2010-07-07 Seven Players

Over on the 3.5 Private Sanctuary Forum somebody asked The Big Group Issue - Save Us! – and I suggested the following measures:

3.5 Private Sanctuary Forum

The Big Group Issue - Save Us!

• Roll initiative at the beginning. Take the highest initiative modifier for the enemies and just roll once. Announce the number. *Any player character who beats this number can go. Then the enemies go. Then all the player characters go again, in any order.* Either by how quickly they can decide, or go around the table. This works because they could delay for another anyway. The only thing that you loose is unconscious and dying characters effectively get to delay as well, but that’s not problem for me. The benefit is that you can just ask “has every body gone?” and if nobody says anything, enemies go. Plus: indecisive players automatically have more time to decide.
• *No take-backs for players or DM* once the next person has gone. Explain to your players that the DM also makes mistakes, and there will be no take-backs either.
• **Encourage a caller/leader** player. Sometimes a lot of people at the table can lead to indecisiveness. Ask: “so, who’s the leader? who has the most experience? who has the most charisma?” and then start asking them instead of asking the entire group. Make sure your players are ok with that. Make sure players don’t have to announce the obvious stuff. Assume the elf is always searching, the rogue is always sneaking, etc. If you’re benevolent like that, they’ll accept more guidance by a caller/leader player.
• Skip over the obvious parts. *If the enemies are loosing, have them run away*, or surrender, or let players narrate how they finish them off.
• *Modify spells that require a lot of die rolling.* Entangle or Web are such spells: A lot of creatures get caught in the area, need to save, every round, etc. Agree upon alternate solutions such as “can move as many feet per round as their “strength or escape artist (dex) bonus” and be done with it. Or have one roll for half the enemies, or all the enemies.
• *Limit the game to lower levels.* Higher levels means rolling lots of dice and doing lots of additions. Depending on your game, that slows players down.
• Encourage players to *write the current bonuses down* so that they don’t have to add up effects after rolling dice (avoiding “uh... prayer +1, haste +1, bull strength +2, …). Less calculations while everybody is waiting.
• Use the *simplification for multiple attacks* suggested by Wulf Ratbane. All iterative attacks now have the same attack bonus and get easier to resolve.

suggested by Wulf Ratbane

The simplification for multiple attacks works as follows: Instead of the cascading bonuses for current iterative attacks, up to a possible 4th attack at BAB +16, the variant works as follows:

• At BAB +6, you get a 2nd attack. Both attacks are made at a -2 penalty (instead of 0/-5).
• At BAB +11, the penalty drops to -1.
• At BAB +16, the penalty drops to 0.
• When hasted you get an extra attack using the same penalty.
• With Two-Weapon Fighting, you gain an extra attack with your off-hand.
• With Improved Two-Weapon Fighting, you gain two extra attacks with your off-hand.
• With Greater Two-Weapon Fighting, your penalty for fighting with two weapons decreases by 1.

Statistically, you get similar damage output as current iterative attack rules, except at the corner cases when facing foes whose ACs are extremely high or extremely low relative to your attack bonus. The big advantage – fewer rolls, but in particular fewer different bonuses to add!

You can allow both rules as written and the above simplification at the table. Some players might feel that they’re quick enough at adding things up and they like the rules – no problem. Those that are slow might prefer this simplification.

And finally, enjoy the chaos at the table! Maximize the part that is cool about having so many people at the table. It’s not intimate. It’s not personal. It’s about chaos, mayhem, confusion, and action. If there’s one person that gets the spotlight such as a bard or paladin doing Diplomacy, make sure that this too plays fast and make sure to allow other players to help out. Simply encouraging a lot of Aid Another is a good way to start.

Additional suggestion by Adrian in the comments:

• Let players *know the AC* of their enemies so that players can *pre-roll attacks*. The slight advantage gained by characters using Power Attack in the first few rounds is negligible.
• If you have some favorite spells or dragon breath attacks, **take the average of ⅔ of your dice** and write it down. Just roll the remaining ⅓ of your dice at the table.

​#RPG ​#advice

Comments

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Computer/iPhone dice rollers for big spells (esp. *disintegrate* and such) are nice. Or, following an example I saw once for a high level D&D Game Day event (or something like that), you could take a level 20 wizard’s *disintegrate* spell, which would normally be 40d6, and turn it into a few dice plus a large static modifier, i.e., 6d6 + 119. It does take away some of the swinginess of big damage spells.

Also, if the player already knows what he or she is going to do, i.e., the fighter is definitely going to attack this guy, then roll the dice and write down the numbers while others are going, when it is your turn then you can just rattle off the results.

Finally, tell the players what the monster’s AC is. They figure it out after one or two rounds anyways.

– Adrian 2010-07-07 20:21 UTC

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Good points, I’ll add them to the list!

– Alex Schroeder 2010-07-07 22:22 UTC

Alex Schroeder

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Another nice rule I recently read was that players should always have their move prepared and the relevant rules open and at the table. If they don’t, they automatically delay and possibly loose their turn if everybody else has gone.

Playing D&D 3.5 does require the addition of one house rule. It’s no really a rule, but a modification that takes into account 3.5’s design principles. Namely, players have to be on top of the rules. For example, a player cannot simply say, “I grapple the orc.” Because of the many and varied rules, the player needs to state his intentions AND have the PHB open to the page that covers grappling. If they do not have the rules for their spell, special attack or stats for their summoned monster, they get skipped until they do have them. – Christian in Exploring The Magnum Opus That Is Ptolus

Exploring The Magnum Opus That Is Ptolus

It’s evil, but it might speed things up.

– Alex Schroeder 2010-07-08 12:52 UTC

Alex Schroeder

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Hi Alex - great minds think alike? Your initiative rule is close to that of my own fantasy heartbreaker. How do you like your initiative? (Harald participated in one of the playtest games, and his portrayal of The Dwarf is well-remembered.)

How do you like your initiative?

– DirkR 2010-07-09 14:33 UTC

DirkR