F I D O N E W S -- Vol.11 No.26 (27-Jun-1994) +----------------------------+-----------------------------------------+ | A newsletter of the | ISSN 1198-4589 | | FidoNet BBS community | Published by: | | _ | | | / \ | "FidoNews" BBS | | /|oo \ | +1-519-570-4176 1:1/23 | | (_| /_) | | | _`@/_ \ _ | Editors: | | | | \ \\ | Donald Tees 1:221/192 | | | (*) | \ )) | Sylvia Maxwell 1:221/194 | | |__U__| / \// | Tim Pozar 1:125/555 | | _//|| _\ / | | | (_/(_|(____/ | | | (jm) | Newspapers should have no friends. | | | -- JOSEPH PULITZER | +----------------------------+-----------------------------------------+ | Submission address: editors 1:1/23 | +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ | Internet addresses: | | | | Sylvia -- max@exlibris.tdkcs.waterloo.on.ca | | Donald -- donald@exlibris.tdkcs.waterloo.on.ca | | Tim -- pozar@kumr.lns.com | | Both Don & Sylvia (submission address) | | editor@exlibris.tdkcs.waterloo.on.ca | +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ | For information, copyrights, article submissions, | | obtaining copies and other boring but important details, | | please refer to the end of this file. | +----------------------------------------------------------------------+ ======================================================================== Table of Contents ======================================================================== 1. Editorial..................................................... 2 2. Articles...................................................... 3 Cat Torture: Well deserved, too............................. 3 Endorsment of Illegal Activites?............................ 4 Publishing of Cat_torture................................... 5 US Vs. The Governmet........................................ 5 CAT_TORTURE................................................. 6 Subject: FidoNews........................................... 8 Region 13 Election Proposal Delayed......................... 8 ONE TIT..................................................... 14 Just an idea about this NodeList............................ 19 Reply to article in FidoNews 11-24.......................... 22 Nodelist.................................................... 23 Welfare Reform and Where To Discuss It...................... 25 FidoNet LAW Echo Moderator Makes News!...................... 26 ECSTASY now available from 1:163/328........................ 28 CORELDRAW now available from 1:163/328...................... 29 Wholly_Bible, To whom does it belong?....................... 29 Darling Madam EMilia........................................ 30 FidoNews 11-26 Page: 2 27 Jun 1994 1984 tee shirt.............................................. 31 3. Fidonews Information.......................................... 33 ======================================================================== Editorial ======================================================================== Of all the problems in Fidonet, I think that the policy four section on geographic areas is the biggest. While it makes sense to organize so that as many calls as possible are local, the insistance on such a thing makes little sense. First of all, such an organization is going to be the norm by the simple virtue of being the cheapest. Where it is not the cheapest, then there is no reason for it. Secondly, the geographic organization is used far too often for political grandstanding and control. In the past two years we have had major disruptions in Britain and in Germany. Both have been excessively annoying to hundreds of sysops, and both can be directly attributed to an elite attempting to use a geographic rule against the wishes of a large group. The same sort of bickering and political infighting takes place on a smaller scale daily, all over fidonet. I would wager that an extremely high percentage of all policy complaints (read annoyances) are caused by sysops using that policy section to attempt to claim control over particular BBS's as "theirs", meaning that the sysop must join "their" net and abide by "their" rules. It never seems to occur to the complainers that each BBS belongs to the sysop, not to the net, not to the RC, not to the CRP, not to anybody but the person that runs it. Lastly, the rule serves as a monopoly rule for poorly run nets. I received a phone call this morning from a sysop that has being attempting to join Fidonet for four months. The RC of the local net has not responded for two months. Nobody else is allowed to start a net in the area, even though there are some twenty of them running as a private net that cannot get access to fidonet. The net that has control of Fidonet in the area consists of seven nodes. Every week I hear complaints about the power of the phone companies, and the evils of monopolies. It is about time that we stopped doing the same thing in Fidonet. FidoNews 11-26 Page: 3 27 Jun 1994 ======================================================================== Articles ======================================================================== Cat Torture: Well deserved, too Fredric L. Rice, The Skeptic Tank 1-818-335-9601 Michael Johnson (1:106/3323) in Fido1125.NWS has let the cat out of the bag. Though he didn't clearly state the _reasons_ for the well deserved distaste for -- as he puts it, "those of the feline persuasion" -- quite simply, he wasn't authorized to do so. I, on the other hand, aftering reporting his having made CAT_TORTURE known publically to Control, have been granted the authority to offer some of the "de-tails" of The Furred Alien Destroyers (FADs) among us. They came to Earth over 4,000 years ago and began their bloody experiments. Though Humans originally slaughtered and ate them where ever they tried to hide, they clevery tied the planet together with their telepathic machine network -- PURRM: People-Usurping Role Reversal Machine. When it became established that the ancient and ignorant humans of those times became enslaved to PURRM then openly accepted them into their homes, they started stealing from the Earth all of its natural resources. Chief among their crimes is the stealing, collecting, and the transmission of needed solar energy up to their mother ships in orbit. Control has learned that there are currently nine such mother ships which continue to plague humanity. The shuttle missions as yet have been unable to place an agent on board any of the ships with any success and NASA, along with JPL, have been keeping secret the number of astronaught Control agents which have been boosted into orbit never to return. What happened to them? No one knows. Oh the inhuman monsters! As Michael Johnson points out: "We need to get on the backbone so that we can share our tips and hints with all of the other cat-o-phobes and start making this a great nation like it was intended. People point their fingers at the liberals and demorats and accuse them of bringing this country down, but I happen to know that it is those darn cats." It gets much worse. The rise of religious fascism the world around is caused by The Furred Alien Destroyers and their evil experiments.(1) The underlaying free-flowing stress caused by PURRM over the centuries causes unidentifiable irritations which lead to intolerance. Only by slaughtering all cats everywhere will Humanity ever be safe! Few know the real reason for flouride being introduced into the world's water supply: Control has learned that flouride acts as a powerful conductor to Zeta-rays! The consequences of this immutable fact should be clear: The World Health Organization is entirely controlled by cats! FidoNews 11-26 Page: 4 27 Jun 1994 Scientists at the Superconducting Kitty-Colliders at CERN, working closely with Control, have managed to unlock some of the mysteries of cat physiology. The drape and curtain shredding these fiends exhibit is a blatant attempt to let the sun light into the house so that they may bathe in the electromagnetic gluon flux stream. Their unholy bodies convert these photons into hellish Zeta-rays, used to power their hidden PURRM network and feed their mother ships. Join CAT_TORTURE. Link in today! Help us save Earth. Help us rid the universe of this infestation. The first 13 SysOps which link in will comprise the newest Control cell so call 1:106/3323 now! This is __NOT__ a joke!!! Act NOW to save yourself!!! -=- (1) Case in point: "Anyone who is not a true Christian, is by default, Satanic." - Steve Winter ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Endorsment of Illegal Activites? Ronnie Toth (1:135/71) Ä Area: 56 ÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄÄ Msg#: 4 Date: 22 Jun 94 15:10:13 From: Ronnie Toth To: Dan Buda Subj: Illegality question - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Hi! DB> A friendly note pointing out the discrepancy, "may" be appropriate, DB> but remember that the moderator is in charge of the echo and DB> whatever they decide pretty much goes, as long as it is not illegal. Referencing FidoNews, Vol.11, No.25, June 20, 1994, I wonder if such an echo as described in the "Cat Torture" article which begins on page 3, endorses illegality in FidoNet. What do you and others say about this? Would such an echo be considered legal? I believe there are laws on the books of every state in the U.S. that say something about this. If this was posted in jest, it certainly did not come across as such and should be clarified. Ronnie FidoNews 11-26 Page: 5 27 Jun 1994 Publishing of Cat_torture Dia Spriggs (1:135/68) I must protest the publishing of Cat_Torture in the fidonews. WIth all the echos that are good, decent and trying to do something to improve life in any form you must advertise that something like this actually exists? Even in an off hand humorous fashion this is offensive and to waste time to cater to any kind of cruelty is insane and far below any standard I thought was trying to be upheld by Fidonet. I wonder how funny and how much attention would I receive if I said that I hated children and I was starting and echo on how to abuse them...how to molest them...kidnap them...torture them....would you find this newsworthy ? Would you find it amusing? Since the standards for echos seems to have fallen into the pits I see no reason for such an echo to exist. Better yet I think an echo on all kinds of ways to torture and kill abusers of any kinds...animal or human would be VERY appropriate. There are enough sick people in the world without giving them ideas on how to torture and maim little creatures. I, for one after spending years trying to stop animal abuse in any form and lately starting echos to help the human animals improve their lives am appalled and highly offended that you would even consider giving such an echo space and consideration. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- US Vs. The Governmet RICK LITHGOW (1:2601/574) Hey Editor I'll tell ya something, twix the Local, State, & Federal Governments and Al Gore's speech on the "National Communications Infrastructure", never has the government been so ludicrous! (Well except maybe the McCarthy era) Things are going too far with the government trying to control everything from BBS's to the entire computing industry! First Al Gore yap's off about the internet (which is been around for well over a decade), and in pop's the government trying ot promote clipper and throw poor Phil Zimmerman in jail. (Phil is the author of PGP encryption). Scares all of FIDO and other net's into not allowing encryption because of possible illegal traffic. Then all the crackdown's and press on porno bbs's. Rumor's about this and that and you'll goto jail for harrassing this person or showing a .GIF to that person. Well now here's a goodie from the Washington State government.. "NEW SECTION. Sec. 706(1)" A license is required for the commercial use of virtual-reality FidoNews 11-26 Page: 6 27 Jun 1994 technology for entertainment or purposes other than bona fide education, training, research, and developement" Where VR is defined as "NEW SECTION Sec. 702(4) 'Virtual Reality' means any computer or other electronic technology that creates an enhanced illusion of three-dimensional, real-time interactive reality through the use of software, specialized hardware, holograms, gloves, masks, glasses, computer gun's, or other item's inducing audio, visual, and sensory effects of versimilitude beyond those available with a personal computer." The bill is being pushed by Senator Phil (I really don't squat about c omputers) Talmadge. What are with these loons in the government?? First they've been trying to take away our 1st ammendment rights, then our privacy, then talk of regulating our hobby, now they're trying to stiffle the computer industry into stagnation. How long are we going to take this lying down? What is it gonna take for people like you and me to stand up to these goobs? If we don't we're going to loose what little freedom is left in this country and it will no longer be a democracy, it will be "He who has the most money wins". Geez people, write your congressman, write a senator, write the president, but do something to prevent law's like the clipper chip becoming mandatory and programs like PGP to become outlawed, stop the regulating of the computer communication industry, otherwise one day you may turn on your monitor and be looking at the picture of a federal agent because of a stupid or little known of law that you didn't want to stand up for.... Sorry 'bout the blathering, but I wrote it in the heat of annoyance(grin). Regards Rick Lithgow * WCE 1.5/2295 * People who shouldn't breed...Next on Geraldo!... ---------------------------------------------------------------------- CAT_TORTURE Michael Johnson (1:106/3323) Well, since last week I have had several replies to my solicitation for those who shared my affinity for discussing innovative ways to make felines miserable. I have also recorded several death threats, one offer of sexual abuse of a most unusual sort and a most silly fool who is probably the most gullible dummy in FIDOnet. (I'll let you decide) I suppose it is time to reveal to those persons who express cranial density beyond Uranium235 that CAT_TORTURE is a hoax of minor magnitude. I understand your need to preserve your little fluffy and all of their brother and sister felines who remain oppressed in the world today.....I even understand the threats of violence and the death threats. In fact, I sorta liked the death threats because they weren't the usual "I FidoNews 11-26 Page: 7 27 Jun 1994 am gonna blow your head off" type of threats...nooooo these were creative death threats involving kitchen utensils, sporting goods items and one who had a decided fixation on Italian sausage.....but this one guy was ominous and self-important, with all the trappings of a CIA agent he barged into my bbs and said......... - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Area Netmail, Msg#99, Jun-20-94 22:24:00 From: Michael Oujesky (1:124/5117.2) To: Michael Johnson (1:106/3323) Subject: Fair warning Just saw your article in FidoNews and thought I'd drop a note on your proposed echo. As soon as I see that is in distribution within nets 124 or 130, I intend to persue measures against whoever necessary for supporting cruelty to animals. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - "Supporting" cruelty to animals? Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha...... This guy should take a pill and then spike a tree. Guess I had better turn in my guns and go on about peacefully plowing the land and give up this nonsense of supporting cruelty to animals. Too bad, it was an idea whose time had come....if the response I got from you guys in PITBULL_TRAINER was anything to gauge by. To the fellah who offered to have cats inserted into his anus....yer on yer own guy. I'm not condemning, just refusing to participate. Interestingly, the only sane letter that had a modicum of humour it it was posted by our own Sylvia, who is a definite cat person. SYlvia, because your cat is Canadian I can see no threat to the USA at this time if it is allowed to live....as long as you keep it in Canada and don't allow it to stray into one of our border towns where it might incite our cats to riot or possibly worse. The rest of you know who you are and you (most of you) should be totally ashamed of yourselves. The level of netmail flaming was terrible and honestly, I can get better flames from one test message in internet in a well chosen group. Is FIDO going downhill? Have we been invaded by dweebs? Are we doomed to eternal seriousity? Have we lost our edge after all of these years? Maybe.....maybe not Actually, who cares? Well, besides Oujesky..... FidoNews 11-26 Page: 8 27 Jun 1994 Subject: FidoNews Lee Lefler (1:280/5) Over the years I have read quite a few articles in FidoNews. I have browsed just about every issue that was published since I originally joined the net in '89. There have been many good articles; we've had our share of stupid and silly ones as well. But the one in issue 1125 announcing a new echo called 'Cat Torture' is just plain sick. I can understand that you don't want to censor articles that are sent to you, but in essence by advertising this echo you promoting animal abuse. I doubt you would think twice about sending an ad for an echo called 'Gang Rape' to the bit bucket, so where does FidoNews draw the line on decency? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Region 13 Election Proposal Delayed REGION 13 COORDINATOR DELAYS ELECTION PROCEDURE PROPOSAL By Alan Boritz - 1:2605/102 Democracy has been a long time coming to Region 13, but it looks now that it won't be coming our way for a while. Although elections for *C positions was a hot topic during R13C Michael Walsh's campaign last year, and he promised to get moving on the project, it seems that he's now gone back on his promise and won't move the election proposal any further. On January 12, Walsh stated in the REGION13 conference, "It got quiet because of the holidays. You'll see the bit on elections first, and shortly." Then on March 14, Walsh stated, "Please review the proposal and make any suggestions you want... I want to get this puppy off the ground." But now it seems that he's but this project on the "back-burner," as he stated on June 11, "When the time comes. I said that we'd have one, and we will. I never said it would be at a specific time...I'm not going to answer any more questions of this nature here. I'm far more interested in finishing my current project before getting into another one, and once I have, we'll get back to it." It seems rather convenient to delay an election proposal, especially in light of the wide-spread dissatisfaction with Miles Hoover's "regional echo hub" activities. And many of us in Region 13 who have been here long enough have had enough of Hoover's and (former R13C) Bill Andrus' phony scam "elections" (the old "a vote not received is a vote for whatever I want" routine). Sysops in Region 13 have made their desires known, they want an election procedure. While we've become accustomed to ignoring Michael Walsh's "promises," especially all of the OTHER campaign promises he hasn't kept, it's important that we continue to FidoNews 11-26 Page: 9 27 Jun 1994 formalize the election procedure that presumably will be used to (at least) select Walsh's successor. For the benefit of all those who haven't been given the opportunity of reviewing the current Region 13 election proposal, here it is, as presented by R13C on March 18, 1994, reformatted slightly for Fidonews: Region 13 Election Policy Proposal Revision 1.03 February 21, 1994 Written in committee by Michael Walsh, R13C, with the assistance and input of Phillip Dampier, Howie Ducat and Bill Fisch Changes suggested by various members of the region and incorporated This proposal is presented to the membership of Region 13 for debate and modification as is deemed appropriate, and will be balloted upon in its final form. If adopted, it will become the first part of a region-wide operations policy. For the purposes of balloting on this proposal, when that time comes, a member of the region will be selected to serve as the vote-counter. The person selected will not be a coordinator at any level in order to ensure impartiality. 50%+1 of the ballots received will be necessary to adopt this proposal. --Michael Walsh, R13C ================================================================= I. The Election Moderator A. The moderator is appointed by the RC at the beginning of his/her term, and must be confirmed by a vote of the NCs of the region. Discussion on the appointment will take place for one week in the NCRC13 echo, after which a netmail ballot to confirm or reject the appointee is held, using the procedure outlined later in this document. The RC will count the votes and post the results in the NCRC13 echo, and if 50%+1 vote in favor of the appointee, this person is confirmed. NCs are expected to solicit the opinions of the members of their respective networks when casting their ballot, casting their ballot in accordance with the majority view in their respective networks. B. The election moderator has complete control over the electoral process and validates all candidates' nominations, counts all votes and announces the results. The election moderator may appoint an assistant with the approval of all nominated candidates at the end of the nomination process, whose job will be to assist in counting votes. FidoNews 11-26 Page: 10 27 Jun 1994 C. In order to easily identify the election moderator to members of the region, s/he will receive the nodelist designation of 1:13/2, and will be added to the segment upon confirmation. D. The election moderator serves in the appointed position for the entire term of the sitting RC, but may be replaced by the RC if needs be by this same process. II. Election Details A. Schedule: all schedules start at 00:01 hours and end at 24:00 hours 1. Announcement of the election: October 1st through October 7th a. Made in the REGION13 echo by the election moderator so that everyone in the region can participate, and in netmail to each of the NCs in the region with instructions to repost the announcement in their local administrative echomail areas, or to forward it in netmail to any nodes not receiving them. An announcement is also made in FidoNews by the election moderator. b. Describes what position will be elected, whether RC or REC c. Is done three times in a one-week period in REGION13; the netmail notification is done once, as is the FidoNews announcement. 2. Declarations of Candidacy: October 8th through October 21st a. Any member of the region may declare candidacy b. Two weeks are allowed for such declarations c. All declarations must be done in the REGION13 echo, which will be used for all election-related business d. The message header/timestamp will be used to determine whether a declaration was received on time, but no more than two days after the end of the declaration period. 3. Questions to the Candidates: October 22nd through November 11th a. The candidates will state, briefly, their platforms in the REGION13 echomail area b. Members of the region may question the candidates on any issues that they may feel are important to them or FidoNews 11-26 Page: 11 27 Jun 1994 the region c. Debate between candidates should be limited; it is the membership that must be answered, and the election moderator may halt debate at any time if it is clear that the membership is not benefiting from the debate. This does not apply to clarification of position; i.e., if a candidate states a position and it isn't clear, any other candidate may request clarification and present their position. This is not intended to prevent opposing points of view from being discussed, but rather is intended to prevent the candidates from focusing on each other and ignoring the members of the region. d. Three weeks are allowed for questions and answers 4. Vote: November 12th through November 18th One week is allowed for all members of the region to vote 5. Announcement of the results: within three days of the end of the vote, or by November 21st 6. Elections are held once every two years for each of the RC and REC positions. The elections are staggered, such that in one calendar year an RC election will be held, and the next calendar year an REC election will be held. The purpose of this is to maintain continuity in the operation of the region. B. Recall Elections 1. Recalls are started by a referendum, in which 20% of the NCs of the region request the recall election; this request for a recall must be filed with the election moderator. In order to allow for each member of the region to have a voice in the recall process, any NC who receives requests from 10% of their network to recall a *C shall make such a request for a recall election. 2. The recall election is held as a regular election would be, with the sitting *C running as a candidate while still in office. 3. A recall election does not upset the regular schedule of elections; if a recall election is held, and results in the replacement of a *C, that replacement will only serve until the next regularly scheduled election at which time s/he may run as a candidate if nominated. III. Voting Procedure A. Each nodelisted operator is entitled to one vote; if more than one person shares responsibility for a system, and also share a nodelist entry, then only one vote is allowed FidoNews 11-26 Page: 12 27 Jun 1994 between them. B. Votes are counted only when sent by netmail, and when sent by the nodelisted operator to the election moderator. Voice votes or proxy votes are NOT COUNTED. Votes must be addressed to 1:13/2. C. Votes should be sent DIRECT to avoid the possibility of tampering, but in recognition of the fact that not all members of the region are able/willing to make a long-distance call to deliver their vote, it may be routed. Votes which are routed are not guaranteed to be delivered, and as such, no responsibility can be placed on the person(s) who may route such mail. D. Each vote must contain: 1. The name and node address of the operator casting the vote, 2. The vote itself, 3. A password to be used in announcing and validating the vote. E. The election moderator will tally and summarize the votes, listing each vote by password in the announcement, i.e. if John Doe and Jane Doe are candidates, the announcement of the results would look like this: John Doe Jane Doe -------------------- -------------------- Beeswax Whatchamacallit Zaphod Zoos Viper Kitchen Wrangler Hunter -------------------- -------------------- 3 votes (37.5%) 5 votes (62.5%) A second announcement will follow this, listing in numerical order, all node addresses from which a vote was received and counted. These two messages will serve as the record of vote, and by the nature of their content, will allow all members of the region to see that their votes were counted and counted correctly while maintaining the confidentiality of the votes. F. A candidate must receive 50%+1 of the votes in order to be elected. If four candidates are running, and the vote is: A: 91 votes B: 37 votes C: 69 votes D: 12 votes Candidates "A" and "C" will face each other in a runoff to determine the winner of the election. A runoff election is held between the two candidates receiving the most votes, and FidoNews 11-26 Page: 13 27 Jun 1994 is handled as described above except: 1. One week for further questions to the remaining candidates, not three, and 2. All results from the general election are discarded and a new ballot is taken, with the results of the new ballot alone being counted. G. If the election results in a tie, the ZC will choose the RC from the candidates. H. The elected person will take office one week following the announcement of the results, and in the case of the RC election, with the approval of the ZC (in recognition of FidoNet Policy.) The outgoing coordinator will make available all materials necessary to ensure a smooth transition, and will support the coordinator-elect for as long as is possible or needed. IV. Dispute Resolution A. Any dispute must be filed, in netmail, to the election moderator within the one week time frame before the electee takes office. This dispute should be carbon-copied to at least two other members of the region to ensure fairness and action on the part of the election moderator. B. The election moderator will announce the dispute, and request a Judge of Elections be named. The Judge of Elections will be the ZC, or if s/he is unavailable, another region's RC or a member of the region acceptable to all of the candidates. C. The Judge of Elections will receive from the election moderator all votes cast, without the summaries. D. The Judge of Elections will recount the votes and create a new summary which will be forwarded to the election moderator and posted accordingly. This will be the final count in cases of dispute. V. Amendments to Election Policy A. Any member of the region may propose an amendment to this election policy, but no amendment may be proposed during an election. B. Such a proposal must be sent to the RC and the election moderator. The RC will cause it to be distributed to all NCs in the region, and direct that the NCs distribute it to all members of the region. C. Debate on any amendment will be held in the REGION13 echo. FidoNews 11-26 Page: 14 27 Jun 1994 D. The process for voting on the amendment will be as follows: 1. The proposal will require 50%+1 of the votes to be adopted 2. The votes will be counted as in a regular election, with the results posted similarly 3. The time frame for debate is open, but voting will still take place in one week's time 4. The election moderator will schedule the vote at least one week in advance to allow all members of the region to have time to consider their vote 5. The vote can be forced to occur by referendum of the NCs; if 20% of the NCs request the vote to be scheduled, the election moderator must schedule the vote VI. Continuity and Successive Administrations It is recommended to the members of the region that any candidates who may run for the RC position be clearly asked to abide the terms and conditions of approved regional policy, such that no future RC may throw out policy to suit his/her whim. If a candidate does not clearly state that they will abide the terms and conditions of approved regional policy, you are advised that you should cast your vote in favor of a candidate who will abide it so that it can be maintained in perpetuity for the benefit of the members of the region. -##- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- POLICY 33.5 - THE FINAL INSULT Charles Herriot (1:163/110) (this had to be done, Doc, now where's my Ibogaine?) 1. TITLE: (amateur policymongers probably don't realize the importance of leading off with at least one "tit"... capture their imaginations and their hearts and minds will follow) The title of this document shall be: "Policy 33.5 - The Final Insult, otherwise known as: "Mom! Mom! He/she dissed me and I'm gonna whump his/her sorry ass with this policy document until he/she either apologizes or else gets locked in a room and forced to listen to John Denver singin' 'Rocky Mountain High' until her/his ears bleed." 2. PURPOSE: The purpose of this policy is to create more policy. The Region has recognized quite clearly that if more FidoNews 11-26 Page: 15 27 Jun 1994 policy were created then, incredibly, we'd have more policy. If we had more policy, then we would definitely need even more of it to expand upon the previously created policy. Hell, in no time at all, this policy stuff would be breeding on its own and provide sustenance to unemployed cod fisherman. 3. DEFINITIONS: AcetyleneMail: The polite staple of inter-sysop communication which must include, at a minimum, at least one demand that the recipient engage in an act of self-replicating his/herself. It is entirely appropriate to substitute the preceding with a suggestion to the recipient that they engage in an act of procreation with anyone having the surname: "Off." Cod: Humiliated trout. Not to be confused with the traditionally refrain of grunt sysops to *C-beings which loosely paraphrases into: "Who named you Cod?" Beer: The official sysop monetary unit. Debts can be satisfied upon payment of these units, and *C-beings are obligated to buy grunt sysops copious quantities of this particular resource. CRPs: Mistakenly identified as "Cost Recovery Plans", these are really guileless attempts to extort money from Grunt Sysops. The money is expended on fast women and loose cars. Echomail: A system of distributing the latest gnarly-rad path lines, and logoff macros, by "K00L D00DZ" which are rivaled by Sea Slugs for their intrinsic wit. Also, any quote of the preceding is considered "echomail" and the high fibre content helps to improve echomail regularity. Humungous amounts of megabytes of this stuff are sporadically sent throughout the Region. All of this echomail was spawned by one message which was entered in 1985 and everyone has been quoting the shit out of it ever since. Grunt Sysops: A strange infestation which has plagued Fidonet for years. No one has figured out what sort of toxic spray would be effective in eliminating them. The freshly hatched sysop-beings, shortly before mastering the basic skills of mailers and echomail distribution, plaster messages all over the known universe announcing yet another new net.. one that promises some feature so outstanding that it probably isn't replicated in more than 500 of the existing 600 Fidonet echomail areas. Hubs: Dwarf-like creatures who live in tinfoil lined, darkened caves, where their multi-node, Lan-based, 69 gazillion baud modems, poot forth echomail. Hubs are recognizable from the fact that their plastic pocket pen FidoNews 11-26 Page: 16 27 Jun 1994 protector mounted pagers beep whenever they receive an inbound mail packet. Hubs secretly dream about bringing the entire Sports Illustrated Swimsuit modeling group to gaze at the diode arrays winking from every corner of their kleenex-piled rooms. NECs: Pituitary challenged Hubs who can often run a mailer for almost a whole day without having the system crash. NECs spend hours explaining batch files to bored and miserable people everywhere. NECs have LAN work-stations in their bathrooms where they do their best work. Nets: Nets are largish containment devices used to bag various *Cs who have run amok. These are not to be confused with "Network" which is also herein defined. Netwar: An exchange of pleasantries between sysops culminating in at least a dozen threats of policy complaints, filled diapers, and about 20 megs of brainlessly quoted text. Networks: Are collections of nodes who have mastered the incredible mentation powers to remember the same sequence of digits. Networks are loosely centred on geographic areas within easy mortar range of each other. Network Coordinators: (see also "Mazola & Bondage") Network Coordinators are selfless individuals who are reluctantly railroaded into wearing a large bullseye on their foreheads for the amusement of grunt sysops who are bored and have already painted the cat. Region: The region shall encompass that area in Canada lying to the east of the Manitoba border (unless they lower their taxes and sell cheaper beer) and continuing past the welfare states in the Atlantic provinces to whichever dead cod happen to wash up on the beaches of Sable Island. The Region shall also include the Free Republic of Quebec, but only insofar as it does not impinge upon their God-given right to rant endlessly about their contused and paranoid cultural identity. Regional Coordinators: The larval stage of Small Animal Psychologists. These beings are to be humoured and indulged since their are obligated to buy rounds of beer for all sysops at social gatherings. Regional Coordinators can be identified by the horrible sucking noises they make while applying Vulcan lip-locks to the ZC's nether bits. After weeks of sheep and sleep deprivation, these poor souls can be spotted, buck naked in the moonlight, howling for more policy. Technical Standards: A basepoint for launching into some sort of penis-envy type message comparing baud rates, how many terrabytes of online GIFS can be shot through the phone FidoNews 11-26 Page: 17 27 Jun 1994 lines, or how some moron has pissed away a small fortune on a Pentium chip so that they can display messages at 14 million times their visual comprehension rate. I mean, let's face it, if you happen to have cute blossooms, nobody is going to give a damn whether your mailer works... in an ideal world, your mail would get hand-delivered. Users: Like, get serious wouldja? Screw 'em if they can't take a joke. 4. Official Titles: In this Region, a group of sick minds will choose some relatively innocent soul and propel the poor sucker into the job of Regional Co-ordinator. The Regional Coordinator shall have all the powers biologically granted to bread mold, but otherwise can be safely ignored. The Region shall be hacked up into small fiefdoms, called "Networks" which shall elect mascots, order pizza in bulk quantities, and participate in the annual Node Draft to choose the players for the upcoming Netwar season. Nets will dragoon someone into being the Network Coordinator who will be obliged to either undergo spontaneous human combustion before a full term is served, or else stand for re-election to the particular purgatory for which they are ideally maladapted. Network Coordinators will not be surprised to discover that they commune directly with either God or if they want to go right to the top; to Luke Kolin. Network Coordinators are entitled to screech that "they need a really big net." Judging from their post electoral behaviour, most grunt sysops would agree with their appraisal, and might further suggest a cell of the padded variety as well. Any grunt sysop who has stood in the blinding white light of their own ego too long is entitled to pile nine or ten listings of their own number into the nodelist and appoint themselves as Net Coordinator. They will be entitled to exhibit multiple-personality disorderly conduct and pontificate about "what their net wants." Spray misting these lost souls with regular doses of crystal-meth is advised. 5. Elections: Anyone who actually wants a title in Fidonet should be put in a bottle and sent out into the Japanese current. If their lives are so incomplete without the fame of a Fidonet title, then they should be encouraged to get their pictures on milk cartons, but don't elect the poor bastards because they'll inflict bad grammar on you until you lie in a pool of drool, clutching your "I Adore My 64" button, babbling about the good old days when men were men FidoNews 11-26 Page: 18 27 Jun 1994 and sheep were not particular. 6. The Netwar Season: The netwar season shall commence nanoseconds after the election of each new Regional Coordinator. A season can be kick-started to a promising beginning by any Regional Coordinator who campaigns on some sort of "peace" platform. Like, nudge nudge, wink wink, we all *deplore* the fights in hockey games, so we'll be sure to take these kind of lame promises just as seriously. (snicker) (Incidentally, don't trust any candidate who quotes Arlo Guthrie in "Alices Restaraunt" and says "I wanna kill. I wanna kill. I mean, I wanna see blood and guts and veins in my teeth. I wanna kill. KILL! KILL!" because these are the kind of milquetoasts that probably brake for whales and will screw up a perfectly good netwar season with their puerile sniveling for calm. C'mon, fess up... you tryna tell me that you forked out five grand for a BBS system that was just gonna bring in the DOGTALK echo? At the beginning of each season, grunt sysops will make irrational decisions about who they hate at the moment, and will bounce up and down in their cribs, asking to be picked by their most favoured Network Coordinator. Top draft choices will always be those sysops who are prepared to nitpick the hell out of issue that occurred way back in the late fifties. Network Coordinators should not ignore the "specialty teams" that make netwars so fascinating. Getting one of those tight-assed weenies who quotes every obscenity that comes down the turnpike and then appends some cloacally-challenged moralizing, should be counted as almost as important as the wankers who brag that they are the very first to be running the "new" Fido Version 1.01 software. The latter can be be guaranteed to smoke out some peckerwood who counter-brags that he/she has been running that version for three nanoseconds longer.... under Windows, no less. A truly successful Netwar season can be measured by the logarithmic expansion of new nets, and the number of excitable, intrigue-filled, phone calls that Lesley-Dee makes. 7. The Stirring Conclusion: Just as this policy document was about to end. Just as Luke in his X-wing fighter was about to drop the Neutron bomb down the exhaust shaft and put this puppy out of it's misery. Just as the Bikersluts were about to perform peculiar ablutions in the lap of the good Rev. Visage. Just as your RETURN button was begging for mercy like some spaghetti flogged, Jesse Hollington -type combination fax machine and gratification device... just at that moment... a rock fungus will burst it's spore pod and some flatlined-on-the-EEG sysop will suggest that "we really FidoNews 11-26 Page: 19 27 Jun 1994 oughta have lots more policy." ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Just an idea about this NodeList By Jan Derk Otter - 2:282/100.20 Just an idea about this NodeList Last week I've read through several of the latest FidoNews's. I hadn't much time lately, so I read through quite a few of them in a few days. The continuing story seems te be the world NodeList. Most people complain about it's size, and they then try to point out that what causes it to be so big is, that it contains too many duplicate nodes, private nodes, down nodes and nodes on hold. Also the number of flags at the end of each node-entry would be a problem, and cause too much data. They then suggest that the NodeList is cleaned up, so it would regain normal proportions. To my opinion this is not a solution at all. Even if half of the size of the NodeList is caused by this "redundant" information, then cleaning up the NodeList would still result in a filesize of more than 1 Meg currently. I suppose this would still be unacceptable to the most of us, at least to them who currently complain about its size. And even then: if FidoNet continues to grow the way it currently grows, we're back on 2 Megs and more in a relatively short time. So, to my opinion, removing this redundant information is not, or at least of little value. What we really need is another concept. Let's take a look at the "real" world (whatever that may be ;). I'm living in The Netherlands, a small country here in Europe. Though The Netherlands are not a big country all together, I do not have a phonebook of the whole of The Netherlands. In fact I only have a phonebook of my own area. And even that one is already more than 4 cm (~ 1.5 inch) thick. If I would like to have all the books with all the phonenumbers in The Netherlands, I would be left with a stack of books of about 1 meter (~ 3.3 feet) high. That would be a little overdoing things, or not? So, what if I have to call someone whose number I do not have? If the person lives in my own area, I can look up his phonenumber in the book I have. If the person lives in another area, I dail a central service, give them the information they need, and I get the requested number, or a series of numbers which could be of interest to me. If I need a phonenumber from somebody outside The Netherlands, I dial another central service and the same procedure takes place. If the number I got, somehow is of importance to me, I write it down in my personal phonedirectory. Now let's re-think the whole NodeList-idea. From a historic point of view, it is a logical situation where we have come todate, concerning the NodeList. If you have a net with just a FidoNews 11-26 Page: 20 27 Jun 1994 "few" numbers, the idea just works fine. At the size of which FidoNet is at this moment this is already somewhat harder to pretend. At the size of which FidoNet tends to grow at this moment, it might become almost impossible. Nobody is interested in having a Nodelist of 10 Meg or more, lazy laying around on a disk, just occupying space. And every time it's updated it takes to much time. Even on a fast computer. So why not implement the idea of "normal" phonenumbers in the FidoNet. Say I become a new member of the FidoNet. At that moment I get a small file from my Boss (who-ever that may be), containing the most important nodes-information. Of course my and his node-information is in this file, and probably information of a few other important nodes. If I want to send direct Netmail to a node whose information I do not have, I just send a Netmail to an (let call it) AddressManager, requesting information about this node. I so drop an Address-information-request on my Boss's system, using relevant information such as for example a nodenumber, or a name if I don't know the nodenumber, or both parts of them if I just have parts of them both. The requested system (it could be my Boss's system, but of course also might be another system) looks up the information in its own Nodelist. If it finds relevant information, it then compiles a file containing this information and passes that back to me. It also sends me a Netmail saying that something was found. This latter is of cource just for my convenience. If the AddressManager does not find something relevant, it forwards the request to an uplink, and returns me a Netmail saying that nothing was found on it's own system, and that the request is forwarded to that and that system. I then know I might have to wait a little longer before getting an answer. If some node-information was returned, I use a sort of NodelistManager to update my private nodelist, eventualy removing entries that are not of concern to me. And voila, I'm ready and have my updated "phonebook". If nothing returned (but "errors") I know that I probably made a mistake and that in any case the information as I stated it, is not available in any searched Nodelist, which of course would normaly mean that the information is not avalable in any existing Nodelist, including the world NodeList. In essence we already have such a system. If I want an Echomail-area connected, I send a request to an AreaManager. If the requested area is not available on the host-system, it forwards the request to it's own host (or another possible uplink), also requesting that area (for it's own system to be connected). If the system is or becomes connected, I become connected. If not, I get an "error message" returned. Now, one new problem has arisen. How to keep your personal, private nodelist up to date? FidoNews 11-26 Page: 21 27 Jun 1994 Well, again: how does this function in the daily life? Say you call a friend who just bought a new telephone. You probably won't notice this until s/he mentions. You're discussing this topic for some time, and both sides know all of each other again. Finished. How to implement this in the FidoLand? As we (almost) all know, we have this fine and wonderful EMSI/IEMSI handshake-protocol. This protocol has some fields defined, and also allows for some EXTRA_FIELDS to be defined. One of the already predefined EXTRA_FIELDS is the IDENT-field. This field servers as "General identification of system that includes all information to generate a St. Louis-format nodelist entry." (I quoted this from the FSC-0056 specs). I suppose it's obvious what I'm up to. One system calls another. They both connect to each other via an IEMSI handshake. If one of the EMSI-datafields was the IDENT-field, then the information in this field is saved until after the session is finished. After the session completed, the IDENT-information is compared to the known node-information for that specific node. If the information has altered in the meantime, the (private) nodelist is updated. Of course no Nodelist-files serving as files for download or file-request, residing on the system are altered! Just the nodelist the mailer uses to set up connections. And of course it is important not to use any other data than the data in the NodeList for that specific node! In this way, what we end up with is a "few" big main systems, where the whole, complete world NodeList resides. For example two or three in every Region. The somewhat smaller but still big systems contain the smaller Nodelists. For example a Nodelist of the specific Zone. And the smaller systems contain the smaller Nodelists, for example just the ones from the most important Regions for the specific area. And everybody else just "own's" its own nodelist, whatever it may contain. Of course, everybody who likes to do so may request a specific complete Nodelist, even the complete world NodeList for my part. And they may of course request to get the reguarly updates send to keep this Nodelist up to date. But for the most part of us, we could do with our own private nodelist, I suppose. This all doesn't mean that the integrity of the Nodelists is not important. Of course it is. And there should be people taking care of that. Well, before this article get's even longer, I think I should make an end somewhere here. I know this whole thought needs some re-thinking. But of course I can and want not do that all myself. These are just FidoNews 11-26 Page: 22 27 Jun 1994 first thoughts about how to implement a new type of nodelist-distribution, without having to be incompatible with the past. Just give it a thought. Think of it. Reconsider: do you really need a complete nodelist on your system, or can you do with a list of the few nodes you daily call? Do you have phonebooks of the whole world? How many entries of the nodelist you have, do you really use? Any suggestions are welcome. Don't send them to me. Send them to the FidoNews bulletin. As I did. Or send them to a (professional) programmer who has experience in programming for the FidoNet, and who probably might like this and/or your idea. Though I'm a programmer myself, I don't think I start writing software for the FidoNet. And, if you have anything unpleasant to tell (mail) me, please send that to 0:0/0.0 or something equivalent. If you really dare, try to get it published in one of the next FidoNews's. Sorry this article got so long. I didn't plan that. With sincerely greetings, hoping my article may be of help to all of you, Jan Derk Otter AKA Nozem (2:282/100.20) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Reply to article in FidoNews 11-24 Mikael St†ldal (2:201/337) In FidoNews 11-24 there was an article, "D R A F T P R O P O S A L", about Zone One Mail Backbone Policy. There was no name or address in the article so I can only reply this way. You may say that I shouldn't care since this is a policy for zone 1 and I'm in zone 2. But I think that it will affect the whole FidoNet, why publish it in FidoNews otherwise? Many international EchoMail areas will be covered by this, right? In that case the whole FidoNet will be affected. > 4.2 Message Technical Standards > -------------------------------- > FTSC specification FTS-0001 is followed. > Only ASCII characters are used in a message's control fields. What does the last quoted line mean? Does "ASCII" mean only 7 bit and "control fields" include From, To and Subject? If that is the case, why? How should then people like me do? I have a non-ASCII character in my name, the thrid letter in my last name is an 'a' with a ring above. I don't want to change it to a normal 'a' as I have done in the nodelist. FidoNews 11-26 Page: 23 27 Jun 1994 If you specially say that only 7 bit is allowed in the header, then it's logical to draw the conclusion that 8 bit *is* allowed in the message body. That good, but shouldn't you specify a character set or a method to indicate which character set is used (such as FSC-54)? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Nodelist Doug Mclean (1:255/9) In response to an article entitled "Insanity" by Carl Kristoffersen (1:141/910) which appeared in FIDO1125.NWS, regarding the size of the nodelist. First, if Mr. Kristoffersen's nodelist is only 1.54 megs, then I would suggest that he has either a regional nodelist, a compressed one, or an antique one. My nodelist (nodelist.168) is 2735309 bytes long. My nodelist compiler tells me the following about it (I'll use some of these numbers later on): Total Nodes Processed = 32415 Bad Nodes = 0 Unique Nodes = 32415 Nodes Down = 643 Points = 3 ------------------------------------- Zone Coordinators Listed = 7 Regional Coordinators Listed = 72 Network Coordinators Listed = 725 Hub Coordinators Listed = 1535 ===================================== Diff'ing = 0:34 Parsing = 0:19 Sorting = 0:03 Processing = 0:00 Writing = 0:22 ------------------------------------- Total time needed = 1:18 As you can see, the "real" nodelist (this week) has 643 nodes listed as "down", almost double the number claimed by Mr. Kristoffersen. Mr. Kristoffersen is correct that the time it takes to compile a nodelist could be shortened only marginally and not enough to make any real difference (although why his nodelist compiler takes 30 min to compile a 1.5 meg nodelist is beyond me). However, if we assume that the time required to process a nodelist is directly proportional to it's size (not necessairly a valid assumption), then my calculator tells me he would save about 2 min (by his numbers), not about .12 seconds. Carl, how did you arrive at .12 seconds? Further, he is ignoring the time it takes to recieve the nodelist FidoNews 11-26 Page: 24 27 Jun 1994 via modem, and the space it consumes on a hard drive. He also ignores most of the possible measures to trim the nodelist, concentrating only on down nodes and the v32/v32b and v42/v42b flags. There is a fair amount of excess in the nodelist that could easily be eliminated. Let's do some rough calculations. I wrote a small program to count some of the things in the nodelist, and I will use the results below. I will assume that the average node occupies 80 bytes in the nodelist, and that the average comment line occupies 60 bytes. The following may contain a small amount of guesswork and estimates, but should give us a general idea of what COULD be saved. Note that when you eliminate a flag, you eliminate one of the associated commas, for an extra byte saving, this is why I assume that eliminating a single (for example) V32 saves 4 bytes. Also note that the following is not a complete list of all redundancies, but a quick look at just some of them: Eliminate "down" nodes: 643 * 80 bytes = 51440 bytes Eliminate the dashes in phone numbers, 1-506-636-9117 would become 15066369117. I don't think software needs the dashes anyway: 32415 nodes * 3 bytes = 97245 bytes Eliminate the underscores in the BBS names AND in the locations, the capitals for each word should suffice. Leave them in the sysop name, software needs that to reply correctly to messages: 32415 nodes * 2 bytes = 64830 bytes (2 bytes/node is a very conservative estimate for both BBS name and location taken together) Replace CM for nodes that are 24 hour with a flag for nodes that aren't CM (maybe ZM for Zone Mail hour only) 24293 nodes * 3 bytes - (8122 nodes * 3 bytes) = 48513 bytes Eliminate the last 2 chars of baud, 2400 would become 24, 9600 becomes 96 etc: 32415 nodes * 2 bytes = 64830 bytes Eliminate the V42 and V42b flags. Who uses these anyway???? V42 flags 612 nodes * 4 bytes = 2448 bytes V42b flags 11928 nodes * 5 bytes = 59640 bytes Eliminate V32 from V32/V32b pairs: 317 nodes * 4 bytes = 1268 bytes Eliminate comment lines. Make these available in a fido document instead for those who want them: 1055 lines * 60 bytes = 63300 bytes -------------- Total bytes saved: = 453514 bytes 453514 / 2735309 = .1658, or over 16% of the nodelist. And, that doesn't even include other redundancies, like FidoNews 11-26 Page: 25 27 Jun 1994 non-standard flags, pairs involving HST flags etc. Even more space could be saved by eliminating other redundancies that I didn't check for, but surely must exist. If we assumed that 80 percent of nodes maintain a full nodelist, we can collectively save at least 453514 bytes * (.9 * 32415) nodes = 1.323 E 10 bytes or 12617.7 megs of hard drive space worldwide. And that number will grow as fido grows! While the above could be implemented fairly easily (except maybe the baud rate change), we could save even more space in the distant future with even more radical changes. Replace MO, CM, X? etc flags with a 16 bit hex number (represented as text 0000 - FFFF) where each bit represents a flag. Replace the modem capability flags with a similar scheme. Eliminate the baud rate all together and use only the modem flags instead. Maybe move the nodelist to a binary format (to increase speed as well as reduce size). While these ideas could not be implemented immediately, standards for their future use could be developed (these things take time, right?). Finally, I must agree with Mr. Kristoffersen that it is not imperitave that drastic changes be made immediately. After all, while 12617.7 megs sounds like a LOT of hard drive space, it isn't really that much when divided among over 30000 nodes. But, computers in general (and telecommunications in particular) are rapidly changing, and fido is eventually going to need to trim some fat from the nodelist, and develop standards for a new nodelist format. The current nodelist format is rapidly becomming too complex and outdated. Why not start looking at some changes now? If changes aren't made, 10 years down the road the nodelist will become a huge monster that will not be practical to work with. It is getting pretty close to that point now! The future will have to bring changes, and a good time to start looking at them is today. Doug McL