created by Inner_Response_1714 on 19/01/2024 at 03:21 UTC
409 upvotes, 16 top-level comments (showing 16)
I "cross-posted" to a subreddit I knew about. I allow sharing on subreddits, TikTok, Twitter, etc. that I don't know about.
This controversy was sparked by the games Maple Story and Genshin Impact. Although this is a misogynistic incident that occurred in the gaming industry, I believe it is an extension of the 21st century misogyny that has continued as a tradition for over 20 years.
I wrote the post from January 6th. I tried to complete this post on January 7th, but due to my personally busy life, I finished it now. I apologize for uploading this late and would appreciate your understanding.
After the incels' unreasonable claim that the "index finger" in Maple Story was a symbol of male hatred, the "witch hunt" (feminist hunt) accelerated in Korean society. No matter how much the studio and the parties themselves explained that it was not true, the incels did not listen. Instead, the incels inflicted cyber violence on the studio and the person involved.
In the end, “Studio Puri” announced that it would hold a meeting with users and clearly state that the index finger is not an expression of hatred toward men.
Four users promised to attend this meeting on December 29th. However, when “Studio Puri” announced that it would check users’ real names and phone numbers, no one attended. From the studio's perspective, this was the minimum safety measure since incels had been harassing company employees by tracking their personal information.
Afterwards, Studio Puri held another meeting on January 5th. Six users attended this meeting. Users who attended participated anonymously.
In fact, incels' claim that the "index finger" is a symbol of male hatred was unreasonable from the beginning. I was happy when “Studio Puri” hosted a meeting to clarify, but on the other hand, I was devastated that the studio had to explain this absurd “index finger” controversy to users.
However, despite the studio's explanation, most Korean male communities reacted in three ways.(Negative reactions to all three)
1. **The index finger may not be a symbol of man-hating, but unless “Studio Puris” breaks with feminists, we can’t trust them.**
2. **The explanation is a complete lie because the studio is staffed by “feminists.”**
3. **She has already stated that she will engage in feminist activities “subtly and quietly.” Does her statement go away just because the studio provides an explanation?**
In the end, the Korean male community does not admit at all that they have engaged in an absurd witch hunt. Moreover, in the Korean male community, no one criticized the fact that some incels had brutally harassed victims by disclosing their personal information.
I will summarize and describe the reasons and events that led to this absurd witch hunt in Korea.
1. Some incel communities claimed that the index finger of the character Angelic Buster in “Maple Story” was an expression of male hatred.
2. The evidence that the incels are talking about is what a female illustrator said on Twitter.
3. She said on Twitter, “I will continue to engage in subtly and quietly feminist activities in the future.” I wrote an article called.
4. Korean incels interpreted her post as saying that she would “subtly and quietly” draw a finger that hates men.
5. Naturally, most women and a few progressive men refuted the incels' unreasonable claims, saying that they were ridiculous and far-fetched.
6. Her remarks only meant that she would not give in to the dark future of feminist activities along with the defeat of the progressive candidate in the presidential election the year before last. At the time, most feminists made her remarks with a similar meaning.
7. However, most of the male community interpreted her statement as saying that she would draw index finger “subtly and quietly.” And it expanded into a collective madness called feminist hunting.
8. Nexon accepted the feedback from incels.
9. From this point on, the incels became more confident and began to reveal her personal information and phone number. Then, the incels began cyberbullying her, including sexually harassing her and threatening to kill her. The incels not only harassed her, but also harassed the employees of her studio “Puri” by revealing their personal information.
10. Korean incels did not stop here and expanded to other games to track male-hating expressions (index fingers). And the male community collectively believes that it is an expression of male hatred.
11. Due to the aftermath of the "maple storys index finger", not only Nexon but also most gaming industries in Korea issued statements apologizing to users or saying they would be careful in the future.
12. However, the game maker “HoYoverse” did not issue any apology or statement. Korean incels wanted the Korean branch of “HoYoverse” to apologize like other gaming industries.
13. This was the catalyst for Korean incels to start harassing the illustrator of Genshin Impact.
14. When HoYoverse did not apologize to users, angry Korean incels became convinced that there were Korean women on HoYoverse and began tracking them down. As a result, incels discovered that the illustrator revealed in the "Mihoyo hacking incident in June 2023" was the person who created Furina's concept art. Due to this incident, Korean incels acquired the information of a Korean woman and branded her as a vicious feminist.Of course, it was illegally acquired material. (This was also posted on Genshin Impact's bulletin board by an incel, saying that Korean radical feminists hated men.) She despaired of the reality in Korea, which is full of misogyny, and made harsh remarks toward male culture.
15. Korean incels wanted her fired from “HoYoverse”.
16. Korean incels branded her as a vicious feminist and began reporting her to the Chinese community.
17. Korean incels began to incite Chinese people with the false claim that “in Korea, men are sexually assaulted and killed by feminists.” (The reality is that most women are sexually assaulted by men. And this is like a man lying about being assaulted by a feminist because he had short hair. The reality is that a woman with short hair was assaulted by an incel.)
18. However, the Chinese community instead criticized Korean incels.
19. Angry at this, Korean incels began to think about how to get her to be criticized by the Chinese community. Korean incels began to incite Chinese people by branding her trivial complaints as “Chinese hate.” Not only that, Korean incels also reported her complaints to Chinese public security. The incels expected that if she did so, she would receive huge punishment from Chinese police. And the incels expected her to be criticized by the Chinese people.
20. However, only a few extreme Chinese people criticized her, and most Chinese people ignored the claims of these Korean incels. And Chinese public security also ignored the incels’ claims. Game production company HoYoverse also did not respond to the incels' claims.
21. However, Korean incels were very happy, mistaking the reaction of a few Chinese people to mean that most Chinese people were criticizing her. Some Korean men were worried about her safety, but some Korean incels branded the man a hypocrite.
​
22. Korean incels are making sexual harassment, death threats, and horrible ridicule by revealing her real name and personal information.
23. Korean incels launched an airship demanding communication from the game producer “HoYoverse”. Korean incels want her fired from "HoYoverse". Naturally, HoYoverse ignored the protests of Korean incels.
24. Currently, In the Korean gaming industry, ideological censorship (feminism) is carried out only against “female employees.” Horribly, most male communities are cheering the game company's censorship of female employees' thoughts.
​
25. Recently(December 29th), studio “Puri” announced that it would provide an explanation regarding the “index finger” controversy. General Manager Kim Sang-jin suggested meeting and talking about the "index finger" controversy, and some men promised to attend.
26. Studio “Puri” requested the names and phone numbers of attendees out of concern for the safety of its employees. Because until now, misogynists have tracked down and harassed the studio's "Puri" employees. Therefore, Studio Puri took such measures to ensure minimum safety.
27. In the end, not a single person attended the meeting arranged by Studio “Puri”.
28. On January 5th, Studio “Puri” again hosted a meeting with users. Six men participated in this meeting. The participants requested anonymity and the studio “Puri” accepted their offer. At this meeting, General Manager Kim Sang-jin explained the male-hating conspiracy theory contained in "Index Finger" that users are taking issue with. General Manager Kim Sang-jin's explanation was made in the form of questions and answers from users.
29. Studio “Puri” provided a logical explanation as to why “index finger” is not an expression of male hate.
​
30. However, users who participated in the meeting drew a line, saying that they could not give a positive evaluation to the actions of Studio Puris without a breakup with “certain forces.” For reference, the “certain forces” that users are talking about refer to feminists.
31. This article did not make headlines in Korea. In Korean society, the “index finger” is still perceived as male-hating. Some men who have read this article claim that even if "Forefinger" is a misunderstanding, the studio "Puri" can only be trusted if it breaks with feminists. In other words, this is the same as claiming that “feminists” who are treated as social evils in the Korean male community should be fired.
32. And many incels claim that the explanation cannot be believed because there are feminists working at the studio “Puri.”
33. And, the male community is still advocating feminist hunting by arbitrarily interpreting the text “I will continue to engage in subtly and quietly feminist activities in the future” as “I will subtly and quietly draw index finger.” The terrible truth is that more than 60% of men in their 20s and 30s agree with this absurd witch hunt. When most women and a few progressive men criticize this absurd witch hunt, incels always claim that her post “I will continue to engage in subtly and quietly feminist activities in the future” is proof.
34. Currently, “feminist hunting” is taking place in Korea as if it were a natural thing. Female applicants to the gaming industry are always subject to ideological censorship from the company.
​
P.S : There has been severe misogyny in Korea since the early days of the Internet. I consider this 21st century misogyny. Although prejudice, hatred, and discrimination against women still remain in society, I believe that misogyny in the 21st century is a newly emerging form of violence against women.
Many misogynistic words have been used in Korea since the early to mid 2000s until now, such as soybean paste girl, kimchi girl, cuntment post(cunt+government), cunsquid(cunt+squid), international whores, chewing gum breast size, momsect(mom+insect), Mrs. Kim, blood spitting twit, etc.
I grew up seeing and hearing about the 21st century misogyny taking place in the male community since elementary and middle school(2005). In the Korean male community, women have been portrayed as selfish beings who are treated preferentially by society, while men are portrayed as pitiful beings who are discriminated against. The Korean male community argues as if misogyny does not exist in Korea and only male hatred exists. If you want to assert the seriousness of misogyny in the Korean community, you must also mention male hatred. However, issues asserting the seriousness of male hatred do not receive criticism from the male community even if misogyny is not mentioned. The problem is that in Korea, the male community is overwhelmingly larger than the female community. In other words, the percentage of men using Internet communities is overwhelmingly higher than that of women.
Therefore, in Korea, male opinion was and still is mainstream, trying to control women by classifying them as saints and witches.
The biggest sin in Korea is “hating against men.” Until now, I have never seen far-right incels receive social burying for “misogyny.” However, I have seen countless women being socially buried for being accused of “hating men.”
Currently, Korean incels are packaging this absurd witch hunt (feminist hunt) as if they are pacifists opposing hate. However, Korean incels are typical extreme right-wingers who hate everything related to progressive human rights, including women, black people, cats, dogs, socially disadvantaged people, LGBT people, workers, and the disabled. This is like a white supremacist holding a few radical black civil rights activists hostage and pretending to be a pacifist while hating all black people. In Korean male community, generalized hatred of women, black people, cats, dogs, socially underprivileged people, etc. is not considered a problem, but hatred of men is very strict.
A few months ago, there was a victim who was assaulted by an incel because her hair was short. She suffered a secondary heartache recently when a prosecutor in charge asked her if feminism was still being taught in “girls’ middle and high schools.”
​
Comment by Archylas at 19/01/2024 at 09:07 UTC*
188 upvotes, 3 direct replies
Korea keeps crying about the low birth rate and blames women's education, high cost of living and high competitiveness (and hence stress) as the reasons, but you will NEVER see them admit that blatant misogyny is the #1 reason (especially if the speaker is a male). A lot of developed countries also have low birth rate problems due to similar economic reasons, but the misogyny level in Korea is on another level.
Just look at the 4B movement in Korea
Masculinity there is so fragile that it's hilarious. Yes, blame women for not wanting to date and marry you when you've been treating them like shit from the start.
Comment by Kahako at 19/01/2024 at 06:41 UTC
69 upvotes, 1 direct replies
How can those not living in Korea or who cannot speak Korean help?
Personally, I am not a fan of these kinds of games anymore, but I want to support the women who help make them.
Comment by Spiritual_Order_3049 at 19/01/2024 at 05:05 UTC
122 upvotes, 1 direct replies
It doesn't really shock me seeing how Korean, especially gacha gamers, can get. Being someone who is fascinated by how the K-pop industry works from a business perspective. Anytime a female idol shows any semblance of feminist sentiment, Korean incels will go ballistic, they'll burn any merch they have and harass their ageny.
Comment by Actual-Gear7761 at 19/01/2024 at 05:01 UTC
175 upvotes, 3 direct replies
Imagine being mad about gender "oppression" when the most you face is a hand gesture.
Comment by Icymountain at 19/01/2024 at 04:01 UTC
41 upvotes, 1 direct replies
There's a lot of references to "she" and "her" but I genuinely don't know who it's referring to
Comment by Wadachii at 19/01/2024 at 14:29 UTC
40 upvotes, 1 direct replies
A slight correction to your post (I agree w/ everything else tho),
the controversy started because Project Moon (my favorite indie studio 🫠🥹) fired Vellmori (late July 2023) due to DCInside incels being upset that a female character's summer outfit was not in a bikini, but instead in a skin tight wetsuit that is also representative of Korean culture (Haenyeos).
They discovered that the artist who designed the outfit was a man, so they pivoted 180 degrees to find a scapegoat. They dug through and found DELETED tweets made when the artist was 17~ where she retweeted some posts that supported pro-choice and was against secret filming of women in private locations (i.e public washrooms.)
With this "proof" they literally went to their office in Seoul to complain/protest, as well as like emailing and shit iirc. And several hrs later, as the CEO was in Japan for Tokyo Game Fes, the CEO of the company made a post and called the artist at 11pm, informing her that shes been let go/fired, and that they will have a in-person meeting to discuss the firing after the CEO gets back from TGF.
With project moon kowtowing to these incels, it gave them the courage & shit to go and harass other companies.
Just an FYI, project moon's franchise had a very strong female fanbase, as lots of themes of their work tackle breaking cycles of abuse, standing up for who you are and what's right, and they have lots of strong women characters who don't need a prince charming to save them either. On top of that, although they covered disturbing topics like cannibalism, homicide/suicide, religious/cult torture and indoctrination etc. Sexual violence and violence against women were NEVER part of their stories as they probably saw no purpose.
So they didn't put their money to where their mouth is. By firing vellmori, they isolated like 60% of their fanbase (kr & intl) and have been struggling to make pre-controversy levels of revenue.
Comment by Inner_Response_1714 at 19/01/2024 at 08:18 UTC
49 upvotes, 1 direct replies
When news about Korea's terrible misogyny is reported, some anti-feminists often write comments trying to justify misogyny by mentioning radical feminism. So far, most Korean women have placed great emphasis on sexual violence and discrimination against women, which are rampant in Korean society. Therefore, most Korean women did not mention Internet misogyny.
However, since some incels continue to say that radical feminists hate men on the Internet, I will go into great detail about this.
I allow sharing of this article.
The most active period for radical feminists in Korea was from 2017 to 2019. After that, its power gradually weakened. And Korea's anti-feminism is becoming stronger as time goes by.
https://dprime.kr/g2/bbs/board.php?bo%5C_table=comm&wr%5C_id=21469346[1][2]
1: https://dprime.kr/g2/bbs/board.php?bo%5C_table=comm&wr%5C_id=21469346
2: https://dprime.kr/g2/bbs/board.php?bo_table=comm&wr_id=21469346
The link above is data from a survey conducted at the end of 2019. This is data obtained through thorough analysis. This was a time when feminism was most active.
As a result of the survey, men in their 20s with hardcore anti-feminism tendencies were found to be 25.9%. This is one in four men in their 20s. On the other hand, only 0.4% of women in their 20s had hardcore feminist tendencies. Moreover, this was a time when feminism was most active. Through these results, we can feel the huge difference of 25.9% (men) VS 0.4% (women).
Furthermore, the power of feminism has weakened since 2020. On the other hand, anti-feminism has become several times stronger. Currently, more than 60% of men in their 20s and 30s are affected by misogynistic sentiments.
Korean incels hold a very small number of Megalia hostage to justify their misogyny every time a misogynistic crime occurs. This is the same as white supremacists who hold some radical black human rights activists hostage and hate all black people. Surprisingly, Korean incels actually have a lot of hatred towards black people. Korean incels branded and attacked a girl group member as Megalia because she read a book titled “Kim Ji-young, Born 1982.”
For reference, most women in their 20s and 30s in Korea are liberal feminists, and among those highly involved in women's rights, there are progressive radical feminists. However, far-right radical feminists like Megalia are less than 0.4% (liberal feminist > progressive radical feminist > far-right radical feminist).
The groups supported by Korean liberal feminists and progressive radical feminists are as follows: Women's human rights, black human rights, disabled human rights, workers' human rights, environmentalists, cats, dogs, LGBT, socially disadvantaged human rights, etc.
Those who have confirmed this fact may wonder why Korean liberal feminists and progressive radical feminists are divided into the words “liberal” and “progressive radical,” even though the society they aim for is similar. Therefore, I will explain the differences between Korean liberal feminists and progressive radical feminists.
Korean liberal feminists argue that no matter how severe misogyny and discrimination against women are in Korea, we must not lose our cool and respond calmly. However, progressive radical feminists were frustrated by Korea's misogyny. As time goes by, there are many cases where even liberal feminists become frustrated with Korea's misogyny and turn into radical feminists. Korea's progressive radical feminists support and love the improvement of human rights for black people, the disabled, workers, LGBT people, socially disadvantaged people, etc., but are angry at men.
Comment by imjustheretonotsleep at 19/01/2024 at 11:49 UTC
24 upvotes, 1 direct replies
Thank you so much for taking the time to explain this. I knew it was pretty bad in S. Korea (concerning sexism) but had no clue about the specifics.
It’s disturbing, to say the least. Horrifying even. Given how disheartening the social climate can be in the US when it comes to misogyny, I hate to even imagine how depressing it would be to live in a place where it’s even worse.
Comment by OisforOwesome at 19/01/2024 at 12:26 UTC
18 upvotes, 2 direct replies
This whole thing is incredibly distressing and I'm sorry it's happening.
I know it's going to be a stupid reason, but could you explain how come a curled index finger is considered by these idiots to be a man-hating gesture?
Comment by SoftPastelsYT at 19/01/2024 at 15:38 UTC
14 upvotes, 1 direct replies
Man, as a huge gacha game nerd, this just makes me depressed more than anything. I genuinely want to know why gacha games attract so much incels, since it's a common stereotype that all of us are misogynists or pedophiles
Comment by xenleah at 19/01/2024 at 15:48 UTC
11 upvotes, 1 direct replies
It's so horrible. Thank you for taking the time to compile and share this information. If there's any way to show support, through petitions or anything, please let us know. We stand with these women.
Comment by rookie-mistake at 19/01/2024 at 17:22 UTC*
6 upvotes, 1 direct replies
does anyone have a screenshot of this "index finger" or can elaborate on how its "man hating"
genuinely confuaed and trying to understand here
edit: this is it[1]. so yeah, i guess it's about dick size. same as it ever was, lol
1: https://newsimg.koreatimes.co.kr/2023/11/27/302e121c-1ffc-43cc-b2b6-674a105afead.jpg
Comment by reginwillis at 19/01/2024 at 03:26 UTC
18 upvotes, 3 direct replies
By chance, was this post inspired by Moon Channel's latest video[1]?
1: https://youtu.be/-Im4YAMWK74
Comment by [deleted] at 19/01/2024 at 16:00 UTC
6 upvotes, 1 direct replies
I mean korea is most blackpilled country on earth. US or generally western world incels pale in comparison to sheer size of korean blackpillers.
Comment by Nommm_app at 25/05/2024 at 07:48 UTC
1 upvotes, 0 direct replies
Wow found this after recently visiting Korea and loving the country but also then reading more about the gender pay gap and general sentiment of misogyny made me really sad. I’ll continue to do what I can to speak about this as it’s not widely known in other countries and international support for equality and safety amongst women should be top priority. Your post goes into such amazing detail. ❤️
Comment by 1elysian at 20/01/2024 at 01:19 UTC
1 upvotes, 1 direct replies
I read it all and thank you for sharing this information, I am surprised by what is happening in South Korea, how sad. It seems so exaggerated to me that they would be offended by a gesture that is actually a misunderstanding.
