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💾 Archived View for gemini.ctrl-c.club › ~phoebos › logs › kisslinux-2022-05-09.txt captured on 2022-07-17 at 03:01:37.
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[2022-05-09T00:01:19Z] <illiliti> not everyone use busybox su
[2022-05-09T00:06:38Z] <phoebos> i still think the best solution is to include with kiss a bit of C to print the username of the owner of a file, so the ls parsing isn't required
[2022-05-09T00:09:05Z] <illiliti> i remember dylan was against adding C code to kiss, even as a helper
[2022-05-09T00:16:12Z] <illiliti> acheam_: ssu has minimum deps
[2022-05-09T00:16:27Z] <acheam_> I know, its just the spirit of the thing
[2022-05-09T00:16:27Z] <illiliti> i understand your point though
[2022-05-09T00:16:33Z] <pomekon> guys, does anyone know a way to pipe irc chat to other programs? Is there some kind of a file where its logged or something? What client should i check?
[2022-05-09T00:17:02Z] <acheam_> look into ii and jj
[2022-05-09T00:17:13Z] <acheam_> someone here made an improved version IIRC
[2022-05-09T00:17:42Z] <pomekon> ii and jj are clients? 
[2022-05-09T00:17:56Z] <acheam_> yes, which write/read irc to/from a file
[2022-05-09T00:18:07Z] <acheam_> phoebos: I "improved" kisscommunity.org
[2022-05-09T00:18:10Z] <pomekon> great! exsactly what im looking for
[2022-05-09T00:18:17Z] <pomekon> thanks dude!
[2022-05-09T00:18:20Z] <acheam_> np
[2022-05-09T00:21:41Z] <pomekon> one more question haha
[2022-05-09T00:22:07Z] <pomekon> did anyone ever did a disk encryption with a passphrase on usb keydisk? 
[2022-05-09T00:22:43Z] <pomekon> i know its common thing to do on openbsd, but idk if its even possible on linux
[2022-05-09T00:23:26Z] <illiliti> i do
[2022-05-09T00:23:35Z] <illiliti> with zfs encryption though
[2022-05-09T00:23:42Z] <illiliti> but i have done luks before
[2022-05-09T00:23:53Z] <pomekon> ohh dude awesome! 
[2022-05-09T00:24:28Z] <pomekon> ill be securing my offline computer so im looking for a best way to do it... Keydisk seems like a way to go
[2022-05-09T00:24:54Z] <phoebos> illiliti: https://github.com/kisslinux/website/blob/79b5586e2bc5afc95ae06e2a4a0035155e0b54b6/site/blog/20210711a.txt#L261 re dilyn on C
[2022-05-09T00:25:09Z] <phoebos> oops, s/dilyn/dylan/
[2022-05-09T00:25:29Z] <phoebos> haven't done that slip for a while
[2022-05-09T00:26:14Z] <phoebos> acheam_: thank god, that looks beautiful
[2022-05-09T00:26:32Z] * phoebos breathes peacefully
[2022-05-09T00:26:33Z] <acheam_> thank you thank you. I put my best css in it
[2022-05-09T00:27:20Z] <acheam_> actually its not even neede
[2022-05-09T00:27:40Z] <acheam_> the only rule is 1000px max width but the page is under 1000px
[2022-05-09T00:27:51Z] <acheam_> there are bytes to be spared!
[2022-05-09T00:29:23Z] <maximum_yellow> acheam_ any chance of a community-maintained copy of kisslinux.org? Would be nice to have, eg, valid links in Github PR for package style and so on
[2022-05-09T00:30:00Z] <acheam_> wdym by valid links? are they broken anywhere?
[2022-05-09T00:30:22Z] <pomekon> maximum_yellow: i like the idea
[2022-05-09T00:30:51Z] <maximum_yellow> acheam_ https://kisslinux.org/wiki/kiss/style-guide
[2022-05-09T00:30:59Z] <phoebos> oh do they mean the gh pr template
[2022-05-09T00:31:06Z] <maximum_yellow> is linked in README.md of community and the PR templates
[2022-05-09T00:31:07Z] <phoebos> it probably wasn't ever changed
[2022-05-09T00:32:05Z] <maximum_yellow> i think the point i'm after is slightly more general, kiss-community now houses the core repos and stuff. If someone lands on kisscommunity.org and goes to kisslinux.org they'll find only dylan's versions which are unmaintained
[2022-05-09T00:33:17Z] <phoebos> hmm, imo we're just keeping them updated, this is still Dylan's KISS
[2022-05-09T00:33:25Z] <acheam_> feel free to open a PR or make a plan or whatever... outreach/accesibilty has never been a key focus of this group for better or for worse
[2022-05-09T00:33:47Z] <acheam_> grep the freenode logs if you wanna see the hours of discussion we had on this the first time dylan stepped away
[2022-05-09T00:39:18Z] <acheam_> totally random fun fact: we were the 8th most active chanel logged by logbot (180 total)
[2022-05-09T00:40:38Z] <acheam_> another fun fact: its almost been a year since we moved to libera.chat
[2022-05-09T00:41:38Z] <acheam_>  since then, whitequark has logged 72375 messages
[2022-05-09T00:41:53Z] <acheam_> an average of ~200 per day
[2022-05-09T00:56:02Z] <phoebos> eek we've lost our pizazz
[2022-05-09T00:59:42Z] <acheam_> indeed
[2022-05-09T00:59:49Z] <acheam_> those were fun times
[2022-05-09T01:00:23Z] <acheam_> I spent most of my 2020s lockdown messing with KISS/linux/programming and chatting with y'all
[2022-05-09T01:00:37Z] <acheam_> also a lot of minecraft
[2022-05-09T01:00:48Z] <acheam_> but thats just because it was harder to mess with kiss while on a zoom call
[2022-05-09T01:00:59Z] <maximum_yellow> well say hello to front page of hackernews
[2022-05-09T01:01:17Z] <maximum_yellow> which links to, of all things, an internet archive version of kisslinux.org
[2022-05-09T01:01:21Z] <acheam_> ugh
[2022-05-09T01:01:46Z] <maximum_yellow> (to be clear, this wasn't me, i'm reporting the fact)
[2022-05-09T01:05:34Z] <maximum_yellow> anyway, returning to an earlier topic: i think we could really benefit from having a community-editable wiki
[2022-05-09T01:05:40Z] <acheam_> we used to have one
[2022-05-09T01:05:56Z] <acheam_> and we still do
[2022-05-09T01:05:58Z] <acheam_> https://kisslinux.org/wiki/
[2022-05-09T01:06:07Z] <acheam_> its just a bit different now
[2022-05-09T01:06:21Z] <acheam_> I always thought even the old plaintext in git system was ugly but it worked
[2022-05-09T01:06:32Z] <maximum_yellow> acheam_ community-editable in theory, right? not in practice, because dylan has repo rights only?
[2022-05-09T01:06:35Z] <acheam_> all the articles are still in git, would be easy to bring it back if there is interest
[2022-05-09T01:06:41Z] <acheam_> i mean, you can make a PR
[2022-05-09T01:06:47Z] <maximum_yellow> ah sure
[2022-05-09T01:06:53Z] <acheam_> https://github.com/dylanaraps/wiki
[2022-05-09T01:07:09Z] <maximum_yellow> but this is the editable in the weak sense essentially
[2022-05-09T01:07:20Z] <acheam_> the weak sense?
[2022-05-09T01:08:33Z] <maximum_yellow> sorry, i guess it's a something like a mathematics term. We've identified one aspect of editable which we then take to be representative of the whole process and a test for whether something is editable. In this case, and hence the weak sense, the website passes the test: is it possible for people to propose changes
[2022-05-09T01:08:59Z] <maximum_yellow> it does not pass the test: is it possible for people to implement changes
[2022-05-09T01:09:06Z] <acheam_> okay sure
[2022-05-09T01:09:14Z] <acheam_> but thats how kiss in general works
[2022-05-09T01:09:19Z] <acheam_> its BDFL driven
[2022-05-09T01:09:36Z] <maximum_yellow> except BDFL is absent
[2022-05-09T01:09:41Z] <acheam_> sure
[2022-05-09T01:09:50Z] <acheam_> and kiss-community is more democratic
[2022-05-09T01:10:04Z] <maximum_yellow> and i'd be happy merging junk back if/when said person returns, but i'm advocating that we have something in the interim
[2022-05-09T01:10:11Z] <acheam_> so start up a more freely editable wiki if you'd like, and import the old/existing articles
[2022-05-09T01:10:16Z] <maximum_yellow> great
[2022-05-09T01:10:21Z] <maximum_yellow> i take that to be permission :)
[2022-05-09T01:10:49Z] <acheam_> i mean, theres not really an org hierarchy here or anything
[2022-05-09T01:10:53Z] <acheam_> if you want to do something just do it
[2022-05-09T01:10:59Z] <maximum_yellow> when you say ``all the articles are in git history'' which repo is this?
[2022-05-09T01:11:08Z] <acheam_> https://github.com/dylanaraps/wiki
[2022-05-09T01:11:12Z] <acheam_> and the current website
[2022-05-09T01:11:13Z] <maximum_yellow> acheam_ ah but my goal is to have kisscommunity.org point to this
[2022-05-09T01:11:30Z] <maximum_yellow> and that involves you afaiu
[2022-05-09T01:12:34Z] <maximum_yellow> and possibly dilyn to have this be part of kiss-community on Github
[2022-05-09T01:13:19Z] <maximum_yellow> anyway, i'll start recovering this stuff in my spare time and ping again when i think it's ready
[2022-05-09T01:15:46Z] <acheam_> okay sure. Sorry if I'm not being helpful here, its just that theres not much that I can approve or disaprove of here. Everyone in the GH org has equal rights in control (and its not like theres anything special about us, I just happened to hit the "create organization" button, and we invited a few active members to be a part of it. Historically, if something has been generally popular, or at least "not massively dissaproved of" then its been added to 
[2022-05-09T01:15:48Z] <acheam_> the org. The only infrastructure beyond the org is the kisscommunity.org domain which micr0 controls, and he hasn't really been around here in a few months (although I'm sure he'd be open to an email)
[2022-05-09T01:16:02Z] <acheam_> sorry thats super rambly I hope it makes a tiny bit of sense
[2022-05-09T01:16:49Z] <maximum_yellow> acheam_ yeah, that's good to know. On the contrary i think you are being helpful :)
[2022-05-09T01:21:56Z] <illiliti> i second community-maintained wiki idea
[2022-05-09T01:22:02Z] <acheam_> maximum_yellow: :)
[2022-05-09T01:22:13Z] <illiliti> i don't have enough time to participate in it though
[2022-05-09T01:23:46Z] <acheam_> honestly, its not kiss, but someone quickly spinning up a mediawiki instance might just be the easiest
[2022-05-09T01:24:06Z] <acheam_> (i suggested this earlier and it got shut down, idk if people's opinions have since changed)
[2022-05-09T01:30:56Z] <illiliti> how about setting up git repo where everyone have commit rights? this is exactly how latest tinycc fork works btw
[2022-05-09T01:31:10Z] <illiliti> not sure if it's possible on github
[2022-05-09T01:35:17Z] <acheam_> what fork are you referring to?
[2022-05-09T01:35:23Z] <acheam_> I don't think thats possible on github
[2022-05-09T01:35:54Z] <illiliti> the mob branch
[2022-05-09T01:35:56Z] <illiliti> https://repo.or.cz/tinycc.git/
[2022-05-09T01:37:11Z] <acheam_> why am I not surprised that its on https://repo.or.cz/ lmao
[2022-05-09T01:38:18Z] <acheam_> interesting
[2022-05-09T01:38:56Z] <acheam_> I don't really see the issue in updates being in PRs/Patches
[2022-05-09T01:51:06Z] <illiliti> unrestricted write access is better in this case imho
[2022-05-09T01:51:50Z] <illiliti> in order to workaround github dumbness, i think simply giving commit rights on demand is an elegant solution
[2022-05-09T01:52:01Z] <illiliti> this way we can verify(well, almost) that account isn't some kind of bot
[2022-05-09T01:54:25Z] <illiliti> one would need github account(to request commit rights) which defeats the point of mob branch though...
[2022-05-09T02:11:49Z] <testuser[m]> Hi
[2022-05-09T02:14:12Z] <illiliti> hi
[2022-05-09T03:00:16Z] <maximum_yellow> is there a busybox implementation of pr?
[2022-05-09T03:00:52Z] <maximum_yellow> i can't seem to find the option in the config file, and it's nigh impossible to search for this
[2022-05-09T03:10:18Z] <maximum_yellow> hmm, openbsd's version is 2k LOC in C. Maybe i won't use this for blog generation
[2022-05-09T03:10:23Z] <maximum_yellow> but it's so pretty...
[2022-05-09T07:47:53Z] <testuser[m]> https://github.com/llvm/llvm-project/blob/main/libc/src/__support/common.h#L24
[2022-05-09T07:47:54Z] <testuser[m]> So bad
[2022-05-09T09:00:01Z] <phoebos> maximum_yellow: use roff
[2022-05-09T09:19:26Z] <phoebos> pr(1p) is awful, it's so complicated
[2022-05-09T09:19:45Z] <phoebos> can't use getopt(3p) for option parsing
[2022-05-09T09:47:45Z] <horroar> Who's using kisslinux as a daily driver desktop?
[2022-05-09T10:08:45Z] <mmatongo> Hey, anyone using docker?
[2022-05-09T10:09:13Z] <testuser[m]> horroar: everyone here
[2022-05-09T10:16:51Z] <mmatongo> I can't seem to build this https://github.com/cemkeylan/cpt-docker
[2022-05-09T10:17:06Z] <mmatongo> Am I missing something?
[2022-05-09T10:20:43Z] <testuser[m]> mmatongo: https://github.com/git-bruh/kiss-repo/tree/master/repo
[2022-05-09T10:20:47Z] <testuser[m]> try the one here
[2022-05-09T10:20:50Z] <testuser[m]> its still outdated though
[2022-05-09T10:20:55Z] <testuser[m]> but newer than the cpt one
[2022-05-09T10:23:26Z] <mmatongo> It's building, thank you.
[2022-05-09T10:48:33Z] <pomekon> there are no checksums for community made "main" repo, right?
[2022-05-09T10:51:46Z] <testuser[m]> wat
[2022-05-09T10:51:53Z] <testuser[m]> u mean the tarball?
[2022-05-09T10:51:56Z] <testuser[m]> there's no community tarball
[2022-05-09T10:52:14Z] <pomekon> i want to compile vim, but it says "-> Vim Verifying sources" cant open /home/user/repo/extra/vim/checksums: no such file
[2022-05-09T10:52:58Z] <pomekon> no no. i mean repo with "core, extra and wayland|"
[2022-05-09T10:53:42Z] <phoebos> you might have an old version of kiss? vim uses a git source
[2022-05-09T10:56:30Z] <pomekon> im in the proces of building the system. I cloned the "community" core,extra,wayland repo today. Kiss tarball is from kisslinux.org
[2022-05-09T10:59:39Z] <testuser[m]> kiss b kiss
[2022-05-09T11:00:14Z] <pomekon> i compiled gnupg1 fine, than I did gpg --keyserver stuff, cd /home/user/repos/repo and git config merge.verifySignatures true. 
[2022-05-09T11:00:33Z] <pomekon> ty
[2022-05-09T11:00:49Z] <testuser[m]> gnupg is useless
[2022-05-09T11:00:56Z] <testuser[m]> community commits are not signed by dylan
[2022-05-09T11:01:09Z] <pomekon> thanks dude. i wanted to ask this
[2022-05-09T11:01:51Z] <pomekon> im still in the learning proces, sorry. 
[2022-05-09T11:06:37Z] <phoebos> although testuser[m] and ioraff sign their commits
[2022-05-09T11:07:36Z] <pomekon> now it seems wvwrything works fine. its building :) Ill be asking more stupid questions.. Sorry haha
[2022-05-09T11:08:05Z] <pomekon> kiss b kiss fixed it
[2022-05-09T11:09:21Z] <pomekon> so thats a package manager rewrite right?
[2022-05-09T11:09:45Z] <pomekon> new kiss
[2022-05-09T11:17:48Z] <testuser[m]> update
[2022-05-09T11:17:50Z] <testuser[m]> yea
[2022-05-09T11:20:24Z] <pomekon> so i just had to do "kiss update" actually
[2022-05-09T11:20:29Z] <pomekon> im doing it now....
[2022-05-09T11:37:51Z] <pomekon> am i able to build everything with O3?
[2022-05-09T11:38:34Z] <testuser[m]> yhe
[2022-05-09T11:39:12Z] <pomekon> great! 
[2022-05-09T12:58:37Z] <pomekon> is there any good guyde u guys reccomend for minimal kernel without unnecesarry bloat?
[2022-05-09T13:00:03Z] <pomekon> where should i learn about this kernel config stuff and what i actually need of not? 
[2022-05-09T13:04:09Z] <testuser[m]> gentoo wiki
[2022-05-09T13:09:17Z] <pomekon> oh yeah. Thanks dude
[2022-05-09T16:20:42Z] <phoebos> illiliti: test if this works https://tmp.bvnf.space/0001-su-support-numeric-UIDs-with-a-n-flag.patch
[2022-05-09T16:20:45Z] <phoebos> for busybox
[2022-05-09T16:20:56Z] <phoebos> if yes i'll send it to the mailing list
[2022-05-09T16:35:24Z] <testuser[m]> https://drewdevault.com/2022/05/09/hare-ssh.html
[2022-05-09T17:26:48Z] <omanom> kiss in hare when?
[2022-05-09T17:27:25Z] <testuser[m]> > On the 4000th day G*d added generics to Go and he saw that it was good. Inshallah Mr DeVault will add type safe collections to his language 5, 10 years from now when he is done fixing the segfaults.
[2022-05-09T17:27:28Z] <testuser[m]> When this happens
[2022-05-09T18:46:01Z] <pomekon> hmm it does not want to compile my kernel... it spits out some __always_inline errors and simmilar
[2022-05-09T18:46:10Z] <pomekon> weird 
[2022-05-09T18:51:38Z] <pomekon> maybe the libelf fix? 
[2022-05-09T18:52:02Z] <omanom> you should post your kernel build log so we can see more specifically what the output is
[2022-05-09T18:54:07Z] <pomekon> is there some command line util to copy the output?
[2022-05-09T18:54:20Z] <omanom> you can use http://ix.io/ or anything like it
[2022-05-09T18:54:53Z] <testuser[m]> pomekon: check install page
[2022-05-09T18:56:22Z] <pomekon> [200~Ensure that CONFIG_IKHEADERS is set to =n as it being enabled will result in build failures due to busybox incompatibility
[2022-05-09T18:56:25Z] <pomekon> probably that
[2022-05-09T18:56:43Z] <pomekon> ill check it out :)
[2022-05-09T21:03:22Z] <pomekon> does anyone have an idea where is the problem? its a try to compile a custom kernel... http://ix.io/3Xp8
[2022-05-09T21:17:27Z] <acheam> https://kisslinux.org/install#024
[2022-05-09T21:17:42Z] <acheam> pomekon: make sure you run the sed command
[2022-05-09T21:17:59Z] <pomekon> i did not..
[2022-05-09T21:18:19Z] <acheam> I reccomend grepping the channel logs, there is a lot of good info there
[2022-05-09T21:23:25Z] <pomekon> the sed command says there is no such a file or dir such as tools/objtool/arch/x86/decode.c for some reason
[2022-05-09T21:24:43Z] <acheam> you're running it in the extracted kernel sources?
[2022-05-09T21:24:55Z] <pomekon> yes
[2022-05-09T21:25:15Z] <pomekon> there is tools/objtool/arch/x86/
[2022-05-09T21:25:21Z] <pomekon> lib and include
[2022-05-09T21:25:30Z] <pomekon> but no decode.c
[2022-05-09T21:26:21Z] <acheam> uhhh I think it should be there, but its been a while since i've compiled a kernel
[2022-05-09T21:26:23Z] <pomekon> its 5.17.6
[2022-05-09T21:26:25Z] <acheam> its in the git tree
[2022-05-09T21:26:52Z] <pomekon> hmmm
[2022-05-09T21:27:13Z] <pomekon> the new kernel probably doesnt have that
[2022-05-09T21:27:50Z] <acheam> I just downloaded 5.17.6 from kernel.org and it has it
[2022-05-09T21:28:02Z] <acheam> checksum your tarball
[2022-05-09T21:28:07Z] <acheam> or just redownload
[2022-05-09T21:28:12Z] <pomekon> hmm wow... thats super weird 
[2022-05-09T21:28:19Z] <acheam> and double check that you are in the right directory
[2022-05-09T21:28:20Z] <pomekon> because i downloaded it today too
[2022-05-09T21:28:40Z] <acheam> you should be able to "cat COPYING" and have it display the license info
[2022-05-09T21:29:04Z] <pomekon> yeah i extracted the tarball and cded in. 
[2022-05-09T21:29:31Z] <pomekon> the dir is called linux-5.17.6
[2022-05-09T21:29:39Z] <acheam> yeah thats right
[2022-05-09T21:29:43Z] <acheam> but you should have decode.h
[2022-05-09T21:30:41Z] <pomekon> ill pull another one and see. im super confused now
[2022-05-09T21:30:43Z] <pomekon> hahah
[2022-05-09T21:31:19Z] <acheam> its also possible that im just pulling a big stupid
[2022-05-09T21:35:31Z] <pomekon> ok i have it. im just dumb because i wanted to check it with tab while using cd command
[2022-05-09T21:35:59Z] <acheam> lmao
[2022-05-09T21:36:11Z] <acheam> okay so just make sure that you run the sed command in the right dir then
[2022-05-09T21:37:53Z] <pomekon> so, i have to sed it in linux-*? or something else? Im unfortunantly not familiar with this shell operations. Will learn... omanom sent me some shell stuff where to learn from
[2022-05-09T21:38:31Z] <acheam> yes
[2022-05-09T21:38:45Z] <acheam> you need to cd into the directory that you untarred, then run the sed command
[2022-05-09T21:39:00Z] <acheam> in the same directory that you ran "make menuconfig"
[2022-05-09T21:39:12Z] <pomekon> weird. i did that at the beginning
[2022-05-09T21:39:17Z] <pomekon> same error
[2022-05-09T21:39:20Z] <pomekon> same sotry
[2022-05-09T21:39:24Z] <pomekon> story
[2022-05-09T21:39:50Z] <pomekon> ok
[2022-05-09T21:40:06Z] <pomekon> i think i figured it our
[2022-05-09T21:40:20Z] <pomekon> i had a space between \ and tools
[2022-05-09T21:40:49Z] <acheam> ah
[2022-05-09T21:40:54Z] <acheam> oop
[2022-05-09T21:41:19Z] <acheam> o/
[2022-05-09T21:41:30Z] <pomekon> disconnected... Ok lets see
[2022-05-09T21:44:17Z] <pomekon> such a stupid mistakeee... yay yay
[2022-05-09T21:44:19Z] <pomekon> ahhahahaha
[2022-05-09T21:44:26Z] <pomekon> everything is fine now :D
[2022-05-09T21:44:34Z] <pomekon> its compiling 
[2022-05-09T21:44:44Z] <acheam> yay
[2022-05-09T21:45:41Z] <pomekon> the problem was i had \ tools and not \tools/bla/bla/decode.c
[2022-05-09T21:45:48Z] <pomekon> ah... Thanks guys
[2022-05-09T21:46:40Z] <pomekon> and when it compiles ill have some questions about tinyramfs i think... Probably
[2022-05-09T21:46:59Z] <acheam> illiliti is your guy for that
[2022-05-09T21:47:10Z] <pomekon> :D I know
[2022-05-09T21:47:58Z] <pomekon> I saw his ssu. ill be using that :D
[2022-05-09T21:48:12Z] <acheam> that's top notch software right there
[2022-05-09T22:23:25Z] <pomekon> already compiled! wow i thought it takes longer to compile a kernel..
[2022-05-09T22:23:49Z] <pomekon> eh... Going to sleep now! night guys! 
[2022-05-09T22:27:31Z] <cot> Wait till you have to compile webkit :p
[2022-05-09T22:28:56Z] <acheam> oh hey cot
[2022-05-09T22:29:32Z] <acheam> congrats on the roguelike release
[2022-05-09T22:30:24Z] <cot> oh, ty ty :)
[2022-05-09T23:43:49Z] <phoebos> hei cot!