https://www.reddit.com/r/feminisms/comments/1hfscny/the_largest_womens_revolutionary_force_is_being/
created by BuildThenBurn on 16/12/2024 at 20:15 UTC*
84 upvotes, 21 top-level comments (showing 21)
I've been a feminist for about ten years now. I became a feminist because I came to realise, that at the core of all of societies ills - from the unjust neoliberalism & neocolonialism of the West, mass killings, genocides, capitalist greed is maleness, and that in order to build a future based around real justice, democracy and freedom, we must place women at the core of social and political life. Coming to this conclusion, I began reading a lot of books which strengthen already perceived notions I considered but only barely thought about deeply - chiefly Women's History of the World by Rosalind Miles, Woman on the Edge of Time by Marge Piercy, Woman at Point Zero by Nawal El Saadawi & Women Without Men by Shahrnush Parsipur.
This being said, I have since often found it difficult to relate to other feminists, and without sounding extremely self wankery, I find a great deal of what a lot of feminists my age talk about, to be deeply banal and asinine. Firstly, I see a great deal of asinine superfluous conversations which whilst may have vaguely important notions, are mostly just something cathartic to rant about, conversations which go nowhere and have no realistic perspective other than to bitch & complain & moan about how shit men are (yes they are, yet a solution is rarely offered). This may not be your experiences, but it certainly is mine.
Meanwhile, often when I talk to feminists (mainly lib feminists, or non-radical feminists which to be honest, is sadly most feminists, certainly not the people in my little left radical bubble, but certainly most feminists my age in my country), they seem utterly devoid of understandings about women's perspectives from the Global South, alternatives to neoliberalism etc. Most western feminists cannot carry a conversation about women's social and political theory in Kurdistan, or North West Africa or from within historical revolutionary movements, and yet we have so much to learn from said movements. More than this, most western feminists do not place an understanding on searching for alternatives or ways out of the neoliberal system, instead wanting to see more women MPs, drone pilots, bankers etc). Such movements offer genuine change and hope for a better future, whilst we live in a political environment stilted and unmoving at best, and moving steadily to the right at worst.
Right now, a revolutionary experiment in North East Syria is being threatened. The overthrowing of Assad has, whilst been at least momentary a moment of celebration for the many many Syrians tortured and oppressed by that beast, has led to instability which now threatens the Rojava, or AANES. This is a radical experiment/autonomous region in the North East of Syria that has for the past 13 years, laid down multiple practical, in use, frameworks for policies and governance based around direct, participatory democracy, ecological justice, religious and ethic pluralism and jineology (a radical Kurdish form of feminism). This area has a real framework, real perspectives, real radical solutions to patriarchy & capitalism.
Ask yourself if you know about this movement, please educate yourself about Rojava if you do not. You might say to yourself "oh of course I understand about Rojava", but if so please come out for them, attend protests and inform your unknowledgeable friends about them.
Edit: For all you types saying "be nice", and "why are you infuriated", I am from Başûrê Kurdistanê, I have lived in UK since I was ten. I am not going to apologies for being deeply infuriated at feminists in this country never looking part their own noses and learning NOTHING about the most important women's revolution of the modern age. I am very very angry at this. I make no apologies.
Here are readings about Rojava, Jineology & what is currently happening with Rojava
https://www.revistalegerin.com/en[1][2]
https://anfenglishmobile.com/[3][4]
https://medyanews.net/why-i-am-seriously-worried-about-kobani-and-the-whole-of-rojava/[5][6]
https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/theory-and-practice-of-kurdish-women-s-movement-interview-in-diyarbakir/[7][8]
https://medyanews.net/jineology-a-women-centred-science-redefining-knowledge-and-life/[9][10]
https://mesopotamia.coop/jineology-knowledge-experience-and-science-of-women/[11][12]
1: https://www.revistalegerin.com/en
2: https://www.revistalegerin.com/en
3: https://anfenglishmobile.com/
4: https://anfenglishmobile.com/
5: https://medyanews.net/why-i-am-seriously-worried-about-kobani-and-the-whole-of-rojava/
6: https://medyanews.net/why-i-am-seriously-worried-about-kobani-and-the-whole-of-rojava/
9: https://medyanews.net/jineology-a-women-centred-science-redefining-knowledge-and-life/
10: https://medyanews.net/jineology-a-women-centred-science-redefining-knowledge-and-life/
11: https://mesopotamia.coop/jineology-knowledge-experience-and-science-of-women/
12: https://mesopotamia.coop/jineology-knowledge-experience-and-science-of-women/
Comment by mysticpotatocolin at 16/12/2024 at 22:32 UTC*
38 upvotes, 1 direct replies
i think sometimes people don’t know/don’t know where to start with feminism in other countries. i did part of my MA on feminism in the middle east and i think finding sources/resources on this stuff can be difficult especially if you’re coming from a western lens. i know a worry of mine when reading was getting some really western view or something completely inaccurate and not knowing because of cultural or societal differences.
then i think it also becomes a question of which countries you focus on. every country in the world has women, do you learn about them all? a surface knowledge of all of them? or just deep knowledge of 5. i don’t think there’s a right answer.
also lol i think it’s funny you’re upset at other feminists for not being as feminist as you yet are using the word ‘bitch’
Comment by StonyGiddens at 17/12/2024 at 02:13 UTC
13 upvotes, 1 direct replies
I know a little about the Rojava. Who is threatening/invading their territory? Are the Rojava U.S. allies?
Comment by [deleted] at 17/12/2024 at 18:16 UTC
12 upvotes, 0 direct replies
[removed]
Comment by JustDeetjies at 17/12/2024 at 09:08 UTC
46 upvotes, 0 direct replies
As a non Western feminist in the *Global South* (man I hate most of these terms so much😭)
This post was needlessly judgmental and rife with internalized sexism at best. You dismiss people venting their frustration or fear or legitimate anger for their sometimes just shitty but a lot of the time violent experiences with men, why? Because they’re in the West? Rape, DV, femicide and a society that protects and venerates abusers is alive and well and *still systemically powerful* in Europe and North America.
You’re comparing oppressions and judging the Global South’s to be “_worse_” so the other women need to shut up and “focus” on “_real_” issues? No.
Listen, there are many ways that women in the Global South struggle that women in the North do not, but in other ways there are parts of the Global South that are better and more progressive than the Global North. More women in parliament and having led countries, more support and easier and cheaper or free access to vital healthcare and at least more talk about the violence and harm women face at the hands of men.
We should be open to each other, listen to each other and support each other - by sharing information and links and *being excited* to share knowledge and tell people.
We need to liberate women the world over, but we also need to liberate ourselves and remain vigilant to the ways in which we have been taught to hate and be critical of other women and ourselves.
Comment by quattroformaggixfour at 17/12/2024 at 09:39 UTC
11 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Drop a few links sis
Comment by genuszsucht at 17/12/2024 at 00:25 UTC
31 upvotes, 1 direct replies
Rojava is an extraordinary project that gives me a great deal of hope. I wish more people would see it too like you do.
Comment by Mander2019 at 16/12/2024 at 21:59 UTC
95 upvotes, 1 direct replies
Judging other feminists based on them specifically putting effort into the issues that you’re concerned with is not helpful. The entire world is swinging conservative right now. Women are losing their rights everywhere because of the declining birth rate. Have some compassion.
Comment by hopeful_communicator at 17/12/2024 at 02:04 UTC
79 upvotes, 1 direct replies
all of this would have been so much more awesome if it were framed as suggested readings and things to consider rather than a massive judgement of your feminist peers
Comment by pie_is_tasty at 17/12/2024 at 03:05 UTC
40 upvotes, 0 direct replies
You know how we are not going to defeat the patriarchy? By negatively judging other feminists. Everyone is a work in progress, show a little more compassion.
Comment by No-vem-ber at 17/12/2024 at 08:09 UTC
16 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Why do you assume we "don't care"? I think every feminist would probably care about this if they were informed about it. But it's not realistic to imagine that every person should be fully informed about every thing you care about. Lots of people don't know lots of things yet. It's normal that people gravitate towards being more passionate about causes that have touched their own lives.
If you approach people like this, like you're already fighting them in your mind before you even meet them, you're going to find yourself in a lot of fights.
Trust me, we want to hear from you. We want to learn from you. But if you come at it with this "you dumb bitches don't even know or care" attitude it's going to turn almost everyone against wanting to learn from you.
Comment by Derois02 at 18/12/2024 at 04:54 UTC
5 upvotes, 0 direct replies
definitely needed to learn about rojava, thanks for it
Comment by StayJaded at 17/12/2024 at 05:46 UTC
25 upvotes, 0 direct replies
I think you missed the #notliketheotherfeminists at the end of your diatribe.
Comment by kat_goes_rawr at 17/12/2024 at 00:51 UTC
31 upvotes, 0 direct replies
We got the top feminist over here
Comment by elkieok at 17/12/2024 at 05:41 UTC
29 upvotes, 1 direct replies
Oh yes, feminist infighting is my favorite brand of feminism. Great work.
Comment by plotthick at 17/12/2024 at 13:54 UTC
13 upvotes, 0 direct replies
We cannot burn the Patriarchy to the ground if we use other feminists for kindling.
Comment by almondrocaslut at 18/12/2024 at 07:30 UTC
8 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Jfc these comments are NOT passing the vibe check. She linked the suggested reading. She’s mad and probably fucking scared (wouldn’t you be?) maybe cool it with the bad vibe policing?? Have you acted perfectly every time you were upset ever in your life?
Comment by Antique_Fondant_8241 at 17/12/2024 at 00:28 UTC
9 upvotes, 0 direct replies
You are right .
Comment by Zomaarwat at 18/12/2024 at 14:26 UTC
5 upvotes, 1 direct replies
Thank you for speaking up. People will try to tone police you, but I am glad some people at least still dare to speak against the neoliberal hegemony.
Comment by sulfurSLUG at 18/12/2024 at 23:51 UTC
2 upvotes, 0 direct replies
I think it is slightly ludicrous for another feminist to tell you to confine your negative feelings or rephrase your emotional statements to a more neutral beige... just an observation.
Same thoughts as all the other comments about OPs anger/feelings being justified, and comments of gratitude for “new to me” literary links on Rojava.
Comment by MarsV89 at 17/12/2024 at 13:45 UTC
3 upvotes, 1 direct replies
Yea please teach me how to be a feminist. Jesus Christ
Comment by LBTTCSDPTBLTB at 23/12/2024 at 00:57 UTC
1 upvotes, 0 direct replies
I am aware of Rojava and that they’re threatened due to Turkey backing the coalition rebel forces which overthrew Syria. However as an American I have no power in dictating what happens. Even less so due to trump being voted in, someone who aligns himself with Russia and pulled out of Syria entirely in 2018, abandoning the Kurds yet again. Knowing this, even if I somehow was able to organise enough people to protest in my country I am disillusioned it would do jack squat. Our country is so polarised that only whatever side you’re closest to with give half a care about your cause, and even then look at how the dem party handled the Gaza protests.
The reason you see people focusing on how shit men are is because it directly affects them in their communities. Movements like 4B or decentering men are things we actually have the power to do and to change. Talking about the way men harm you and your community within your community can actually achieve something.
It is not that Rojava doesn’t matter or deserve solidarity - it absolutely does. But aside from giving some desired look of international support it is not going to change anything. The new administration has little incentive to care about Rojava or the Kurds. The Republican Party by and large has been bought by Russia. Maybe it is different in Britain since the liberal party has power there but I cannot imagine that they have enough political capital or even regular capital to spend on a military intervention that doesn’t directly benefit the capitalist class of Britain.
It is depressingly bleak how little the west cares of the global south or even its former allies it uses to gain advantage in its global interventions it decides to abandon.