser[m]> coreutilsd
[2021-07-19T17:21:54Z] <dilyn> like s6
[2021-07-19T17:22:20Z] <cem> s6 is how systemd should have been
[2021-07-19T17:22:30Z] <mrlix> imagine a systemd display server
[2021-07-19T17:22:36Z] <cem> I can
[2021-07-19T17:22:48Z] <cem> logind
[2021-07-19T17:22:56Z] <cem> why not displayd
[2021-07-19T17:22:57Z] <mrlix> it would definitely take some hate out of x11
[2021-07-19T17:24:56Z] <noocsharp> systemd-xorgd
[2021-07-19T17:25:27Z] <dilyn> https://github.com/kisslinux/kiss/commit/4be87844765ab327b00a124cb293559dfd04b662 ohoooho fancy
[2021-07-19T17:25:46Z] <dilyn> lmfao kiss is sitting at exactly 1k loc
[2021-07-19T17:26:07Z] <riteo> the rule shall not be broken
[2021-07-19T17:26:19Z] <noocsharp> i installed the latest kiss today and it appears KISS_SU has to be set now
[2021-07-19T17:27:08Z] <dilyn> indeed
[2021-07-19T17:27:18Z] <dilyn> dylan droped the KISS_SU:- line
[2021-07-19T17:30:05Z] <riteo> it was worth it though
[2021-07-19T17:30:25Z] <msk[m]> dilyn, I force-removed libressl you said, but now I'm getting errors building qt5-webengine, which I think is related (http://0x0.st/-VQG.txt)
[2021-07-19T17:30:38Z] <msk[m]> s/you said/like you said/
[2021-07-19T17:30:54Z] <nerditup> NAS appliance suggestions?
[2021-07-19T17:31:17Z] <riteo> appliance as in machine?
[2021-07-19T17:31:20Z] <dilyn> this is a python problem msk
[2021-07-19T17:31:25Z] <dilyn> kiss-depends python ?
[2021-07-19T17:32:00Z] <msk[m]> kiss-depends python: http://0x0.st/-VQk.txt
[2021-07-19T17:32:20Z] <msk[m]> should I recompile python?
[2021-07-19T17:36:03Z] <dilyn> perhaps...
[2021-07-19T17:36:04Z] <dilyn> hmmm
[2021-07-19T17:37:00Z] <dilyn> what happens if you open up a python interpreter and try to import md5 yourself?
[2021-07-19T17:37:11Z] <dilyn> 'import hashlib'
[2021-07-19T17:38:26Z] <msk[m]> in python3, both "import hashlib" and "from hashlib import md5" worked
[2021-07-19T17:38:40Z] <dilyn> interesante
[2021-07-19T17:38:47Z] <msk[m]> in python2, neither
[2021-07-19T17:38:48Z] <msk[m]> and the log seems to mention python2 a lot
[2021-07-19T17:38:51Z] <dilyn> so _md5 should be built into python. fascinating
[2021-07-19T17:38:57Z] <dilyn> oh yes qt5-webengine does require some python2
[2021-07-19T17:39:00Z] <dilyn> kiss-depends python2 ?
[2021-07-19T17:39:14Z] <msk[m]> bzip2, sqlite, zlib
[2021-07-19T17:39:39Z] <dilyn> can you import hashlib in python2?
[2021-07-19T17:39:45Z] <dilyn> so strange
[2021-07-19T17:40:27Z] <dilyn> the sick irony is this error happened almost immediately in your build log and yet it continued to almost the end XD
[2021-07-19T17:40:44Z] <msk[m]> nope, import hashlib fails
[2021-07-19T17:40:52Z] <msk[m]> wait
[2021-07-19T17:40:57Z] <msk[m]> oh
[2021-07-19T17:41:10Z] <msk[m]> I was recompiling both python3 and python2 as we went, and now, after recompiling, python2 lets me import
[2021-07-19T17:41:54Z] <msk[m]> I'll try doing qt5-webengine again
[2021-07-19T17:41:56Z] <dilyn> nice
[2021-07-19T17:42:05Z] <msk[m]> thanks dilyn
[2021-07-19T17:42:13Z] <dilyn> i live to troubleshoot
[2021-07-19T17:51:27Z] <testuser[m]> Same
[2021-07-19T18:09:35Z] <acheam> dilyn: have you played with building llvm sans python
[2021-07-19T18:09:50Z] <dilyn> it's not easy
[2021-07-19T18:09:57Z] <acheam> but possible?
[2021-07-19T18:09:58Z] <dilyn> python is a big part of their build system
[2021-07-19T18:10:05Z] <dilyn> i mean... you'd have to do a lot of work
[2021-07-19T18:10:11Z] <acheam> nah
[2021-07-19T18:10:35Z] <dilyn> lol okay
[2021-07-19T18:10:41Z] <dilyn> let's check for the shebang, shall we...
[2021-07-19T18:12:11Z] <cem> There is more python in llvm than C
[2021-07-19T18:12:20Z] <acheam> lol
[2021-07-19T18:12:24Z] <dilyn> f
[2021-07-19T18:12:34Z] <acheam> is there any C?
[2021-07-19T18:12:39Z] <dilyn> uh, still grepping
[2021-07-19T18:12:47Z] <acheam> besides maybe some cross compatible header files?
[2021-07-19T18:12:47Z] <cem> yes, 88 files C
[2021-07-19T18:12:52Z] <acheam> nice
[2021-07-19T18:12:57Z] <cem> 227 files python
[2021-07-19T18:13:01Z] <acheam> dilyn: ug or ag is the way
[2021-07-19T18:13:01Z] <cem> 3167 c++
[2021-07-19T18:13:12Z] <cem> 2477 headers
[2021-07-19T18:13:45Z] <dilyn> what a beautiful concoction
[2021-07-19T18:13:51Z] <dilyn> still better than webkit
[2021-07-19T18:13:55Z] <cem> That's not even all
[2021-07-19T18:14:07Z] <acheam> dont even mention webkit
[2021-07-19T18:14:50Z] <cem> https://termbin.com/vnacm
[2021-07-19T18:15:11Z] <acheam> cem: whats that?
[2021-07-19T18:15:19Z] <cem> That's llvm source code cloc
[2021-07-19T18:15:31Z] <acheam> oh I pasted the wrong link
[2021-07-19T18:15:47Z] <acheam> > Swift
[2021-07-19T18:15:59Z] <noocsharp> > OCaml
[2021-07-19T18:16:19Z] <acheam> > Windows.*
[2021-07-19T18:16:24Z] <acheam> pascal too?
[2021-07-19T18:16:27Z] <acheam> wtf is this?
[2021-07-19T18:16:48Z] <noocsharp> only 17k lines of python
[2021-07-19T18:16:49Z] <noocsharp> not too bad
[2021-07-19T18:16:50Z] <acheam> how tf do they have that much yaml?
[2021-07-19T18:17:19Z] <cem> And people start throwing crap at me when I say I like gcc better
[2021-07-19T18:17:46Z] <cem> I mean they are both monstrous, but gcc is slightly less monstrous
[2021-07-19T18:17:50Z] <acheam> i dont like llvm honestly
[2021-07-19T18:18:03Z] <dilyn> this is roughly a list of the python scripts that are probably involved in building my llvm pkg http://ix.io/3trN
[2021-07-19T18:18:06Z] <acheam> like, me avoiding gnu is more just for fun
[2021-07-19T18:18:17Z] <acheam> thats a lot
[2021-07-19T18:19:15Z] <dilyn> you can maybe cut out many of */utils/* files
[2021-07-19T18:19:25Z] <cem> gcc supports like a bajillion languages, yet C is still a bigger portion of the compiler
[2021-07-19T18:19:31Z] <dilyn> 'many' would be like, less than half i think
[2021-07-19T18:19:43Z] <dilyn> cem: but have you considered: GNU
[2021-07-19T18:19:54Z] <cem> I did
[2021-07-19T18:20:07Z] <cem> I'm just not into namespace circlejerk
[2021-07-19T18:20:18Z] <dilyn> :'(
[2021-07-19T18:20:31Z] <cem> I'll switch to cproc, I promise
[2021-07-19T18:20:40Z] <cem> one day
[2021-07-19T18:20:47Z] <acheam> i only have 5 c++ packages
[2021-07-19T18:20:59Z] <acheam> which makes it even more annoying to keep around llvm for
[2021-07-19T18:22:50Z] <noocsharp> the problem with cproc is that many c programs aren't compliant with the spec
[2021-07-19T18:23:06Z] <dilyn> new goal
[2021-07-19T18:24:46Z] <cem> yeah, that's annoying
[2021-07-19T18:25:27Z] <cem> but musl had similar issues when it first came about
[2021-07-19T18:25:37Z] <cem> now webkit natively supports musl!
[2021-07-19T18:25:49Z] <noocsharp> who woulda thunk it
[2021-07-19T18:26:32Z] <noocsharp> also cproc can't build shared libraries afaik
[2021-07-19T18:26:38Z] <acheam> thats a shame
[2021-07-19T18:26:42Z] <cem> I see that as an absolute win
[2021-07-19T18:26:45Z] <noocsharp> i guess it's the linkers job actually...
[2021-07-19T18:26:48Z] <micro_O> cem acheam I would be really surprised if a good chunk of all the languages were actually in test code
[2021-07-19T18:27:21Z] <acheam> yeah but lfortran and swift and stuff aren't mainline llvm right?
[2021-07-19T18:27:34Z] <acheam> so why should they be there
[2021-07-19T18:27:43Z] <acheam> screw downstream, amirite?
[2021-07-19T18:28:29Z] <micro_O> for projects this big (llvm, firefox, gcc, etc), I think it takes a bit of time to familiarize yourself with the codebase as simple 'find/grep/cloc' doesn't really paint the whole picture, or at least misrepresents it.
[2021-07-19T18:29:03Z] <micro_O> for instance, oil-shell has i think 3 different 'lines of code' counts, because it doesn't make sense to count just whats checked into git for that project
[2021-07-19T18:29:30Z] <cem> Yeah, I mostly agree with that
[2021-07-19T18:29:36Z] <dilyn> i feel like when you're dealing with a codebase that large, you're better off doing things like profiling the code more than just doing a surface-level gaze at what makes it up
[2021-07-19T18:29:55Z] <dilyn> plus you're like... NEVER working with large chunks of that code
[2021-07-19T18:30:41Z] <cem> It's mostly divided in subprojects
[2021-07-19T18:30:52Z] <cem> Similar to the kernel
[2021-07-19T21:39:20Z] <acheam> https://marc.info/?l=openbsd-misc&m=159041121804486&w=2
[2021-07-19T21:44:17Z] <acheam> wait
[2021-07-19T21:44:24Z] <acheam> openbsd 6.7 introduced support for my wifi card
[2021-07-19T21:44:28Z] <acheam> see ya Linux!
[2021-07-19T21:45:07Z] <sad_plan> hello kiss-bsd much? :p
[2021-07-19T21:45:12Z] <acheam> maybe
[2021-07-19T21:45:23Z] <acheam> id like to learn the openbsd way first
[2021-07-19T21:46:15Z] <sad_plan> that would be an idea, yeah :p
[2021-07-19T21:46:48Z] <acheam> burning an iso right now
[2021-07-19T21:47:16Z] <sad_plan> cool. ive been wanting to try out a bsd myself, but im a bit busy messing with kiss :p
[2021-07-19T21:47:41Z] <sad_plan> did you even try sdhcp? the simple dhcp client. listed at the suckless site.
[2021-07-19T21:47:49Z] <sad_plan> oasis linux also uses it apearantly
[2021-07-19T21:48:01Z] <acheam> its been on my todo list
[2021-07-19T21:48:10Z] <acheam> noocsharp has used it, if you have any questions
[2021-07-19T21:49:50Z] <sad_plan> I am a bit curious about how its used. I mean, it doesnt run as a service, like dhcpcd does.
[2021-07-19T21:50:14Z] <sad_plan> havent delwed too deep tbh. just recently packaged it into one of my repos
[2021-07-19T21:54:03Z] <sad_plan> oh, while I remember. iirc you seem to enjoy suckless' software, correct? perhaps check out svc. its a service manager. seeing as you also talked about switching out busybox earlier aswell, youd need service manager, unless your sticking with runit's
[2021-07-19T21:54:24Z] <acheam> im sticking with busybox for now
[2021-07-19T21:54:35Z] <acheam> otherwise, next in line might be s6
[2021-07-19T21:54:39Z] <sad_plan> ah ok
[2021-07-19T21:54:51Z] <sad_plan> why exacly s6?
[2021-07-19T21:54:57Z] <acheam> no real reason
[2021-07-19T21:54:58Z] <acheam> lol
[2021-07-19T21:55:04Z] <acheam> i haven't looked into it that much
[2021-07-19T21:56:41Z] <sad_plan> artix has a small wiki page on it anyway, for some minor info anyway.
[2021-07-19T21:57:25Z] <soliwilos> s6 is nice.
[2021-07-19T22:05:04Z] <akira01> Anyone knows a good music streaming for terminal?
[2021-07-19T22:07:20Z] <acheam> mpd
[2021-07-19T22:07:28Z] <acheam> and mpv
[2021-07-19T22:11:14Z] <dilyn> can you imagine my fucking surprise when I discovered that K&R is outdated?
[2021-07-19T22:11:28Z] <dilyn> chapter 1 section 9, 'make a function named getline()'
[2021-07-19T22:11:34Z] <dilyn> added to stdio in 2010 https://c-for-dummies.com/blog/?p=1112 rip
[2021-07-19T22:11:36Z] <akira01> acheam: how can i stream with this?
[2021-07-19T22:13:28Z] <akira01> hi claudia 0/
[2021-07-19T22:19:07Z] <claudia> hola
[2021-07-19T22:19:32Z] <sad_plan> o/
[2021-07-19T22:24:37Z] <noocsharp> sad_plan: wdym it doesn't run as a service? are you saying it doesn't fork into the background?
[2021-07-19T22:25:14Z] <sad_plan> no, I meant a service like you can start/restart/stop with service manager. or Im I just plain wrong here?
[2021-07-19T22:25:17Z] <sad_plan> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
[2021-07-19T22:25:44Z] <sad_plan> I know it forks into backround or w/e. as its stated in the man page.
[2021-07-19T22:25:52Z] <noocsharp> any program can be a service, so you're just plain wrong here :P
[2021-07-19T22:26:26Z] <sad_plan> I stand corrected :p
[2021-07-19T22:26:30Z] <noocsharp> you just need to make a suitable service file for it if you're using busybox sv
[2021-07-19T22:28:05Z] <sad_plan> I am currently using busybox, yes. Im not sure how I write a service file for it, but Im sure I could eventually figure that out :p
[2021-07-19T22:29:14Z] <noocsharp> look at the other files in /etc/sv as examples
[2021-07-19T22:29:20Z] <noocsharp> that's what i do if i need to write on
[2021-07-19T22:29:24Z] <noocsharp> one
[2021-07-19T22:30:29Z] <sad_plan> nice. does it require any configuration of sorts? appart from creating a service file.
[2021-07-19T22:33:17Z] <dilyn> https://git.2f30.org/sdhcp/file/sdhcp.1.html probably not
[2021-07-19T22:33:36Z] <noocsharp> ^
[2021-07-19T22:33:43Z] <noocsharp> just a resolv.conf
[2021-07-19T22:34:20Z] <dilyn> my favorite about sdhcp is that "It ignores most of the DHCP options it understands."
[2021-07-19T22:34:58Z] <dilyn> surprised nobody has submitted sdhcp to community :o
[2021-07-19T22:35:03Z] <sad_plan> lol, yeah I noticed.
[2021-07-19T22:35:53Z] <sad_plan> people probably dont bother with it
[2021-07-19T22:36:22Z] <sad_plan> do I need the supervise dir and its file? I noticed vim cant even open some of those files. it just freezes instantly
[2021-07-19T22:36:25Z] <acheam> akira01: mpv <URL of stream>
[2021-07-19T22:36:48Z] <dilyn> supervise is created by sv
[2021-07-19T22:37:03Z] <sad_plan> ah ok, so just the run script then
[2021-07-19T22:37:06Z] <dilyn> you just need /etc/sv/foo/run; ln -sv /etc/sv/foo/run /var/service
[2021-07-19T22:37:39Z] <dilyn> run will probably just be something like sdhcp -d, or whatever sdhcp's option to not daemonize is
[2021-07-19T22:37:39Z] <sad_plan> yep
[2021-07-19T22:37:44Z] <dilyn> don't let that sucker fork :P
[2021-07-19T22:37:59Z] <sad_plan> otherwise itll just eat up all my ram? :p
[2021-07-19T22:38:24Z] <noocsharp> it won't die if you stop the service
[2021-07-19T22:38:43Z] <sad_plan> ah, itll just keep going. that would be unfortunate
[2021-07-19T22:38:44Z] <dilyn> sv would try to constantly restart it
[2021-07-19T22:38:53Z] <sad_plan> I see
[2021-07-19T22:50:42Z] <sad_plan> it worked :D
[2021-07-19T22:53:44Z] <dilyn> how big id sdhcp?
[2021-07-19T22:55:43Z] <sad_plan> 22.3k I belive
[2021-07-19T22:58:20Z] <dilyn> itsy bitsy
[2021-07-19T22:58:27Z] <sad_plan> yeah
[2021-07-19T22:58:50Z] <sad_plan> vs dhcpcd's 580kb
[2021-07-19T22:59:05Z] <noocsharp> is it static or dynamically linked?
[2021-07-19T22:59:41Z] <sad_plan> I didnt specify that in my buildfile, so im guessing dyamically, if thats default
[2021-07-19T23:00:05Z] <dilyn> probably static
[2021-07-19T23:00:10Z] <dilyn> ldd /usr/bin/sdhcp?
[2021-07-19T23:00:48Z] <noocsharp> i would imagine it's at least linked to libc
[2021-07-19T23:02:17Z] <sad_plan> yep. libc.so
[2021-07-19T23:02:21Z] <dilyn> ah, they don't have -static :o smh
[2021-07-19T23:02:27Z] <dilyn> suckless devs water u doin
[2021-07-19T23:03:07Z] <mrlix> guys
[2021-07-19T23:03:13Z] <cem> Are you even suckless if you don't force -static flag on the Makefile
[2021-07-19T23:03:21Z] <cem> like LDFLAGS += -static
[2021-07-19T23:03:27Z] <sad_plan> lol
[2021-07-19T23:03:28Z] <mrlix> kqueue is a million times better than epoll
[2021-07-19T23:03:43Z] <dilyn> something something not portable?
[2021-07-19T23:03:51Z] <mrlix> so much cleaner so much simpler so beautiful
[2021-07-19T23:05:01Z] <cem> dilyn: have you heard of #ifdef tho
[2021-07-19T23:05:18Z] <dilyn> you give CPP too much power
[2021-07-19T23:05:46Z] <cem> just delete all #include's too I guess?
[2021-07-19T23:05:56Z] <dilyn> indeed
[2021-07-19T23:06:02Z] <dilyn> write your own functions you lazy bums
[2021-07-19T23:06:49Z] <cem> macros were a mistake
[2021-07-19T23:06:53Z] <cem> revert
[2021-07-19T23:10:55Z] <sad_plan> ls
[2021-07-19T23:11:02Z] <sad_plan> ffs, wrong terminal
[2021-07-19T23:16:35Z] <sad_plan> the executable gets way bigger if you use -static. its 22.3k vs 70.9k
[2021-07-19T23:16:59Z] <dilyn> that's how static works
[2021-07-19T23:17:05Z] <sad_plan> yeh
[2021-07-19T23:17:42Z] <dilyn> can't always be strictly better :'(
[2021-07-19T23:18:00Z] <sad_plan> I knoow :c