https://www.reddit.com/r/TheSilphRoad/comments/1ig1wp8/is_iv_relevant_in_max_raids/
created by Secure_Accountant745 on 02/02/2025 at 17:06 UTC
85 upvotes, 26 top-level comments (showing 25)
Some of my friends don’t have the GMax mons and I intend to give some to them. But they will be regular trades not lucky guaranteed. So the IVs will be rubbish. But how relevant are they for doing Max raids anyway?
In the non-Max phase, is it as relevant as regular raids?
In the Max phase, for both Attack and Shield, are they part of the equation? Or they are calculated based on the base stats only?
Does anybody have the formula? I understand the attacks for DMax are 250/300/350; GMax being 350/400/450.
Please someone explain how it works! I can find amazing resources online for regular raids, the best attackers and etc., but nothing quite as good for the Max mechanisms. Please help! Thank you!
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1 upvotes, 0 direct replies
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Comment by NinsMCD at 02/02/2025 at 17:09 UTC
123 upvotes, 2 direct replies
Pretty irrelevant atm. People need to start powering up their D/Gmax mons if they want a good shot at defeating them without needing a lot of players
Comment by JibaNOTHERE2 at 02/02/2025 at 18:01 UTC*
13 upvotes, 2 direct replies
In the non-Max phase, is it as relevant as regular raids?
Really not all that much, given how much powerful the Max phase is compared to the regular phase
In the Max phase, for both Attack and Shield, are they part of the equation? Or they are calculated based on the base stats only?
The damage formula remains the same in the max phase. So yes, IVs are part of this. All Max Guard does is add a flat amount of shielding onto your Pokemon (20/40/60, stacks up to 3x).
Other stuff:
- IVs aren't really that relevant in regular raids either barring hardcore shortmans.
- In Max Battles, the lack of a visible countdown makes precise gameplay more difficult to measure for absolute edge case shortmanning,
- Additionally, the game doesn't give you extra rewards for completing these faster unlike in raids.
- Offensively, the sheer power of Max Moves and the Max phase in general makes breakpoints a bit less potent than in raids.
- Defensively, your HP/Def IVs really only matter if they result in avoiding a KO threshold (ie, can I turn a move from a 3HKO into a 4HKO with enough Defense and HP IVs?).
- There are also too many factors to consider in regards to your success or failure in dynamax, such as boss moveset (which you can reroll!), group competency, and general execution (since it's a lot less tap tappy than raids). All these matter far more than IVs.
Quick maths (we'll assume Level 50)
- A 15 Attack IV Charizard (~199.9 Attack) is approximately 6.2% stronger than a 1 Attack IV Charizard (~188.2 Attack)
- The difference in power between a Lv.3 GMax and DMax Move is 450/350 = ~28.6% stronger
- A 1 Attack IV GMax Charizard still deals ~21% more Max Move damage than a 15 Attack IV DMax Charizard. (188.2 x 450) / (199.9 x 350)
Comment by yanagiya at 02/02/2025 at 17:27 UTC
22 upvotes, 1 direct replies
I have kept many Dmax pokemons, evolved them and gave them out to new players that are interested in Max battles. I told them to use it and not level up until they get themselves a better one.
IV isn't very important. I gave a couple 4 Metagross, 2 each, and we took two Articuno down with the three of us.
Gmax is a special trade though, so I'll suggest trading only when you are lucky friends. Dmax is very usable.
Comment by EGBTomorrow at 02/02/2025 at 17:13 UTC
13 upvotes, 0 direct replies
The IVs are pretty small relative to the base stats, about 10%. Your friends would be able to compensate for some bad IVs with more powering up.
Comment by Miyyani at 02/02/2025 at 17:56 UTC
6 upvotes, 0 direct replies
I use my garbage (like, 0-1 star) gmaxes and they work just fine.
Comment by Remarkable_Ad2032 at 02/02/2025 at 17:50 UTC
6 upvotes, 0 direct replies
I have a 30% or something Gigantamax Lapras (not lucky trade, exactly like you said came out bad) It has 14iv attack and basically 0 in everything else and still works fine to charge the Max meter and tank some hits (I haven't really used it as an attacker yet)
Comment by LTDlimited at 02/02/2025 at 17:44 UTC
9 upvotes, 1 direct replies
TBH, in non-solo/duo situations, they hardly matter in regular raids.
Comment by fieregon at 02/02/2025 at 19:41 UTC
6 upvotes, 0 direct replies
SInce max Pokémon are not widely available, and are quite scarce compared to regular spawns, you're forced to power up your strongest IV mon if you want to have a chance to go against the stronger max battles, even if it means powering up a 82 IV Kingler for example if that is your highest IV one.
But that's okay, a 0 IV mon compared to a 100 IV mon, the difference is very minimal, so it's even less when you're talking about 70 IV or 100 IV mons, just power up your strongest meta relevant max mon and you're good.
I've been tanking Kingler with my 82 gmax Blastoise and it went perfect, I can't imagine seeing a difference if I had a 100 IV one.
I have a 96 gmax Kingler that I've been powering up for Moltres next monday, but the kingler would've been just as viable would he have been a 76 IV one.
Comment by insistondoubt at 02/02/2025 at 17:19 UTC
32 upvotes, 1 direct replies
IVs aren't relevant for anything except PvP and collector's value.
Comment by Princep_Krixus at 02/02/2025 at 19:39 UTC
3 upvotes, 0 direct replies
my understanding is IV only really matter on your bulk/tank the one that is going to be on the field the most and its mainly for def and health to ensure high bulk. high attack helps with chip damage. but most of your damage is coming from the max stage and those are pre set damage amounts i believe.
Healer IV also matter but its solely HP i believe since healing is the percentage of your max hp.
Comment by Endurill at 02/02/2025 at 22:30 UTC
3 upvotes, 0 direct replies
According to my understanding, everything you apply to raids, should also be applied to Max raids.
- So party bonus.
- Friendship bonus.
- Weather bonus.
- Same Type Attack Bonus.
- Effectiveness bonus of the attack.
- Level of the used the Pokémon.
- Level of the defending Pokémon.
And specially for Max raids, if 1 or more Pokémons are placed at the Power Spot before you being, that also gives a damage bonus from 10-20% extra. But that it totally random, since sometimes no Pokémon is placed beforehand.
Here are my calculations from last week's Zapdos, regarding damage against Zapdos.
They are calculated against their max defense stat, which normally is lower, since some mentioned that Tier 5 was equal to level 40 bosses. But later some said that they were equal to level 27 bosses, with 2X damage multiplier.
Anyway, normally raid bosses are their max stat + 15 IV and around level 40.
Zapdos have 185 DEF (Defense stat at max level), which i choose as my calculation.
You could also try with a level 40, hence = (185 + 15) x 0,79 CPM [lvl 40] = 158 defense
Or even level 27 as someone mentioned = (185 + 15 ) x 0,694 CPM [lvl 27] = 139 defense
FLOOR(0.5 x Power x (Atk/Def) x Multipliers)+1
My Pokémons for attacking Zapdos:
- Level 40 G-Max Gengar with G-Max Terror at level 3 (Max!) and Neutral damage: 319 dmg
- Level 20 G-Max Lapras with G-Max Resonance at level 1 and Super effective damage 160% = 196 dmg
- Level 20 D-Max Articuno with Max Hailstorm at level 1 and Super effective damage 160% = 161 dmg
- Level 23 D-Max Cryogonal with Max Hailstorm at level 1 and Super Effective damage 160% = 170 dmg
- Level 27 D-Max Excadrill with a normal Charged Attack (Rockslide) and Super Effective damage 160% = 61 dmg
My Gengar totally ruled the damage. Even if I do the calculations a level 20 and level 3 (Max!) = 241 dmg
- It would still win at a level 20 and level 2 attack = 214 dmg
- Even a level 40 D-Max Cryogonal with Max Hailstorm at level 3 (Max!) and Super Effective damage 160% = 295 dmg, so it would still loose to G-Max Gengar
Gengar is a beast on the attack stat with a wooping 261 base stat at max level. So at level 40 and max IV, the attack stat would be: (261 + 15) x 0,79 CPM = 218,123 attack stat.
- Which is why when even doing only neutral damage to Zapdos, it would hit like a truck.
If you do the same calculations for the weekends G-Max Kingler my Gengar would still hit really hard.
- My closet rival in damage was Rillaboom at level 26 and D-Max attack level 2.
- Gengar level 40 = 326 dmg
- Rillaboom level 26 = 276 dmg
But saturday in my town was Sunny weather, so Rillaboom got 20% damage from Weather Boost.
- Rillaboom level 26 with Sunny weather = 331 dmg
So TL;DR:
Max Attack is just like regular attack (Fast and Charged), but instead of a power of 5-10 and 75-150 - its just way higher. D-Max 250/300/350 and G-Max 350/400/450. But it still only one part of the calculation.
FLOOR(0.5 x Power x (Atk/Def) x Multipliers)+1
- Where Power is the attack damage
- Level 40 G-Max Gengar vs. Kingler = FLOOR(0.5 x 450 x (((261 + 15) x 0.79) / 181) x 1.2) + 1 = 326
- Level 26 D-Max Rillaboom vs. Kingler = FLOOR(0.5 x 300 x (((239 + 15) x 0.6811) / 181) x (1.2 x 1.6)) + 1 = 276
- Rillaboom with Sunny weather vs. Kingler = FLOOR(0.5 x 300 x (((239 + 15) x 0.6811) / 181) x (1.2 x 1.6 x 1.2)) + 1 = 331
- Gengar with 15 IV and level 40 = 326 and Gengar with 0 IV and level 40 = 308
So IV matters, but not much. Max attack level and the level of the pokemon and the attack stat of that pokemon all matters.
Comment by Disgruntled__Goat at 02/02/2025 at 18:01 UTC
6 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Firstly, make sure you are interacting with the friends each day (e.g. opening gifts) during the current event, as there is a boosted chance for lucky friends.
Generally IVs don’t make a big difference. For Pokemon you’d catch in the max battles it’s miniscule as with the 10/10/10 floor it works out around a 1-2% difference.
For your trades it could be a bit more, maybe 5-10% worse, but not a big deal. Much better to have a bad IV Charizard than a perfect Wooloo.
Comment by nolkel at 02/02/2025 at 17:22 UTC*
14 upvotes, 0 direct replies
IV are equally relevant in max battles as they are in raids, yes. If you are doing hard fights with a minimum number of players, they make a big difference. If you are in larger groups they make a small to zero difference.
A max attack is identical to a regular attack in every way. The damage formula is the same. Actual stats matter, so species base stats, level, and IVs are all factors.
https://pogo.gamepress.gg/damage-mechanics[1][2]
1: https://pogo.gamepress.gg/damage-mechanics
2: https://pogo.gamepress.gg/damage-mechanics
How much 15 attack vs. 10 attack matters though depends on how close of a battle it is. If you win just before the enrage timer would have wiped out your team, then the IVs mattered. If you win with plenty of time left, then they didn't really matter. If everyone's teams get wiped out when the boss had a sliver of HP left, then they may well have mattered.
The shield move itself is not affected by IVs, but the taunting effect is definitely going to work better with higher defense and stamina. More IVs can sometimes matter if you're right on the edge of a narrow victory, or trying those harder movesets that do a lot more damage than others.
Also I think the amount of hit points of damage a shield prevents is fixed, so higher defense probably makes it work a little better. But I'm not sure on that one.
Max Healing is based on max HP in some way, so a higher HP IV probably means a tiny bit more healing.
Comment by jaxom07 at 02/02/2025 at 19:09 UTC
3 upvotes, 0 direct replies
I refuse to chase IVs for max Pokemon. Maybe if it’s something useful that I can solo but it’d be really helpful if they’d extend the hours they’re open. I just don’t have time during the week with work to stop and do them. With Gmax I work with what I can get for free. I got a 14-14-14 Kingler so he’s my guy.
Comment by WearNothingButASmile at 02/02/2025 at 20:37 UTC
2 upvotes, 0 direct replies
iVs alamost never matter.
except in min-max situations like solo raids and PVP.
in PVE, its all about base stats and level.
here's a good yt vid to watch (also my source) https://youtu.be/zWvai45DCIg?si=dc9bcBnB-F_5OBpZ
Comment by Wafflecopter84 at 02/02/2025 at 18:50 UTC
1 upvotes, 0 direct replies
IVs only seem to give 1 stat per point so negligable. I assume the case is the same for max raids too. Personally I don't bother with them, but even though I'm semi meta chaser, the way I see it, current max pokemon are largely replaceable with future mons so might as well make the most of it now and be more selective later on.
Comment by sin-iudicii at 02/02/2025 at 19:24 UTC
1 upvotes, 0 direct replies
As mentioned before, IVs are relevant in PvP but they can also be relevant if you intend to solo the raid. Anything else is just personal preference. In PvE terms the difference between flat 0 attack and max attack hovers between 5-15% (depending on Pokémon) but no one is using 0 attacks in PvE so having a 2* attack won’t be as different than having a max attack
Comment by MaxPeriod at 02/02/2025 at 23:48 UTC
1 upvotes, 0 direct replies
See my old post https://www.reddit.com/r/TheSilphRoad/comments/1h1yu5w/iv%5C_101010%5C_vs%5C_151515%5C_and%5C_level%5C_pokemon%5C_effects%5C_on/[1][2] on how much IVs affect stats at various levels.
Comment by Travyplx at 03/02/2025 at 02:39 UTC
1 upvotes, 0 direct replies
I don’t think they will end up being noticeable for normal gameplay, the big thing has been actually getting people to build out their max Pokemon. If you’re focused on soloing 5 stars and things to that effect they might come into play.
Comment by Omnizoom at 03/02/2025 at 04:50 UTC
1 upvotes, 0 direct replies
IV play about a 4-5% difference between 0 and 15
Yes IV is that small of a difference (although I say small 5% is still significant)
So yes it’s relevant, no more then any other part but it’s still just IV
Attackers don’t need any defense stats and defenders don’t care much about their attack
Comment by AshenKnightReborn at 03/02/2025 at 04:53 UTC
1 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Generally for max battles CP & max move levels matter most, in that order. IVs slightly matter but in a max raid the difference between a 0/0/0 IV and a 15/15/15 IV is not nearly as meaningful as it is in normal raids & pvp
Comment by AUTOMATED_RUNNER at 03/02/2025 at 07:55 UTC
1 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Moltres is coming up and we're afraid we aren't well prepared yet due to not having enough squirtle candies for our Blastoise.
Comment by NeptuneSpark at 02/02/2025 at 18:59 UTC
0 upvotes, 0 direct replies
I power up 15 atk pokemon for max phase and x/15/15 for the normal phase
Comment by CommanderDark126 at 03/02/2025 at 02:34 UTC
0 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Yes IVs matter, just like they do with regular raids. Can you do them with trash mons? Of course, but having higher IVs will certainly make it easier overall.