https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/ck5549xyrydo
created by TAKEitTOrCIRCLEJERK on 08/07/2024 at 17:59 UTC
644 upvotes, 14 top-level comments (showing 14)
Comment by VladWard at 09/07/2024 at 06:05 UTC
1 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Okay. I hate to do it, but I'm locking this post *about communicating uncomfortable feelings* because a lot of uncomfortable feelings are being communicated in resentful, confrontational, aggressive, and generally inappropriate ways for this space.
The irony is not lost on me.
I'm not going to lecture you. Instead, I'm just going to point to a relevant section of the r/MensLib Mission pinned to the sidebar.
Comment by Unreal_Daltonic at 08/07/2024 at 18:22 UTC
667 upvotes, 10 direct replies
There is a very big reason why men simply don't open up and I'm tires of seeing this sort of articles treating it as some sort of unsolvable enigma.
The moment we stop treating and even encouraging treating men feelings as issues, we would not be afraid to show them.
Men have to be stoic machines all the time or they will be obliterated by their peers. Sad men are seen as failures, angry men are seen as dangers, withdrawn men are seen as deadbeat rejects.
You will see countless posts here on reddit and even comments from your social circle irl to just "open up". But I don't think any men out there does not have his personal horror story of what happened when he truly showed his vulnerable side. And sure I have had some pretty nice experiences opening up and being vulnerable to some people I really trust, but even in our times, opening up as man feels like walking through a land mine.
Comment by mrisrael at 08/07/2024 at 19:21 UTC
360 upvotes, 3 direct replies
The reason men don't open up emotionally is because men are constantly punished for opening up emotionally.
Comment by greyfox92404 at 08/07/2024 at 18:41 UTC
169 upvotes, 3 direct replies
I had a conversation this weekend that this reminds me of.
Most men of my father's generation aren't comfortable talking about how they are feeling and aren't comfortable with the introspection that often comes with sharing your feelings. Sure sure, this isn't news. But one thing that this article hints at is to the "why". Why *should* men open up emotionally? Which leads me back to this conversation I had this weekend.
While we had some friends over, enjoying the 90+ degrees in the PNW, with the help of my daughters, I sneakily crept up behind my spouse and dumped a 5-gallon bucket of water on her. She reacted as she always does, with shock and then smiles. We soak each other this way (she got me just last friday with a 5-gallon bucket from the patio roof) and I really enjoy it but I wasn't always receptive to this kind of fun.
It used to make me feel shock ~~> anger/fury.
I wasn't able to have the kind of kid-like fun of just unexpectedly getting wet with water in the hot summer. I used to take this so poorly and one day, many years ago we just hashed out why. But the thing is, I didn't exactly know why until sharing my feelings forced me into an introspective thought chain.
Why did it make me so upset? My clothes are just wet but im actually refreshed from the water. It's not actually that inconvenient. So why am I upset?
And during that conversation and some thought, it was because I was the youngest of 4 brothers with a dad that took joy in trolling us. That meant I was often at the butt-end of most household pranks. My dad was the worst of them, once got me to hold a broken extension coord so that it would shock me when it was plugged into the wall. 120v isn't a joke but he sure laughed hard when it finally stopped shocking me. Stuff like this was constant and only got worse as I aged.
So I didn't like the feeling of being tricked, even when it was something meant to be a fun surprise. It made me feel vulnerable and reminded me of all the times I've been laughed at by my family. And only by talking about it did it start some introspection that I needed. Because I do want to introduce more fun in my life, especially if it's at the low cost of 5 gallons of water. And I want to model healthier behavior with my daughters.
Even in this one little thing, being able to discuss my feelings in this way just makes my days easier and more enjoyable. And I want that.
Comment by snake944 at 08/07/2024 at 19:34 UTC
91 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Been there, done that, not doing it again. Depending on where you live and what sort of people you are surrounded by(not always something you have a say in) there are very real consequences to doing it. Not exactly rocket science why most dudes refuse to open up.
Comment by General-Greasy at 08/07/2024 at 18:34 UTC
194 upvotes, 2 direct replies
It's a terrifying thing because I think a lot of men have negative experiences opening up. Either a partner leaves them, friends lose respect, are talked to dismissively, etc. Then you see men like Will Smith and Michael Jordan crying and they get made into memes. This is purely anecdotal, but I've had people on my Facebook claim to be all about men's mental health and how they're a safe person to talk to, and within the same day share like 3 mean-spirited "men are trash" type posts with zero self awareness. Maybe the reason your male friends won't open up if because YOU are the problem?
I agree 100% with the idea of men opening up emotionally and I actively put effort into manage my emotions better and maintain a good support system when I cannot, but overall I don't think society is at a place yet where men can open up without fear of ridicule and dismissiveness.
Comment by mcwopper at 08/07/2024 at 22:32 UTC
35 upvotes, 0 direct replies
I think an important thing to do is have conversations about this issue with each other when we aren’t in crisis. We tend to wait until we are in desperate need of help, and if there is pushback we crumple or get mad or whatever because we’re already in a bad place.
It’s already hard enough to have the conversation with people whose reply is “just suck it up, I thought you were better than this, etc” when in a good frame of mind. I’ve been having an ongoing conversation with a friend that is incredibly frustrating, and I know if I was having this dialogue while in a crisis I would lash out pretty badly
Comment by leroy2007 at 09/07/2024 at 01:14 UTC
43 upvotes, 0 direct replies
The real reason men don’t open up easily is because we have, and it didn’t fucking help it actually made things worse.
Comment by Wildydude12 at 08/07/2024 at 21:15 UTC
65 upvotes, 1 direct replies
Honestly, I don't think it's super hard to be an appropriately expressive guy. I think you always need to have some amount of emotional control, but I've never felt like I had to permanently push down my feelings, and honestly after I started to really open up to close friends in my early 20s it's only served to deepen my friendships and relationships.
But it's a skill like any other, and for men who go through life without learning how to open up it just gets harder and harder to do so. And I have no doubt there is some subset of women out there who don't want their guy to open up, but it isn't all women, and I imagine a lot of the concern is less with opening up and more with how their dude is opening up. Bottling down things for a long time then exploding like a volcano isn't pleasant for anyone to deal with.
If guys want to develop this skill, I recommend starting with friends. Start small, avoid trauma dumping, pay attention to social cues.
Comment by TAKEitTOrCIRCLEJERK at 08/07/2024 at 18:02 UTC
62 upvotes, 1 direct replies
The documentary builds towards a conclusion as Cowles sits down with his parents to tell them he loves them.
While both are receptive, his father is somewhat dismissive of the "airy-fairy" nature of showing emotions, suggesting it's "not a normal thing for a man".
Therefore, his father argues, if somebody isn't opening up, that's actually a good sign, as not feeling the need to be vulnerable means they are generally feeling content.
one thing I've learned as I've aged is that generation gaps aren't real, but they are very very real.
we're all the same, yes, we are all born and we will all die and there will be struggles betwixt. But each generation can teach another something new, something better, something we did when we were kids and something that I should learn *from* the kids.
opening up is something I've tried to teach my dad. He's a classic boomer, the kind described above. But he's willing to *learn from me*, learn from his kids and The Youths, about how to live a better and healthier and more expressive life.
idk... maybe try that with the Elder Dudes in your life.
Comment by generic230 at 09/07/2024 at 01:18 UTC
63 upvotes, 0 direct replies
One reason is bc the minute they tell you how they feel we tell them what’s wrong with feeling that. I saw this on r/AskMen yesterday. A woman asked, “When you’re stressed what do you need? What would help?” And the top answer was: “Stop asking questions. Just let me feel what I feel and not stress me further by constantly asking me questions about why I’m stressed.” Lots of men upvoted that and I thought, “Oh, that’s terrific” bc that’s how my brothers are and I had to resist the female urge to get answers. They need space. The first comment after that was a woman saying: “Well I can’t not ask a question. You need to communicate in a relationship.” And I was like: THIS IS WHAT THEY DO TO MEN ALL THE TIME. They ask what they want they tell us and we say, “No you don’t.”
I’m female, gay, and a feminist but more if a humanist now and I’m so angry it’s like at some point women began to think that our way was superior and men are behind. It just infuriates me. My older brother ate himself to death and I know why. Just try to respect that we are 2 different types of humans.
Comment by calDragon345 at 09/07/2024 at 04:21 UTC
11 upvotes, 0 direct replies
I wonder if a possible solution to this is to set up groups for men based around helping form friendships and foster emotional vulnerability and other skills.
Comment by BillySpaceDust at 08/07/2024 at 22:08 UTC
26 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Open up, get punished.
Comment by AGoodFaceForRadio at 08/07/2024 at 21:23 UTC*
-12 upvotes, 0 direct replies
So many comments to the effect of “I displayed vulnerability to someone and they hurt me, therefore I conclude that it’s not ever safe to display vulnerability.” Ok … ?
This feels like a deliberately oppositional take, but are you familiar with the story *The Farmer and the Viper*?
I wonder how many of us have been tucking snakes into our coats.
We do have a certain responsibility to be selective in who we chose to display vulnerability to. If you try with your boomer uncle and he acts like a boomer, or you try with your narcissist girlfriend and she acts like a narcissist … . That doesn’t mean never show vulnerability; it means try with someone who has signaled a greater willingness to accept that.
Am I victim blaming? Probably. But I don’t care. Yes, everyone **should** be kind and supportive. But in the world we live in there are snakes, and if you pick one up you’re liable to get bit. We owe it to ourselves to be mindful of who we pick up.