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Conspiracy Nation -- Vol. 8 Num. 75
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("Quid coniuratio est?")
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GENE TATUM & TWO OTHERS -- JUNE 7, 1996
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My transcription of a conversation between Gene Tatum and two
others, identified here as "Andrew Dunn" and "Bob Irvin" (not
their real names.) This is an abbreviated transcription.
+ + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + +
[...continued...]
BOB IRVIN:
What do you say really went on with the whole money deal in
Arkansas, with the cast of characters of the Lasaters, Jackson
Stephens... Did you ever have any contact with him?
GENE TATUM:
I've heard conversations at meetings. I know that one avenue
they were approaching on the money side was having to do with the
mortgage industry: selling mortgages to Fannie Mae. They would
utilize the monies, clean the monies up, utilize it as mortgage
monies and sell them to the government.
One of the banks they were talking about was a bank out of
Tennessee, but it was Japanese-owned.
ANDREW DUNN:
In '92 (going back to our friend from Texas): Did it matter to
Bush or Clinton which one won? Later in that campaign, Bush was
almost like a quarterback throwing the game. It didn't seem to
me that he wanted to win.
GENE TATUM:
If Bush maintained an office [of President], the timetable [for
New World Order, a.k.a. "Global Union"] would have been set
back, simply because of the media coverage of the President.
BOB IRVIN:
He's a lot more free to get things done.
ANDREW DUNN:
Though actually Clinton was the brand [brand name]; Clinton
guaranteed that everything went forward on schedule.
GENE TATUM:
Clinton was a "yes man" for years.
BOB IRVIN:
I heard that he was enrolled in "the Company" [CIA] early on,
when he was at Oxford.
GENE TATUM:
That's what I heard, and I heard it from the horse's mouth.
"Skull and Bones" [Bush] inducted him early there. {2}.
ANDREW DUNN:
Let me ask you: who is... Are they household names, in terms of
the [hidden] hierarchy of this whole operation?
GENE TATUM:
I wouldn't say "household." I would say, in the financial
community certainly they're household names. And in the
international community. Yes, in some countries they would be
household names. They would be the "Folgers of America." [CN:
not meant literally; a definite Folgers connection is not
necessarily indicated.]
ANDREW DUNN:
Right. Did you ever hear Lippo Group, out of Indonesia? Did
that name ever come up?
BOB IRVIN:
Related to [Jackson] Stephens.
ANDREW DUNN:
Stephens would obviously be a character. What other? Goldman
Sachs.
GENE TATUM:
Lippo Group?
ANDREW DUNN:
Yeah.
GENE TATUM:
I've never heard of it.
BOB IRVIN:
They paid Webb Hubbell $500,000 to keep his mouth shut.
ANDREW DUNN:
Yeah. He took a dive for them on this whole Whitewater affair.
Keeping a low profile. And he still only got 21 months. {3}.
GENE TATUM:
And you've got to understand that this Iran-Contra leg was only
one arm of what was going on worldwide.
BOB IRVIN:
The Iraq-Contra was even bigger, I understand.
GENE TATUM:
And the Pacific Rim had quite a bit going too.
BOB IRVIN:
Carlos Cardoen? Did you ever run across him?
GENE TATUM:
No.
BOB IRVIN:
He was from Chile. But he came up and had meetings in the
States, private little meetings. I think one was with [then-CIA
Director] Gates in southern Florida.
ANDREW DUNN:
Chilean arms dealer. [Cardoen]
BOB IRVIN:
He sold the cluster bombs to Saddam [Hussein]. Which we gave him
the technology for.
ANDREW DUNN:
That was the "Third World shuffle" you were talking about: you
know, get stuff down to a friendly country where we don't have
export restrictions. {4}.
BOB IRVIN:
Related to the Cayman Islands and Barry Seal: Coral Reinsurance,
Fuji Bank....
GENE TATUM:
World Fidelity Bank, down in Grenada.
BOB IRVIN:
You never, I suppose, ran into Vince Foster?
GENE TATUM:
No.
BOB IRVIN:
Supposedly he was working very closely with Jackson Stephens.
GENE TATUM:
I only know Stephens because of what I heard in the meetings.
BOB IRVIN:
Who out there are there who could come forward to support your
claims?
GENE TATUM:
There are many who could.
BOB IRVIN:
But won't.
GENE TATUM:
That's a good analogy. Or can't.
BOB IRVIN:
Maybe this Internet stuff might be able to produce some kind of
reunions. Somebody to come out of the woodwork, whether it be
anonymously or under some veil of protection, to provide some
support, substantiation. That's always a problem.
ANDREW DUNN:
The, to use a loose term, New World Order [a.k.a. Global
Union]... It's no surprise that 21 companies here that are
multi-billion dollar conglomerates control probably 80 percent of
the media in terms of newspapers, periodicals, cable and network
television.
GENE TATUM:
The media is under their control. For years. You have editors
-- senior editors -- who are former members of the CIA.
ANDREW DUNN:
Let me go back for a moment to our friend in Texas there. After
you walked [away from Pegasus], for whatever reason they chose
not to follow through on that [i.e., black ops against Perot].
And I assume, using the Ortega model, they probably gave him
[Perot] some warning -- which is when he came out with the excuse
about dirty tricks and his daughter. Right?
GENE TATUM:
I don't know. I know that after I walked, the warning was: this
covers me and him, this tape. {5}.
ANDREW DUNN:
But he did resign from that race.
GENE TATUM:
I don't know what he wanted to do. Look who he chose for a
[running mate].
ANDREW DUNN:
Right. Exactly. [laughs]
Pegasus, as a unit: would you say that the personnel in your
unit was what? Twelve, twenty guys? Were there other arms of
Pegasus? As an organization, has it got 500 people in it? 50
people?
GENE TATUM:
I would say about 80...
BOB IRVIN:
You were in a cell which...
GENE TATUM:
...in our cell.
BOB IRVIN:
Did anyone in that cell have contacts with other cells?
GENE TATUM:
No. We never crossed cells. Meetings were held in separate areas.
BOB IRVIN:
How was [Congressman] Henry Hyde involved in all of this?
GENE TATUM:
Henry Hyde provided the lines of credit at the banks for us to
utilize.
BOB IRVIN:
And which banks were those?
GENE TATUM:
[Laughs] Depended on where you were!
ANDREW DUNN:
He [Hyde] *is* the official paymaster of the CIA "black budget."
{6}.
GENE TATUM:
If we had something come up that was too short notice for us to
collect the monies, we normally kept $25,000 *only* for Customs,
going into foreign countries. It's amazing how easy it is to get
in and out of countries.
---------------------------<< Notes >>---------------------------
{2} "Skull and Bones" is a nickname for former-President George
Bush. Bush was inducted into a secret Yale society, "Skull and
Bones," when a student at Yale. Note also that Bill Clinton is a
Yale alumni.
{3} Regarding Webb Hubbell, presumably he is ensconced in one of
the nicer "Club Fed" facilities.
{4} The "Third World shuffle": For example, arms dealers want to
export arms to Iraq but export restrictions won't allow this.
But export restrictions allow export of arms to Chile. From
there, the arms could be sent on to Iraq.
{5} "I don't know. I know that after I walked, the warning was:
this covers me and him, this tape." Tatum says he has several
copies of a videotape which, if made public, would scandalize
powerful persons amongst the ruling clique. He warned his
Pegasus superiors that if anything happened to him or his family,
that videotape would surface. The "him" referred to above
apparently means that this protection is also extended to Ross
Perot.
{6} CIA's "black budget" refers to money available to that agency
for which public accounting records are not available; a.k.a.
"hidden budget."
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