💾 Archived View for gemini.ctrl-c.club › ~phoebos › logs › freenode-kisslinux-2019-10-28.txt captured on 2021-12-17 at 13:26:06.

View Raw

More Information

-=-=-=-=-=-=-

2019-10-28T02:22:33 #kisslinux <flippy> spectrum more like GAY
2019-10-28T02:22:54 #kisslinux <flippy> jmarin217: so are you an IRC user now?
2019-10-28T02:23:35 #kisslinux <flippy> we could write a client with a massive font for Hadet and get away from discord
2019-10-28T02:48:34 #kisslinux <jmarin217> I mean I know how to use irc but I don't prefer it by any means
2019-10-28T02:48:52 #kisslinux <jmarin217> Well, I should say I know how to use weechat
2019-10-28T15:01:13 #kisslinux <p410n3> Aight shit finally works
2019-10-28T15:22:12 #kisslinux <p410n3> fuck mobile clients. i will come back when i have my bouncer set up
2019-10-28T16:32:22 #kisslinux <belfry> Howdy
2019-10-28T16:35:40 #kisslinux <belfry> So I started using KISS lately and I really like it
2019-10-28T16:35:49 #kisslinux <belfry> Few questions though, if I may
2019-10-28T16:36:49 #kisslinux <belfry> How do I enable searching through the FF address bar? for some reason it seems disabled, it tries to interpet everything as url
2019-10-28T16:37:00 #kisslinux <belfry> Anyone managed to get conky working?
2019-10-28T16:37:17 #kisslinux <belfry> How do I get bluetooth working?
2019-10-28T16:37:46 #kisslinux <belfry> Thanks for any pointers ^ ^
2019-10-28T18:23:52 #kisslinux <stee> Hey all, n00b question: The KISS site mentions "POSIX sh". Is that Bourne shell or Bash? Or Bash, but just a subset of its features?
2019-10-28T18:24:42 #kisslinux <stee> For example, on Fedora, /bin/sh is GNU bash
2019-10-28T18:24:47 #kisslinux <stee> so I get confused
2019-10-28T18:27:48 #kisslinux <stee> Also, I see that GNU Bash is meant to be "POSIX-compliant"
2019-10-28T18:27:53 #kisslinux <stee> aarrgg
2019-10-28T18:35:25 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> busybox ash
2019-10-28T18:36:03 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> bash, zsh and most shells run in a POSIX sh "emulation mode" when invoked as "/bin/sh" though it's never perfect.
2019-10-28T18:36:58 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> busybox ash also extends the shell beyond POSIX sh features (though this can be disabled).
2019-10-28T18:37:35 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> dash or mrsh are your best bet for something close to or 100% POSIX sh.
2019-10-28T18:37:55 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> or ash in KISS' case :)
2019-10-28T18:38:51 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> The only sure way of confirming adherence to POSIX sh is to test your script in a large number of different shells.
2019-10-28T18:39:17 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Each shell has its set of quirks despite being "POSIX sh [compatible]".
2019-10-28T18:40:53 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> belfry: Which version of Firefox? It works in mine.
2019-10-28T18:41:02 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> (Apologies, didn't see your messages till now)
2019-10-28T18:41:39 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> belfry: (bluetooth) You'll need to package and install BlueZ (which requires dbus and friends).
2019-10-28T18:42:13 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> belfry: (conky) No one has thus far packaged it but it should be simple to get running.
2019-10-28T18:45:24 #kisslinux <belfry> The latest one installed from kiss
2019-10-28T18:45:37 #kisslinux <belfry> Maybe I need to reset it?
2019-10-28T18:46:25 #kisslinux <belfry> Ah, well, so there's no dbusless BT, is there?
2019-10-28T18:47:12 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> BlueZ _is_ the "official" bluetooth stack on Linux (their words).
2019-10-28T18:47:16 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> It's a shame really.
2019-10-28T18:47:34 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Your Firefox issue is a simple about:config flag.
2019-10-28T18:47:36 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> 2 secs
2019-10-28T18:48:06 #kisslinux <belfry> I tried to get conky running, but it doesn't appear trivial. It claims it is unable to find ncurses library
2019-10-28T18:48:25 #kisslinux <belfry> Despite having it installed with kiss for kernel config purposes
2019-10-28T18:48:31 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> You need to pass something like this: `--with-tlib=ncursesw`.
2019-10-28T18:48:43 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> KISS only uses ncursesw.
2019-10-28T18:48:47 #kisslinux <belfry> Oh! Let me try that, thanks
2019-10-28T18:49:06 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Set: 'keyword.enabled' to 'true' in about:config
2019-10-28T18:49:21 #kisslinux <belfry> Aight lemme try that
2019-10-28T18:51:05 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Fixed in the package itself now. :)
2019-10-28T18:51:24 #kisslinux <belfry> Thanks a lot!
2019-10-28T18:52:17 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> What does conky use ncurses for?
2019-10-28T18:52:32 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Looking through the source code to find the exact option name.
2019-10-28T18:52:41 #kisslinux <belfry> I have no idea tbh, looking as well
2019-10-28T18:53:04 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> > if(BUILD_NCURSES)
2019-10-28T18:53:09 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Seems to be optional(?)
2019-10-28T18:53:21 #kisslinux <belfry> But maybe it has to do with conky being able to print to terminal
2019-10-28T18:53:38 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> It uses this to search for it: https://cmake.org/cmake/help/v3.7/module/FindCurses.html
2019-10-28T18:53:51 #kisslinux <belfry> I see, huh
2019-10-28T18:55:10 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> https://github.com/Kitware/CMake/blob/master/Modules/FindCurses.cmake#L115-L141
2019-10-28T18:55:54 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> We should be able to set 'CURSES_NEED_WIDE' which will make Cmake use ncursesw.
2019-10-28T18:57:06 #kisslinux <belfry> Aye, I see
2019-10-28T18:59:01 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Testing a build now.
2019-10-28T19:00:57 #kisslinux <belfry> I was able to get past ncurses with that now, but now it complains about not being able to find lua
2019-10-28T19:01:00 #kisslinux <belfry> Hmm
2019-10-28T19:01:12 #kisslinux <dylanaraps>     -DCURSES_NEED_WIDE=ON 2019-10-28T19:01:14 #kisslinux <dylanaraps>     -DCURSES_INCLUDE_PATH=/usr/include
2019-10-28T19:01:19 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> This works for me for ncurses.
2019-10-28T19:01:36 #kisslinux <belfry> Aight, sounds good
2019-10-28T19:01:43 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> I get the lua error now too.
2019-10-28T19:02:40 #kisslinux <belfry> Maybe an issue with pkgconfig?
2019-10-28T19:03:02 #kisslinux <belfry> Given how it stems from file FindPkgConfig
2019-10-28T19:03:10 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> No no
2019-10-28T19:03:14 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Do you have lua installed?
2019-10-28T19:03:19 #kisslinux <belfry> Yea
2019-10-28T19:03:22 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Seems to be a mandatory dependency.
2019-10-28T19:03:36 #kisslinux <belfry> I have latest lua kiss package
2019-10-28T19:03:39 #kisslinux <belfry> Yea
2019-10-28T19:04:28 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Ah.
2019-10-28T19:04:38 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Lua ships with no pkgconfig file.
2019-10-28T19:04:41 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Distros add it.
2019-10-28T19:04:49 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> It's non-standard of course.
2019-10-28T19:05:03 #kisslinux <belfry> Btw kudos on Rust support, as a mainly Rust dev, I was very pleasantly surprised you got support for it and even solved the musl libc Rust usability issue
2019-10-28T19:05:06 #kisslinux <belfry> Ah, I see
2019-10-28T19:05:31 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> rust was fun...
2019-10-28T19:05:51 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Upstream support for musl is getting better though.
2019-10-28T19:05:57 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> The patch is rather minor.
2019-10-28T19:09:58 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Fixed the lua package.
2019-10-28T19:10:00 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Will push now.
2019-10-28T19:10:37 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Pushed.
2019-10-28T19:10:52 #kisslinux <belfry> Alright, awesome, thanks!
2019-10-28T19:11:05 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> There's another error though.
2019-10-28T19:11:22 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Fails at 98%.
2019-10-28T19:11:30 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> > make[2]: *** No rule to make target '/usr/lib/libform.so', needed by 'src/conky'.  Stop.
2019-10-28T19:11:49 #kisslinux <belfry> Yea, the main issue with the rust-musl relationship, fwiw, was that proc-macros reauire dyn. linking to work, but rust musl is static by default
2019-10-28T19:11:52 #kisslinux <belfry> Oh rip, yea
2019-10-28T19:12:33 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Yup
2019-10-28T19:13:16 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> ooo
2019-10-28T19:13:22 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> This error is ncurses related again.
2019-10-28T19:13:24 #kisslinux <belfry> Hmm, libform seems to be a form library built on curses?
2019-10-28T19:13:27 #kisslinux <belfry> Yeaa
2019-10-28T19:14:46 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Fixed
2019-10-28T19:15:13 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> And it works :P
2019-10-28T19:16:50 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Will push it to community in a sec.
2019-10-28T19:18:46 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Pushed.
2019-10-28T19:47:19 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> brb
2019-10-28T19:51:21 #kisslinux <belfry> Yay,awesome!
2019-10-28T20:33:34 #kisslinux <belfry> dylanaraps: yep, it works like a charm! Thank you
2019-10-28T20:35:29 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Anytime
2019-10-28T21:04:31 #kisslinux <belfry> so now, I am trying the BlueZ thing and dealing with D-Bus really seems to be unfortunate
2019-10-28T21:04:53 #kisslinux <belfry> BlueZ apparently has no no-dbus option
2019-10-28T21:05:28 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Yup
2019-10-28T21:05:49 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> I looked into this extensively.
2019-10-28T21:06:12 #kisslinux <belfry> yea, it's a shame
2019-10-28T21:06:19 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> If you decide to go down the dbus route it is packaged here: https://github.com/fanboimsft/kissD/tree/master/core/dbus
2019-10-28T21:06:41 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> kissD is a user's KISS repository with glibc, systemd, dbus, pulseaudio and friends.
2019-10-28T21:07:03 #kisslinux <belfry> unholy :D thanks though
2019-10-28T21:07:08 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> I'm sad that iwd requires dbus too. :(
2019-10-28T21:07:32 #kisslinux <belfry> it does? shite, I had no idea
2019-10-28T21:07:47 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> It's built around dbus for its client/daemon stuff.
2019-10-28T21:08:38 #kisslinux <belfry> hell, as if Linux didn't have nice IPC tools already
2019-10-28T21:08:47 #kisslinux <belfry> whether SysV IPC or unix sockets
2019-10-28T21:09:16 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Yup
2019-10-28T21:09:41 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Even the BSDs pull in dbus for Firefox etc nowadays.
2019-10-28T21:14:33 #kisslinux <belfry> yea
2019-10-28T21:14:37 #kisslinux <belfry> however, speaking of Firefox
2019-10-28T21:14:42 #kisslinux <belfry> there might be a new hope
2019-10-28T21:15:09 #kisslinux <belfry> the guys over at mozilla are developing their own IPC library, ipc-channel, which abstracts over system IPC
2019-10-28T21:15:48 #kisslinux <belfry> that is Unix sockets and fd passing on *nixes, and whatever on Windows
2019-10-28T21:16:11 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> I maintain a patch KISS' Firefox to rid it of dbus :P
2019-10-28T21:16:18 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> patch for*
2019-10-28T21:16:30 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> I didn't know about ipc-channel though.
2019-10-28T21:17:01 #kisslinux <belfry> Windows support didn't work until a while ago (because of course it didn't), though
2019-10-28T21:17:06 #kisslinux <belfry> so still new, but I see it as a hope
2019-10-28T21:17:21 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> ipc-channel won't replace dbus though.
2019-10-28T21:17:41 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> It's useless for Firefox communicating with a third-party process.
2019-10-28T21:17:53 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> It'll only work between Firefox processes.
2019-10-28T21:17:55 #kisslinux <belfry> yea, I saw you got a patch :D it's neat
2019-10-28T21:18:02 #kisslinux <belfry> yea, that's true
2019-10-28T21:18:34 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Mozilla should get a move on with Python 3 support ;)
2019-10-28T21:18:44 #kisslinux <belfry> oh yea, that too haha
2019-10-28T21:19:13 #kisslinux <belfry> for third-party, it would be better to negotiate a standard data format for IPC (pls no D-Bus xml) and then use that over IPC
2019-10-28T21:19:34 #kisslinux <belfry> just like Wayland is just a protocol/standard (although I am not a fan of wayland in particular)
2019-10-28T21:19:40 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> I doubt they'll move away from dbus.
2019-10-28T21:19:47 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> I'm not a fan of Wayland either.
2019-10-28T21:20:01 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> The hype is around BUS1 and dbus-broker now.
2019-10-28T21:20:05 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> It's not going away.
2019-10-28T21:20:16 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> https://github.com/bus1
2019-10-28T21:20:21 #kisslinux <belfry> unfortunately, probably yea
2019-10-28T21:21:23 #kisslinux <belfry> sheesh, I see
2019-10-28T21:21:28 #kisslinux <belfry> speaking of sheesh
2019-10-28T21:21:42 #kisslinux <belfry> have you heard about systemd-homed?
2019-10-28T21:21:46 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Yup
2019-10-28T21:22:08 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> I started KISS to escape all of this.
2019-10-28T21:22:33 #kisslinux <belfry> glad to come aboard to join the escape :D
2019-10-28T21:23:09 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> :P
2019-10-28T21:24:40 #kisslinux <belfry> the idea of systemd-homed is particularly atrocious - let's break classic parts of Linux structure just because we can
2019-10-28T21:25:01 #kisslinux <belfry> inspired me to write my own init and service manager, though, so that is nice
2019-10-28T21:25:18 #kisslinux <belfry> haven't finished the service manager yet, however
2019-10-28T21:25:55 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Nice
2019-10-28T21:27:10 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> I'd be fine with these "radical" changes if they were _optional_. Software like dbus, pulseaudio and systemd are becoming more and more mandatory.
2019-10-28T21:27:47 #kisslinux <belfry> yea, I agree
2019-10-28T21:28:04 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> udev is mandatory if you want Xorg input drivers too.
2019-10-28T21:28:21 #kisslinux <belfry> I am all for choice, but those a becoming a monopoly
2019-10-28T21:28:30 #kisslinux <belfry> I saw, yea, shame too
2019-10-28T21:28:37 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> They're all Red Hat software too. ;)
2019-10-28T21:29:12 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> brb
2019-10-28T21:29:33 #kisslinux <belfry> sounds like red parties are bound to give us problems the last few decades :P
2019-10-28T21:31:37 #kisslinux <belfry> welcome back
2019-10-28T21:32:47 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> ty
2019-10-28T21:33:30 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> The one saving grace udev has is that its daemon is optional.
2019-10-28T21:33:42 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> I load it at boot to discover my hardware and then kill it.
2019-10-28T21:33:54 #kisslinux <belfry> yep, at least that
2019-10-28T21:34:32 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> I actually find libinput to be decent.
2019-10-28T21:35:15 #kisslinux <belfry> it solved my trackpad issues when I switched libinput, so I can't complained
2019-10-28T21:35:19 #kisslinux <belfry> *complain
2019-10-28T21:35:20 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> The maintainer for the xf86-input-* drivers is the libinput creator.
2019-10-28T21:35:37 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> The xf86-input-* drivers have now been left to rot and he works on libinput.
2019-10-28T21:35:46 #kisslinux <belfry> ah, I see
2019-10-28T21:35:53 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> I can't see him making something worse. :P
2019-10-28T21:36:02 #kisslinux <belfry> lol :D
2019-10-28T21:36:36 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> It may move away from udev too.
2019-10-28T21:36:42 #kisslinux <belfry> speaking of bad things, BlueZ apparently requires a separate calendar library, the hell lol
2019-10-28T21:36:46 #kisslinux <belfry> yea, that would be great
2019-10-28T21:37:07 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> I looked through their mailing list, it uses dbus all the way back in 2008.
2019-10-28T21:37:29 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> I thought you'd have the option of at least running an older version...
2019-10-28T21:37:34 #kisslinux <belfry> early adopters, huh
2019-10-28T21:37:35 #kisslinux <belfry> shame
2019-10-28T21:39:21 #kisslinux <belfry> btw, I don't know, if you heard, but apparently OSS is in development again
2019-10-28T21:39:28 #kisslinux <belfry> speaking of pulseaudio alternatives
2019-10-28T21:40:28 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> I just use ALSA.
2019-10-28T21:40:39 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> sndio is another option too.
2019-10-28T21:40:41 #kisslinux <belfry> I am too young to have lived in the era of OSS prevalence, so I don't know how it compares to ALSA, but it's great to have competition and alternatives
2019-10-28T21:40:48 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Yup
2019-10-28T21:41:10 #kisslinux <belfry> oh, I thought sndio was a BSD thing, are there ports to Linux?
2019-10-28T21:41:24 #kisslinux <belfry> huh, it looks there are
2019-10-28T21:41:41 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> I don't know how good the ports are though.
2019-10-28T21:41:46 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> The doas ports are iffy too.
2019-10-28T21:42:13 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Oh
2019-10-28T21:42:16 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> It's an official port.
2019-10-28T21:42:20 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Nice
2019-10-28T21:42:30 #kisslinux <belfry> huh, yea, it is
2019-10-28T21:42:32 #kisslinux <belfry> pretty neat
2019-10-28T21:42:43 #kisslinux <belfry> yea, doas is iffy
2019-10-28T21:42:55 #kisslinux <belfry> nixi: could say something about that :^))
2019-10-28T21:43:14 #kisslinux <belfry> I looked into sup as a sudo alternative
2019-10-28T21:43:25 #kisslinux <belfry> looks interesting, but I haven't tried it yet
2019-10-28T21:43:58 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> I just use 'su'.
2019-10-28T21:44:04 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Works for me.
2019-10-28T21:44:07 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> :P
2019-10-28T21:44:22 #kisslinux <belfry> same
2019-10-28T21:44:50 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> > as you may have realised already, sup is so minimal that all its documentation is written lowercase.
2019-10-28T21:44:55 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> lol
2019-10-28T21:45:19 #kisslinux <belfry> yep lol
2019-10-28T21:46:18 #kisslinux <belfry> I like how the author documented each section of the code
2019-10-28T21:46:36 #kisslinux <belfry> makes it easy to understand, what & how it's doing
2019-10-28T21:46:49 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Yup
2019-10-28T21:46:58 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> brb
2019-10-28T21:47:57 #kisslinux <belfry> aye
2019-10-28T21:49:43 #kisslinux <nixi> i like doas for it's simple config
2019-10-28T21:49:51 #kisslinux <nixi> and i do not need all sudo features
2019-10-28T21:50:05 #kisslinux <nixi> actually, almost none of them except "run this as root"
2019-10-28T21:50:43 #kisslinux <nixi> `sup` looks nice, i just haven't gotten around to testing it yet
2019-10-28T21:52:13 #kisslinux <nixi> does it keep the environment?
2019-10-28T21:53:29 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> No idea.
2019-10-28T21:53:36 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Apologies, I'm off to bed.
2019-10-28T21:53:40 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> Nice talking to you.
2019-10-28T21:53:42 #kisslinux <dylanaraps> :)
2019-10-28T21:53:59 #kisslinux <belfry> lol
2019-10-28T21:54:56 #kisslinux <nixi> am i that scary? O.o
2019-10-28T21:55:42 #kisslinux <belfry> that's the PHP effect