https://www.reddit.com/r/zenbuddhism/comments/1i63jjx/buddhism_is_not_lifedenying/
created by minutemanred on 20/01/2025 at 22:47 UTC
41 upvotes, 7 top-level comments (showing 7)
Suffering is CONTAINED in life, not the *whole* facet of it. Life CONTAINS many things: cold, hot, red, green, piss, poop. Would it not be natural, when freezing cold, to bring balance by wearing a scarf?
A Buddhist, when met with suffering, may *embrace* it (and all things) with compassion: "I see this suffering as it is. I hold it like a mother holds her child." – and like the clouds on a cloudy day, it moves over us and we realize, *oh, I've been here all along!* Resting in this moment. How could this ever be "life-denying"?
Shall we embrace the moment; containing all things and nothing at once, just as it is, and let it be what it is?
I see this chronic pain as what it is, I am of the nature to experience chronic pain.
I see my mental anguish as what it is, I am of the nature to experience mental anguish.
And like this, all things become realized.
Comment by chintokkong at 21/01/2025 at 04:04 UTC*
6 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Suffering is CONTAINED in life, not the whole facet of it.
This isn't quite what the buddhist teaching on dukkha (suffering) is about.
For those who would like to understand the basic relevance of dukkha (suffering) to buddhism, Dhammacakkappavattanasutta is a good text to check out. I also wrote a short summary of what dukkha (suffering) in the sutta is about:
https://www.reddit.com/r/zenbuddhism/comments/131l1t2/the_four_noble_truths_and_the_relationship_of/
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Those interested in the pervasiveness of dukkha (suffering) through the six modes of being/life, can explore and investigate the dharma mark of:
While discussing about dukkha (suffering) in buddhism, might be helpful to note also that dukkha (suffering) is a key theme in sravakayana buddhism, and not quite so much in mahayana buddhism of which the zen school is part of.
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Finally, like to point out that u/jundocohen has a history in this sub of misinterpreting zen koans, even as he likes to dish out his explanations of koans with the supposed authority of a Soto zen priest.
In one of his posts in this thread, he has finally corrected his erroneous translation of a term (谛观 - from "listen" to "observe") in Case 1 of Book of Serenity after being pointed out to him two years ago, but it seems he is still trying to push the koan as about silence in this thread.
Used to be able to respond to his posts, like the factual mistakes and his misleading translation of chinese words, as per this post (https://www.reddit.com/r/zenbuddhism/comments/10ex8b2/understanding_the_koans_of_the_book_of_serenity/j4v1ibw/[1]), but well, he has blocked me.
For those interested in koan texts like Book of Serenity and Blue Cliff Record, it's a good idea to check out the actual lines of the source texts and not rely fully on other's explanations.
Comment by TK-Squared-LLC at 21/01/2025 at 05:12 UTC
4 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Let's make this easier. You may have noticed that there always seems to be something missing,. something you have left undone, it always seems that if only you could have this or do that your life would be complete and you would have eternal happiness.
That is what it means to be human. That craving, that longing, that empty spot, that lack of fulfillment. THAT is the NORMAL human condition. It can't "be satisfied." Nothing you do can make you not feel like something is missing. It is, actually, what has driven all of human advancement, all of the exploration and discovery, all of human knowledge, it was all an attempt at satisfying that that...that something that seems to be missing. But it never will. Because this is how you are supposed to feel. This is being human.
Comment by jczZzc at 21/01/2025 at 17:50 UTC
4 upvotes, 0 direct replies
That suffering is part of life shouldn’t be taken as a negative/bad thing.
Comment by Airinbox_boxinair at 21/01/2025 at 07:16 UTC
2 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Driving force of “life” is suffering in my opinion. But, we gain something in return. I need to spend my money in order to buy something. I don’t want to lessen my money but i have to. It is the cost of doing things is suffering. It is only annoying when we don’t get something valuable in return. But we can also name the driving force as karma and call suffering as absence of pay back.
Comment by 2bitmoment at 21/01/2025 at 16:00 UTC
1 upvotes, 1 direct replies
I don't know about whether Buddhism is life-denying or not. I do know certain self-identifying buddhists seem to be life-denying. Saying that life is just an illusion. Maybe they should call themselves nihilists instead of buddhists.
Comment by CertaintyDangerous at 20/01/2025 at 23:28 UTC
1 upvotes, 2 direct replies
All true! Now say this with half as many words. And then after that, half as many again.
Comment by JundoCohen at 21/01/2025 at 07:35 UTC
1 upvotes, 0 direct replies
There is pain in this life, sadness, loss and worry for tomorrow ... there is cold, hot, red, green, piss, poop. It is true. We must embrace it, as it is. This is life, let it live! We are of the nature to experience pain and sometimes mental anguish.
And yet, and yet, there is no birth and death, no lack or anything to mourn, a place beyond hot or cold, red, green, piss, shit., free of all pain and all anguish.
Yes, all of such at once as one.