https://www.nytimes.com/2025/02/02/us/politics/democrats-trump.html
created by MediocreExternal9 on 03/02/2025 at 01:09 UTC
296 upvotes, 45 top-level comments (showing 25)
Comment by Scary_Firefighter181 at 03/02/2025 at 01:14 UTC*
353 upvotes, 17 direct replies
The smartest play is to bide your time and wait. There's no point in getting outraged by every thing, because that's how Trump works- he floods the environment with chaos, which in turn makes the public numb, and the dems get swept up with it.
Its also time to really align with the mood of the public with stuff like the border. People recognized just how lax the Dems had been on it until a year before the election where they suddenly seemed to realize how unpopular it was. They need to distance themselves from the far left side of the party, and realize that a majority of the public support deportations of illegal immigrants and so on. There's no point in trying to shed tears over it- agree with it or not, getting with the times is the smart play.
Also being smart would be to stop, for heavens sake, talking outwardly about identity politics(people *really* hate it, and if the new DNC meeting was anything to go by, I'm not hopeful)- right now, its the GOP relentlessly blaming DEI for everything, and are super disorganized and chaotic. People will inevitably grow tired and will start hating that too- then seize the opportunity and constantly spread good things you're doing on social media and podcasts(Barron Trump really schooled the entire Dem apparatus on navigating the modern landscape)
Otherwise, tbh, just wait for Trump's tariffs to hit people's wallets and watch everyone grow tired. I feel that Whitmer has really played it smart so far, she's been pretty quiet and has reached out to get on Trump's good side to help Michigan as much as she can while still spreading her message(I wish her good luck with those tariffs hitting her autoworkers though)
Comment by Lowtheparasite at 03/02/2025 at 02:03 UTC
172 upvotes, 10 direct replies
Electing David hoggs as vice chairman. The message is clear gun control.
Comment by zenbuddha85 at 03/02/2025 at 01:23 UTC
77 upvotes, 3 direct replies
I think the opposition party (I’m intentionally not using the word Democrat) should prioritize competence, good will, and personal liberty - all of which will be severely eroded during this term. There is no reason to react to Trump insanity since it happens ad nauseum; but also important to not miss key opportunities to strike.
Comment by Careful_Farmer_2879 at 03/02/2025 at 02:15 UTC*
64 upvotes, 4 direct replies
I often see the idea that the trans issue was blown out of proportion in 2024.
Well… this is about upending a societal norm that has been the basis of human behavior for all of history. How’s that a small thing? Not judging where people fall on the issue, but don’t insult voter’s intelligence by pretending it’s not a big deal.
Voters felt it’s gone too far and are concerned it will go further. They don’t like what they saw, I’m sorry.
Comment by alittledanger at 03/02/2025 at 01:30 UTC
56 upvotes, 0 direct replies
There seems to be a consensus brewing among Democratic governors that they should let people really feel the effects of Trump’s policies this time.
I don’t know how sustainable this is but I am leaning towards agreeing in the short term. The hubris of the administration is astounding and they are bound to eventually overreach and screw up massively.
And the Dems really need to drop identity politics and make their cities/states more affordable places to live. As someone in the Bay Area, I don’t blame voters at all for thinking we don’t care about cost of living issues. They can just look to the housing policies of big blue metros to have all of their assumptions confirmed.
Comment by notapersonaltrainer at 03/02/2025 at 01:15 UTC
148 upvotes, 7 direct replies
Their priorities are plenty coherent[1]. They're just not appealing.
1: https://x.com/CollinRugg/status/1885864492375892354
Comment by Quality_Cucumber at 03/02/2025 at 01:14 UTC
125 upvotes, 4 direct replies
I think they spent so much time catering to San Francisco, they forgot about the rest of the nation.
Comment by Evol-Chan at 03/02/2025 at 01:37 UTC
48 upvotes, 2 direct replies
Really hoping Democrats get a stronger message in the future. Something that actually matters to most people and isn't just " Hey! um, well, I am not THAT guy, lol"
Comment by DRO1019 at 03/02/2025 at 01:43 UTC
41 upvotes, 1 direct replies
No, they don't. They left their base for white-collar suburban voters and the corporate establishment. Chuck Schumer even said that was the plan. When they lose one blue-collar voter, they will gain two white-collar voters. It's going to be another 2 terms of Republican control. Might be 3.
Obama took more money from Wall Street than McCain, Democratic Party has been broken since 08', it just took losing to someone like Trump for them to admit it.
Comment by I_Never_Use_Slash_S at 03/02/2025 at 01:22 UTC
48 upvotes, 3 direct replies
“We’re not Trump” is probably going to be more popular in 4 years, they’ll just stick with that.
Comment by Put-the-candle-back1 at 03/02/2025 at 01:53 UTC
46 upvotes, 2 direct replies
It's normal for a party to not have an overall message soon after losing. After Republicans lost in 2012, Trump didn't take over until years later.
Comment by likeitis121 at 03/02/2025 at 01:36 UTC
12 upvotes, 0 direct replies
“The policies that we support and the message that we have is not wrong,” Mr. Martin said in an interview after his victory. “It is a messaging problem and a brand problem. Those voters are not connecting our policies with their lives.”
I mean, you do have a trust issue after you tried to convince us that all these people under 40 are struggling to keep up with Biden, but I think you need to look deeper than that. "We're perfect, but we need to be better at talking about ourselves", that doesn't inspire a lot of confidence that you are willing to look at what went wrong.
Comment by alotofironsinthefire at 03/02/2025 at 01:45 UTC
26 upvotes, 1 direct replies
Honestly outside of what they are doing right now, working in Congress grilling appointments And helping to establish lawsuits on illegal EOs. I don't think they should be doing anything else.
People voted for this and pointing out all the very bad decisions Trump has made in the last 8 years has not done anything.
Let them stick the fork in the outlet.
Comment by pixelatedCorgi at 03/02/2025 at 01:42 UTC
21 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Well that’s the understatement of the century. You’re telling me screaming that anyone who doesn’t agree with your wild culture war hot-take of the day is a racist, sexist, xenophobic bigot isn’t a party-wide unifying strategy? 🤔
Comment by ventitr3 at 03/02/2025 at 01:12 UTC
19 upvotes, 1 direct replies
They’ve been doing it for like 10yrs straight, why is it hard now?
Comment by [deleted] at 03/02/2025 at 01:56 UTC
14 upvotes, 3 direct replies
[removed]
Comment by Maladal at 03/02/2025 at 04:42 UTC
9 upvotes, 1 direct replies
If the tariffs work out poorly then they should prioritize unions, push anti-monopoly and anti-oligarchy legislation, keep border control, keep anti-China, but emphasize friendly relationships with Canada and Mexico specifically. They should position the tariffs as a failure of isolationism/protectionism.
DEI--either rename it or de-emphasize it to the bottom of the platform. We're in the new McCarthysim and right now it's in its heyday. People will get tired of it eventually but that time isn't now.
They should stick to Green policies.
Abortion didn't win them much, but I wouldn't stop pushing for at least a 12-16 week allowance or more. Either as federal law or just as a measure in as many states as possible
If the tariffs are really bad then they should try to swing laws or even constitutional amendments that restrict the powers of the President.
If the tariffs are good then I don't know and they should wait for the midterms before making a play.
Comment by Hour-Mud4227 at 03/02/2025 at 02:54 UTC*
4 upvotes, 1 direct replies
All due respect to the Very Serious Punditry, the ever-successful Democratic leadership, (/s) and some commenters here, but I call bullshit on this 'lay low and let Trump be Trump' strategy.
A.) There is no evidence it works. Not for Republicans, not for Democrats. When did the Republicans claw back their biggest gains against the Dems when they were a minority? In 'complain about and stonewall everything' mode in 2012-2016.. When did the Democrats have their most recent success? In 2018, 2020 and 2022. What did the latter three elections have in common? They featured Democrats at peak '#resistance' mode. When did Harris get her biggest bounce? When she and Walz were poking fun at Trump, Vance and co. for being 'weird'. When did they get precisely nothing? When they were trying to look 'reasonable, meek and moderate' by parading around the Cheneys.
B.) It makes the exact *opposite* conclusion about how to campaign in the current informational environment than the one that was just vindicated by 2024 election. It ignores that we are in an attention economy. Attention is the currency du jour. Consider the following two statements, and what gets the most attention:
I.) "Donald Trump is a bad person, possibly a fascist; in contrast to him, I will build up the middle class with tax breaks on...zzzzzz...."
II) "I'll BRING PRICES DOWN ON DAY ONE!!! The Democrats support people EATING THE DOGS!!!!"
That's the election we just had. Who won that freaking election? The guy who was shouting (II) from the rooftops. And *that*'s what the Dems need. You *don't* lay low and let the opposition "defeat themselves"--you win the attention game, by being louder, more brash, more bombastic than the opposition. So loud, brash and bombastic that your memes are all over tik-tok, Joe Rogan can't ignore your antics, and Republicans can't get a word in, because everyone's busy being entertained at your performances. It doesn't have to be 'eating the dogs'--Bernie Sanders's 'The 1% and the vampire billionaires are picking your pockets!' will do fine, and be accurate to boot.
I keep hearing people say "Well if you oppose every little thing people grow numb to it"; but this ignores one very self-evident fact--that people are already numb. They're already basking in competing information streams. And they don't have time to research the veracity of each one. So what do they do? They go with the one that gets their attention by eliciting the strongest emotions in them. The lesson of 2024 is that you must be the one who elicits those strong emotions, whether negative or positive--or people will lose whatever message you have in the noise.
Comment by Lurkingandsearching at 03/02/2025 at 03:02 UTC
3 upvotes, 0 direct replies
It all goes back to 2008. The DNC couldn't push Hillary and Obama was the will of the people steamrolling the DNC's wishes, so when 2016 rolled around they pushed Hillary harder and made sure to push anyone else out... and we as a nation got Trump as a result. 2020 rolls around, people still remember what Trumps actual first term was and wanted anything else, so the DNC shoves Biden on the Democrats and run as "Not Trump", because people wanted some form of "normal".
Ironically this "normal" was undoing some damage, but the man they "put in charge" was revealed to not be all there, and not as sharp as he may have been decades prior, but he was the DNC's "guy" to keep the status quo just enough for the people on Wall St to stay happy. Still I think the Democrats would still do better than Trump, but in turn the GOP had other options that were also better than Trump, but they likely wouldn't have played ball with the Tech Bros who we are watching in real time start to gut the country.
I know why the Democrats picked Harris, because she could use the campaign funds and it was too little too late, but Biden never should have run again in the first place and there should have been and open primary for the Democrats. But once again, they wanted their "sure win".
That said I still think the GOP should have taken the bitter pill and barred Trump and joined up in prosecuting him over the Fake Electors, instead of doubling down over him. I know his supporters may not like it, but after everything he did, it would have been the right thing.
Now both parties are falling apart, if we want to admit it or not, and frankly I'd rather not have the extremes of either side take over. Right now, we are seeing a lot of previous bad choices all coming to a head, and there's not much we can do about it unless leadership from both parties and their supporters actually have the will to step up and fix things.
Comment by KayeToo at 03/02/2025 at 05:34 UTC
3 upvotes, 1 direct replies
Maybe they should stop making their entire platform about opposing Trump.
Comment by Cryptogenic-Hal at 03/02/2025 at 01:36 UTC
9 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Some advice for Dems, Trump will be Trump, you'll probably win the house in the midterms, you might as well make a deal with him on immigration. The country has shifted right on immigration after Biden opened the borders but if Dems can shelve that issue with legislation, they can concentrate on other matters. Immigration will be front and center during the Trump years, might as well neuter it with a deal.
Comment by HarlemHellfighter96 at 03/02/2025 at 01:31 UTC
5 upvotes, 0 direct replies
It’s not just good enough to say”We aren’t Trump anymore”.
Comment by hylianpersona at 03/02/2025 at 01:49 UTC
5 upvotes, 0 direct replies
The truth is that they don’t need a message right now. Let America see what musk does to the economy. They won’t like it
Comment by MediocreExternal9 at 03/02/2025 at 01:19 UTC
4 upvotes, 2 direct replies
This article goes into how Democrats are struggling to find a message after their defeat back in Nov. They can't seem to find a clear message with their being multiple calls from different members to focus on different topics. Right now it all seems to be in a free for all with some established Dems urging Schumer to be more retaliatory against Trump's actions while others suggest waiting it out and be mindful what they say. Generally, there's this feeling that they failed and that their message is toxic.
I personally think that this article is a great insight into the current workings of the Democratic Party and explains why they've been quiet during Trump's more hostile rhetoric against our allies. They are in crisis and have no idea what they're doing. I don't think the Democrats can wait anymore and will need to start speaking out more against Trump, especially because his second term has begun with such a bang. I just don't know how affective it'll be since they don't have a message yet, but I think their only option now is the 'making it up as they go along' option.
What do you guys think? You think the Democrats will come up with a new message soon and what do you think it will focus on?
Comment by risky_bisket at 03/02/2025 at 06:37 UTC
2 upvotes, 0 direct replies
The problem they're facing is that if they tell the truth about what's scaring them (hostile takeover of the government by oligarchs) they sound crazy and it turns off everyone who's not immersed in politics.