https://www.reddit.com/r/toolbox/comments/141locs/announcement_reddits_upcoming_api_changes_and/
created by creesch on 05/06/2023 at 17:24 UTC
420 upvotes, 34 top-level comments (showing 25)
Over the past few days I have seen various people debate the API changes, blackouts and all sorts of things related to that subject. As such, I have also seen various people bring toolbox to the conversation.
Reddit recently announced[1] changes to their API which ultimately ends in Reddit's API moving to a paid model. This would mean 3rd Party developers would have to pay Reddit for continued and sustained access to their API on pricing that could be considered similar to Twitter's new pricing[2]. The dev of Apollo did a good breakdown of this here[3] and here[4].
1: https://www.reddit.com/r/reddit/comments/12qwagm/an_update_regarding_reddits_api/
2: https://www.wired.co.uk/article/twitter-data-api-prices-out-nearly-everyone
3: https://www.reddit.com/r/apolloapp/comments/12ram0f/had_a_few_calls_with_reddit_today_about_the/
^^Yes, ^^stolen ^^from ^^the ^^RES ^^announcement[5] ^^because ^^they ^^did ^^a ^^nice ^^job ^^of ^^writing ^^it.
There are two ways to look at the impact these changes have on toolbox:
1. The immediate technical impact on toolbox.
2. The other side of the coin.
This one is simple. Toolbox only uses the reddit API, so isn't impacted by things like pushshift not being accessible. The API policy in general also isn't likely to impact toolbox in the foreseeable future. Simply due to the nature of it being a browser extension and effectively making use of the reddit session.
This also has been said as much by reddit themselves.
Toolbox is currently not directly impacted. Hooray! That doesn't mean there is no impact on toolbox. In fact, these API changes are part of a downward spiral where reddit as a platform is closing up more and more. Reddit is gone from a platform where the code was open (I even still have the badge to prove it) to one where a once vibrant third party developer community has been dealt blow after blow. This clear signal reddit is sending to the world also impacts any future toolbox might still have.
Toolbox development already has slowed down to a crawl over the past few years. The two of us still maintaining it still do it out of a sense of obligation and a bit of pride.
In an ideal situation, there would be plenty of people ready to step in and help out. In the past this actually was the case as we have had dozens of people contribute with varying levels of activity. But, that simply isn't the case anymore. The same is true for similar projects like RES.
For a bit more thought on the matter, you can also see my comments in the modnews announcement thread[6].
I felt like I should make this post as I have seen people use toolbox in their discussions about whether they should join protests or not. This post isn't here to make that decision for anyone. I just felt that instead of selectively being quoted from various posts and comments, I'd just provide the information in a single place here.
Comment by 2th at 05/06/2023 at 17:28 UTC
38 upvotes, 2 direct replies
Toolbox is currently not directly impacted.
Oh thank god. Thank you for all your work creesch and the rest of the team. Yall make modding so much better, which in turn makes reddit better.
Comment by Pissmittens at 05/06/2023 at 17:31 UTC
23 upvotes, 1 direct replies
Without Toolbox, there is no meaningful moderation on Reddit for me. Full stop.
I owe you and your team a debt of gratitude that I fear I may never be able to adequately repay.
Thanks for all that you do <3
Comment by Georgy_K_Zhukov at 05/06/2023 at 17:47 UTC
14 upvotes, 1 direct replies
As you say, toolbox isn't directly impacted, but that doesn't stop me from being fearful of the path things are on. I don't use it, but my understanding is that Apollo was the toolbox equivalent for mobile centric mods, with a robust suite of mod tools.
If reddit had done this at the same time they announced mod tool parity with Apollo that would be one thing. But as you more than anyone are no doubt mindful of, reddit does so little to build their mod tools to that point and have continued to let that be off sourced to folks like you...
So when they pull the rug on one prong of that without having prepared anything to fill that void, it gives me no faith that if, God forbid, future changes DO directly impact toolbox functionality, they will have their native built tools be anything close to comparable.
So just because certain third party features aren't impacted now doesn't mean this isn't a picture of the direction things are going.
Comment by Derausmwaldkam at 05/06/2023 at 17:29 UTC
13 upvotes, 1 direct replies
Reading the headline gave me a short little heart attack
Comment by kittens_from_space at 05/06/2023 at 17:27 UTC
14 upvotes, 1 direct replies
Yep, Reddit is really hitting it out the park with shitty decisions. Not to mention that these API changes make it harder for us mods to do our work, but it hinders spam detection. There's been a HUGE wave of repost bots, and Reddit has done absolutely nothing to block these.
It might even be Reddit astroturfing their own site to boost post and engagement stats, just like they were caught doing previously[1].
Comment by 1Davide at 05/06/2023 at 17:35 UTC
7 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Thank you for this clear and to-the-point submission.
And deep gratitude for your work.
Comment by maybesaydie at 05/06/2023 at 17:34 UTC
6 upvotes, 0 direct replies
I'm happy that toolbox will be okay because I depend on it every day.
You're right about this being just another blow in a long series of admin decisions that will eventually drive away long term users and mods in favor of the ghastly tiktok experience they provide on the native apps.
Comment by powerchicken at 05/06/2023 at 17:40 UTC
7 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Without this tool I would have quit modding long ago. You guys are the best.
Comment by squarecoinman at 05/06/2023 at 17:35 UTC
5 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Thanks for the update and Info , and for all the work done on the toolbox
Comment by [deleted] at 05/06/2023 at 17:36 UTC
5 upvotes, 0 direct replies
[deleted]
Comment by billbapapa at 05/06/2023 at 18:02 UTC
6 upvotes, 0 direct replies
I thank the two of you and appreciate that you even have stuck with it this long.
Be well, and may the future be great for you both.
Comment by parrycarry at 05/06/2023 at 18:37 UTC
4 upvotes, 0 direct replies
As long as Toolbox works, I can continue using Reddit no differently than I currently do. Toolbox upped my Modding game significantly when I was introduced to it, and I couldn't go without it.
Comment by JBHUTT09 at 05/06/2023 at 18:56 UTC
4 upvotes, 1 direct replies
Reddit is absolutely in the "enshittification" process that social media platforms all inevitably reach.
https://www.wired.com/story/tiktok-platforms-cory-doctorow/
Comment by 316nuts at 05/06/2023 at 17:43 UTC
7 upvotes, 1 direct replies
Comment by Karmanacht at 05/06/2023 at 18:01 UTC
3 upvotes, 1 direct replies
In an ideal situation, there would be plenty of people ready to step in and help out. In the past this actually was the case as we have had dozens of people contribute with varying levels of activity. But, that simply isn't the case anymore. The same is true for similar projects like RES.
I've done some editing of toolbox and I know a little bit of javascript, I could easily learn more as one of my professional roles is software development.
Do you need people to work on it?
Comment by f0rgotten at 06/06/2023 at 00:05 UTC
3 upvotes, 0 direct replies
I used to mod a few large, busy subs - at least in my opinion - and that experience was night and day once I discovered Toolbox. Reddit's been going down the tubes for some time and that is part of what made me want to *stop* moderating to begin with, but I can't imagine moderating without Toolbox. Best of wishes to the devs, and hope we can all find something as cool as reddit used to be in the future.
Comment by Oak_jack at 01/07/2023 at 22:59 UTC
3 upvotes, 0 direct replies
I couldn't run my subreddits without you guys. You deserve to feel that sense of pride!
Comment by nivh_de at 05/06/2023 at 17:56 UTC
2 upvotes, 0 direct replies
thank you both for your work!
Comment by fluffywhitething at 05/06/2023 at 18:16 UTC
2 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Thank you for the update! I rely on toolbox!
Comment by SamMee514 at 05/06/2023 at 18:17 UTC
2 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Thanks for all that you and the team have done. I really couldn't moderate without this tool.
Comment by [deleted] at 05/06/2023 at 18:19 UTC
2 upvotes, 1 direct replies
[deleted]
Comment by PlNG at 05/06/2023 at 19:49 UTC
2 upvotes, 0 direct replies
I thank you all for your contributions to a marvelous addon.
Comment by texnessa at 05/06/2023 at 22:09 UTC
2 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Can't mod without it. Thank you for what you do.
Comment by iKR8 at 06/06/2023 at 06:45 UTC
2 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Thank you for your continuous work on Toolbox without having much support. We do understand that currently toolbox is not gonna get affected by the API fiasco, but can understand your concerns that things can change in a heartbeat, and also breaking of 3rd party apps and bots can have a domino affect somewhere.
Wishing you guys all the best and thanking you for making our modding experience smoother all these years.
Comment by creepgirl at 05/06/2023 at 19:12 UTC
2 upvotes, 1 direct replies
As a mod of a somewhat large sub, Moderator Toolbox is absolutely essential. If it would help, I'd gladly pay a few $ a month to keep it going. And yes I know, thousands of us would have to do that.
As a developer myself, I also understand the developer fatigue that sets in after a while, and Reddits move towards being closed rather than (mostly) open, doesn't help with the aforementioned fatigue.
Reddit *really* need to take a good, hard look at its most loyal user base. Those of us who's been here for over 2 decades is going to stop moderating these big subs, thus decreasing the quality of those subs. It doesn't take a genius to figure out what the result will be in the long run.